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To bondo or not to bondo?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by scoggman, Jan 3, 2013.

  1. scoggman
    Joined: Feb 25, 2009
    Posts: 478

    scoggman
    Member

    Well, I'm about to get ready to paint the model a, so I rolled her out of the garage to look her over in the light. I've done the best I can trying to straighten it out but it is still rough, should I put a healthy coat of bondo on this or shoot is as is with all the war wounds? Just wondering if you have had a bondo job blow up on you or have you shot a car and wish you would have smoothed it out more. Thanks, Jon
     

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  2. BISHOP
    Joined: Jul 16, 2006
    Posts: 2,571

    BISHOP
    Member

    Well, you cant leave it like that.

    Now is your time to prove to yourself how good you can get at metal work.

    You can straighten that without a bunch of mud. If you really put your heart into it.
     
  3. DocWatson
    Joined: Mar 24, 2006
    Posts: 10,273

    DocWatson
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    What colour, shiny, just what are you hoping to get out of the paint? If it's going to be flat or satin I would leave it, or maybe do a spray on bondo coat and give it a good going over with a flat board.
    But hell, there is thousands of better people on the HAMB to tell you what to do so I will just shut up now!!.......

    Doc.
     
  4. scoggman
    Joined: Feb 25, 2009
    Posts: 478

    scoggman
    Member

    This is what I started with, it looks TONS better, but just looking for experiences. The car is going to be a daily driver.
     

    Attached Files:


  5. I'd keep going on metalwork,you'll be much happier.
     
  6. BISHOP
    Joined: Jul 16, 2006
    Posts: 2,571

    BISHOP
    Member

    This is just me.......... These cars are art, and should be treated as art.

    No mater what you start with, if it looks like poop in the end, well..... you got poop.
     
  7. Bruce A Lyke
    Joined: Jun 21, 2009
    Posts: 2,523

    Bruce A Lyke
    Member

    i did a lot of research here and in books on body work and most seem to say first step is to get the metalwork as close as you can. Then prime it with Epoxy and then a light coat of body filler.
    That is the step I'm on now, just in from a evening of making "good enough" better with some light filler.
    Since it is all ready now, you any want to just plan on spending some more time, unless you are sure you will like it as is at least for now. MTCW
     
  8. Model T1
    Joined: May 11, 2012
    Posts: 3,309

    Model T1
    Member

    Keep working on it slowly. Get a cheap dolly and hammer kit and try pounding out some of those dents from the inside.....slowly. Then paint with a good building primer and work on it again. A skim coat of Bondo on the deeper dents will help.
    A good candidate for flat primer or a light finish coat. Take your time.
     
  9. Gremlinguy
    Joined: Oct 29, 2009
    Posts: 505

    Gremlinguy
    Member

    You will be allot happier if you keep going on the metal work work. Then some nice plastic filler work, prime and paint.
     
  10. themole
    Joined: Oct 5, 2011
    Posts: 40

    themole
    Member
    from So-Cal

    Definitely bang those dents out. Bondo shouldn't be used to avoid body work. I wouldn't apply it too much more than 1/8". I've never put bondo over any kind of primer. I've always applied it directly to bare, (usually sand blasted), metal. If the metal isn't blasted, be sure to rough it first with sandpaper. Guide coating the bondo will help get it flat. Did this on a 32 highboy frame when working for Magoo's. Car took first in class at Oakland.
     
  11. Bondo over primer.
    Bondo under primer.

    OK. Who is right and why?
     
  12. Do it right, or do it twice. Your decision.
     
  13. sbakar
    Joined: Mar 20, 2009
    Posts: 37

    sbakar
    Member

    These guys have some interesting products that you might want to look into. www.clausenautobody.com

    The All-U-Need filler claims to have no shrinkage, etches straight to metal, sandable, yet waterproof and solvent-proof. Sounds like a high-tech Bondo.
     
