Projects Not worth saving... 1929 Model A Roadster AV8 Hotrod (build thread!?)

Got started on the panels I got from you will start a build thread soon

 

Thanks Aaron, your consistent positive encouragement has motivated me more than once when I didn’t feel like going out to the garage.

Gosh, Mike, I’m speechless. Thank you very much for the kind words. I did work for a performance shop; one of the very best in the business, but in the earliest days of it’s existence. I went in there a cocksure 20-something, and had to learn how little I actually knew, before I could start learning any actual skills. And, unfortunately, I left there before I had a chance to REALLY learn, though the owner has remained a friend and mentor. I still feel like I don’t know what the heck I’m doing half the time, but I’m actively trying to learn and hone the skills I do have.

They actually have clinical terminology for this situation. When I first heard of The Dunning-Kruger Effect, it was like a light bulb went on.



Anyway, thank you so much for the positive reinforcement. I’m beyond stoked to hear that my build thread has motivated you on your own project. That is the coolest thing ever!

Brian, awesome, and thank you! That was my aim in starting a build thread. I can’t wait to see it finished up, either.

Thanks Ronny! Let me know when you do. I can’t wait to see what you do with them.

 

Figured I’d do something a little bit different for this week’s update. Please check out this video walk around and “introduction” to my Roadster project. Look for a “bonus” update later in the week going into more detail about what I actually accomplished since the last time I said hi.



Hope you all enjoy!

Thanks,

Casey

 

Please make sure to fit everything possible that bolts to the body before painting, just in case something needs a bit of tweaking or adjusting. Fantastic job so far!

 

Thank You!

Yes, not a single panel has been primed without a test fit. And, even still, I’m finding I’m having to do some tweaking, but it’s easy enough to scuff and reshoot primer on the parts I mess up. The reason for priming first is just because I don’t want the original sandblasted stuff to flash rust, and the new stuff is made from such crappy steel that it rusts if you look at it wrong. And there are so many places on this car where you’ve got three or four layers of metal sandwiched together, sometimes with a piece of original 93 year old steel that I painstakingly removed the rust from trapped in the middle; I can’t help but feel like it’d just be a recipe for disaster to do it any other way.

Anyway, thanks for checking out the video. And thanks for the support!

 

Great job on the A, the build thread and videos!
Car is really shaping up nicely

 

Thanks Paul!

Here’s another video:



I’ll try to get another traditional update put up here soon. Hope you all enjoy!

 

STOP scrolling, it’s time for a NEW massive multi-week Update!



So, for those of you who have watched my You Tube videos, some of this may be a bit redundant, BUT when attempting to make the attachment of the quarter panels to my subrails a bit more permanent, I ran into ALL KINDS of confusion, obfuscation, and down-right falsehood...so, read along. This might actually be interesting.



So, I thought that the first order of business would be to permanently attach the panels above and below decklid. But boy was I wrong. More on that later...



I started with the “panel above decklid”. Using the body lines and the “panel above decklid” itself as a template, I drilled the 5 necessary holes per side, and fitted the panel with #12x3/4” pan head machine screws and blue loctite.



After I went about drilling and bolting in the upper panel, I focused my attention on the lower panel. And once I had made it bolt-in (also with #12x3/4” pan head machine screws), I went about trying to fit the rumble seat reinforcement “triangle” braces (I don’t remember what you call them) and the rear most quarter panel to subrail braces.

You see, on my original quarters, these triangular braces were fit to the inside of the quarters...like, behind the T-molding. In fact, I started to modify one of my triangles to fit that way, removing some material, only to find out that this positioning put the quarter panel brace which holds the rumble hinge in a weird bind. So I took it back apart, and tried to fit it on the outside of the T-molding, between it and the “panel below decklid”, and le voíla! It fit perfectly.



Functionally, the braces and brackets don’t really care which side of the quarter panel they attach to, but this wouldn’t be the last of the inconsistencies I found between my original panels and the reproduction pieces...

