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History An American V8 That Never Was: the Kaiser-Frazer 288

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Bill McGuire, Mar 2, 2015.

  1. kiwijeff and dan c like this.
  2. doinbad
    Joined: Sep 17, 2012
    Posts: 324

    doinbad
    Member
    from celina tn

    I started to say that would be cool in a j ! But henry js were built with its budget, it sounds like if the v8 was built the j wouldn't have been made! Thank god they went the other way! Bet my chebby make more power anyway !
     
  3. seb fontana
    Joined: Sep 1, 2005
    Posts: 8,444

    seb fontana
    Member
    from ct

    Noticing the lifter orientation and rocker arm off sets allowed Intake ports to be straight shot at valves [re: Ford 427 Tunnel Port] with a clean slate where Ford had to work around existing lifter orientation..
     
  4. Dan Timberlake
    Joined: Apr 28, 2010
    Posts: 1,530

    Dan Timberlake
    Member


  5. Zerk
    Joined: May 26, 2005
    Posts: 1,418

    Zerk
    Member

    A really interesting article in light of what might have been. If Kaiser had a V8 of around 140 horsepower in 1952, would they have cut into the marketshare of Oldsmobile, Mercury and Desoto?

    The Kaiser had good styling and nice interiors. There was the Traveler model which was an early hatchback, similar to Chrysler's Traveller and Desoto's Carry-All. Station wagons and camping would come on strong in a few short years...

    A note on the Kaiser/Oldsmobile engine deal that is mentioned in the comment section of Mac's article (it's claimed that Kaiser wanted to buy 25,000 detuned Oldsmobile V8 engines from GM). The fact is that Oldsmobile was already building a suitable detuned version of its V8, in limited quantities for the use of their Experimental Motor Group (Boss Kett's department). There were thirty of these special engines built between '49 and '54 for in-house testing and for petroleum companies to use in high-octane fuel development. And that detuned Oldsmobile V8 happened to displace 288 cubic inches.
     
  6. Blue One
    Joined: Feb 6, 2010
    Posts: 11,459

    Blue One
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Alberta

    Does the engine still exist, or only in pictures ?
     
  7. Rusty O'Toole
    Joined: Sep 17, 2006
    Posts: 9,657

    Rusty O'Toole
    Member

    It's just as well they never built it. I see a few details that would have been big headaches.

    Fuel pump mounted high at the front of the engine, the perfect place if you want vapor lock. Everybody else mounted them low (except Ford) for a reason.

    Generator mounted low on the right. Guaranteed the bearings will not be oiled a lubrication time. 53 Lincoln had the same setup and burned out generators were a common problem until they changed the location.

    Ports too small and the siamesed exhaust is not good.

    Head bolts between the cylinders make the engine longer than it needs to be, and inhibit enlarging the bore.

    The design is unnecessarily heavy and expensive to build. Even by 1951 standards. By 1955 the Chev V8 would break new ground in light weight and simplicity. Every previous V8 suddenly became obsolete. This was especially hard on smaller makers like Studebaker who could not afford to redesign their engines. Kaiser would have been in trouble the same way, stuck with an obsolete, heavy , expensive to make engine in a very competitive market.

    Kaiser did come out with a supercharged six that developed 140 HP, like the V8s it was competing with but it wasn't enough to catch the eye of the car buying public.
     
    jcmarz likes this.
  8. I don't know this but I sort of doubt it. I would assume it would surface by now. There is a fair bit of other stuff from Willow Run in circulation. Just to mention it, the photos seem to show more than one engine.

    There are also photos showing a one-cylinder test mule, along with a six-cylinder OHV built on the 226 L-head engine.
     
  9. Hnstray
    Joined: Aug 23, 2009
    Posts: 12,355

    Hnstray
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Quincy, IL

    Thanks, Bill.
    Once again you have brought forth an excellent article for our viewing pleasure ...and education of automotive history.

    Regards,
    Ray
     
  10. Zerk
    Joined: May 26, 2005
    Posts: 1,418

    Zerk
    Member

    Rusty, all of your points make good sense, especially considering the market of the early '50s. Kaiser indulged in innovation for its own sake, but there might have been a method in their madness. If the V8 engine had been cast in aluminum, as first planned, the extra material in block and heads would ensure strength and long life for the engine.
    The Chrysler slant six is an example of overbuilding for aluminum and then going to iron, and that engine didn't suffer from the switch.
    Suppose Kaiser decided to make the McCulloch supercharger available on their V8, as Studebaker later did. The small ports and circled headbolts might not seem such a disadvantage.

    Bill, excellent article, thank you. Only want to add that they tested an overhead cam 226ci. 6 in Mr. Kaiser's own car.
     
  11. Hnstray
    Joined: Aug 23, 2009
    Posts: 12,355

    Hnstray
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Quincy, IL

    Given the State of the Art at the time this engine was being developed, it's not so poorly
    designed. Several engines of the period share many of the criticisms leveled at Kaiser's
    effort. Certainly the Olds and Caddy V8's developed in the same period were no lightweights
    for their displacement, had siamesed ports, and yet are revered to this day. I, for one, am glad
    to learn Kaiser was "in the hunt".....even if they didn't prevail in the US in the longer run.

    Ray
     
  12. Rusty O'Toole
    Joined: Sep 17, 2006
    Posts: 9,657

    Rusty O'Toole
    Member

    I suspect this was an early prototype never seriously considered for production.

    Speaking of an OHV version of the Kaiser Continental flathead six, in 1962 Jeep introduced a new OHC version of their venerable engine. It only lasted till 1965 in the US but continued to be made for years in Argentina.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_Tornado_engine
     
  13. U-235
    Joined: Dec 18, 2010
    Posts: 452

    U-235
    Member

    Rusty.....all early Cad V8s had the fuel pump mounted on top of the engine.......
     
  14. Thanks for the kind and generous words. I am extremely grateful for people to share this stuff with -- makes it so much more fun.
     
  15. choptop40
    Joined: Dec 23, 2009
    Posts: 5,114

    choptop40
    Member

    Nice article...great share,,,
     
  16. That was interesting and informative. Thanks for posting it.
     

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