Let's Talk Cyclecars

I finally got some time to roam the aisles today and the Baillon collection. A selection of cycle cars, micro cars and light sports cars.
BSA






Singer


Amilcar




Sanford


Tracta




Bugatti from the Pre War Car site booth




Gordini Simca 5

 

Chris,
Thank you on wonderful photos!​

I would like to have BSA and TRACTA because of front-wheel drive, rare in that period... Then, I would like to have Bugatti T-15 - cute and rare small automobil, sporty... The best - Simca Gordini, based on FIAT 500 Topolino (if I am not wrong), that is my favourite and had once... But, I would be glad to have cheapest of them, just to seat at it in garden (after cleaning and a little of sorting) and making BRMMMM-BRRRRMMM, feeling the smell of old car...

Ciao,
Zoran​

 

Zoran, I wanted to get better pictures of the Simca 5 Gordini but the straps and poles were so close to it that it was real hard to get a clean shot of it and on these 2 pictures one can't really see how small and odd looking it is, there were others nice cars stuck in corners or with protective barriers so badly placed that it's impossible to get nice pictures of them.
On our booth there were no barriers and we actually invited little kids to sit inside one of our fully restored Le Mans cars. Other exhibitors told us we were nuts to let people touch our cars, our answer was : yeah they'll need a buff but they'll get driven and get beat up.

 

F- Type Morgans have the chassis number stamped in the top of the flange where the torque tube bolts to the gearbox. This is not very clever because it is easy to change the torque tube. I have done this with my car. It's 1948 but has a pre war torque tube which has a sleeve in it to support a propshaft centre bearing. Fitting a 2-piece propshaft is a necessary mod for F-4s because otherwie the propshaft bangs on the torque tube at high revs, makes your teeth fall it and breaks the clutch plate and spiggot on the gearbox lower wormshaft. Some of the early F-4s are reported to have had a center bearing and there are a couple in captivity. The setup is just like the 3-speed twin but the front shaft is linger and the splines match the Ford clutch.
Consequently the chassis number on the torque tube might not mean much, and I don't think they stamped anything on the pressed steel chassis. You might find a car number on the St Christopher badge which may still be on the dashboard, but these can be bought new... You might find some numbers on any original woodwork but I am not certain what they mean. I believe the numbers on the gearbox can help dating too.
Join the MTWC and contact the Registrar, he may be able to date the car from the registration number and certainly from the chassis number if you can find it.
PS If you can fit a straight track-rod without it banging on the radiator supports do so, use EN16T, the steering will be better.
PPS Thats my 1922 2-speeder just before your post. It's a copy of the 1914 M.M.C. TT car, not very accurate though. Very exciting to drive.

 

If that 1922 2-speeder referred to is the red one pictured in post #8587 I would love to see more pictures of it.

 

It was built on the French-built Simca 5 version of the Topolino. I'd love one, even if I don't fit in it...

 

Thank you for the information Methanerall. I am moving slowly forwards and actually just put the torque tube in. I'll check that for numbers. Joining the MTWC is definitely high on the to do list. I can use all the help I can get, because this car has been in parts and pieces for more than 40 years. I'd rather it doesn't continue that legacy under my care.

 

I have dozens, I just need to find out how to upload pictures!!!!

 

I've had my F4 for 45 years (I can name at least one mate in the MTWC who has had his F4 for longer) and its been on the road for most of that time.. although they are not as impressive as the twins they can be almost as fast and much more reliable, and there is lots of room for stuff. Get them right and they go on for ever, in as much as a Morgan ever will...The only bit you can't get now is probably the gearbox casing.
I have written a huge instruction & maintenance manual for whoever inherits it and an happy to send off big chunks to anybody who needs sdvice.

 

I seem to hav found out how to upload pictures, there are lots more

 

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Chris,​

I always loved such small "torpedo" style spiders made on small-car base! When we were kids, our father show us one like that in small alley in centre of Belgrade, behind building where he worked. We were always going there to see it, for many years. Later, it changed a few destinations in Belgrade (garages or back-yards - probably new owners) and a few times was at old-timer "races"... Now, it is somewhere in central Serbia (I saw it once on top of village's garage). Unfortunately, owner refused to sell it, but neither had will to renovated it...

It is shown here at the first attached photo, under the name of "KECMAN" (probably name of constructor?). Our father, in spite being quite serious officer, was interested too, either to buy that one or to build something in the same style on Topolino chassis (mother would kill all three of us). Unfortunately nothing of that during his life. Similar ideas had I, but abounded them, even twice started such project, once on Triumph Herald chassis and the second time on FIAT Topolino chassis... Of course, that would be free interpretation, not any kind of exact replica/copy – just for fun, not for shows...

Attached are a few similar photos, three on Topolino chassis and three on JAWA Aero chassis (not so cute, but I would like one)...

Ciao,
Zoran​

 

P.S.: I am not sure for diemensions of any special based on Topolino chassis, but I think that it shouldn't be too small for any driver - but passenger should be tinny or at least not shy for closed seating? I remebr that out Topolino had quite good space on front seats and not so bad at rear - it was Belveder type (caravan)... Attached are photos of similar Topolino Blevedere reconstructed in Blegrade, only our had red-black combination of colour...

