Where were all the HA/GR's at the Hamb Drags? I think this would have been the place to be if you owned one. Are they still being built? Is the interest fading? Just curious.
Since I own an HA/GR car I will take a stab at the question. The places where this type of race car have taken hold is where there is a race series. The HA/GR style cars can get together and race each other and have some sociability in the pits. California has the ANRA races and Rocky's Eagle Field meets. Australia has a legitimate class within their sanctioning body and a number of races where several show up. The Tulsa area has a series of races for the SDRA-style cars. (If I get the next section wrong, please someone correct me) 2b-Banjo and Cowboy Bob in Wisconsin built cars about the same time and raced each other. A few additional cars were under construction in their area but fizzled for various reasons. There's little incentive to build an HA/GR car to run one day a year at MoKan. And run brackets or Test and Tune at the local strip the rest of the time.
It might help to run an optional class of HA/GR and HA/GR--A, with a 6 tenths head start for the standard when they race together. Joe
$.02 (minus taxes, of course), In addition (to my eyes), there will never be a large or wide-spread following of such a fringe class. Let's face it, HA/GR requires, before anything else, and at the least, a fascination with a style of vehicle and it's operation long since superseded by automated equipment. Then, it needs to draw from a limited supply of this type person, mostly already engaged in other aspects of the fetish. Even then, building one further requires a knowlege of, and skill level for, fabrication and engineering that is nowhere near as common as these things once were, not to mention tuning knowlege long out of use. Lastly, driving one without shattering parts on an hourly basis requires techniques and attention to the machine's needs that few are willing to learn these days. Hell. Here, on this board, is one of the damn few places it could've been born. And as well, one of the damn few places it could've grown at all. That it has grown, to the extent it has, is likely as much fulfillment as it's capable of at this point in it's life. I quite doubt it's dead, and I fully expect it'll grow still further, just more like a lilac rather than a river sedge. As to leadership? My own opinion's that it's better growing sparodically, in out of the way, shaded canyons than rife out on the plains. Frankly, it's reminiscent of the way the sport grew originally. To quote a great comic; "Of course that's just my opinion, I could be wrong".
We could all be wrong, but that is just in the minds of "normal people". My feeling is that it takes a somewhat distorted personality to even consider building one of these cars. Logically, it makes no sense to build a car that doesn't fit into the current classes and technology. That said, there is something very alluring to a small segment of our "hot rodding community" about building a race car from chalk marks on the floor and a bunch of 50 plus year old parts the way that the early drag racing cars were made. To those among us who enjoy this kind of warped passion, it doesn't really matter if there are only one or two other cars of this kind in the area, or if you only get to run the car once or twice a year. A great deal of the fun is in the building. I guess it's like the guys who build replicas or restore FEDs from the '60s and '70s only to "cackle" them. That doesn't appeal to me and I'm sure that most of those folks see no sense in building "replica relics" that run in the 14 second range when there are lots of modern "door slammers" that will go quicker and faster right off the showroom floor, "box stock". Different strokes for different folks. We may never see the mythical 8 car HA/GR field at a meet in the near or even distant future. Doesn't really matter if the few cars that are out there are running somewhere and the guys that built them are still banging gears and grinning. That is in it's self what this is all about. Hope to have ours running next year and we'll be glad to run against any others that show up. If there aren't any others our there we'll be running time only single passes and grinning anyway. Guess its a sickness that I have that can't be cured.
H.A.M.B. Gas Rail -- HA/GR, They got that name because the rules were made up here, on the main board, and then this board was created to group us together. They are made to look like the early dragsters of the early 50's, but with more modern safety equipment. the rules are posted in a sticky at the top. You are welcome to join in. I like your ford.
