Just saw these pop up reading GoodGuys media coverages. Johnsons Hot Rod shop in Gadsden Alabama is making them I guess. SSBC disc brake guts with these polished pieces on the exterior. It's the only picture I could find so far. Seems to have the outer scoops on the outboard hub, but can't really tell from here. I called earlier, maybe the time zone difference, or too early....but no answer today. I always liked the Doane Spencer car, and realize his are the real deal.......Hurst Airheart and Kinmonts thru the years.....but has anyone perhaps popped on these yet? Any info, or writeups ? I sure can't find anything but this....thus far....but maybe someone else has more intelligence here. Sure do look great, and I guess with the hidden disc setups....should work great too. Dunno'. Supposed to be 2300 bucks for a pair.
Big thread on them a while ago. They have a similar appearance, but not the real thing. Kinda like New Coke.
I still can't find it. If you get crazy, or lucky.....do you mind posting the thread if you beat me to it ? Thank you sir. I typed in Kinmont Safe Stop with zero for my results. LOL
Dude........you are the MAN !! Thank you very much. Found one guy here with them installed, 25 pages of build thread........I'll have to read that when I get home. THANKS AGAIN sir!
You would think that someone out there would attempt to actually devise a newer technology, better materials repurpose of the original design one day. It would be a jackpot situation for both the builders and the manufacturers.....I would think. It's surprising that So-Cal, O'Briens, Speedway, or someone along the same would not think it to be a great new product. Oh well, I guess.
My thoughts... I got to handle a set of these at the LA Roadster show this year and came away impressed. They are fucking gorgeous and manufactured like a fine watch or something. I mean, they are really well made. They will not, however, ever be confused as the real thing by anyone that knows Kinmonts. Part of that is simply because these are made so much better than the originals... And, of course, they are just different. So, where does that leave us as traditional hot rodders? If you want a period car, these aren't your brakes in my opinion. They aren't Kinmonts and I don't think they were made to be reproductions of them either... They aren't faking anything - they are just a different kind of brake with an inspired look. If you are building a traditionally inspired hot rod these brakes look fantastic (way better than those silly fake Buick drums that hide discs inside) and from what I've heard, they work great as well. My conclusion? Really fucking cool on the right car.
Lol.....awesome. I love you. It's hard for me to go full old school on some things, but love those that choose to devise new ways of old school. I thought they were real deal Kinmont repros initially, and then figured out that they weren't sort of......the covers so to speak....but gorgeous and more so.....DIFFERENT.... then what you see every day. I like different. Lurking thru the day, some have said there is an attempt to actually reproduce down to the minute details....the actual Kinmont braking system....which I would also think would be badass......but then again....would they perform better then the originals? I would like to see them too. My OT build is initially modified over 30 years ago.....it had Hal Baer disc brakes which were essentially retro improved Hurst Airhearts.....they worked great for what they were. Example of re-invent improvement done well. This was before the advent of 4 and 6 piston calipers of course. Guessing that those Baer oldies would be worth something now to somebody. This is my first thread here, and I apologize for my avatar......I have had some luck picking up pieces of traditional hot rod interest, here and there, but am FARRRRR away from actually putting anything together....to be of any real HAMB threat. I love everything about this site, and try to absorb as much as possible here. Thanks for the answer.....and more so....thanks for not kicking my Torino ass out of here to boot. You will see something Hamb'er in my garage soon. I have the sickness.....for sure.
Faux Kinmonts http://www.streetrodderweb.com/tech/1309_window_shopper_september_2013/ Johnson Kinmonts are modeled after the original Kinmont Safety Stop brakes of the ’40s. This modern disc brake version uses 11-inch vented rotors, four-piston calipers, and comes complete with all proper dust and weather seals (for zero maintenance). Unlike other similar kits, Johnson Kinmonts has easy access to bleed the brake system. The aluminum hubs are available in all bolt patterns from 5-on-4.5 to 5-on-5.5, and the assembly will bolt on reproduction and early Ford round-back spindles ’37-40. All parts are cast/machined in the United States. Cost: $2,300 in natural-cast finish. Johnson’s Hot Rod Shop (256) 492-5989 www.johnsonshotrodshop.com
I did a fairly in-depth 4-page article on these in issue #59 of The Rodder's Journal. On the opening spread we show the Johnson's Kinmonts next to an original set for comparison. (I'll see if I can get a high res scan of the layout to post on here.) As Ryan said, they are not intended to be a copy of the originals, though they were reverse engineered from an original set and then the dimensions were tweaked in order to fit the modern brake components within. I've seen them on a few cars now, and they look excellent.
Silly fake Buick drums? Maybe a bit harsh, considering the conversion has been out for over 15 years, is marketed and sold by one of your very respected and well known vendors, and has been used on many high end traditional/modern hot rods by some of the best builders. The rotors and calipers on the Johnsons look to be the same or similar Wilwood parts used on the SoCal kits, and result in a great performing brake. IMO, anytime a disc upgrade is used on the front axle is a good thing, and while some may hide the caliper better than others, as does the Johnson Kinmont, they all should deserve some credit. Now, what I think is really silly is running 50+ years old genuine Buick alloy drums with genuine 66+ year old Lockheed drum brakes on the front axle of high powered hot rods in today's traffic. 'Course, that's from someone that uses alternators and electric fans.
My Buick drums work great!....one time. Not easy to keep round either. The worst brakes I ever had were Pontiac 8 lug style.
That's what the picture description indicated, this is a prototype Tucker transaxle and not the production unit that had drum brakes.
