I've seen the other threads but I want to make sure I get this right, never done it before. I want to raise and radius my fenders about an inch higher. Do I cut the fenders to the finished size I want, then fillet weld some 3/16" or 1/4" rod behind and just slightly lower than the cut line? Or is there some way to roll a new lip in place? Fenders aren't removable.
Could be the camera angle. But, to answer the question, yes that is one way to radius wheel wells. We used to use 1/2" conduit tubing, you have to clean off the galvanize before you weld it.
Bend some 1/2" diameter conduit to the new shape you desire after the axle is centred if at all possible and check that you have an even radius. Cut off the unneeded section leaving 3/4" all around. Clamp the conduit in place and hammer form the new lip. That's what I'd do as all you'd need to do then is dress up the new lip and surrounding areas. Repeat on other side taking careful measurements to replicate the same radius. A lot less work IMHO than cutting and welding etc. Retains OEM style bead and strong, run into existing front and rear beads.
That sounds pretty good! My fenders are a mess, the other side is too far the other way but part of that is the camera angle and part is the funky shape of the fender. In addition to raising them I hope to get them (and the rear end) centered under the radius where they are welded to the bed. I don't want to end up with a sharp edge on the inside though since tire clearance is tight, maybe I could hammer roll all the way into a U?
Try making a cardboard templet to the radius you like. Center it on the wheel/tire and draw it on to the fender. You may be able to cut the opening in a manner that will make it center on the tire. Looks to enough beef in the fender to do it. Its certainly worth drawing a few lines to experiment with. Tim
Thanks Tim. Here is a better photo with a mock up wheel. As you can see by the dotted circle the fender has an odd shape, high in the middle. I would like to make the fender match this radius, maybe a bit higher up, and of course straighten it out towards the ends. My real concern is the best way to form the new radius. If I could fold inward a new flange like the U shaped one it has that would be great but I don't know if the metal will do that.
If the fenders can't be removed it's going to be difficult at best to roll the edges of the fenders under after you reshape them. HRP
What you've drawn has sure made the opening look a lot better. I would think about welding on a piece of 1/4 or 3/8 rod and flare to the outside, if that's not contrary to what you invision.
I thought maybe someone knew of a hand held lip roller of some sort, like this Eastwood thingy. I got a kick out of the "works without having to remove the wheel!". Is this a timed event? Anyway the car they are using it on appears to be made out of tin foil. I don't want a flared edge on the outside but I do like the idea of welding 1/4" rod. I think if I put it on the inside I can weld it like this.
When I did my 1/4's I cut my opening to size and welded 3/8 brake line to the edge centered under the metal so it didn't have a big flange. Body filler to finish and has a nice rounded edge. Suppose you could weld to bottom inside of metal and finish off so no flange but a return.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/47-chevy-custom-build-thread.933720/page-3 I did a reshaping of my fender opening, without a lip, on my 47 Chevy. All you need is a piece of plywood, a jigsaw, and maybe a router. The results, if you take your time, come out very professional, and you get the exact same shape on both sides. If your fenders curve inward a lot, as they go toward the ground, as most fat fenders do, you probably need to use a shrinker-stretcher to recurve your fenders to the right contour, after reshaping the opening. You could also do it by cutting a series of slits in the inner lip. Those fender roller just bend in the inner lip on late model cars, to give an extra 1/2" clearance, they do not reshape the opening!
The fenders don't need a typical edge distance to look good. So draw away to look good to your eyes. You could tackle the lip in a bunch of different ways, depending on what equipment you have, the skills you possess and the look you want. The size of bead or no bead contour, wire edge detail. Adding the 1/4 rod like your sketch would give you some strength, but it's weld will likely to pull the fender in so you'll need to straighten as you go. The top will make a great water trap too, so some sort of water ramp will be needed. A hammer form could be made to turn in a small stiffener lip fairly easily. You could form the entire edge off the car and weld it onto the fender also. You'd could shape the opening anyway you want or envision.
Boy that turned out nice. I like the plywood idea, though being off the car and with a larger flat area to clamp to makes it easier. I still might be able to make a wood buck that would fit. Thanks!
