History Perspective

I think the only reason to not talk politics is so we don't upset any tender hearts. But I doubt there is a single HAMBer who would be upset at the quote above.

I agree that in essence, hotrodders are a bunch of hillbillies. We get greasy making something out of nothing. Usually for low cost (at least that's what we tell our wives). I'm proud to be a greasy hillbilly.

 

Fuck politics. Perspective? NOTHING to do with the geography or times that produced that work of art. I wouldn't even consider it real money. It's what the human spirit can accomplish when one pushes one's self to the very edge, and Dr Porsche did that in spades. I mean LOOK AT THAT BITCH! The inner drive and wheels all housed within that skeleton of tubing. Weight? Who gives a shit! Sematics! Wow, just fuckin WOW! Sure it's easy to wrap your head around the things behind a creation. K&L doing it cheaper? Maybe not. Transportation advanced so far and fast it was almost easy to do what they did, yet my perspective is whether locked in a lab or a 2 car garage there's a spirit that has to exist in order for EITHER EXAMPLE, from EITHER CAMP to come to light. Buck Rodgers? You bet your fuckin Flathead. Hillbillys? Yeah, that too. That German bitch is beautiful. Marlena Dietrich vs Marilyn Monroe maybe.Would you kick either one outta, umm, the garage...

 

I'll betcha they ripped someone a new one screaming at them to hurry the hell up and go get something to hold the beast up for that photo op. I can just imagine them running all around the shop trying to find it...or hell maybe he thought f' you I'll get you something...the worst chunk o wood I can find.

State of the art everything and they didn't engineer the frame jig for this purpose. Or at 6000 something lbs it blew a gasket on the support.

It does drag it down a notch...good eye and yeah...makes for a Wtf...

 

That monster beast is beautiful. I have always thought looking at all the technological genius of man from all points of this globe if we could just compete through these avenues and other more cordial cooperation. Unfortunately it really isn't that simple.

That said I certainly enjoy and appreciate the history of this evolution we celebrate and its global roots. I love it all.

Thanks for sharing this. Does it still exist...I missed that detail.

 

I don't know what's so funny about the blocks holding it at ride hgt minus wheels. 9 out of 10 development shots of 30s cars, look close and there's blocks holding things. The sophistication of engineering didn't quite make it to mundane shop tasks. Sometimes there's old floor jacks employed. I guess it's that charm of get it done, they wanted the shot. I still block things up, every bracket racer I ever tubbed was blocked up and built at ride hgt. Not fun but accurate.

 

To me, a 44.5 liter (2715 cu. in) supercharged V12 making 3000 horsepower in 1939 is not....a "little cubic incher"

Yep. This is Ryan's show and he gets to do anything he wants. I'm cool with that. If I got to a point where I'm wasn't cool with it, I know where the door is.

indestructableforce, I completely agree with your original post, however, I wanted to comment on your opening statement. If the T80, built in 1939, with that awesome shape and slippery drag coefficient of .18 and 3000 horsepower would have showed up in Bonneville in 1950 it would have crushed anything that anyone could throw at it even though by 1950 it was already 11 years old and technology had progressed as a result of WWII.

RIGHT ON BROTHER! This car is a work of art. I only wish we could know what speed it would have achieved.

 

I think its along the lines of focus on the product but not on All the details...just use the ugly blocks. Nobody considered the maintenance or a presentation of high standing.

I see it in my line of work alot...a huge amount of resources and money spent on fancy jigs and templates...but tooling and instruction...nope. I usually hear...use the stuff you always use and you know what to do right...or a saying from an accomplished artist I worked with that you can have a fantastic art show with great caliber work but if someone involved cheaps out on paper or framing that will drag it down.

No dispute about the blocks being able to support the Titanic within a +/-.002" tolerance.

I understand the humour posted.

 

What about this, land speed record on the road. They started to build this in 1935 if I remember right Don't forget that germans habe no salt sea, they had to try those records on the road. And the war didn't help much developing record cars and attempt land speed records. They started 1934, i think its pretty impressive what they did. I'm actually sitzing here at work less than a mile away of the museum those cars are displayed, maybe I take a walk there after work
I'm not an expert, but there was an record car that they could not get on the road due to the war was in full swing... They planned one more attempt for a record if i remember right....

 

There's the real reason they commissioned the autobahn... to make a test track.


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Maybe irony is a better word. Blank check build, zero spent on blocking...

