Are any of you considering building an "efficent" hot-rod?

Talking modern engines?
So, I guess I should have kept my 96' LT4 Corvette 350 V8 roller cam and rockers 6-speed 3.54 gears rated at 330 hp but actually 350 hp. Got 21 in town and 31 on the highway doing 80 mph (but had the ac off). With the ac it dropped to little over 27 mpg.
placed that motor in a light weight car with a hood on it.

 

I'm planning a 260 from a 63 fairlane, 3 speed overdrive car right now but I would like a 4 over or a T5. I expect the car might hit high 20s pretty easy, probably ran mid 20s in the fairlane that was 1000 pounds heavier.

 

The family beater for a few years was an '88 T-bird with a 3.8 EFI and whatever the OD auto was. The thing had well over 100K on it and I jumped in and had to be someplace 100 miles away pretty quick, and I'll swear to this day, I did the math three times, and it pulled close to 30 MPG on that trip - going 75-80 the whole way down the interstate. The T-bird was about 3400 lbs, RWD. Now swap the auto for a T5 and drop the power steering, go to an electric fan, dump the AC compressor, and put the whole works in a T-bucket or even a Model A. I'm thinking mid-30s should be reasonable.

The other fun car I had to drive was my '60 Pontiac and it got about 18 highway with a 2bbl on the 389, even with the Hydro trans. It had like a 3.08 gear. I've wondered ever since what you'd get for milage if you put the whole works into a light car like a Model A - the Pontiac had to be around 4000 lbs, I'd think you could do mid-20s in the A - and the big car was a blast to drive as it was.

Some of the mid-80s GM automotive diesels might be another place to look for high milage. They have some mechanical gremlins to attend to, but can be made reliable. The 4.3 V6 or 5.7 V8 versions will pull about 40 and about 30 respectively in the cars they came in. Diesel costs more, of course, but if you can pull 40-45 MPG and have enough power to enjoy driving the car, who cares. There is a 1.8L/2.2L Isuzu 4-cyl diesel, too, which I've heard reports of low-50's in a Chevette with - but I'm guessing the thing runs out of RPM fast and you'll be going up hills in the breakdown lane with the 4-ways on, unless you can build like an 1800-lb bucket for it.

One thing you can do with any car, though, to improve economy - get rid of anything that robs power from the engine. Power steering pumps, automatic transmissions, air, steel fans that always turn, even clutch fans all take power away. I just robbed an electric fan off one of my old beaters to put on my current beater Suburban to see if it will make a difference; I just have to figure out how to wire up a relay so it kicks on when it's supposed to.

 

I am considering a more fuel efficient build of an old car. (I try to choose my words carefully)
I have a few v8s and would like to build a vehicle that will satisfy the need for efficient travel without driving a soulless plastic econobox.
The picture of the yellow and brown Track T is almost exactly what I envision. Then I can pair the the big ones with the little one and have "Banger and the Beast".
I have always been a fan of different vehicles for different situations and one of the would sure fit the bill.

 

I have been toying with the idea of a Track T or similar with either a Quad 4 (I have one in parts) or a 3.5 Rover Aluminum V8 (215, I have one completw W/ the Rover EFI). I would basically want it to be a straight axle 'Super 7' with a track style T body on it (with my budget, it would almost certainly be a tupperrod ). That said, I would like to immagine it as coming out between 900 and 1200Lbs dry, I probably couldn't afford the insurance.

 

My dad had one of those Chevettes. He bought it in the fall of 1985 brand new... it had been sitting on the lot since February of 1984. No one wanted it. I want to say he paid about $3800 for it and the sticker was in the high $5K's. It was a four door automatic. He averaged 42 on the hwy and low/mid 30's in town. A coworker of his had one with a stick and it would get about 10% better mileage. My dad's ended up burning in a garage fire. Two things I recall about it... it was truly gutless even in a Chevette and it smoked like a Kenworth everytime you stepped into the throttle. Don't know if I'd want to have to deal with that in todays "green" world. Another option would be one of the Mercedes diesels found in rear drivers sold here for many years.

As for electric fans and the "power robbing" fan on your Suboybahn... all I can say is don't do it. I work at a shop the does only heating/cooling/a.c. work and we've returned many of these owner enhanced "modifications" back to stock when people run into problems like overheating and poor airflow through the radiator. What year is it? I might have a few other suggestions for you. Keep in mind... it's a Suboybahn... no matter what you do... you aren't going to get that much better mileage unless you only drive downhill at all times.