Zoran​

 

My father purchased this F4 in 1968-9. In 1973 the internals of the gearbox seemed to eat themselves alive and he took it off the road for repairs. One thing lead to another and so 40 odd years later, he sends it to me in boxes and crates of unlabeled parts for the honor of returning it to the road. I'm hoping to get it there in the next year or so in order to take him for a drive the next time he visits.
I just spent the last 6 months of nights and weekends doing some major repairs on my '54 F100 that pairs with my '65 Morris Mini Traveler as my daily drivers, so a short break was needed before diving into this project. But I'm heading into the shed tonight! I'm sure I'll have numerous questions as I work through the restoration, so thanks in advance.
Conor

 

Thanks, that's a great machine.

 

Here is a nice report on Retromobile. Lots of photos.
http://www.sportscardigest.com/salo...port-photos/?awt_l=67mRc&awt_m=Jaewc4cobes.C0

 

Zoran, did those things had souped up Topo engines?

 

Chris,​

I must admit that most of the "knowledge" collected from internet pages are not quite deep and serious – everything found is more like as picture-book then quality studies... However, I as know - (almost) all of the specials based on Topolino had complete mechanics of serial automobiles, including engines, probably tuned for racing and sport drives... From my experience (only as passenger - my brother was daredevil driver), Topolino was quite lively and good road-holding small automobile (for standards of forties-fifties) in spite of just 16.5 HP from 500 cc engine. Part because of my brother's driving, part of Topolino's small weight – we were quite challenge for other small cars from late sixties...
Probably that with better aerodynamic and lighter “torpedo” body, sporting variants with 20 HP – could be good on fast twisting roads in good hands?
There are attached some more photos... Some models are built by small factories and were more modified.

Zoran​

 

There's a nice shot of the Simca-Gordini on page 4 of the Sports Car Digest show coverage: www.sportscardigest.com/wp-content/uploads/Simca-Gordini-Cinq-Le-Mans-–-1939.jpg

 

Auction results coupled with nice pics.
http://lautomobileancienne.com/resultat-vente-artcurial-collection-roger-baillon/
Wonder how the dealer prices will adapt after this historic sale. Hope it will not spoil our hobby. I like to get my hands dirty on old iron and greasy mechanics, but do not know if I can still afford it.

 

... something more about Topolino/Simca specials. On attached photos is chassis of Simca 5 Berlinette Le Mans with engine from FIAT 600 D, 767 cc and 25 HP! As blog is on French, I couldn't understnad if that was original configuration or modern reconstruction? The same question is about meny mentioned Italian small specilas from fifites that have FIAT 600 d engines! Some had around 40 HP developed from such engines. Web-link:
http://autoreve.auto-blog.fr/59038/SIMCA-5-Berlinette-Le-Mans-Chassis-arriere/

... and, video-link:


Note that engine is moved behind front suspension frame: original or modern modification?
Zoran

 

I wonder also if the coilover shocks are retrofitted to supplement the transverse leaf spring/ upper control arm?

 

That Simca5 is a recent build, kind of hot rodish without telling it as to not hurt the vintage car guys, the body is chopped, I think I have pictures of it from some show from a couple years ago.
At our shop we have a Simca 5 for sale and a simca 5 collector came and wanted only to see what was under the hood especially intake and oiling, apparently there were some perf parts for those cars at the time, ours had none.
Here's today batch from a local junk yard who's owner collects microcars:
Velorex




Vespa 400


Messerschmitt 2 of them


and an Atlas

he has others at an other location.

 

... it is a little strange modification, indeed?​

As there is still transverse leaf-spring - why to add coil spings (over hydraulic shocks)? Leaf spring should be enough for such light auto, but maybe he wanted something stiffer suspension?
Anyway, he replaced old-style piston-type shocks with modern telescopic-type - and keep coil over (for style or stiffness)...

Zoran
​

 

Chris,​

It looks to me as well done reconstruction - I would like to have such good auto for cruising around...
However, there are too much modifications! Chassis is longer, the same as bonnet/hood part of body? If he started from some junk-yard "basket-case", then I would accept any kind of modifications, just to stay in the same style and spirit, keeping one more oldtimer on the road.
Anyway, that was his auto and he could do whatever he want to do with it?

Zoran​

P.S.: It seems to me that all SIMCA-5 had quarter-eliptic rear leaf-springs, the same as the first Topolino models?

 

The finished car doesn't have the coils, just the tube shocks.
I have no clue about the rear springs on the 5

 

Gentlemen , I'm still around but don't get to drop in here as much as I should , but the Jappic recreation is progressing well , the big news , is after a long wait I hope to get the engine this week , so that should spur me on to get going on the huge amount of little jobs that need doing , why is it the last 10% of a project takes 25% of the time

But here is a link to some recent detail pics of the build

https://flickr.com/photos/55288722@N00/sets/72157649331368818

Regards Ade


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!