31V, about time you chimed in . Good point on the water catch. It doesn't rain here though, except for about 20 inches last week! Flooded my garage and my shed is about to slide down the hill it's sitting on. I'm at a bit of a crossroads, trying to avoid what happened to you with your '34. The previous owner brazed my bolt on fenders to the body and bondoed over that. And they are skewed as much as 1/2" from each other, they really need to be cut off and start over. But then the bed is a mess too... it's actually fairly straight looking and drivable now, I'd like to keep it that way until I get the mechanicals and everything else the way I want it and then have a pro do it right. Can you explain the "hammer form"?
Hammer form would be a form in the shape of what you want usually made of wood. Then the metal is hammered over that form. I can see quick fixes to get in the ball park, but throwing good after bad just don't make any sense to me. If you cut them to fit now with them 1/2" off with intent to move them later then they are off again. Up to you but thank goodness nobody can see both sides at the same time . Sort of hard to determine what others did, but is one side off by 1/2 or are both off 1/4 ? As far as my car goes, they rebuilt the wheel lip with tiny little pieces over lapped like shingles and snotted together with weld. Then paved the whole mess with mud carved to perfection.
Many guys saide use 1/2 inch conduit. My thought is use 1/4 round stock tac 2 lenths together every 4 inches or so and bend it. Then cut the tacs and you have your edge for both the right and left side and the are exactly the same!
Blowby...a hammerform is exactly what I made to do my fenders. If it's easier, you can even do them in 2 or 3 sections instead of all at once. You'd want to use reference holes to be sure they line up correctly, both to each other, and to the other side. While I did them off the car, you could probably do it on the car as well. A bit more struggling, but I'd bet it will be less time, and work, than any bending and welding job would be, not to mention, no warpage and the need to correct it, from welding.
OK, I thought those were called a buck. Yesterday I made a paper pattern of where my fenders are welded to the bed and was happy to find they are only off about 1/4" from each other. I have a feeling it's the outer edge that varies more, the part I will be cutting off. The other side doesn't have that raised part at the top. It's the factory edge but who knows with American Bantam, only 500 pickups ever made. In any case when I do cut them I will make them the same dimension to each other. So it again comes down to which way to form the lip. UA's idea of 1/4 welded every 4 inches was also my original thought but I also wonder: If I made a matching cut on both fenders 3/8 from my finished line, made a hammerform out of 1/8" steel of the finished radius that was only a foot long or so, clamped that behind and hammered the edge over that, perhaps with some heat to form a complete U, and moved it as needed until I got to where the fenders straighten out, the make a new form for those areas. How does that sound? Can't work in the shop until after the holidays unfortunately, too much non-hot rod stuff going on.
You can try that, but the chances of getting a truly nice smooth radius with a moving back up will be quite a challenge. Basically you'll be shrinking the turned edge in the radius and just bending on the straights, so that means every hammer blow will be creating ripples and tucks that you'll be beating into each other collapsing the metal into itself. Whole lotta lotta metal reading with a movable backup. The fender will want to bow into the bed for lack of shrinks, and hammering tucks that move can stretch it instead of shrink making it worse. If i were bending 3/8" I would make the form 1/2 at least and probably 3/4" MDF because there's a lot of it around here. When you've finished, the 3/8 bend will not be uniform and will require trimming. With a 1 solid piece secured and stationary it takes care of a lot that can go wrong or in the opposite direction. The metal follows the form, with a movable you'll be directing the metal, and metal is puzzling at times.
Listen to 31 Vicky! And another thing you'd have to be careful about is using steel as a form. Hammering against it can stretch the metal, so when you unclamp it, things might go awry. Hammerforms are usually made of wood or aluminum, so you can hit the sheet metal and shrink it without the form trying to stretch it.
I made a cardboard template a little smaller diameter than the opening size I wanted and used a hammer and comma dolly to roll the edge 180 degrees with about a 3/8" bead. Here is the finished product with some black primer touch up.
Dirty, crude, possibly ugly in the wrong hands, but traditional as fuck I have multiple articals from back in the day with guys like george barris doing just that
hi, if you take a strip of plywood a little longer than then you need to get past fender lip drill a hole in one end use a rod or some thing long enough to touch the center of the rear axel then find the spot you what your radius to start drill a 1/2 hole stick a sharpie in it move from one end to the other and you'll have your radius . back in the day they made pliers for doing what you want they had a half round on oneside and a piece round stock on the other . only about a half inch wide . pliers looked like channel locks . I have 2 0riganal pairs . i'm also old and stupid and can't figure how to up load pics. if you send me your email I can send you a pic. of what they look like.
Well I made my first cut. I'll have to play with it some, maybe raise and fine tune before finishing.
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