  14. Dirty Dug
    Joined: Jan 11, 2003
    Posts: 3,712

    Dirty Dug
    Member

    Get it blasted before you do anything else. You'll be glad you did. Then start pounding on it lightly until it's straighter before you smear anything on it.
     
  15. BarryA
    Joined: Apr 22, 2007
    Posts: 643

    BarryA
    Member

    Take your time to school yourself a little on metalfinishing. (Some tech articles on here, or check out Metalmeet.com or allmetalshaping.com)

    It is tedious but really not hard to do at all. But you need to know what you are trying to achieve - wailing away on dents could do more harm than good and things can get out of shape and overstretched fast. Slow and steady wins it, monitoring the effects of your actions as you go.

    You can decide exactly how far you want to take it, but that is DEFINITELY not ready for mud yet!!
     
  16. patrick english
    Joined: Feb 15, 2008
    Posts: 806

    patrick english
    Member
    from La puente

    bondo on bare metal..i dont know why,but thats how its done.
     
  17. cornbinder52
    Joined: Dec 31, 2006
    Posts: 385

    cornbinder52
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Body shop I worked in during high school always did bondo to bare metal, usually prepped with a 60 or 40 grit sanding disk.
    Get some of those dents leveled out, then throw the bondo at it. Most good paint jobs have filler under them, it just is not a cure all.


    Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad
     
  18. Bruce A Lyke
    Joined: Jun 21, 2009
    Posts: 2,523

    Bruce A Lyke
    Member

    I suspected this would come up and have done it on bare metal in the past but after a lot of reading am going over the epoxy this time.
    It seems to be a preference issue without a night and day difference. The key is to have it properly prepared to receive the hopefully small amount of filler needed.
     
  19. chopolds
    Joined: Oct 22, 2001
    Posts: 6,208

    chopolds
    Member
    from howell, nj
    1. Kustom Painters

    First, if you use epoxy, you can use bondo under it, OR over it. There are good opinions on both sides. I use both techniques, depending on the situation.
    Get rid of the rust first. Blasting is best, glass bead, sand, or slag. Media doesn't remove rust.
    Metal work: Lots of controversy here. There are a few really good metal masters here on the HAMB, and they always recommend metal finishing to perfection, if possible, no filler! Now, I'd say 99% of the rest are not nearly that good, including me. Your panels definately have too many dents to just "pave over". I'd recommend finding someone to help you out if you're having difficulty with it. If you really want to learn, buy the book by Frank Sargent, "Key to Metal Bumping" and get some practice. A couple good quality body hammers, a couple dollies, a spoon, and a slapper file should be all you need to get those panels shaped up. The slapper is a great beginner tool, and I highly recommend it. You can actually see your progress as you go along, and you can both shrink and stretch, as well as flatten metal as you go. It may not make it metal finishing perfect, but as a beginner, you won't be there for a few years anyway.
    I like to try and keep my filler thickness (lead or bondo) to 1/8" or less. 1/4"should be the absolute max, only in situations where you can't work it any more, or places you cannot access. My chopped 55 Olds has been done for over 30 years, with bondo over BRASS, and there are only 2 spots where the filler has cracked.....the bottoms of the C pillars, where a lot of stress is. And the body was so bad, and my abilities were much less than now, so the filler was a bit thicker on that car, than more recent ones. So using filler, even bondo, is NOT the end of the world! It will hold up well, IF your metalwork is good underneath.
    Good luck!
     
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  20. go-twichy
    Joined: Jul 22, 2010
    Posts: 1,648

    go-twichy
    BANNED

    i do under and over as well.
     
  21. Rusty Kustoms
    Joined: Feb 5, 2006
    Posts: 238

    Rusty Kustoms
    Member

    First off, bondo is brand of plastic filler, avoid it like the plague. Get a good quality filler from your local body supplier, most pros will recommended Rage or USC brands. 3M/dynatron/bondo is all the same low quality filler, 3M owns bondo now.