After these panels were fit, I drilled through the T-molding and chamfered the holes to accept #12x3/4 flat countersink type machine screws...because these attachment points will ultimately live behind the trunk drip rail. I landed on the #12 size because that’s what Brookville supplied with the quarters (attaching the drip rail), and 1/4” fasteners didn’t quite fit through the holes in my original panels.

Then I got out my well-used #10 drill bit and went to work drilling all of the holes that will eventually receive 3/16” brazier head rivets; they’re held with Clekos for now.



With the rear section all fit up (it still has to come back apart one last time, because there are a couple of rivet holes I couldn’t quite reach with my drill), I focused my attention to the front quarter panel to subrail braces. Namely, in trying to figure out just exactly where they would attach. And this is where things started to go “pear shaped”, as the Brits would say.



You see, I still have what’s left of my original subrails, and while torch-cut and rusted quite badly, they still provide “forensic” clues for how the build should proceed every now and again. In fact, I should have studied the original subrails more carefully, and taken notes prior to even starting this project.



Regardless, judging by the rusty rivet nubs leftover on those original subrails, THIS is where the front quarter panel braces should go. Upper step of the subrail and all...Err, no. Way too long! And with this realization, also came the realization that the panel above decklid was going to have to come back out. But where exactly do these braces even go!? Time for a beer and a HAMB search...



Back at it, the braces sorta fit right here...but they feel a little short for this position. I mean, they’ve gotta be meant to go on that upper step, right!?



This picture from another HAMB thread seems to suggest that they go slightly further forward, but still on the lower step of the subrail. So I tried my braces in this position, and they were too short to even touch the quarter panel or the “panel above decklid”. What the heck!?



And then I remembered that little quarter panel reinforcement bracket, and the “dog leg” jog in it, which didn’t really make sense as I was bolting in the “panel above decklid” earlier...



Hmmm...that sure seems like it’s meant to hold this bracket, doesn’t it!?



And sure enough, the front quarter panel to subrail brace DOES fit height-wise between this spot and the upper step of the subrail. Only the angle doesn’t look right to me. I’m not sure if these braces serve a double purpose of mounting an interior panel in a stock A roadster. In my opinion, they’re probably “supposed to” go on that lower step, and should probably mount at the same angle as the rear braces. And I could have extended them and made them fit correctly, but then again, those rivets on my original rails were on the upper step...and way too far back. Shoot! It’s almost like these things were just thrown together on the assembly line. And I think I’m probably overthinking this...



So I decided to distract myself with the front quarter to subrail braces...

First, spot welds!



After the spot welds, I drilled for Clekos. I ran out of 3/16” Cleko’s, so I drilled all but one of the holes to 1/8”...and ordered more...when they come I’ll drill the 1/8” holes to #10 size one at a time, and replace with the appropriate sized Cleko until I can get the body off the table to install the rivets (see my second video).



It’s pretty incredible how rigid everything has become with all of these braces in place. And now I get to blow it all apart again for paint...but when it’s done, I am really going to be in the home stretch.

But, I’ve been on a pretty aggressive schedule with this thing for a few months now. A lot of tedious work. I was feeling the need for some instant gratification.



A quick, simple, and fun little project, that will start to make the body feel less like a collection of parts and more like an actual car...



I had a couple of these taillight stands leftover from another Model A project...but I’ve always hated how they jut out at an angle, AND the fact that they’re about a mile long.



And guess what!? The spare tire mount holes on the Bratton’s rear body crossmember aren’t perfectly centered either (my line is).



Taped up the taillight for tacking the bracket back together in the new, shorter, straight back orientation.



Hmmmm...I’m not entirely sold. I think I need to either fab up a license plate mount, or maybe just wait until the body is mounted on the frame to make up my mind for sure though. It was a fun little side project, regardless.



Until next time, HAMB!

 

Nice work on the Roadster body - the detail you're putting everything together with is a way ahead of what goes into many "restored" bodies!!

As you've figured out, the front quarter panel brace does get attached using the two middle bolts on the panel above the deck lid. The bottom end however does mount onto the middle step of the subframe a couple of inches forward of the subframe cross piece. I likely have a picture to show this if you can't find any on the internet. Placement isn't super critical - the only thing that was originally attached to it was a horizontal wood strip that was used for mounting the side upholstery panel. The wood strip was also attached to the shorter rear vertical brace that the rumble lid hinge was mounted on. Keep up the good work!!