on the thursday before the hamb drags OBFG NIGEL and HIS bud JUICE honored the SDRA guys inTULSA with a visit .They got 50 cent tour of BOB Hindmans shop and the senile old mens shop. There was was a lot bench raceing and a little bit of BS. WE enjoyed haveing them and hope they enjoyed us. BOB W-OLD SIX-440 are on the mark with their comments ,these cars are harder to build than you think. one reason you cant call 1-800 send parts. you have build and hunt parts and some folks are just not up to that. as to interest we have had 435 hits on our rules site thats in 10 months just over one aday.last week at test and tune we had two folks wanting to know about the cars one was a woman and she asked good questions . so the interest is there. we have 3 new cars in the process of being built at this time, one is getting a body over at the senile old mens shop maybe we will make the magic 8 next year mean while we will endevor to persevere
Gentlemen, Just in case it slipped past some of us, the Photo & Info thread I started is for SDRA cars as well, it's for both HAMBster types. Nigel & some of the Ozzies and Joe're already on. 'Vicky, no sweat, the two going classes are ...... HA/GR; HAMB (Hokey Ass Message Board)/ Gas Rail SDRA; Senior Drag Racing Association Both are variants of the original concept begun on the HAMB. Other variants have been proposed (and battled, passionately ), but none as yet have shown any traction other than these first two.
Nah, I'm sure we were shunted to a sub-board just to keep us hyper-freaks out of more normal freaks' hair.
One day I'd love to make the Mokan trip and I'm sure my West Coast friends would love to join me with the INVASION, but only time will tell! "O" and I tell people Hokey Ass / Gas Rail
With 6-7 HA/GR running here in Southern California and 4 more being built (both ha/gr & sdra) along with the guys in Pacific Northwest with 4-5 more SDRA type cars I think the HAMBster cars are alive and well out on "The Coast". I agree that we don't need leadership, but I will say that we have three fine spokesman out this way for the HAMBster cars in (old6, 440, Toymaker). It should be noted that it is a lot more fun building one of these cars when you know you have a place like the ANRA & Eagle Field races to run your car when it is done.
i didnt even get to spectate. worst of all my job took me right past the track a few days before, while preprations were being made. what a bummer. but like i said when i first opened my big mouth and declared myself to be one of the fold, i still intend to make my self imposed deadline of 2012. i hope to see several of ya'll there. when i started my project, if you can call it that, i stated abudget of 3535.35 as a joke. i know that number is quite high unless i decided to turn loose with a bunch of machine work. thing is since i stated my desire to build one of these cars my business took a down turn and spare change really did become a rarity. im not complaining, i've still got work and the bills are getting paid but the projects are suffering. i still intend to make passes at next years HAMB drags, that said i just hoppe that interest in these cars doesnt dwindle to the point of nothingness. i dont understand people saying there isnt any other venue. if your car is built to nhra specs, as so many aer, most tracks that run brackets offer no e classes that would allow these cars to run. that fact is intregal to my wanting to build one of these rigs. and i should be able to get to tulsa a time or to. not to mengtion the nostalgia drags rusty and his bunch put on at the old yellowbelly strip in texas. anyway, i dont have a clue how fast to expect it to be yet, but when i finally get mine built you can bet im gonna talk a little trash til one of ya'll makes me eat dust. then im gonna wash it down with a cold one and offer you the same. until then enjoy the parts search and the build.
The folks from NHRA (No HOT Rods Allowed) here in St. Louis wanted my car to be built to the specs of a 7 second car before it would be allowed to run at the only local track. That track has since folded (Gateway). Currently there is not a drag track within a 4 hour ride from here. IF we could get NHRA to relax a bit for our class it would make a difference.
Rotsa ruck on your relaxion. NHRA has been actively strangling anything not applicable to money generation since Wally passed control. There's no money to be had in strictly local, small classes of any sort. The resurgences of local tracks in circle, road, and drag racing have been on the cuff of local folks, period. Better to chase dreams of other frameworks than the 'Nother Hundred Rules Assoc, the probabilities are more favorable.
dabirdguy (and anyone else thinking about building an HA/GR), Get a NHRA rule book and build your chassis to meet the 10:00 second and slower Altered requirements. Unfortunately it will lose some of the early 50's look in the roll cage area but it should pass tech at any track in the country. It is true that building one of these things is a lot of fun. But once it's built, running it becomes the priority. The point is that while it is fun to run against the clock at test and tune or line up against one of a hundred bracket Camaros, it would be a lot more fun to race with a collection of HA/GR's.
My observation is that for most of us,these cars are one trick ponies. They arent legal to run most places and if you build them so they are legal,they lose that "traditional"look. They arent competitive in brackets because of the stick rule,so for the most part,they are a first round casualty. That gets old quick. So what do you do with one other than take up space?At best,the rules that gave them charm have been their demise.
