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Technical Traditional looking wire organizing?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Hemi Joel, Mar 25, 2017.

  1. ago
    Joined: Oct 12, 2005
    Posts: 2,199

    ago
    Member
    from pgh. pa.

    Aircraft have all one color wiring, and are much more complicated than our cars! Traditional wiring:
    5 wires to front, 1 parking lights, 2 low beam, 3 hi-beam, 4 left TS, 5 right TS. Rear 3 wires, 1 running lights, 2 left TS and stop, 3 right TS and stop. Then Ignition,starter, charging. In the end not many wires!
     
    rjones35 and 31Vicky with a hemi like this.
  2. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,935

    squirrel
    Member

    Speaking of fathers teaching us about how to build hot rods...my guess is not very many had that luxury. Mine taught us boys the basics of electronics, and what was best, he let us take stuff apart and play with it, so we could learn on our own. That included buying an old car with the stated goal of us taking it apart when it quit working.

    But his own workmanship was not so neat by the time I was starting to do stuff. The wiring on his patent model (made when I was a baby) is OK, but nothing like the wiring in the show cars in the little books :)

    patent.jpg

    https://www.google.com/patents/US3262356
     
  3. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 7,589

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    That's true "Point to point" wiring. Very traditional, very common wiring technology used back in the day. Packed a lot into a small space. Point to point guitar amps are highly prized and collectible.
     
  4. I use electrical tape and have for a very long time. Now that I am more sophisticated I have been known to use a plastic anchor or a rubber lined metal clamp, but my wiring is still all wrapped in electrical tape.

    I don't know how traditional electrical tape is my Ol' Man used it and he started playing cars and motorcycles in the '30s. If it was good enough for him it is good enough for me. :D
     
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  5. I don't know what that item is that Squirrel posted but point to point wireing was required in some electronic devices, if the wire were all run together like we are talking about, you would get interference if the wires carried high hz. The early radios were first built with wires all tied up neat and all running at right angles to eachother then they learned to go to point to point.

    but now back to cars.
     
  6. I agree, and it's really too bad how into "perfection" this all got.
     
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  7. LOL not at the 'beaners place. I may build something really nice for a customer but my stuff is still built for one thing and one thing only, having fun. ;)
     
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  8. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,935

    squirrel
    Member

    it's described in the link to the patent :)

    yup, no more airplanes, pinball machines, or darkroom timers
     
  9. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 23,264

    gimpyshotrods
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    My grandfather was a simple farmer, turned repair man. He missed both big wars (just born at the wrong time), and never had any schooling on how to do things of this topic. He just did everything in a neat and tidy fashion, knowing that one day, someone, possibly him, would have to service it. He thought through the possibilities of what might happen when something was going to be used, and built it accordingly.

    Everything that he did was simple, neat, precise, and very nearly perfectly designed. To say that what he was responsible for was well cared for is an understatement.

    Although he has passed, his purchased new 1931 Model A (that I learned to drive in) is still running, registered, insured, and on-the-road, and has NEVER been otherwise. It still runs the never serviced since built hand made radiator that he produced, from common materials.

    Not all art hangs in galleries or museums. Some of it lives on a family farm in Northeast Connecticut.
     
  10. cretin
    Joined: Oct 10, 2006
    Posts: 3,066

    cretin
    Member

    Since when has taking pride in your work, and doing the best of your ability, and trying to improve your ability been a bad thing?

    Some people like to do that. Some people don't give a shit. But giving a shit about the quality of your work shouldn't be frowned upon just because it's leaps and bounds better then some 50's "barn find".



    Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
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  11. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,935

    squirrel
    Member

    Perfection gets boring, after a while.
     
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  12. cretin
    Joined: Oct 10, 2006
    Posts: 3,066

    cretin
    Member

    I can appreciate that, but striving for it isn't a bad thing.

    Also, if you think it's perfect, you aren't looking hard enough.


    Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
     
  13. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 7,589

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    This has been a pretty cool thread with some good info. Let's not ruin it by arguing that old argument again and get it deleted please. Let it go guys.
     
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  14. Not exactly sure what you are looking for here.
    You said you are using cloth covered wire. Seems to me you're kind of locked into cable lacing, or maybe the asphalt coated stuff? But then ,why use cloth wire and then cover it up?
    But, are you trying to build a 60's style hot rod? Electrical taped harnesses were used throughout the 60's.
    Is that the car, with the modern front wheels?
     
