Hi Guys Pretty sure my anti freeze leak on my 1950 Buick Special with a 248 is the rear freeze plug in the engine. Mechanic says the transmission needs to come out to get to it. Anyone have any idea how much it should cost to pull the transmission, fix the freeze plug and put it back in? I don't have the place to do it myself, so I'm going to have to pay someone to do it and I don't want to get screwed. Any input would be GREATLY appreciated Scott
Kinda depends on condition of all that stuff. Been apart before, not rusted, failrly clean will cost less then rusty, gunked up who know's what's gonna break. I'd be replacing all the core plugs in the back of the motor while I was in there, as well as the front & rear seals in the trans. Rough guess :10 hrs labor.
Easily 3-4 hours labor by a competent mechanic; parts cost $20, labor cost $200-$350. Prepare yourself for bad news. I wouldn't want to do it myself either. I did it once on my back in my parents driveway when I was 25 --never again.
With these Buicks, in order to pull the transmission you have to back out the rear end/driveline assembly before the trans can come out since the rear end and driveline are one unit and attached to the trans via a torque ball. I would say that with a actual shop doing the job....and depending on the hourly labor rate...Somewhere between $600 & $1000. Its mostly labor. But I did mine myself, you can do it. Just get yourself a shop manual and just go for it. That's how you learn.
I would think $600-$1000 is about right. However, if you were just a little closer to me, it would cost you a case of beer!
Well here's a consnesus of input I've received so far: Most people tell me that if it's the rear freeze plug, it's going to require either a) pulling the engine, or b) pulling the transmission to fix it. I have heard from some people that pulling the transmission will not work because the freeze plug is too high up on the engine. Another bit of input I've received is to cut a 4-6 inch hole in the firewall to access the freeze plug and replace it and then weld it back into place once it's fixed. Yet another piece of advice is to put GM cooling tabs in and see if that stops the leak. I've heard that if I pull the transmission it's going to be a huge expense because the rear end has to be pulled to get the transmission out. Looking for any other input people may have or feel free to weigh in on the options listed above. Thanks Scott
cost = 3 busted knuckles, 2 weeks of sore back muscles, 2 cases of beer, and at lease 4 screaming/cussing rants on why you screw with old cars!
Well since you are unsure and have a few opinions from others. I would suggest the following,,find a picture of the motor,,determine where in fact the plug/leak is ,,are you sure its not a cracked block ? Pulling the motor is the far easier and less disruptive to the car,,option. I would also have all plugs replaced once motor was out as far as getting 'screwed' This is an old car,,not just anyone can work on it,,its gonna cost no matter what. Pulling motor is teh safest bet, as most monkeys have no idea whats going on with the drive line,,and will either damage something taking it out,,or lining everything up reassembling
Well you obviously park the car somewhere of a night so you do have somewhere to work on it. You don't need much space just a lot of patience. Doc.
I would post something on the teambuick forum and see what they suggest. Have you looked at any old manuals for insight? PM me if you want me to look through my manual collection at home. It could still be a monumental task for a 99¢ freeze plug. Bob
I live in Stephentown New York which is about 45 minutes southwest of Albany and right on the MA/NY border
There's a guy right in your area , Bob Adler, who has a shop geared to old Chevy trucks ,maybe called Adler's Antiques.He might know someone to work on your car or many do it in his shop.I've met him a few times ,he seems nice,but I don't know anything else about him.
Thanks, I know Bob he actually did the wiring harness on my car this past year. I think he deals more with restorations than mechanic work but he's a resource I'll definitely try.
I'd do as Little Wing said an check to see which freeze plug it is. I would also change out every freeze plug on the engine while I was doing it. From spending a lot of years as a mechanic in shops I can say that getting the engine/ trans and bottom of the car as clean and grease, dirt and oil free as you can before you take it to the shop should help a lot and may cut the costs more than a little bit. It is a lot faster and easier to work on a clean engine and things usually go smoother for the mechanic. I wouldn't use or try sealer tabs, stop leak or other snake oil treatments on this one as they won't cure the rusted out soft plug.
Exactly what Doc said. There are a lot of HAMBers in your part of the country may you need to become friends with one of them. That will cost you whatever it takes to fix your Buick and whatever you end up helping them with. But if you actually make a friend in the process that will be priceless.
Three, four hours labor by somebody that has a lift and the tools and the mechanical ability. That'll cost you around $300 done by someone experienced, $1000 or more by somebody that's learning. Buy 4 of the big jackstands and floor jack with a tranny adapter. Less than $200 total at Harbor Freight. Get it up as high as you need to camp out underneath for a week or two. Take the wheels/tires off. Take your time. Whilst under there learn about your car, fix stuff that looks like it needs fixing, steering linkage, tie-rod ends, tailpipe, muffler, etc. The jackstands and jack will pay for themselves soon enough.
