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Lasalle,, Packard ,,what else ??

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Little Wing, Sep 12, 2009.

  1. Little Wing
    Joined: Nov 25, 2005
    Posts: 7,505

    Little Wing
    Member
    from Northeast

    Ok so pre 54 ,,who else made a good sturdy transmission ?
     
  2. Revhead
    Joined: Mar 19, 2001
    Posts: 3,027

    Revhead
    Member
    from Dallas, TX

  3. landseaandair
    Joined: Feb 23, 2009
    Posts: 4,485

    landseaandair
    Member
    from phoenix

    I believe that was a Borg Warner, also used in Ford products. Probably came out in the 60's, but an early Ford style top mounted shifter from a Jeep can be used and they are pretty rugged.
     
  4. jimi'shemi291
    Joined: Jan 21, 2009
    Posts: 9,499

    jimi'shemi291
    Member

    If you mean automatic, GM, nat. I didn'T give a HOOT for the MoPar PowerFlite, 'cause I drove 3 of 'em. Packard's UltraMatic just didn't seem to hold up, reportedly (& repeatedly reportedly). Borg Warner was making a pos-lockup automatic, but I haven't heard much about it (though I surely LOVED their 4-speed -- diff story!).

    Pre-'54, GM seemed to have the hook-up on automatics, and even a bunch of the independent companies just bought GM trannys instead of developing their own automatics (as Packard stubbornly continued to do).

    I don't know squat about foreign transmissions of that era, so no help THERE.
     

  5. landseaandair
    Joined: Feb 23, 2009
    Posts: 4,485

    landseaandair
    Member
    from phoenix

    Sorry, wrong transmission again. I didn't see the link.
     
  6. pimpin paint
    Joined: May 31, 2005
    Posts: 4,937

    pimpin paint
    Member
    from so cal

     
  7. jimi'shemi291
    Joined: Jan 21, 2009
    Posts: 9,499

    jimi'shemi291
    Member

    If you're talking standard trans, I think i remember a BUNCH of guys in the early '50s (from reading hotrod mags of that time) who could not lay hands on a Cad/LaSalle tranny, instead used pickup transmissions & adapted their rearend ratio accordingly.

    Shit, I wish I'd paid more ATTENTION to transmissions when reading that old material, instead of just focusing on mills! I'LL BET A TON OF YOUNG GUYS WITHOUT MUCH DOUGH WERE DOING AWESOME EXPERIMENTATION WITH STD, TRANNYS BACK THEN!

    LittleWing, I surely recognize that you are an experienced rodder & HAMBer, so I do NOT think your question is about generalizations; I think you are looking for some other experienced HAMB members to put on their thinkin' caps & give serious input.

    To THAT end, I hope a bunch of guys wade in after their weekend activitives, 'cause THIS thread could provide a GREAT future resource for guys looking for a "period" tranny for a traditonal rod! I am GLAD you asked the question.
     
  8. Rex Schimmer
    Joined: Nov 17, 2006
    Posts: 743

    Rex Schimmer
    Member
    from Fulton, CA

    I had a friend back in the 50s that had a small block Chevy in his 50 Ford and used an early Packard, 37 I think, and it was very strong and also had a sycro first gear that the Cad/LaSalle did not have, and it shifted much better than the Cad. If you look inside one they are really nice and the gears are wide.

    Rex
     
  9. jimi'shemi291
    Joined: Jan 21, 2009
    Posts: 9,499

    jimi'shemi291
    Member

    Pimpin'Paint! AWESOME input.

    I just can't believe Cad/LaSalle was the only hookup prior to the mid-'50s, so I (as I am sure LittleWing is) am glad input is starting -- AND, I'll assume henceforth LittleWing meant std. trannys made '54 & earlier. Didn't wanna just ASSUME before.
     
  10. jimi'shemi291
    Joined: Jan 21, 2009
    Posts: 9,499

    jimi'shemi291
    Member

    RexSchimmer, now three is osme great info on the late-'30s Packards. Packard had great engineers. I don't recall anybody having a problem with Packard standards, juts the automatics of the early '50s.
     
