History Vintage "Cageless" Midget Picture Thread

another

 

Hinchcliff Stadium Paterson New Jersey

 

If you run the car on dirt, and get some stone damage to the undertrays, from the right front wheel, or simply for the ease of cleaning and servicing, i reckon you will wish you had gone for removable undertrays.

 

The side panels only turn under the frame tube and stop. There are no undertrays at all. I plan to add them but they will be a separate and can be removed seperate from the side panels.

 

In my book Carl Edward Schaefer .. aka ED "DUTCH" SCHAEFER was one of the greatest (if not THE greatest) midget chauffers of all time.

He's pictured here in the Bennett Brothers owned Spotoil Kurtis Offy, which at the time was teamed with the Joe Ciski built & driven Falcon.

Maybe someone here can add some about the #21.

 

Beat from FINALLY reaching the last page of the pre '69 sprint car thread, I'll post one more here tonight - before hitting the sack.

THANKS to Al Consoli .. Johhny Coy in the Ken Brenn 4 bar Edmunds Offy #20.

 

I'm going to COPY a few postings (re the HONKER II Midgets) here .. from the .. SPRINT CAR PIC THREAD, 1969 and older only please

 

[QUOTE=Hutcho;4449201]
I first thought this was a good looking #3 but when I sat down I thought this is a great looking #3,thats from my view anyway. [/QUOTE][/SIZE]

<LEGEND>Attached Thumbnails</LEGEND>




This car -- the Honker II -- is a Don Edmunds single tube chassis.

It was origionally owned by someone out of Chicago, IL and driven by Bob Tattersall. If memory serves me right it was all white when Tattersall flipped it at Hershey, PA, in an USAC/ARDC co-sanctioned event.

Ken Brenn bought it and it was driven to many feature wins in both the ARDC & USAC by various chauffers. Bert Brooks lost his life in it, at an ARDC event at Hershey, PA. That tragedy - I believe - really accelerated the use of cages. It was a wreck that Brooks might well have survived had there been cages on the cars then.
There's an Al Consoli picture elsewhere on this thread of this car as the white & red Ken Brenn #35 Offy, with Bert Brooks up.

A truly superlative gentleman - Pete Petraitis from Huntington Station (Long Island) NY then bought it. Sonny Sanders (aka Anthony Madonia) drove the Petraitis Chevy II #40 to many victories in both the ARDC and the SMRC. Under the Petraitis banner Sanders took the checkered flag at the only indoor midget race ever on Long Island. The headline read (something like) .... OLDEST CAR - OLDEST DRIVER WIN INDOORS. (Actually it was the second oldest car there.)

The Petraitis/Sanders/Honker II combo out of the Petraitis stable was know as "ONE OF THE (Long Island, NY) BAD GUYS"!!!!

All in all this car has quite a loooooong history of winning!!!!!

The last time I saw this car (running) was after it sat for many years, I'd helped convert it to run on racing gasoline (ease of maintainence) to by used as a pace car in various Pete Petraitis Memorial Races.

Maybe it was somewhere along the line, but I don't remember the car being yellow & red as pictured here.

Of course I wonder where this car is now (Austraila??) and who is it's current care taker?

THANKS
-Ken
<!-- / message --><!-- edit note -->

 

I'll repost Al Consoli's picture of the Honker II when Ken Brenn owned it, with Bert Brooks driving.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm?????? This might NOT be the same car.

A quick glance shows MANY differences.

Front & back radius rods are different, as is the dry sump tank. Outside hook (brake) and weight jack are either very different & one or the other is missing.

I never remember this car having a hoop over the nose at any time.

Throughout it's history the front bumper distictively had the letter L in it (not just a verticle bar).
Now I'm wonfering if this #3 is the real Honker II or a nice tribute car???
<!-- / message --><!-- attachments --><FIELDSET class=fieldset><LEGEND>Attached Thumbnails</LEGEND>
</FIELDSET>

 

Posted by BUILDY

Re: VINTAGE SPRINT CAR PIC THREAD, 1969 and older only please.
<HR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #e5e5e5; COLOR: #e5e5e5" SIZE=1><!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->Ken My uncle Jerry Karl drove the car still in it`s Honker II colors for Ken Brenn in 1968 at Hershey PA.
Late in the race Jerry took the lead just as the Yellow came out. It reverted back to the previous lap,and Coy ended up winning,Jerry Second.
Jerry quit Brenn and took over the Fahey #18 and Brooks went to the now Brenn #35......
Jerry won the Labor day race in the Fahey #18,which was supposed to be twin features. The second race was called due to the Brooks tragedy.

BTW There were more than one Honker II cars.

Even after Brenn got this one Tattersall was driving another one still called Honker II in USAC.




