Register now to get rid of these ads!
  1. Hey fellas, just in case you missed it - The Rodder's Journal and The Jalopy Journal is celebrating 20 years of bringing you traditional hot rods and customs by offering you a one-year subscription to TRJ and a H.A.M.B. Alliance membership for only $75. Click here for details.

Tips on Buffing Urethane basecoat/clearcoat?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Mark, Mar 21, 2007.

  1. Mark
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2002
    Posts:
    159
    Location:
    CT

    Mark Member

    I spent some time with the searching old threads, and half the time im not sure what type of paint people are talking about. I imagine different paints should be buffed differently

    we sanded the clear urethane with 1500, and i have a wool pad, gallon of fine compound, (i forget the brand) and a waffle pad and a bottle of polishing "swirl remover"

    Use the compund with the wool pad and the swirl remover with foam pad? IS the waffle pad good for use with the swirl remover?
    which brings me to the question : Whats the difference between a waffle foam pad and a smooth foam pad? Are tey used for different things?

    My old man an I have color sanded and buffed cars before, but they were always "drivers" , not something that we actully wanted to come out as nice as possible. lol
    Any helpful hints will be appreciated.

    Mark
  2. gahi
    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2005
    Posts:
    734
    Location:
    Moab, UT

    gahi Member

    I've always used the Perfect-It III system. But for your setup, your right. wool/compound, then foam/swirl remover. The waffle pads dont shoot the compound all over as bad, and they might keep the clear a little cooler. Just remember not to get it hot, and do any high spots or crowns by hand.
  3. Tinbender
    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2001
    Posts:
    3,758
    Location:
    Corner of Sodom & Gomorrah Spokane WA.

    Tinbender Member

    I'd look into the DA sanding systems. I've been using Norton, and finishing with 3000. Well worth the money, and saves hours with the buffer.
  4. Roothawg
    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2001
    Posts:
    14,650
    Location:
    Slackerville, OK

    Roothawg Member

    Tinbender. We have the "3M Hookit system but are kinda scared to use it. Afraid of cutting through. Is the 3000 all you use on it?
    Register now to get rid of these ads!

  5. indyjps
    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2007
    Posts:
    1,584
    Location:
    Chicago - West Burbs

    indyjps Member

    I stick with 3M, use their compounds and pads. the guy at the paint store should be able to steer you straight. I cant remember the colors of pads now. I prefer the waffle.
  6. dbildvil
    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2006
    Posts:
    45
    Location:
    quebec,canada

    dbildvil Member

    I always start with #1500,then #2000.I use a black wool pad with the extra cutting coumpound from Presta,next I switch with a blue wool(find it's faster than the waffle)with the glaze and finish with the swirl remover.
  7. gbones32coupe
    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2007
    Posts:
    510
    Location:
    pennsylvaina

    gbones32coupe Member

    I polish every day. I think it all depends on how long the clear has cured for depends on how it is sanded and polished.

    We use dupont urathane clear. I also like the 3M perfect it. We use 3M 1500 hook it 2 dry on a DA sander with an inter face pad. It is the fastest way to sand I think. We try to sand and buff the cear with in 24 hours. The compound will cut better and the clear will polish up faster.

    If you wait too long then the clear is a lot harder to polish and harder to get the sand scratches out. The prefect it 3000 is great for sanding out the 1500 sand scratches. It is more time comsuming to sand it again but buffs up faster in the long run. Also looks better too.

    I still wet sand when I wan't to be anal and make it perfect but then your hands start bleeding from all that sanding. I still like going over it with 3000.

    Buffing pads I like are 3M white wool for cutting compound and 3M black foam waffel pad for swearl mark remover.
  8. Mark
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2002
    Posts:
    159
    Location:
    CT

    Mark Member

    Thanks for the responses! I have a little more confidence now. Ill try and post a pic if it comes out good.


    Mark
  9. Jeff J
    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2007
    Posts:
    709
    Location:
    Wingate N.C.