That is a Tucker prototype engine. That thing sticking out that looks a little like the brakes in question, is a torque converter.
They certainly are trying to "fake" the real thing. Johnson's wouldn't be using "Kinmont" in its marketing or have designed the brakes to look like Kinmonts to anyone but those who are familiar with the real-deal. These things are the same exact concept as the silly fake Buick drums that hide discs inside. They just happen to have a different veil over them.
IMHO...if Kinmont brakes were the Holy-Grail of drums...so much so that they bring 5 figure prices...then WHY are the repops such a different design, and IF the design was changed to improve the brakes... then how "Holy" were the originals. THIS is why certain aspects of this culture are so rediculously over-priced. They become RARE only because too many people have them on a shelf and won't part with them because they can't get that 5 figure pay-back on their investment....get real.
Bass Kustoms said that someone was trying to actually re-produce "originals" down to the last detail....on one of his old threads. THAT would be cool. Just to have something new, and manageable price wise to start with would be great. Altering $10k originals to perhaps resto-modify would hurt financially. I like the odd stuff, and have tried to collect pieces to build a cool car around. I'm sorry to get into the argument of real versus fake. Disc in drum versus real deal original Kinmonts. I just had high opinion of the builder and thought they looked cooler then the finned drum disc setup that's being run. Until the reproduction Kinmont originals appear....(if they make it)....there isn't much available numbers wise for the average guy to have....if you want something "close". Thanks for all the information guys. I may just wait, or who knows? I don't wait long for stuff I like......
here is a little better pic. Do they look 100% exactly like Kinmonts? no. But they are much better looking and functioning than the fake buick stuff.
The Kinmont design is a complicated setup. Take a look at previous Kinmont threads, particularly this one: "Pics: Kinmont Brakes". The "Credit Card Builders" that make up the market for the Johnson Fauxmonts want things that are familiar and don't require a lot of thought to install or setup. The Johnson brakes fit that bill; they're basically a SSBC disc brake with a fancy cover. The Kinmonts are the "holy grail" because they've always been rare and have long been coveted by people who know what they are. They're expensive for a reason. If you can't pay to play, save your pennies until you can or find an alternative. There are a lot of other cool vintage brakes out there beyond just the old standby Ford drums. That would be Bob Wilson of Wilson Welding. He has been very close to having something ready for a (now) very long time. Who knows if he'll ever get them to market.
I am a big fan of the JHRS products including the new Kinmont Clones they produce. I don't have a set for my new roadster but they will be installed when Santa arrives this year. I know several people prefer the real thing and have bragging rights for brakes that only marginally worked proper to begin with. If that's your thing, then spend the $10K for a set…no problem. I had original Buicks on both the front and rear of my last roadster and they worked fine but the cost was way more than a set of reproduction SO-CAL units. My point is if you are looking for "the look" without the big investment then I believe they are the best deal on the market. I talked to several people who had them on their car at the LARS and they said they do stop very well. I think that is what we are all looking for. As Troy Ladd said, "Respect Tradition" which I feel JHRS does in all of their products. Here are a few examples of the original Buicks, JHRS and Kinmonts that have the look I like. If you like a style and can step up to the real thing then do so, but if you want a similar look for less with better stopping power, then try an alternative like JHRS products. I spent a lot of time in junk yards and got a long deal from Mr. Wilson to obtain the look I wanted on my last roadster. I even installed the Buick drums and backing plates on the Halibrand rear axle. Lots of work. Here is the look I am after on my new roadster. Here is a set of the real Kinmonts - can you live with the above units? I can.
Here is my take on the Johnsons Kinmonts.....While I like the looks of alot of Johnsons stuff they have designed and built, And they do Great work as well!...These brakes to me look like a Bad Cheap China made copy of the Kinmont disc brakes. The backing plate looks wrong, And nothing about the cover fits the backing plate at all...The Gap between the backing plate and the cover looks like shit! I mean it looks like they don't even belong together. And I am not beating their product up, But I know the talent these guys have, And they could have done a hell of alot better than this. I do not understand Why they Used such big brakes to have to deal with hiding. There is alot of smaller import stuff or wilwood makes smaller disc brakes that they could have used and made their backing plates and covers more like original Kinmonts, Atleast that way They may actually look like kinmonts....I am sorry If anyone takes offense, But In my opinion, Using "kinmonts" Name on such a poor replica of his Brakes is a Insult to "Robert Kinmont" If I were them I would call them "Johnsons Brakes", Instead of "Johnsons Kinmonts" just my 2 cents.....In fairness I do see room to make them look a little better, By closing up that ugly gap some to start with. Also they could have machined a ring that looked like the original plate to fit inside the notches on the cover.
Thanks to everyone that has complimented the brakes or anything else I have had a part in. I know everyone is entitled to their own opinion but I think some of the photos posted here misrepresent some of the details. The gap that has been referred to is a photo of the first prototype and there is a ring that inserts into the drum cover notches to replicate the look of the original. The four piston caliper used is machined specific for my application and is smaller than any other caliper that has the same stopping power. And all the parts are made in the U.S.A I will be happy to answer any questions someone might have about them. Thanks again.
You are right about Bad photos, Because that Looks A hell of alot better!...That ring was much needed and made a world of diffrence....The offset of this wheel Helps too. And I sure hope I did not offend you with my opinion, As Like I said as well, You are a very talented builder.
It’s all good. No offense taken. If you hang around the group I do you have to be thick skinned. I just wanted to clear up what I thought was misrepresenting the product. Thanks again