 

Thank you VERY much for the compliments. While I agree that the middle step is where that brace is “supposed to” mount, did you see that pic of my original subrail (and what’s left of the rivets)? It looks like mine left the assembly line with the brace attached to the top step. If nothing else, it’s very peculiar. I’m guessing the original interior panels fit poorly in my car. As do the replacement braces. Oh well...

Thanks again for the kind words!!

 

nice work, like the center tail/brake light...

 

Love this build. Good luck. Wouldn't have the courage to start where you did..

 

I saw your other thread with regard to attaching the front quarter panel brace to the subframe and for what it's worth the picture posted by 4bangerbob shows the correct position for Roadsters. I believe that the mystery of the different original attaching location on your old subframe is likely because that old subframe (or at least that part of it) was originally used on a Coupe, not a Roadster. The panel above the decklid on Coupes is much narrower than that on Roadsters resulting in the need for a different location for the brace. The fact that the Coupe version was mounted on the top step of the subframe is offset by the Coupe brace having a curve in it on the top end. Clear as mud??

Keep up the good work!!

 

Thank you! You genuinely like it? I’m on the fence...

Ah, well shoot, Ryan, it’s like eating an elephant, as they say. You gotta do it one bite at a time. I think somebody commented that all the way back on page 1.

Well, if somebody had told me that the rear half of the sub rails weren’t from this car, I’m not sure I would have believed it, but your pictures make sense. I wonder if the reason my repop brace was too short was because it was for a coupe? But it did not have the correct bend at the top; I had to add that. Hmmm. Clear as mud, for sure.

Thank you for the pics!

 

First hotrod ...
'30 fenderless roadster pick up...
cop pulls me over, he said "this is 1984 not 1934", get another tail light ! ...
i did not...

 

Hahahaha! I can appreciate that.

I don’t want to start up the whole single vs double debate on my build thread, because some folks seem to get pretty incensed about that topic, but neither do I plan on running headlights or a windshield (at least not most of the time). Of course, most of the time it will just be used for running around very local, and my main goal is to take it out to El Mirage to use for cruising the pits and messing around out in the desert when my buddy is out there running his Triumph, but it will get towed to the lake bed.

 

Very very nice workmanship and attention to detail............love it!!

 

Thank you Carl. I really appreciate it.

 

Alright, so I’ve got a sort of mini update and a new video for you guys.



I wouldn’t even post anything about this part of the project, but these door sill brackets were kind of a pain. With my body bolted to the table, the table’s surface is the lower-most portion of the body line. And these brackets, right out of the box, didn’t quite fit.



The issue was with the rolled lip at the bottom of the bracket. It was originally twice as wide, which pushed the bracket up out of alignment with the part of the subrail that it’s supposed to attach to. And it shouldn’t hang below the surface of my table (as if I were installing them with the body on a frame instead), because that would pull the body line out of alignment. So the answer was to roll the lip a little bit tighter. In the above photo, the bracket isn’t clamped in the vice, but rather the outside of that rolled edge is just sitting on the vice rail and I am hammering it down against itself (but not entirely). Work slowly and check fit often.



Once you’ve got the height correct, you need to mark and drill the holes for the Clekos/rivets. I drilled 1/8” pilot holes in my part, then used the part as a template to drill the subrail, Cleko-ing in the 1/8” holes, and then stepping up to the #10 size for the 3/16” Clekos, one at a time. All of these rivets will get installed once the body is removed from the table. Which is getting close. BUT, we’re not done with this part quite yet...



After everything is fitting as it should, I took the part to the vice one last time, and rolled the bottom edge a tiny bit more. The point? To make room for the door sill. I mean, nobody’s ever going to notice a 20 gauge thickness misalignment of the body line, but, why not just make it right?

For the visually inclined among us, check out this week’s video:



And, that’s it for this week. Next week I’ve got some more parts heading my way, like the inner rumble panel and all of the hardware to install the lid itself. I’m not sure how far I’ll get, but you won’t want to miss it if I get this thing setting on the frame for the first time.