    Jeff J
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I didn't see anybody post that the yellow wool pads are for polishing after the white pad for cutting then go to the waffle foam pad after the yellow wool pad
  10. chopolds
    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2001
    Posts:
    4,678
    Location:
    howell, nj

    chopolds Member
    1. Kustom Painters

    Just so you know there are other ways to do it.....and I prefer this way.
    I wait about a month before sanding and buffing...or else I just do a REAL quick, light sand with 800 the first week, then finish up 3 weeks later. That way I do not have any "die-back", or flattening, fogging, shrinking of the paint when I'm done. Yes, it's MUCH easier to do it the first couple days, but the paint continues to cure/dry and it does flatten out, and shrink a bit, and you wind up resanding and buffing again later, if you really like a nice finish.
    So, I start with 600 or 800 wet, any finer than that, and I see that it just smooths over the orange peel, instead of really flattening it. I use a hard rubber block for most of this, and whatever curved blocks I need for special contours. Just a light cut to get it flat. Then go to 1000 grit wet again, hard block, or hard sanding pad, going over it very well to remove the scratches form the previous step. You should spend about 3 times as much time on this step, as you did on the previous one. Next, 1500, using a soft pad. Not as labor intensive as the 1000 grit step. If the color is very dark, I go to 2000 grit.
    Buffing, I don't really like wool pads any more. They make foam pads specifically for compound. I use Perfect-It 3, Extra cut, on a hard foam pad. Then go to Meguire's #2 with a softer, polishing foam pad, waffle is good here. Finish machine buffing with Meguire's #9 and a very soft foam pad. If you want it even nicer (or if doing black), use a hand glaze with a microfiber or cotton baby diaper, by hand next.
    Tips...I put a long piece of Tygon tubing on the end of mt garden hose for wetsanding, so the metal end can't scratch the paint.
    Keep the water running while wetsanding, any paint removed can get lodged in the paper, and scratch the paint.
    Use a bucket of water to soak the sandpaper and to dip into once in awhile to clean the paper. I put a little Ivory soap, or carwash in it to help lube the paper, and keep the sanded paint from sticking to it.
    Wash the car in between steps, so you don't cross contaminate. Can cause scratching.
    Use a rubber squeegee to help remove sanding residue. Also helps dry the surface so you can see how much paint you've removed in your first sanding steps. (Keep sanding until all the shiny spots are gone, and the paint will be flat)
    Put tape over sharp edges, or body lines so you don't over sand, or overbuff and remove the paint. It's REAL easy to do!
    Don't stay in one spot too long while buffing, you can burn the paint. Right down to primer or bare metal!
    Clean the buffing pad often. Build-up of compound will slow the buffing process.
    Spray detailer and a soft detail brush will remove sanding/compound residue inside door jambs, and truck edges. Just don't let it dry there too long.
  11. North Bay Shoebox
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2006
    Posts:
    755
    Location:
    Northern California

    North Bay Shoebox Member

    I polish nearly everyday and have tried almost every brand, and what we use now is a company called Farecla. It is by far the best compound I have used. I hate to polish and it has cut my rubbing time down. It holds the gloss and will not die back like 3m can. You can pick up the whole kit, two parts, for about $100, but money well spent. If cars have to go we can rub after about a couple of hours and have ho worries. It will take your 1500 sratches out no problem.
  12. earl schieb
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2004
    Posts:
    2,931
    Location:
    MID-TN across from the cows

    earl schieb Member

    Chopolds, did we go to the same school of buffing? :confused:
    THAT'S darn near the same way we do stuff around here. 800 dry/DA/no interface pad, 1200/DA/wet/ interface pad, finger sand wet with 1500:eek:(hey, I double my paper and fold it twice so it's stiff! :)) Right now, cutting with white wool and 3M extra cut III(and the "new" formula sucks IMHO:mad:), then polish with black waffle and swirl remover.
    I'm fixin' to try the Meguiars Solo stuff(one compound, 4 different pads ;))---just haven't found the right guinea pig yet.

    True, sanding the first time and waiting for complete curing before finishing will 99% of the time eliminate ALL shrinking and dieback(IF you did your bodywork correctly and used quality primers/fillers)

    I like shiny paint :D
  13. Roothawg
    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2001
    Posts:
    14,650
    Location:
    Slackerville, OK

    Roothawg Member

    But you guys are talking about bc/cc only ...yes?
    I am pondering going back to a single stage metallic on the 50 and I am scared I might get into the metallic........

    I have the option of clearing over the particular paint while it is still hot so should I do this just to make sure I have enough build?
  14. chopolds
    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2001
    Posts:
    4,678
    Location:
    howell, nj

    chopolds Member
    1. Kustom Painters

    Yeah, Earl...we're "Old School". Lacquer, I used to do a buff at one month, and wait and finish up after another month! That stuff would keep shrinking for over a year! BUT, you could do a 600 cut, and one or 2 steps buffing, and it looked like a million bucks!
    Root, I definately do NOT recommend using a SIngle Stage for metallics. Especially if you intend to buff it out. BC/CC doesn't cost WAY too much more, shop around. I've been using smartshoppers. for my HOK stuff. Great prices, they sell other brands as well. After all the time you spend on welding, bodyowrk, sanding, don't skimp on paint quality, if it's an old car. Maybe on a daily driver, but not a nice old car.
  15. earl schieb
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2004
    Posts:
    2,931
    Location:
    MID-TN across from the cows

    earl schieb Member

    What happened to single stage black, Root?

    and no.....don't ever be thinkin about cut/buff on a single stage metallic.......unless it's lacquer, and you've sanded between coats about ten times :eek:
  16. Tinbender
    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2001
    Posts:
    3,758
    Location:
    Corner of Sodom & Gomorrah Spokane WA.