Glen there are 3 1/8th mile tracks within 2 1/2 hours from St.Louis. And you can run what ever you want at them. Sikeston MO, Benton IL, Harrisburg IL. And even Benton MO a couple times a year. Just build one.
Bracket cars are just as much "one trick ponies". Any form of racing where you can lose by "going too fast" isn't racing. It seems like the PC bull about self esteem carries through to the current breed of racing, Don't build a car to see how fast and quick you can make it go, make them all "equal", build a car to run 10.00 or 7.50 or whatever, install all the computerized crap you can to control the car so the driver doesn't have to think or drive and make sure you lift at the right point that you don't break out. Sorry, that isn't what racing is about. HA/GR cars aren't about that kind of racing, they are about returning to what drag racing was back when cars were built, not bought. They can be built "Legal" with a little research and common sense and a car with a stick can be competitive in bracket racing, (if that's what you want to do), if the driver knows how to shift and drive. As for "getting old quick", that's exactly how I feel about all the folks with the attitude that the class is a bust, that the cars would be better if you could just...(insert whatever modifications to the rules you desire) etc. etc. ad nauseum. If that's how you feel, start your own class, make the rules so that you have to use an N(o)H(ot)R(ods)A(llowed) certified altered chassis and a (insert whatever type of engine and trans you like here), set a 10.00 limit, (or whatever one you want) and go bracket racing any time you like. Sorry, I'll keep on living in my ancient world and build my HA/GR. Thank you for your concern.
64 Dodge 440 has covered most of the bases regarding building and running a HA/GR or a facsmile of one. Let me add, most strips have a "Gizmo" class and a "No Gizmo" class. The later is for cars that bracket race and have no electronics. Run your HA/GR there. If you don't want to dive on the brakes or play games to keep from breaking out, dial in at what your car will run. Remember, half the cars lose in the first round. I know guys with $60,000 race cars with enclosed trailers pulled by motorhomes that rarely make it out of the first round. If you want to make lots of passes, run Test and Tune or find "Hot Rod" drags events in your area where the program is mostly running against friends, etc. Regarding legality, the only really visible necessity is the roll cage area. And, there's ample reason for that. Lots of blood was spilled on drag strips in the evoluton of driver protection. Yes, many of us would be willing to have less protection in order to be closer to the early 50's look. Especially in cars that run the e.t.'s and speed these run. But you need to have a drag strip like King Chassis alluded to nearby. BTW, a chassis doesn't need to be certified for slower than 10:00. Ain't no HA/GR's gonna see that. The guys hanging roadster bodies on the backs of their rails are in effect starting a new class; HA/GR(oadster). Fortunately, they easily fall under the umbrella of HA/GR. I'm assuming a coupe or sedan body would be acceptable too. Maybe I'll plop my glass Fiat body on mine and make it the first HA/GC(oupe).
Hey Bob, I always thought competition coups and modified roadsters were the essence of "hotrod". Guess we could have sub classifications of HA/GCC and HA/GMR. I'd love to see that Topolino body on the back of your car. My first choice would have been a Austin Bantam coupe body, but the T-Bucket was more economical.
I'm gonna build one with a Briggs & Stratton engine, it'll be a lower & slower class of altered, a HAMB "H" Altered, a HA/HA. Sorry kiddies, just couldn't pass that one up ......... my pathetic sense of humor and all. In truth, I really like that the class allows for bodied cars as well. I'm kicking around ideas for another build (with a body) myself.
64 Dodge 440, when you get yours done I want a black and white poster size photo of it. I'll pay. I agree the bodies add to the variety and creativity of the class. Fun! I built a tube chassis for the Fiat last winter. More of an autocross/street pounder though.
64 Dodge 440,I get the purist thing,reallyI do,but unless there are people with similar cars around,its a parade car. Bracket racing can suck for a lot of reasons, but most of us could race 2-3 times a week if we really wanted to. The HA/GR events are few and very far away. That makes it pretty impractical. An HA/GR attracts attention and is neat and fun,but you'll have a hard time convincing me that a stick,narrow tires and old carbs can reasonably compete,even in a footbrake class. So youre stuck with test and tune nights.If the place is loose with the cage rule. I was told no way,maybe its different by you. If youre that hard core,none of this will matter to you anyway. You could consider others though.
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