<!-- / message --><!-- edit note --><HR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #e5e5e5; COLOR: #e5e5e5" SIZE=1>Last edited by Buildy; Today at 02:07 AM.
<!-- / edit note -->

 

POSTED BY HUTCHO

Hi Ken,I just spoke to my friend Graham & I have a little info for you,
Don Edmunds only built 2 space frame cars with front spring axles for the Stroud family which were to both Strouds & Tattersalls spec & that being short wheel base.The 67 car is the one here owned by Graham.It was delivered to Strouds in blue livery.They both had a differnt radius rod pick up point near the engine plate.The 69 car had an additional helper torsion bar on o/s rear.Both cars had the bonnet hoop,no letter in the front crash bar & both had the std Edmunds dry sump,69 built car had a 120 cubic inch.In 1969 both these cars were the same yellow & Bob run them both that year.The Honker was sold to Bob Olds & run as LuLu's Honker#93 then #76 pear white with red nose or stripe maybe # on US flag.
After researching over the years,the pic of the car you mentioned varies somewhat,there were similar cars at that time that Brenn owned.
The Stround family were thrilled by the restoration of "The Big Honker" that they helped Graham buy the original " Honker" & provided many original spare parts they had been storing all these years.
Please click on the site below & scroll down for more info,it is the real deal,cheers
http://www.vintagespeedwayfestival.com/
<!-- / message --><!-- edit note --><HR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #e5e5e5; COLOR: #e5e5e5" SIZE=1>Last edited by Hutcho; Today at 03:18 AM.
<!-- / edit note -->

 

Quote:
<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset" class=alt2>Originally Posted by [B
Hutcho[/B];4463203]
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Quote:
<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%"><TBODY><TR><TD style="BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset" class=alt2>Originally Posted by [B
Hi Ken,
I just spoke to my friend Graham & I have a little info for you,
Don Edmunds only built 2 space frame cars with front spring axles for the Stroud family which were to both Strouds & Tattersalls spec & that being short wheel base.The 67 car is the one here owned by Graham.It was delivered to Strouds in blue livery.They both had a differnt radius rod pick up point near the engine plate.The 69 car had an additional helper torsion bar on o/s rear.Both cars had the bonnet hoop,no letter in the front crash bar & both had the std Edmunds dry sump,69 built car had a 120 cubic inch.In 1969 both these cars were the same yellow & Bob run them both that year.The Honker was sold to Bob Olds & run as LuLu's Honker#93 then #76 pear white with red nose or stripe maybe # on US flag.
After researching over the years,the pic of the car you mentioned varies somewhat,there were similar cars at that time that Brenn owned.
The Stround family were thrilled by the restoration of "The Big Honker" that they helped Graham buy the original " Honker" & provided many original spare parts they had been storing all these years.
Please click on the site below & scroll down for more info,it is the real deal,cheers
http://www.vintagespeedwayfestival.com/
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
MANY THANKS Buildy & Hutcho (Ron) ..

Now it seems that I might have myself really confused. I'm going to have to do more research re the Petraitis Chevy II #40 that he bought from Ken Brenn that I had always assumed was the Honker II. It was an Offy under Brenn's ownership.

All my personal pictures of the car .. both in Brenn's & Petraitis's livery .. are in storage (easy enough to get); BUT to make matters worse (as far as posting any) they are in 35 mm slide format (color transparencies) and I have NO IDEA how to easily convert them to a digital format for posting here. CAN ANYONE HELP ME WITH THAT?

You say that both the Stroud Honker II's were space frames and it seems that yet another Honker (The Big Honker) was a modified (shorter wheelbase) Kurtis kit. ("If" I have that all straight?) The Kurtis (kit) of course would be a single tube chassis.

If the Brenn #35 was the car that Bert Brooks lost his life in and was one of the &/or the Honker II and the same car that Pete Petraitis owned (all assumptions now - until I can do more research) it's certainly not Graham's current #3 Honker II. One (#35) has wish bone (paper clip) radius rods .. the other (#3) two seperate radius rods (both front & back) and more. As I said now I'm CONFUSED!!!!

]I guess the best I can do is talk to Jon Petraitis (Pete's son) and if need be to Ken Brenn .. as well as dig through my storage bin for my own pictures too.

I could be completely wrong here and if I am I apologize.

Whether right or wrong I'm certainly happy that any &/or all of these cars survive, are still being enjoyed by many & being cared for .. although of course I selfishly wish they were still here in the USA.

BTW .. Speaking of Ken Brenn .. he puts on an annual Car Show in September at the municipal grounds in Warren, NJ (USA). If you're in the NJ, NY, PA, CT or surrounding areas it's one not to be missed. Probably 70 to 80 race cars of every sort and overall between race cars, hot rods, customs, antique cars, trucks and such between 400 & 500 vehicles overall. Chris Economaci of the National Speed Sport News (NSSN) and of TV fame was one of the MANY in attendance the year. It was GRRRREAT to see so many people again .. folks that I hadn't seen in all too many years. Don't miss this show next year!!!

I hope no one minds .. I'm going to copy these postings re the Honker's to the "Cageless" Midget thread here on H.A.M.B. as that's where they belong & to also try to stimulate some growth there too. Maybe some pictures from Ken Brenn's show too

Buildy .. THANKS for the scan & posting of that neat photo of your Uncle (Jerry Karl) from Illustrated Speedway News (ISN) in the Honker II.



