Projects Chrysler L Head 265 Cylinder rust ?

Hey all, recently bought a 265 Chrysler Industrial side valve engine.
It was bought about 25 years ago , and never used, it was rebuilt about 40 years ago and used in a combine for a couple of seasons.
Cyl 6 had some rust the top 2 inches, the rest were a bit carboned.
I cleaned things up to this state in the pics.
I want to know if I could clean up the cylinders some and button her up and see how she runs.
Anyone ever try anything similar?

 

Dozens of times. 80% success rate, but almost all were GM products.
If you cleaned around the valve seats & heads, I'm sure you adjusted the clearance. I always go a couple thou loose on the exhaust.
Pan could be pulled & bearings checked for acid etch & clearance, erasing any doubt other than ring seal.

 

Kool Thanx, anybody else? Bump

 

They're tough engines, I had a 230 that was stuck, after beating two of the pistons out, I just honed over the pits in the cyl walls, these were big pits, and just left them. Did the valves, found two used .080 pistons, re-ringed it.

Been in my forklift for close to 20 years.

 

Yes absolutely, this engine was rebuilt .040 pistons, .010 rods, .010 mains, and then not used much, but sat for more than 25 years.
The valve chamber was super clean, I was hoping to clean up the cyls and use as is, but maybe I am being delusional

 

get some light down in the holes, so we can see the rust....

You have a choice. Do you want to spend money on it now, or maybe spend money on it later? If there are only rust pits, no rust peaks, then it will probably be fine. although it might use a bit more oil than it would otherwise. Costs a lot of money to bore an old motor and put new pistons in it. Usually cheaper to find one that someone else rebuilt already.

 

If it is need of a rebuild, it will get a rebuild at some point.
I am running another engine currently.
This is a 265 and in the Chrysler flathead world is the "Holy Grail" 4 3/4 stroke 3 7/16 bore.
As mentioned this engine was a rebuilt by a local re-builder, who at 1 time, built a lot of the staple engines.
There was no water in it, but got a lot of condensation sitting in a pole shed for years and years.
If i t were a 228, 237 or even a 250, would not spend any time on it, 265s are getting harder to find, although I seem to find them fairly easy here in farm country.
Yes, lots of considerations, crank inspection and measurements, pistons, not big deal to .060, and even .080, a friend of mine has Venolia pistons in 2 of these engines, 1 is .080 over and the other .125 which is the limit for this block.
I will light up the holes and post some pics after I get outta work today, this old boy still working at 56....

 

Reminds me of a story an old time mechanic told me. During WW2 new cars and trucks were in short supply. He rebuilt an engine for a customer with an International truck. The customer had taken off the head and left the truck sitting outside for some time. The cylinders were full of water and pitted with rust. But, beggars can't be choosy as the saying goes. He honed the cylinders, ground the valves, and put the engine together with new rings.

He said it burned oil for a while but after a thousand miles settled down and ran like a good one. A few years later he had the head off, and found the rust pits in the cylinders were filled with carbon and polished smooth.

I saw a similar case with a 71 Chev six cylinder pickup. It had been left sitting for a number of years, then a customer at the garage I worked at bought it. The truck had quite low miles on it, but burned oil. Maybe a quart in 500 miles. After a couple of years the customer had us overhaul the engine. We found all the rings stuck and a ring of rust pits in the cylinders where the pistons had been sitting when it was out of commission. We had the head done, put in new rings, honed the cylinders and it ran like new.

In this particular case the customer was a carpenter who only used the truck for short local drives to customers houses and he never drove it hard. I suspect a few long drives would have loosened up the rings.

The moral of the story is, if the cylinders are not badly worn or and only slightly pitted honing and a set of rings will do. If the rust holes are bad enough to snag the rings, or you are building a performance engine, better bore the cylinders and fit new pistons.

In your case you might not even need new rings. But you should tear it down, clean everything thoroughly and make sure the rings, valves and bearings are up to snuff.

 

Nope rings don't snag along there travel at all.

 

Back in the days of Massey and Cockshutt combines with ironing board chrysler industrials,we would scrounge a 265 wherever we could. Some were rusted like yours, pulled the head and honed the rust out, lapped any rusted valves, and swapped it in and ran it. They usually lasted a few harvests, every bit as long as a 'rebuilt" engine. Yours looks like it cleaned up real nice, I would use it as is.