 

… Perspective! Along with Carroll here is another Texas Farmer I admire more so than any results of an Unlimited Hitler Bank Account. If it wasn’t for big balls guys like him we would all be speaking German now, do an online search on Audie Murphy learn about him, don’t let his name fade into obscurity his photo ought to be hanging in that Mercedes Museum right above that ‘world famous T80’as to why it was not finished. It was his results and Nations he represented that gives us the freedom to build some butt ugly cars that go fast, remember
“Its not how fast you went - Its how you went fast”
Ric

 

I Dont think he was laughing at the wood blocks..... He circled the hole in the frame to reduce the wieght.....

 

Thank you, porkshop, somebody finally saw the picture correctly. BTW, the wood blocks are better than the average ones!

 

Damn, I missed all the fun.
What amazes me, is the way top speed has now morphed into basically tubes. The Sprit of Rett is almost a square tube with a smoothed nose.
The wide profile with wheel bumps is almost old school, yea the Ferguson's are pushing 400, but the Thompson's and Speed Demon show us it is easier to move a bullet or arrow, than a flat brick.
And yes the World is faster with thrust, but I am talking about; wheel driven-pedal to the floor-hope the drive-line holds together speed. And most of the teams work in home shops with only paychecks and small business support.
Still the, German Government supported vehicle is beautiful.

 

Freedom always trumps Oppression - 'Merica provides the stage for this. It's not just Hot Rods it's our life. the Drag Coefficient is notable, but the winglets probably would have resulted in lift off as the car pitched and rolled down the road at high speed changing the angle of attack as they are fixed at zero and look to be perfectly symetrical in airfoil. The car is a beautiful eggersize in craftsmanship no doubt and it belongs on a museum wall as an example of that. For sure the Stateside efforts are less complicated efforts with significant results, none the less sophisticated or successful.

Just so this isn't perceived as political - I have driven a car from every nation and they all break. So I'm an equal opportunity thread turner and I can swear in four different languages.

Bitchin' article which brings to light some great contrast

- Tim

 

Das Besser Ja





Credit to Artists, Owners, Photographers
& Original Posters

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If you remove the wings, and shorten the back, you can almost see Chet Herbert's Beast. Appears that the Nazi's design my have inspired another American record setter.

 

take a look at this picture:

 

It's just a contrast in presentation to me. The backdrop, the lighting, the shine on the tires, the symmetry of the shot, and... some random "shop chunks" as we call 'em. it has a "Where's Waldo" vibe.

 

Glean, Glean, Glean...question is who gleaned from who? The proverbial double edged sword...Sometimes its cut and dry but others not so much. But copycatting has been going on for quite some time now. These are amazing machines no matter how they evolved...

 

And now I see that. apologies to Ryan for missing his reference. The speed holes are also LOL.

I still think the wood blocks stick out like a preacher in a whorehouse, but I'm easily entertained.

 

I didn't even notice this at first, but in this picture you can see even better the airfoil and incidence of the winglets in between the front and rear wheels. they are definitely meant to add downforce.

 

So am I... whats that saying about assuming...

I don't see what issue the holes pose. They lighten, creates access points and don't appear hastily laid out and add hold on...cool factor.

I doubt anybody would deny this chassis is a shame to cover up.

Perspective creates a look of one hole seemingly cutting in at the corner.

Maybe @Ryan may elaborate to share what he was thinking.

 

I showed this thread to my old car buddy, Morry yesterday.
He knows everything about all this old shit, but can sometimes be a little vague, a product of old age I guess.
Anyway, he said the winglets had an adjustable tip, that created downforce, and he was pretty sure this car still exists, possibly in a Mercedes museum in Germany.
The adjustable winglets had a name, that I meant to write down, but didn't.
I'm finding I'm having this problem more and more, talking about old cars with him, and I'm going to have to start recording our conversations.

 

This is the longest and most controversial post I have seen here, and I love it!! This is my favorite era of race car development, because they were actually inventing new ideas. Until computer control of everything on a car, this era was the pinnacle. Porsche knew they needed downforce for traction because the tires were sadly lacking at the time, even on pavement (the autobahn, where they ran). That V-12 probably had 2500 lb/ft of torque!! It is amazing to me that the tire shape on the T-80 is exactly like a 50's Indy tire or Bonneville tire. Hmmm, wonder where Firestone saw that profile??

 

Yes it is displayed on the wall of Mercedes museum in Stuttgart


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I'm not trying to argue, but I'm not seeing how the tips of the winglets are adjustable. Agree now they are designed for down force, so maybe I'm missing the adjustability.

 

The whole winglet appears to be a separate piece from the body so perhaps the whole wing could be adjusted?

 

Ailerons?

Canards?