  11. Those big cars were heavy and the trannys were built to last.
    Look to the heavyweights, Cad, Lasalle, Buick, Packard, then look to rearend gearing to get you where you want to be. Keep station wagon rearends in mind.
     
  12. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,222

    F&J
    Member

    [​IMG]

    The pic is from Revheads link...this trans dates back to at least 51 on the Olds. Ahh, the infamous selector :)

    There were other GMs that look identical, including the top cover and main case, but they had smaller shafts on input/output.

    If you can find a 37 Buick bigger series trans for it's donor case and top=shift cover, I can do a tech on how to swap all the guts from the above picture trans, into the 37 case. Oh boy, looking for more rare shit :) ...ain't this trad stuff a little frustrating at times, due to all the junkyards being gone?
     
  13. Little Wing
    Joined: Nov 25, 2005
    Posts: 7,505

    Little Wing
    Member
    from Northeast


    Funny thing is I seem to fall over this stuff alot,,its finding out what it is I like :)
     
    dana barlow likes this.
  14. not pre-54, but the Ford "toploader" three speed, built by Tremec and designated the 3.03, in particular the version that came behind big blocks, is a monster.
     
  15. I reluctantly yanked the LaSalle out of my '36 in favor of one of these. Strong, compact,
    and 1/4 the cost of the 4 speed version. With the Jeep top shifter, it looks pretty
    traditional, too.......
     
  16. Bruce Lancaster
    Joined: Oct 9, 2001
    Posts: 21,681

    Bruce Lancaster
    Member Emeritus

    Buick, BW T-85 (multiple users)...can someone scan in the HRM cover story on transmissions to supplement the vanishing supply of LaSalles?? Roughly 1955?
     
  17. Shaggy
    Joined: Mar 6, 2003
    Posts: 5,207

    Shaggy
    Member
    from Sultan, WA

    Olds Hydro.... the good ones came out in 54, i belive
     
  18. 39cent
    Joined: Apr 4, 2006
    Posts: 1,569

    39cent
    Member
    from socal


    I have what I believe is a 51 olds trans, and it has a longer maindrive gear than the Buicks. Seems it wouldnt be too hard to just put a spacer between the bellhousing to make up for the added distance, but is there another model or did all the olds trans have the longer maindrive? Yes the buick was used as a heavy duty trans, and I believe they were easy to adapt to the ford torq tube drive, however they are a bit longer. Ford [RUG] toploader trans from jeeps can be also adapted to ford torq tube bells, but most modern 3 and 4 speeds are better transmissions than the oldies.
     
  19. Little Wing
    Joined: Nov 25, 2005
    Posts: 7,505

    Little Wing
    Member
    from Northeast

    Was'nt there an earlier version of the Buick trans that was top shift that was just as strong ? like in teh 40's or so ?
     
  20. See above- '37 is the case often used for the Olds gear conversion. Stronger gears and
    better synchros than the Buick; a fairly easy swap. Finding the Olds trans. or gears is
    the most difficult part. Guy I know in Seattle has a decent one already converted, if
    you are interested.....
    Robb
     
  21. Silent Bob
    Joined: Aug 31, 2009
    Posts: 5

    Silent Bob
    Member

    "37 Buick Roadmaster I believe is the one you are thinking of. F&J mentioned it in his post. This is the transmission I first started out with for my altered. It is a torque tube type transmission, but can be converted to open drive with Oldsmobile parts. Because of the expense to convert it, I canned the idea and went with the '37 Packard which was open driveline already. This was in the late '50s and really, there were not many choices, Cad- Lasalle, Packard, and the Buick Roadmaster and if you wanted top shift you were restricted to the late '30s stuff.

