Projects Build thread: 1959 Edsel Villager wagon

Just about 7 min down the road. I have a feeling it will tie up my whole summer, But I am getting excited about building a new shop. I just hope I dont get sticker shock from the builder. 20 years ago I would build it myself, but im 53, and I want it done so i can get back into my cars.
I am hoping my wagon drives good. But with keeping the FE I am not looking forward to the MPG it will get.

 

yea i'm in the same boat. we currently have a 15 acre place with 2000 sqft house, 1800 sqft shop and a 2000 sqft barn. we really wanted some more acreage so bought 43 acres in a nice wooded area down the road but it doesn't have a shop so we need to build one. the house needs a lot of work too. looking forward to getting that over with so i can get back to working on cars. i definitely want to include 20' eaves, a car lift and a heavy duty hoist system in the plans.

yea the FE tends to barely make double digits. my mileage with 460's has been 16 in cars and 12 in trucks. this is my first electronic one with overdrive and lockup converrter so i'm pretty curious how this one will turn out. my 68 lincoln continental got 16 on the highway, can this one get 18 or 20? i'm not getting my hopes up yet, just wait and see.

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Boyoboy, been so busy with all the other curve balls of life.. when I got back into the shop I first had to grab a broom and knock down all the cob webs. Turned the key and.. she started right up! Kewl!

I did get a chance to order me a new center section with the 2.7:1 gears and a posi. Bought it from ebay member axle0007, he can build you any 9" to your specifications.

One night last weekend I was feeling energetic so I worked from midnight to 6am and got my new rear end installed. I know I know, y'all do it in about 19 minutes right.








I put about 50 miles on the car so far, driving 5, 7, 15, 20 mile sections to give the rear end a chance to get properly broken in. The engine runs about 1500 rpm at 65 mph, beautiful low pull that makes the car feel so effortless.

The temperature does want to run in the 210 range. 460's seem to want to do that. I let it idle for 15-20min and the temperature doesn't climb any further.

It's definitely too low. I live on a private sand road that's very bumpy and being 3" off the ground doesn't work out.

I found this cool chart http://www.nastyz28.com/~Todd80Z28/project_pages/front_springs.htm

And an O/T forum post with more relevant information http://www.78ta.com/HTAF/index.php?topic=35823.0 (I know the car in question is not hamb friendly but the same springs are used)

So the next step is to go weigh the car and measure the height and see which of these springs will work out. I'd like to get stock height, maybe even an inch more, and the softest ride I can get away with... I used to be able to lift up / push down my old Lincoln quite a bit and I really liked the soft ride.

 

Seems like traveling to British Columbia kind of gears.

 

Yes!!! I have a wedding to attend and my dear uncle can be swayed to help me with the interior!

 

The car doesn't have any side mirrors. I'd like to have one on the driver's side at least. Y'all think something like this will work?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/141361677236?lpid=82

 

Awesome build; old wagons are killer plus having an oddball one makes it even better. Great job on the drivetrain transplant.

 

Thanks! Yea I'm quite happy the way it turned out. It looks, drives and feels like a healthy original car while having some relatively subtle upgrades (like, twice as much power )

I just got my new front coil springs, I need to get my other car out of the shop so I can get to installing them..!

 

My new springs are here! I bought them based on the Moog data sheets, have no idea if they will fit



Here's the label about square vs tapered ends, interesting I didn't know they were interchangeable, in fact some folks have told me specifically that they are not...

 

Great build! I'm the new owner of a '59 Edsel 6 passenger wagon so it's good to see other builds happening.
Glenn

 

my car is currently running and driving but needs a fair amount of finishing up. I havent done anything for a couple of months other than to start it and a few drives around the block to keep things fresh. Next up are springs. it keeps bottoming out on my rough road .. this is the country, not suitable for low riders

 

Well things have been super busy but I had some spare time over the holidays, so I went ahead with the spring swap.

Here's a comparison of the old and new springs. You can see the new springs are a fair bit longer! I measured them with a caliper and they are the same diameter.



I decided to use my 40 ton hydraulic press to compress it down, and cut out two metal discs, welded a lip to keep them from slipping out, and added a piece of allthread to hold them down. But the springs wanted to buckle, and also I realized I could only compress half of the spring, because I would not be able to remove the plate from the frame pocket. So I abandoned that idea.

The next approach was to just use one of the metal discs and the allthread through the shock tower, and this worked like a charm. Here I could finally get the last loop into the A-arm pocket. These springs were so long I couldn't even get the top all the way into the frame, I really had to crank the nut on the allthread for a good 9-10" orso to get to this point.




The spring still did want to buckle so I had to use a strap to steady it. Without the strap it would do a Shaggy style "Zoink!" and be all bent to one side.