    Second, there are many different types of body filler. Metal filler- this is a thick heavy filler usually silver in color, supposed to have metal in it for heavy fills, again avoid this filler.
    Fiberglass filler- this comes in short strand and long strand versions and is a fiberglass reinforced plastic filler. OK to use this sparingly, still not OK to fill holes or put it on very thick. Stick to the short strand variety for better workability
    Plastic body filler- this is what is commonly called bondo. Find a good quality filler and have fun.
    Polyester filler or "glaze"- this is a thin topcoat for finishing, marketed as brushable or pourable it is best to spread on like any other filler. This is for filling small imperfections and pinholes.

    Now that we know a bit about fillers lets talk about the correct use. Fiberglass strand should be used sparingly for the hard to bodywork areas, these areas may require a little more filler than recommended, don't worry it happens. This is also a good filler to use over welds, it is waterproof and will fill in tiny pinholes and imperfections. Apply this over ground bare metal only. Plastic filler is your general go to, use within the guidelines and you will have no problems. This is for use over ground or mechanically etched metal or epoxy primer only, DO NOT USE ON TOP OF PAINTED OR PRIMED AREAS. Polyester filler or glaze is great for light fills and correcting small imperfections. This is only meant to be very thin and is a great product. Shrinkage is minimal and this is a perfect filler for that final finish. Use this filler over any mechanically etched surface, metal, primer, paint.

    As always metal finish to your best ability, or someone else's best ability, whatever fits your budget. Use fillers correctly and you will have no issues. Bodywork is very time consuming but the end result it worth it, take your time and ask questions if you don't know.
     
  22. ChefMike
    Joined: Dec 16, 2011
    Posts: 647

    ChefMike
    Member

    I think in the long run you will be much happier if you did more metal work, its work thats for sure but thats what I would do !
     
  23. greazy john
    Joined: Oct 13, 2007
    Posts: 457

    greazy john
    Member

    do it once ..paint...be happier...car is also happy !!!!!
     
  24. scoggman
    Joined: Feb 25, 2009
    Posts: 478

    scoggman
    Member

    Thanks guys, yeah I'll keep working on it some. Most of the metal is streached out, so the hammer an dolly thing isn't cutting it. You guys have an recomendations on shrinking hammers or those shrinking disks? I've also heard you could use a torch and heat it up then cool it down, I'll do some more searching. The metal is just so thin, the doors are like aluminum foil, just don't want to mess them up anymore than they are.
     
  25. Prep the metal correctly, then epoxy (remember you have a "window" of time before you have to sand the epoxy to apply filler). I like to let it cure and sand it anyway.
    Bondo is talc based, an absorbent. You want to keep any moisture from getting to that filler.
    When you are happy with your filler work..epoxy again.
    It's a P.I.T.A., but anytime you hit bare metal cover it with epoxy.
    After your filler is "sandwiched" in epoxy, start applying your surfacer.
     
  26. saltflats
    Joined: Aug 14, 2007
    Posts: 12,592

    saltflats
    Member
    from Missouri

    I like using the trans star 6161 epoxy primer sealer because it drys shiny and you can see your work. It helps me keep an eye on my proggress.
     
  27. Gearhead Graphics
    Joined: Oct 4, 2008
    Posts: 3,890

    Gearhead Graphics
    Member
    from Denver Co

    be careful shrinking, maybe try to get someone to come help an teach you.

    Once you get the hang of it, heating it up to a dull red with a torch and a quick cool will shrink it back, but only do tiny areas at at time...
     
  28. I suck at body work, but i'd continue working on that. Maybe if its to far streched you could cut it out and weld a peice in?
     
  29. I'm with Chopolds 90% of builders will use fillers. the other 10% lie about it !!
     
  30. gearheadbill
    Joined: Oct 11, 2002
    Posts: 1,318

    gearheadbill
    Member

    "These cars are art, and should be treated as art."

    No offense meant but I couldn't DISAGREE more.
     

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