Projects I think I F'ed up .....

So a couple years ago when I started rushing into a project I welded in these P&J ladder bars on the rear. Flash forward to today and I am getting back to this project. While figuring out my sub rails on the frame I noticed that the rear of my ladder bars are higher than frame level by about a half inch. The rear angle is correct. That being said, can I get away with leaving them like this? I plan on using the original subrails with wood blocks. That will clear the ladder bars but I'm not sure how much they will move up and down.

 

That's a heavy Z you have going. When you lower a car that much gotta expect changes to the floor, ect if you still want suspension travel. I've been around cars lowered till the have an inch or less travel, they suck to ride in, more so the older I get.

 

The Z is 8 inches. So in your opinion am I all right or are you saying I would need to block the subrails even higher off the frame than the wood blocks?

 

Lots a drop! I thinking if you start raising the body by shims it might start looking like you raised the body with shims. Only asking but could you put a little kink in the top ladder to give you some room? In my opinion if I needed to raise the body I'd make runner for the top of the frame so you don't see gaps from the side. Like the filler when doing a 29 on a 32 frame.

 

If it's at ride height in the pic, it looks like you might have around 3" of travel at the axle. It'll be less than that at the kick up, so if you're using stock blocks with the subframe subtract an inch or so. If you have 2" clearance for the ladder at the kickup you should be good. Now's the time to measure it all and put snubbers on to limit the axle tube travel.

 

To gain the suspension travel you will probably have to raise the floor in that area. HRP

 

Behind the seat its easy to modify the floor. I would be looking at ladder bar travel under the seat area. A little easier to preplan modifications ahead of time.

 

X- cpe wouldn't there be much less travel going towards the seat area.

 

I would leave the body/subrails set on the frame as intended and modify the floor if needed.

 

HRP = I think that is what I need to do. Raise the floor behind my seat area. I think I can figure that part out. What I would love to see some picture of is original subrails modified to go up and over a "Z" and then back down as to keep the rear subrail cross member at frame rail height. Don't know why I'm having a hard time visualizing this .... Ive scoured the forum looking for pictures of a modified original subrail going over my type of Z. Seems most people just build their own sub frame.

 

Any significant modification usually requires several others......each one affects something else.

Ray

 

Lay a straight edge. Across. the frame and move suspension to measure if it will clear

 

Also. a square on the side of frame rail to top of ladder measure from bottom. Of square to frame. should give you how much room you have

 

redroaddog - As it sits now a straight edge laid across the frame right at the beginning of the Z sits on the ladder bars. They are 1/2 inch above my frame.

 

You're gonna need even more cut out to fit that driveshaft.

 

The cross member that the ladder bars are on is lowered in the middle. Hard to see in that pic.

 

Looks like your pinion is higher than the bars. Hence the need for more driveshaft room. Raise the floor now, easier than later.

 

I think the ladder bars are to high at both the axle and the front mount.. If both mounting points were moved down a bit, you would have more travel and not have to modify the floor...

 

I removed the crossmembers on my subframe so the frame fit inside the subframe.
Then i needed to rise the floor for my links to rearaxle.
Allso modified the floor and subframe crossmembers for driveshaft tunnel.



Then i needed to make some loops over the rearaxle on the subframe to clear for suspension.

 

Scrap metal - This is a frame that I bought from Riley's way back when (before he was banned lol). The front crossbar was already installed with the ladder bar tabs. The cross member also has very little drop in it for the drive shaft clearance as mentioned. maybe a new cross member with more drop and rotate the tabs another 25 degrees or so down might make things a bit better.
Like I said this is my first rodeo and trying to visualize this isn't easy for me for some reason. I can do lots of things but for some reason I feel like I hit a wall here.

 

Maybe it's just me; but the clevis ends are screwed out a lot more than they should be. Not sure why the top end is out so far; but something is out of whack. Maybe some cutting and relocating is in order.
If you cut and rotate the axle brackets to get the clevises even; will it affect your axle positioning. If it pulls it to far forward, maybe have to cut out some new axle brackets.

 

Rich that was an older photo. The clevis ends are screwed in half way on top and bottoms. I was thinking that I welded these axle brackets to far forward. If I rotated them down it would lower the ladder in relationship to the frame but the clevis bolts would be to short then if that makes sense. I remember the instructions saying to have the clevis screwed in half way on top and bottom and I think that's how I located where to weld them

 

Would there be an issue with shimming the rear buggy spring? It would have to be a decent sized shim though.

 

The easy fix would be a stock style frame if you dont want to modify your subframe and floor.

 

Are you worried about being too low? Maybe rig a spring spreader to work with your reversed eye spring and spread it out to duplicate ride height. Might tell you where you are at. If too low you could always build a spring spacer to adjust the height; not so much a spacer; but a purpose built part.
Otherwise if the height is good, just go to town modifying the subrails and build a floor to match, some square tube along with some 18 ga and a bead roller will do the trick.
I wouldn't use the wood blocks except the ones under the cowl. Steel with a piece of frame webbing is
easier to deal with, line it all up, drill pilot holes, lift the subrails or body off and weld anchor nuts into the top of the frame rails. Pics of a couple steel floors we put in A subrails, the roadster has inset panels and the sedan has the panels flat on top of the subrail.

 

Rich I'm not worried about it being to low. Heck I'd like it lower. My issue was my ladder bars were sitting higher than my frame height and when I put the subrails down the last cross member was sitting on top of my ladder bars.
I just cut the rear cross member out of the subrail assembly and it all sits flat on the frame now. The paper piece in the pic is a very crude idea of what I thought I could fab up and weld to the subrail to deal with getting around the Z & Axle. I still need to worry about how much up and down travel the ladder bars will have. Also have to deal with driveshaft clearance. So I guess I will also need to build a tunnel on the subrail cross members.

 

I think I may remove most my rear spring pack today as well. Been reading that using the main leaf and maybe one or two tops leafs will get me in the ball park for ride height. One step forward two steps backwards I guess. But with the spring out I can double check my ladder bar position and the recheck the position of the spring hangers.

 

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If you put a framing square onthe side of the frame and over the ladder bar and cycled the suspension till the axle hit the frame. you could measure the distance from top of frame and bottom of square that would tell you if. With stock blocks it would clear

 

Good idea. Couple ratchet straps would accomplish that I think.