Thanks again for all the encouragement. You guys are keeping me moving in the right direction, and I appreciate it greatly. Until next time...

 

Looking great so far!

 

Thanks AJ! Hey, nice to see you over here, man.

 

Took me long enough, eh?

 

Hey gang! Trying to stay honest here with the weekly updates. This week I was hoping to try and start test fitting the rumble lid, but the package with all of the rumble lid hardware has been lost in transit for about a week. So instead I decided to fit up the drip rails and then blow everything apart one last time before final assembly.



When you order the complete quarter panel assemblies from Brookville they come with the drip rail sides pre-“fit”. If I had this to do over, I would order them separately, and fit them myself. My primary “beef” is that the holes for the countersunk machine screws were drilled too large, which meant that the screw head pulled through, and didn’t hold the drip rail to the quarter. Beyond that, they only require a little bit of additional fitting.



BUT, you should also order the forward-most piece of the drip rail, because the Brookville pieces are deeper than the factory piece, and as the holes are already drilled in both rails and quarters, welding everything up and starting over would be a gargantuan task.



The last step of my test fit was to drill one more hole for the attachment to the triangular quarter panel brace support bracket. This really tightens everything on the rear end of the body up quite nicely.



And, as this project so often goes, one step forward, ten or so steps back...



Drip rail assemblies prepped for primer...



...and, BAM!



At this stage in the game, it was time to reassemble the back end of the body. Unfortunately, I couldn’t scrape up the necessary tools to peen my rivets inside the subrail, so I cheated. The hex on these allens will get a little dab of bondo, and no one will know...except for the whole damn internet. There’s more on this dilemma in this week’s video, below.



But there you have this week’s progress. Now I’m going to go and twiddle my thumbs until my FedEx package arrives...maybe...someday......

Oh, but wait, there’s more! Please subscribe to the YouTube channel if you already haven’t. Tell your friends. Everybody needs more roadsters in their lives, right!?



Thanks for looking/reading/watching, gang!

I appreciate you all.

-Casey

 

What’s up HAMB!?

I’m sorry for the lag, here. Last week the in-laws were in town. I’ve got a new You Tube video up:



What’s the consensus? You Tube updates or traditional updates? Or maybe both!?

Let me know. And please subscribe (if you haven’t already), and let me know how I’m doing in the comments.

 

Hi Casey, the Youtube updates are good for me.
I'm sure you got it figured out, but in the video it looks like the hinge point on the hinges are angled to far towards the center of the decklid. I know videos don't give an accurate view of everything though.

 

They’re WAY off Aaron. I thought about trying to force them apart, and I thought about trying to bend the hinges themselves. I’ve got a local guy (Brentwood Bob, who I mention in the video) who is going to send me a pair of OG Ford hinges. It will be interesting to compare them side by side to the aftermarket pieces. The measurements he took put them at nearly an inch longer than the ones I have...

 

Hey, the HAMB! This weeks video update is LIVE!! Please subscribe if you haven’t already. I don’t want to hurt any feelings, but the Ford Barn is kicking the HAMB’s butt in terms of views, subscriptions, likes, and comments.



Teaser for those of you who prefer the traditional uodates...

Basically the aftermarket rumble lid hinges do not fit. I mean, I suppose if you’re making the rest of the stuff from scratch they might be fine, but if you can find a set of OE hinges, it will make your life a lot easier.



With the aftermarket hinges (in black), I would have had to make the hinge brackets completely from scratch, and the angles would have been a nightmare for smooth operation. As it is, I had to slice and dice the hinge brackets quite a bit:







BUT, this extra space nudged me towards a creative solution to shimming the rumble lid...with Oilite bronze...



I’m pretty impressed with how well it works. But if you want to know more, you’ll have to watch the video.

 

Awesome. Thank you for the necessary details.

 

Great thread! Awesome progress

 

Thanks Jamie! That’s what I’m doing it for.

Thank you Flat-Foot. It got off to a slow start, but it’s moving along pretty good now...