 

Interesting, yes it cleaned up well enough the cyls needs to be cleaned up a little too. The valves were fine.
rebuilt engines only lasted a few harvests?
Father in law still has his old 1969 Cockshutt 535 with a 265 unrebuilt 2000 hours, still running.....

 

Okay some close up pics, cyl 6 has a deep rust scale spot, like shit man this ain't good.
The rest would clean up easy, some cyl ridge, blows the hardly used after rebuild theory.
But the good news, it was a $100 usd engine, and more out there if I want. I could also us the crank and rods outta this in my 228 block no problem.
Here are the pics Squirrel and the gang

 

Last time I looked Vintage Power Wagons had NOS oversize pistons real cheap. I also got a set off Ebay a few years back for $10 a slug.

Later..........
NOS army surplus pistons, $75 a set (call for availability of your size). The NOS surplus pistons I had were made by Chrysler and came with Perfect Circle rings.

NEW pistons any size $185 a set.

Rings $75

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BxzO_Oy1EMLIWVFzSHRzNjlOMWs/view

 

Whaddya guys thinks?
Would going and new rings cut it on this engine?

 

Kinda depends on what you expect out of the engine. Are you going to drive it a lot, or a little?

 

I'd run a dingle-ball hone very lightly through the holes and see if the view changes.
....be real tempting to run as-is since the c/r is on the low side.

.

 

I don't know if you have the whole engine. But if you do, it seems like building some sort of support for it. Doesn't need to be fancy. Some angle iron, bed frame, two by fours. Just to set it on the floor and hold it up. Then fire the motor and see what happens. I bet it is OK for what you want. If not, then you know.

 

I would drive it like I stole it, mostly highway driving , not an Ice Cream on Sunday cruiser. I drive this truck now hard and fast, but the little 228 is getting tired.

Thanx Rich, it is out of a combine, so it already had a front mount that allows it to sit up right. I have everything to start it minus a bell housing, wonder if the hand crank would get her going?

 

If you want to put 10k miles or so on it, then just hone that cylinder and put it back together. If you want it to last 100k miles, bore it and replace all the pistons.

 

Thanx Jim, yes 10k over a few years could be alright.
In reality, it should be rebuilt, the bottom end gone over fresh bearing inserts, timing chain, pistons etc.
I have a much hotter cam in the wings for it, the head will either be swapped from a 228 or this one will be milled .100. My dual intake, carbs and split exhaust will be part of the package.
Thanks to all of you for your time and input.

 

A short video, hope it gives a better insight into the cylinder condition,

 

I wish you lived closer because you need this one in your fleet. LOL I hope I can find it a new home soon.

 

I was with the "just run it crowd" until you said the above and that you want to run the truck hard. You have a driving truck now. Rebuild that engine before you put it in. That way you will only change it once.

 

Cyls cleaned up a bit not honed yet...

 

My vote is run the whiz out of it. But I'm not a patient guy. That avatar? 216 in it was ,30 over with new guides and seals in 1972. Parked in 1974. I bought it in 2011. Guides were so-o tight that old fuel shellacked on the valve stems stuck to the valves and bent my intake pushrods on a hot start attempt. Pulled the head, removed the valves and polished the stems, put new seals on and drove it all summer and fall until the trans and radiator began to fail and I flipped the car for some cash. In short, my cylinders and bore looked much like yours and it ran beautifully. Nicest 216 I've driven, a summer the kids will never forget, bombing around in that old bathtub!

 

Kool love stories like this.....

 

Well, gotta decide if I should run this engine as is or rebuild.
If I start pilling it right apart, would rebuild.
I am hoping she m,ay rum decent as is and not burn oil.
I am thinking about shaving the head before running it in my truck

 

Is it already oversize? If so , try and find a standard bore block and bore it and swap everything over.

Cool engines

 

Why on earth would I need to do that? Sure if this had new pistons and rings and the mains and rod bearings.
This is .040 pistons, .010 rods and .020 mains, but used.
If I was to go find an unmolested block, then hopefully it would only need to be bored .040. I might as well go .060 with this block already, it's in good shape. This engine the valves and guides lifters look in very good shape, another block might need all new guides and valves.
This block is good up .100 overbore easy, pistons over .080 are a challenge to find.
I am asking about using this engine as I have posted.....

 

Check you block carefully. A lot of the Dodge and Industrial blocks were sleeved. I have a 230 out of a Dodge truck that has sleeves in it. The last time I checked, been some time ago, sleeves were still available. Hope this helps.