Hot Rods When is it time to give up tradition over being practical?

So, this is sort of a hypothetical (kinda) question. So for years, I have held to my roots as far as building a traditional drag car. All of the parts in the Fly are circa 1965 or older. The Hilborn injectors are 1960, the block, heads etc are all early.

Here's my dilemma. Build creep. So, I start looking at taking the small journal block out and freshen it all up and I quickly get into a hefty machine build. Splayed caps, zero decking, line boring, etc. Not much small journal stuff out there, so stuck with a factory crank I'm sure I could get one custom ground, but $1500 per item adds up quick.

Anyway, so that leads into looking at the Dart block and it snowballs from there...you see where this is going.

So, I guess my deal is, do I forego my convictions for more modern reliability?

I was watching youtube all day since I am down with the flu, the cars at the meltdown drags and the SE Gassers guys are going faster than I can with my 301.

Just thinking out loud in a flu hazed state.

 

To thine on self be true.

 

There are times when you need to consider the practical side of it, and financial considerations are definitely one of the major reasons for going over the line! It is better IMHO to cheat on being 100% traditional rather than not being able to build it at all because it costs more than you can afford!

 

if "the fly" is the car in your avatar I'd guess speed is not the main goal.

 

When being a poor hot rodder means you can't afford to keep your rod running, it's time to make compromises....

 

I try to justify it in my mind, but most folks have become immune to the 11 second ET. Most modern bracket cars crank out 9.90's all day long. It would be a miracle to ever see that in the Fly.

 

Do what you gotta do my friend! HRP

 

if it can be changed, it can be changed back.
change is good.

 

If you are "totally honest" you are restoring a race car to a given point in time. There was a record at that time, it is in some Record Book, some were. If you build a killer motor that turns your car 100MPH faster and three seconds quicker you WILL NOT change history. Bob

 

I bet the flathead guys felt the same way after the OHV stuff

 

Try traditional "Cheating", get the old casting numbers welded into the block

 

I have never seen anybody checking casting numbers at Metldown. It seems to be more " if it looks like a vintage small block , than it is" . It is your car, so make you happy! Larry

 

I have the same thing going on....it's fun to go fast with all that old stuff, and a lot of guys dig it. Not many guys are out there doing it with you, though. And you do reach the performance limit with that particular combo.

I'm building a whole nuther car. Going to have some more modern stuff in it, but trying to still keep the old technology vibe going as much as I can.

Good luck with your decision, it ain't easy.

 

As you know, building and maintaining a functioning traditional drag car can get out of control expensive in a hurry weather you stay strictly with traditional components or more modern replacements. To me race cars are more fun when you can race them instead of repairing them, so concessions for reliability and safety are acceptable. Will you have less fun racing with a Dart block and new crank? I doubt it, but I understand it's a slippery slope when exceptions are made. You seem like a person who takes great pride in racing a truly period correct car. Will making changes to go faster or save money bother you in the long run?
Quoting the movie Dazed & Confused "You got to do what Randel "Pink" Floyd wants to do"!

 

The car doesn't have to be totally traditional to be totally fun. I don't know about a Dart block but you can massage a 350 with a pair of good heads and get another 200hp over that 301. Set it in the corner for future days and enjoy the build and enjoy the new kick in your ass. That's a light car..

 

Exactly. I have thought about building a gasser with a more modern setup, but the wife just gives me "the look". The next issue will be the fact that we are running a solid mounted rear. I wanted it period correct and wanted to know what it felt like to drive a period car. It may start doing crazy stuff if I double the HP.

 

I'd build a whole 'nother motor, and save the traditional for the guys that gotta have it!

 

Are you having fun? As was said, you're not going to make history unless you dip into the threes. Why are you building/racing in the first place? What "convictions" do you have? Only certain engines? Only certain parts? Or win (what) at any cost? Sooner or later you're going to be bumping your head again. You have nothing to prove to anyone except yourself. So-are you having fun? Many of us would kill to have a little A bone that stands up on its hind legs. I guess the answer to the question is "when you have the money and the desire to go faster than you already are."

 

It is fun, but I kind of think we are at that plateau. If you look at the NHRA records for 1962 and we are on par. However, by today's standards, we are at production street car numbers.

I guess where I have issues are where do I draw the line? I have thought about just upping the cubes by installing a 327 crank and reducing the rotating weight, but that starts the proverbial ball rolling...

I don't expect that I am going to be remembered in time for setting some record speed, but I'm ok with just putting on a show....

Oh and I don't really expect an answer, just talking shop with 150,000 of my closest friends.

 

If running a small chevy. You have to be a car nerd like us to tell the difference between them
The folks in the stands could care less
Stroke the crap out of a large journal block and decorate with period accessories.
Have fun

The guys with the late French flathead blocks do

 

I feel your pain. I thought about settling for some OT parts myself and then happened to luckily find a couple of period parts and I'm back on to going for period build. I know for myself I'd never be happy with settling always thinking I should have just did it how I intended. But, if I do settle, it will be on something that is easily swapped out when I find the part I really wanted...

 

LS it....

 

I have a newer style set of Hilborn Injectors I bought that use the new style long nozzle. It's a def design improvement. If I switch to them, it's game on anyway. Might as well use the Brodix track one heads I have as well. I tend to collect parts and never pull the trigger. Sometimes, I hate being a purist.

 

Ha ! That's a whole nuther messageboard and issue.

 

I was there for 9 years building the roadster. Many nights I questioned my sanity but stayed true to the build. Now looking back I am glad I did. What I get out of the true traditional build that is great fun, most people have NO idea what I did, The motor would have been fast in 1950 but a rock by today's standards, and cost was triple the budget. BUT when some old guy or some young punk comes up and is interested in it and understands what the car represents I am very happy.
Walter

 

We went in the 10's in 1969 with a 302 Chevy short block with crane roller cam and heads with stack injection in a chopped 31 model a coupe with solid rear suspension. Push start, center steer, 3 speed running 2nd and high. Ran C/alt. It never pulled the wheels like your car.

 

It boils down to which part of the phrase 'traditional hot rod' is most important to you; the 'traditional' part or the 'hot rod' part. Back in the day, these cars were beat on with abandon in the search for more performance. But replacement parts like blocks, heads, trans, etc were still easy to find and cheap which isn't always the case today. Today, if you go 'full traditional' you're faced with the choices of building your 'full boogie' and treating it like a museum piece so you don't break any of those hard-to-find parts, or de-tune it enough to be 'safe'. Or have deep pockets and/or a big parts stash....

Otherwise, using newer/cheaper/better parts is the answer if the 'hot rod' part is more important.

Of course, where to draw the line on the mix of new/old is the question.

 

That's exactly what we wanted to replicate. Mine is center steer etc. I just have an old aluminum glide that dad and I built in the shop. Parts of the motor were off of dads old C/Gas car. It's about as low buck as it can get. I have time to ponder it all. The antihistamines probably don't help. I was awake at 3 this morning thinking about it.

 

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and goes quack most people will firmly believe that it is a duck. Just don't post a brag sheet on what the block is and if someone really in the know spots it, give them that knowing nod and wink and go on with life. It's still going to have the same early heads, the same injection, the same ignition and probably the same cam that you were planning on all along. The later block and crank alone aren't going to make it any or much faster unless you spend big bucks for the innards and what not to go that much faster.
That said if you are building it to show as a period correct vintage drag car and plan to take it to The Detroit Autorama or GNRS and put it on display as being authentic it needs to be authentic right down to the date coded block.