 

Do you really want to drive a Fiero though?

A quad4 or ecotech in an Anglia... I can see that.

Here's the Quad4 adapter thread link... http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...ighlight=quad4

Another "interesting" engine package would be the old Cosworth Vega 16V 4 (not readily availible)

 

Sure you can, just race other sixes. I've won the last two years at Reynolds and had just as much fun as the faster cars. I add speed equipment, work on my starts just like the big boys. I've got goals, 16's, same as everyone else, just a different # . I'm consistent at 17.1-17.2 that's not much slower than a lot of V8's. Just cause a 14 sec car gets beat by a 13 sec. car dosen't mean he should stop racing.

 

I always thought about puttin' a Cadillac Northstar engine in the back of a Honda CRX .. whooo hooo . !!!

 

If I can find a nice clean Studebaker Wagonaire for a project, in goes the 4.3 V6 with OD trans and a highway gear.

 

Daimler Hemi 276 cu in , 5 speed trans , Halibrand 3.53 final drive , 31" tall tires, 3 97's with 42 jets , electronics in the old distributor , with a proper fuel regulator (Malpasi filter king from Italy ) 26 mpg to Paso last year at 70 mph (speedo calibrated too) I was & still am amazed at the mpg I'm getting I seem to have the perfect "balance" it's pretty quick too !

 

Do they sell aftermarket parts for the ecotech, like a intake for a carb or a dizzy that not computer controlled?
I have a banger motor (Model A) with a TON of work done on it and it cool but not wicked fast and fuel mileage is 14 to 16 with a 5 speed. It drive grea at 65 and the time to get to 60 65 is good but not good enought at times.. I would like to see how a ecotech would do? Sorry none of my V-8's would be "efficent" and nor will be my banger wih my stiff leg
Thanks!

 

well a lot of people forget a lot of rods only get driven on the weekends or to meets and so on,so this changes the fuel economy thing a lot. dam emissions epa crap forget this also and bitch and moan about how much pollution is being put in the air. forgetting that they often aren't driven as much.

 

I see problems on 2 levels

If done traditionally with an old design engine then the route to good mileage is gonna sacrifice power with a small or otherwise mild mannered engine. Doesn't really seem hot-roddy.

If late technology/engines are adapted, the route to good mileage is going to involve electronic engine management and likely an extremely tame engine, even if it makes a ton of power under boost. Again, not very hot roddy. Hot rods are supposed to belch and shake and be barely streetable race machines, not purr like a kitten under the ECM's control.

Maybe the real question is-
Are any of you guys considering building old cars that get good mileage?

 

The only 'carb' intake I have seen for the Ecotec, is an adapter for side draft Webbers. Every year at the Spring Race in Phoenix (NASCAR) the Chevy Motorsports display has an Ecotec drag motor there with an HEI type distributor driven off the back of one of the cams. I'll see if I have any pics.

 

I didn't read all of this, but my answer is yes. I'm doing a 61 Belair bubbletop and plan to get mid 20s hwy mileage. It'll be done with a V8, tall gears, and OD trans. Very easy and efficient. Been done for years. An LT1 transplant would be the best idea but I can't bring myself to do it.

 

The anglia would get the engine in front where it belongs. Back seat, linited as it might be, would be nice to have. I was thinking more in the line of a coupe or roadster for a rear engine. I'm going to stay with my SBC engines as long as the law will allow me to. I get a full body shudder thinking about an injected 4 banger in a Hot Rod. I'm sorry, I tryed to consider it but when you said Fiero I about lost my breakfast
Jeff

 

i'm young. i don't have a great job and in theory i can't afford to own more than 1 car. i have a shitbox 92 buick as a daily now that i have a little time before the insurance and shit that my folks have paid runs out. then it's just the 53. i think there's a decent number of guys and gals on here that run an old car daily and gas adds up. quick. i've heard that commodities trading plays big in this issue and that it might pop like housing but until then things are tight on my pocket. and thats one of the reasons i got a car with an inline engine in it. it's getting a t5 and progressive linkage and a higher compression ratio. and in my eyes, those young cats back in the 50's who we all aspire to be like probably had only one car, their hot rod. so if i drive my old heap everyday, even if i don't dump a silly big engine in it, i'm being traditional.