    Bob
     
  22. Zig Zag Wanderer
    Joined: Jul 6, 2007
    Posts: 563

    Zig Zag Wanderer
    Member

    not to hijack, but i would like to know a bit more about the RUG toploader to torque tube conversion
     
  23. Bruce Lancaster
    Joined: Oct 9, 2001
    Posts: 21,681

    Bruce Lancaster
    Member Emeritus

    The recipes for all the various tailshaft and case swaps are in the old Petersen transmission book from about 1960...the big one, not the little Spotlite book. I cannot find mine. Much of the info is also in a coup[le of mid '50's HRM's.
     
  24. oldebob
    Joined: Oct 21, 2008
    Posts: 782

    oldebob
    Member
    from Spokane WA

    Recently I looked at an interesting variation of this discussion. A Cad, Lasalle ,'49 -'50 Olds side shift trans converted to torque tube. BUT the side shift holes had been brazed up , the top of the case cut off and a fabricated adapter brazed on. This allowed a '39 Ford double detent cover to be bolted on. It appears that they used the ends of the Cad side shift forks which were brazed to the stubs of the top loader cover. This had been done a long time ago and appeared well used. Why someone went to this much work is anyones guess but it is a good example that traditional definately doesn't have to be cookie cutter. These days it would be pretty cool with the '39 Ford cover sticking up thru the floorboards and the Cad Lasalle tranny under them.
     
  25. Shaggy
    Joined: Mar 6, 2003
    Posts: 5,207

    Shaggy
    Member
    from Sultan, WA

    Tommy ivo ran a mid 50's olds hydro with a earlier torque tube tailshaft, car craft covered it in a 60's article
     
  26. 39cent
    Joined: Apr 4, 2006
    Posts: 1,569

    39cent
    Member
    from socal

    ok here,s my 39 cents worth, the 'LARGE' buick trans [ROADMASTER, LIMITED,CENTURY] from 37' into the 50,s and some Olds V8,s from 51 to 64 used the same gears in various different cases [closed ,open,floorshift,side shift.] Basically the Buicks were torq tube [closed] drive, and olds was open drive shaft. There were some changes in the gears in some years, but generally they would interchange into the different cases.therefore the 37 to 38 Buick case with floor shift was much sought after combined with the olds tailshaft to adapt to open drive. However some clever guys did the HAMB thing and didnt let that stop them and made up there own version of open drive floorshift.

    http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=132445

    LaSalle/Cadillac was the most popular for open drive, then Packard open drive [which also had an overdrive version]. They all were pretty strong trans for the times. they are not plentiful anymore but some are still found now and then.
     
  27. 39cent
    Joined: Apr 4, 2006
    Posts: 1,569

    39cent
    Member
    from socal

    Yes I bought a Caddy sideshift trans [as above] from B&M transmissions in L.A. baknthe day. I never used it but the guy I sold it to, used it in his Model A and gave it hell and it never had a problem. I dont know if B&M had modified it, but evidently it was a practice that was successful and solved the availability problem until more modern trans came along.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2009
  28. 39cent
    Joined: Apr 4, 2006
    Posts: 1,569

    39cent
    Member
    from socal

    this was posted here in the HAMB,

    http://www.modelaonly.com/about_us

    for added info as I understand, this adaptation is for a model A, so it should bolt to all the ford torq tube bells, and the ford toploader will bolt on to stock ford/merc bellhousings, and many other adapters. However not having done all these adaptions myself there may be others who can add to this.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2009
  29. oldebob
    Joined: Oct 21, 2008
    Posts: 782

    oldebob
    Member
    from Spokane WA

    The part about B&M is interesting. Cad floor shift cases did get hard to get quickly. Jim Sibley's '27 roadster has a 49 Merc overdrive tranny cut and modified for a 39 top cover. It too was done long ago. Maybe they were cranking Merc ones out also before Hurst style shifters became availible. Anyone else seen or heard of any of these.
     
  30. 39cent
    Joined: Apr 4, 2006
    Posts: 1,569

    39cent
    Member
    from socal


    yes I but am not sure it was modified by B&M but thats where I got it, my memory was that the guy said they used to do that stuff, and I did see one later at a swapmeet . Back then B&M was just a small trans shop.
     

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