But.. as one might have guessed from the extreme forces required to get the springs in place.. once I set the car down the springs barely compressed at all and the car was clearly too high. I want to have the car right around stock - certainly not going for the 'gasser' look.




I did drive it for a little bit, but the suspension was banging from topping out. So no choice but to take it back apart and start cutting the springs. I first cut one loop and it was still too high (seems like the bottom loop was pretty flat). In the end I cut about 1 5/8 turn off the springs and the car sits just about perfectly at stock height now. Maybe in hindsight I would have only cut 1 1/2 loop just to make it an inch higher.. just to accomodate a full load without becoming low.

ok, I still need to take a picture of the final result. I haven't taken the car out of the shop yet since the last 'adjustment' (you know, with a plasma cutter)

Speaking of which ... I just picked up a new tool for making precision adjustments

 

What the hell springs did you buy??? I could probably rattle off 2 Moog numbers that would be closer and come in at under 16" free height. Still a very cool wagon.

 

I think the 8000/8002 are the ones that come in real close..
These have like 300lb/in compression rate so they are real soft, that's the main reason I wanted them. Although now that I cut a piece off they will be slightly higher (stiffer) so it may be just about the same in the end.

 

The rates on the 8000 and 8002 are around 420 lbs/inch. You can calculate the difference pretty easily with a simple spring formula, substitute in the # of active coils, between what you started with and what you have now.

 

Watching closely. At some point i will need new front springs on my villager. From working on my 39 ford, I did the same thing on springs, sort of? I bought a spring from Eaton acording to their chart, and it hit the ground when I let it down. Then exchanged it with longer softer one, then it set too tall. I didnt want to cut it so I was able to buy dropped spindles. I have drove it for about 2 years now, and it has sagged to where my tires are rubbing on turns, so before springtime I am putting the stock spindles back on. I like the looks of it now, but not functional.

 

I have a minor concern that my '59 Ford may sit too low after I have the drive train in place. So I have a contingency plan to make up some 1" spacers that will be located on top of the springs up in the pocket. I'm real glad I didn't go with dropped spindles.

 

Yea this one looked ok when I got it with the 223+cruise-o-matic. Then with the 460+e4od , I still remember the day I finally got to pull all the blocks out from under it and lower the jack. It dropped almost all the way to the ground!

Here's how it sat with the old/stock springs and the new engine. Actually just perfect for a lowered car.

 

Cutting the first loop only dropped it marginally since it is pretty flat. After that every 1/4 turn made a significant difference!!
I hope it won't sag much over time because at the moment it sits just fine, I don't want it too low. My dirt road is pretty merciless !!

 

I have not been through the whole thread, but do you know of the post on here, that starts with:"A Cheap and great alternative.....", in regards to using Ford Aerostar springs on this era vehicle?
I think there are 3 to choose from, of different rates, that might work for ya'.
The thread deals with lowering Fords of this era, and maybe, one of the springs experimented with did NOT lower, when the O P was doing the research.
Also, not sure of the weight differences betwixt the FE engine and a 460.
Give it a look, might find some helpful info!


Edit: This thread.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...49-thru-59-ford-and-merc.260795/#post-2768199

 

A set of 1950's Vintage Joma Tribar 602's would be the best

 

I have the Aerostars on my '59 and I'm sure it will drop another 2-3" after the engine is in. Definitely the best spring for the buck.

 

Pretty cool build for sure. I felt your pain on the engine installation, HEAVY. I put a 429 in my latest 32 Roadster project with a C6 attached, heaviest engine I have ever worked with. Scratched some paint getting it in the chassis, so I can just imagine all the tugging and swearing that went into getting that engine in the front of the wagon!

 

In my case the original springs + added weight just about slammed it, could not make it out of my driveway without doing some grading along the way. I did like the real soft ride. That's why I picked the springs that are very soft and tall. The aerostar springs will likely be nice and soft but I doubt they will keep the car far enoughoff the ground.

 

Just to illustrate the progress, I went back through my pictures and picked the different iterations in the process.
Initially I had the rack mounted too low and it was almost dragging on the ground. So I re-mounted the rack real close to the frame.
After that the tie rods were much more level but still down, so next I installed the new springs.. then it was real high so I cut them down and now it looks like in the bottom picture

 

..and completely in "cosmetics salesman" tradition I took that last picture with a $3000 camera instead of a $200 camera

 

Do you have a side view of the car?

 

I haven't taken it out of the shop yet, just finished buttoning it back up. Let me see if I can get one inside..

 

Here is my 59 with aero star springs. I got 3" drop with them and it still rides good. Good investment


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