THANKS AGAIN!!!
<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->__________________
-Ken Schou ~ Long Island, NY
<!-- / sig --><!-- edit note --><HR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #e5e5e5; COLOR: #e5e5e5" SIZE=1>Last edited by Ken_Schou; Today at 11:13 AM.

 

Speaking of Ken Brenn .. his cars & his show in New Jersey .. here's Brenn's Trevis Offy #24 (also known as "Phyllis") .. now restored/owned and cared for by Dick Briggs .. at that show.

This machine is so carefuly restored & to such detail that even period hose clamps were utilized.

As you can see from the sign Bobby Adamson, Don Branson, Bill Brown, Larry Dickson, Len Duncan, Russ Klar, Don Kreitz, Sr., Dave Lundy, Mitch Smith, Ray Tilley &, Bobby Unser all won features in this car.

 

Chris Economaci of National Speed Sport News (NSSN) & TV fame and Ken Brenn at his Warren, NJ show.


More later.

 

I thought the Brenn car that ended up with a chevyII was the former Ritter KK job. Was number 24, I think Johnny Mann drove it some as well.

Been a long time so could be wrong.

 

I think this may be Sammy Sessions-just a guess.

Maybe Lee Kunsman in the #96 Linne

 

<LEGEND>Attached Thumbnails</LEGEND>


Hey 1935Ron ..

Interesting picture!!

Was this car once owned by the Mataka Brothers (Raceweld) .. or was it sponsored by them???

I heard (too late) about the Hinchcliffe Stadium Show in Paterson, NJ. I would have loved to have attended as this facility was once promoted by a man I had worked for .. Tom Galan (and his partner Harvey Tattersall, Jr.). They had some of the earliest auto racing TV shows broadcast from there.

Tom told a funny story about the TV broadcasts & one of their sponsors .. a (used?) car dealer by the name of "Chick". .. Part of the commercial (live by Tom Galan) was supposed to go .... "Check with Chick!!" .... but Tom kept getting tounge tied and what kept coming out of his mouth (on live TV) was .... "CHICK with check!!!

Can you tell me .. Will this show at Hinchcliffe Stadium be an annual event?

THANKS!!!

 

I think the car that was restored as the red #24 WAS the Johnny Ritter #3.

I live in Connecticut which had a huge midget scene in the post-war years. There was Candlelite in Bridgeport, Cherry Park in Avon, Savin Rock(Donovan Field) in West Haven just to name a few. They used to race 8 days a week(literally) in the NY/CT/MA area.

 

I think that CTtoPA is right on that one.

Geez .. none of those tracks you mentioned exist any longer.

I was at the last race "almost" in West Haven (if I have the right place .. it was a baseball stadium). It was an ARDC show. The reason I say "almost" is that as we were pushing the cars out on the track for warm ups it rained. The show was canceled .. never rescheduled and that was the end of West Haven racing.

Yes, they used to race midgets literally 8 days (8 or MORE shows) a week. Many of the drivers made their living after World War II doing just that.

There were two tracks on Staten Island, NY that were part of that circuit. One was Weisglass Stadium. Does anyone remember the other one????

 

Hey CTtoPA ..

Here's one for 'ya.

I saw this car this past summer at a mixed car/racing/farm/tractor pull (real working, every day tractors) show at the historic Hallock farm out on the scenic north fork of Long Island (NY).

A Trevis Offy #36, it was initially owned by Charlie Nagy (of CT) and mostly driven in the ARDC by Russ Klar. It later showed up with the Super Midget Racing Club (SMRC) with Charles Chariot (also of CT) as it's registered owner (Nagy was always still around with the car too) with SECSO power and Chariot's daughter Louise behind the wheel. She was the first gal I (myself) ever saw wheel a midget and she did a competitent job.

 

Here's Johnny Coy in the Vitucci #10 at Islip

 

Here's Schindler and Tappett at West Haven

 

Hi Ken did you get a chance to check out the stories on the Aussie website Re Honkers?
www.vintagespeedwayfestival.com/
BTW I didnt know the midget site was here is it advertised or linked to the sprintcar site?

 

I see it was that Brian King who paid $35,000 for an Edmunds midget and $52,000 for that Kurtis Offy. Apparently he has money to burn and was dying to have those cars.

 

Just nearly completed 6 years of restoring this "F.Davis Engineering Special". It is running.

Has Davis Duplex steering (no tie rod) and Davis Quick Change. Quarter elliptical rear springs with Hartford friction shocks, single tube frame.

Sudebaker Champion 6 cyl flat head engine fuel injected, Edmunds head, Isky cam.

All aluminum body flared out over frame.

 

WOW!!!! .. A really YOUNG Coy in that photo!!

 

Ted Tappett (Phil Walters) would drive the wheels off ANYTHING .. if you gave him 1/2 a chance .. even in the very late years of his life.

 

Hey Hutco ..

Yes I did (THANKS), but all too briefly. I'll be going back there again (& again) looking at more re the Honkers and the other GRRRREAT midgets you folks have down there.

 

Hi 28dreyer ..

What a great & unique ride you're going to have there!!

PLEASE post more pictures, especially (but not only) as you move along with this fine restoration.


THANKS!!!

 

Here's some more from Ken Brenn's show this past September in Warren, NJ.