Amen, I'm going through that now trying to track down an oil leak. Last week it was pulling the trans to replace a rear main, this week the engine is on the stand. Apparently last week's fix didn't work out too well.
Here is a possible solution and might be able to be done in an hour or so. First things first. Can you visibly see the freeze plug using an inspection mirror? If so, then the freeze plug is accessible. Now how much room is there between firewall and freeze plug. If it is more than 1 1/2 inches then this solution might just work. Using a long drill bit, drill a hole in line with the freeze plug through the floor board and then into the center of freeze plug. Next find some sort of pry tool to grab the center drilled hole of the bad freeze plug and pry the plug out. Lastly find an expansion plug that fits the hole. These are rubber plugs with a stud molded into the middle and have a large washer and nut over the stud. You back the nut off and slide the expansion plug into the freeze plug hole, then tight up the nut till the expansion plug is good and tight. Fill up the block and check for leaks. I would only do this on one freeze plug location. I have done this before with very good luck. When you take the engine out, simply replace the rubber type plug with a brass type. Hope this helps.
I've used those before and they work nicely. Dorman makes a full set, Napa should have the box behind the counter. I just opened my 1948 Motors manual. It looks like there is a freeze plug on the back of the cylinder head, is yours leaking from that high up? Bob
At that point wouldn't it be just as easy to pull the engine and leave the driveline under the car? I'd be inclined to change all of the freeze plugs, if one's rotted out the rest can't be too good either...
sconnors: you never said if it's a Dynaflow or a stick. Everyone assumes a big fat automatic is in the way. When I was much younger, a buddy had a '50 Special 2 Door Sedanette (fastback) and the Dynaslush broke. He was just a kid, not a mechanic but it only took him a few hours to get it out, we went to the scrap yard (not wrecking yard) where they sold stuff at 3 cents a pound and found a straight 8 with a rod out the block, pulled the still-attached tranny in 15 minutes, paid the $4 tab and took it home. It only took him 2 days of lying in the dirt cussing and it was ready to fill. Didn't work right away, needed a little time for the slush to kick in, but the gamble paid off and the $4 tranny worked fine. This is not a board for guys who pay to have work done that they could do themselves with a few wrenches and tools/workspace that can be borrowed or rented. Get some gumption and a friend and just do it.
Personally I would pull the engine. Replace all visual seals and freeze plugs. If one is already leaking the others will be leaking pretty soon also. Just cheap insurance to have that peace of mind.
I'm going to agree with Little Wing on this one. If it was my car, I would pull the motor. My reasoning is if you pulled the transmission to replace the freeze plug and it doesn't fix it and turns out to be a cracked block then you are pulling the motor anyway. If you pull the motor first, you can replace all freezeplugs then, do a better visual inspection of the block for other problems and do some cleaning and detailing to the under hood compartment and the engine itself alot easier.
I'd put on my game face and pull the engine. Break it up into a few evenings (or more), taking things off, label them and take pictures! You would only need help for the actual engine removal, I'm sure you can scare up a local Hamb'er for that. I'd come over if I was close by. Bob
You Obviously have a Big investment in the car, You are in the car hobby, But if you are not a mechanic. As a member of the Buick Club of America that may be a big lead for people who can help you. If it were me I would pull Engine and Trans at this time. I would go thru everything that is difficult to replace while in the car. Seals etc. In my opinion it would be better now to spend 3000.00 and go thru the car rather than spend 1000.00 on pulling the trans to replace one seal.
The freeze plug on that block is on the back of the cam shaft and covered by the bellhousing. So when looking at the engine it's on the passenger side just below the cover that covers the push-rods. An expansion plug won't work.. there is only about 3/8" space behind the freeze plug and then you have a turning cam shaft. Pulling the trans and rear end is NOT easy on one of those, did one a few weeks ago and they are made to stay in the car.. The 3 crossmembers are all in the way, some thin paper gaskets between everything.. messy to say the least. Drilling a hole in the firewall won't work, unless you are planning to also drill a hole in the bellhousing/clutch/pressure plate or torque converter. Pulling the engine is a lot of work on one of those, because the engine is so long and heavy you pretty much need an a-frame, cherry picker won't handle it too well. And it's hard to do with the hood on. So I guess what I'm saying, no matter what you decide to do, it's going to be hard. My advise (and yes I've done this before) is to pull the engine. Expect this to be an expensive repair. I would not sign up to do this job for any of the estimates I've seen here (except for free to help a buddy out) I've attached a picture of a bare block so you can see where the freeze plug is. Mine is still out (it was leaking ;-)
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