  15. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 5,776

    Six Ball
    Member
    from Nevada

    You gotta' love the HAMB. Half of the posters know how everything was done in the day and the other half know they are wrong.o_O There is some good information here anyway.:cool:
     
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  16. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 30,628

    The37Kid
    Member

    Someday, someone will wire a car so neatly that the clueless like myself might figure out how the shit works. Don't bet on that ever happening. Bob
     
    cretin likes this.
  17. That should be a sticky
     
    Hemi Joel likes this.
  18. Fortunately I'm building a custom and "tradition" has nothing to do with it. I want my engine room to look like Howard Hughes ran the wires while H.G. Wells was holding the work light. It doesn't really matter to me if the "look" was there in the past or not. I want it to feel like it was a hand crafted, special build from the past. But that's just me. I think it's legal to do this in the county where I live. ;)

    Pinball, Baby!!
    pinball-stepper-repair-01.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2017
    rod1 likes this.
  19. Blake 27
    Joined: Apr 10, 2016
    Posts: 1,504

    Blake 27

    Perfection? HPIM0430.JPG
     
  20. Some would ask ..With tie wraps?
    I don't think they look bad , trimmed and tucked under.
    Traditional ? (there's that word again) Probably not, with 30 amp relays.
     
  21. Looks good to me Blake.
    But don't much credit to what I say :p
     
  22. Blues4U
    Joined: Oct 1, 2015
    Posts: 7,589

    Blues4U
    Member
    from So Cal

    Looks very neat and tidy, very well done.

    But in a traditional hot road, what the hell are you running that needs all those relays? Someone else posted earlier, there's like 5 wires to the front, 3 to the back, starting and charging and some gauges. I always wonder this when seeing the bundles of wires in some rods.
     
  23. LOL everything I have ever wired has a simplified wiring harness, as in if it doesn't need to be there is doesn't go there. I have been known to use junction blocks to clean things up and I do like my engine bay to be as clean and simple as possible.

    I am not one to say that "I know how it was done back in the day" I know how it got done where I was at when I was there and I saw how the guys before me did it when I was there. I also know that they were not restorers, their stuff was clean and simple for the most part and they never spent a lot of time caring what anyone else thought about it.
     
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  24. Gman0046
    Joined: Jul 24, 2005
    Posts: 6,256

    Gman0046
    Member

    Beaner you have absolutely knocked the ball out of the park with your most recent post on this wiring thread. Thats exactly what I've ben trying to get across with my posts on this subject. I still don't understand why someone who readily admit they missed being there yet don't mind telling us "I know how it was done back in the day". Thanks for your response and insight from someone who was there and have pictures not BS to back it up.

    Gary
     
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2017
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  25. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 14,799

    jimmy six
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Wax string was traditional for power plant control boards; it how I learned. Double halfhitch straight then another and so on. Keeping the wires straight was the hardest using all gray SIS asbestos insulated wire. Numbered them with a fine tip pencil. Do try to keep the wires straight. Good luck.
     
  26. Thanks for the kind words.

    I am just lucky, every freak, boho, and greaser passed through the old man's shop on Saturdays and the ol man liked me enough to let be there to watch it happen. ;)
     
  27. rjones35
    Joined: May 12, 2008
    Posts: 865

    rjones35
    Member

    So I'm confused, is this traditional wiring or not? Came on my 63 that way, I replaced it all, maybe I shouldn't have.....

    [​IMG]
     
  28. I sure would have left that really long wire, it may need to be that length for everything to work properly.

    I peeled the tape off the harness in my '64 Chevelle once and it had wires that were way too long and all folded up. me being the electrical wizard that I am left them that length because I knew that it was how the GM engineers wanted them to be, I even made sure that the folds stayed the same just incase it was some sort of a coil or something. :D
     
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  29. Binger
    Joined: Apr 28, 2008
    Posts: 1,734

    Binger
    Member
    from wyoming

    I used friction tape on my coupe project. Looks old style IMO. Much better than new plastic electric tape. I also used the asphalt wire loom also. Just finished installing all cloth wiring in my car. I was waiting on my wire order to come in and I needed my car wired for the hillclimb so I just used scraps I had in the garage. Even though the wires I installed were not 'traditional' material, it was done the in same spirit a kid would have built a car back then. I finally got motivated and used the cloth wire I ordered. It turned out super nice and I am glad I finally got it installed. Hardly any of it will ever be seen but I know it is there and I take a little pride in a nice neat and tidy installation.
     
    Hemi Joel likes this.
  30. "5 wires to the front" may be true for a "traditional" hot rod, which is basically a soapbox derby with an engine. (I respect and love 'em so put down that tire iron.) But fast forward to the 40's and 50's and the rest of the street rod age and you're dealing with more lights, horns, electric fans and controls, relays and fuses for safety, upgraded alternators, and maybe A/C if you're building a driver. That's just up front. Under the dash is a 'hole 'nother smoke, if you want to play tunes and add some gauges. You would have to go out of your way to make a mess of 5 wires, but with 25 a mess gets easy to do. Remember fellows, we're covering a pretty broad range with this discussion. What any of us might do in one car could be the opposite of what we do in another.
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2017

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