    Tinbender Member

    Root, I haven't broke thru with the DA sanding systems at all. I use the same system on solid single stage, but like the others, I use clear coat over metallics.
  17. Roothawg
    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2001
    Posts:
    14,650
    Location:
    Slackerville, OK

    Roothawg Member

    We found a wierd color that we like that kinda looks like a mid-50's GM color. Besides.....I'm not that good of a bodyman.:rolleyes:
  18. nimrodhaas
    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2012
    Posts:
    2
    Location:
    Austin, TX

    nimrodhaas Member

    It doesn't appear that this question (tips on buffing) has been addressed in awhile, so I'd like to pick you expert brains on this once again. I'm a novice painter with BC/CC and have recently used the following materials: Basecoat-Dupont ChromaBase, Clearcoat-ChromaClear 7900S, colorsanding - both hand wetsanding starting with 1000 grade, and 3M purple finishing discs on a DA, polishing - 3M Perfect it system with foam waffles.

    I am having 2 problems. #1, the orange peel is very hard and very difficult to get rid of. Its all but impervious to hand sanding. I have tried the 3m discs both wet and dry, and although the dry works a bit better, (with cleaning off of the residue ever 5 seconds or so), the discs wear out very quickly and it is very slow going. Is this ultra-resistant clear the result of my having waited about a month after painting to get started with sanding, rather than sanding after a couple of days? Any tricks with dealing with this problem?
    #2 - I can't get the brilliant shine of the original clear back with the 3M Perfect it system. I drop a dime sized dollop of material on the surface and buff away with the intended foam waffles at a low speed (my variable buffer doesn't have the actual RPM to choose from, but I set it to the low end of its range), but at best, I achieve a smudgy glow, certainly no mirror shine. Not enough buffing? Not enough material? Too much? Any suggestions appreciated.
  19. pimpin paint
    Joined:
    May 31, 2005
    Posts:
    4,964
    Location:
    so cal

    pimpin paint Member

  20. Rushrod
    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2012
    Posts:
    23
    Location:
    Northern Indiana

    Rushrod Member

    We do the same thing..... 800..... 1000..... 1500..... 2000.... 3000....... all wet except the 3000 we use the purple 3M trizac paper..... All 3M perfect it compounds and glaze.... We use an orbital buffer to cut down on the "swirl" marks...... I know it seems like a lot of water sanding but when you are after " the look" it is well worth it...... Also use the 3M powder guide coat between each grit of water sand....... Good luck and stay off those edges..... Try taping those edges while your buffing.........
  21. iFlip
    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2010
    Posts:
    174
    Location:
    San Angelo

    iFlip Member

    I wouldn't touch a metallic single stage with a buffer. Meguiars #7 is great for bringing out shine in a single stage though.

    You'll just have to keep sanding. It sucks, but it's all worth it in the end.

    How big is the area your working when using the dime size drop? Are you slowly letting off pressure as you work an area? Some products just don't work good on certain paints. You may want to try different products.
  22. Go to 3Mcollision.com and look at the Paint Finishing video. You can also download the literature on the Perfect it system.
  23. nimrodhaas
    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2012
    Posts:
    2
    Location:
    Austin, TX

    nimrodhaas Member

    Thanks for all of the advise. I'm on it. In response to iFlip, the area I buff is usually around 2 feet square. Too large?
  24. Ob1
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2010
    Posts:
    415
    Location:
    Charleston SC

    Ob1 Member

    You guys might look into Eagle Abrasives' Assilex system. It is a dry sanding system {works wet too}. Not cheap, but a great product, aggressive but shallow cut, a real timer saver.

    Cut down the surface with the yellow {800 grit}, go back over with orange {1500 grit}. You can stop there if you like, or switch over to a higher grit conventional wet sanding paper.

    I like 3M Super Duty compound followed by Evercoat Triple Cut
  25. iFlip
    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2010
    Posts:
    174
    Location:
    San Angelo

    iFlip Member

    Yea i would cut down on the area or use more compound.

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2013 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.