 

My idle daydream is to install the drivetrain from a Tesla roadster into a fiberglass bodied, otherwise stock repro '32. Those new electric engines are supposed to get maximum torque at idle, and I think the result might be something special. Plus, the lack of any engine noise would be interesting for a hot rod. Any thoughts?

 

Ditto - they're not torque monsters, but weird = good.

~Jason

 

I drive a big rig for a living in the city, So I have a good view of the other drivers around me.

Here's how people can save all kinds of money on gas...and it's free. Just Learn how to chill & relax behind the wheel.

I've been waiting for people to start slowing down because of the price of fuel, but I'm not really seeing it yet.

It's hard to change a behavior learned from cheap gas, faster modern cars, mixed in with plenty of attitude.

 

Interesting? Yes. I would not call it a hot rod, though. Sweet looking and probably fun? Yes. But not a hot rod. I have had thoughts of the same, but in the end I would not be able to call it a hot rod if I had it myself. But it could be a fun Custom.

 

Sometime back in the late 70's my buddy put a V6 and a 4 spd out of a Chevy Monza donor in his 31 A pickup as a daily driver. He's still using it as a daily driver/work truck...I don't know what kind of mileage he gets but it sounds pretty cool.

 

I my '56 f100 is chopped six inches and shortened 15" for lighter weight. Then I painted the 354 Hemi with aluminum paint to further reduce weight then added a 6-71 blower to increase the engines efficiency and fuel ecomomy.

I figure I can get 40 Hondas per mile... not bad.

 

Compromise,its a hard decision.I.ve always believed any hotrod worthy of the name would have as much engine as you can afford to give it,but times change,fuel costs and continual traffic jams make a traffic friendly motor seem more attractive.On one hand it seems great to have a rod would drive all over Europe no problem;on the other,a snarling tyre smoking animal IS a hotrod.I dunno where I,m going engine wise?A v8 just sounds the part,I will go no less,but how r
adical, race or cruise???My last rod barely got 10mpg,that wears a bit thin real quick

 

I always thought "efficient hot rod" was an oxymoron. I have a buddy that is building a '31 Vicky and he is considering an Iron Duke or somthing similar. Not so muck for efficiency as for different.

 

I can't quite figure out whether you were posting this just to be an asshole, or to brag about your 55 chevy.

Either way, you're a tool.

 

I agree, gas isn't going to get any cheaper... so wouldn't it make sense to enjoy your big v-8's while gas is still "cheap"? In less than 5 years, when gas is $10 a gallon, we're all gonna be wishing we would have enjoyed $4 gal gas while it lasted.

 

Exactly! But I don't expect drivers to learn this on their own, without being led to it. Nobody seems to talk about the simple fact that driving habits are the biggest factor in fuel economy.

If MPG is a thing you care about, then you have to drive for it, just as you'd have to purposely drive for a low ET at the track.
Speed and efficiency can be similar goals. Some of the '50s-'60s racers also participated in economy runs, and they understood optimizing techniques for the desired results.

Unlike yesterday's, today's cars are refined to the point that you can drive like hell through town, weaving across several lanes, running full bore up to red lights and then stopping in a heartbeat, over and over...all without excessive noise/harshness/vibration/sensation. It's still not the way to save time or gas.

 

I agree... it far too easy to "drive" todays cars... and in some cases like an a-hole. Frankly folks are spoiled. Let's make a list of how to create better drivers by removing all of the crutches.


power steering
power brakes (with or without abs)
air conditioning
music and entertainment systems
heated and cooled seats that move in 46 directions
cup holders spaced every 7"
cruise control
auto dimming mirrors
fuel injection
delay wipers (even wipers that turn on by themselves)
hydraulic clutches... may as well add 6spd auto's as well
navigation systems
entertainment centers for the kids
power sliding doors and liftgates
aircraft headlights
parallel park assist
cockpit adjustable suspension
and on
and on
and on...

No wonder so many people can't drive any better than my 90+ year old grandmother. But I digress... all of these things make it easier to eat a sandwich, read a book, put on makeup or TALK ON YOUR STUPID PHONE!!!!!

Anyone want to start making and selling Model T's again?