Hot Rods Issues when installing a harmonic balancer/damper on Crankshaft

For those that have pressed on a harmonic balancers, in my case a SBC,even with the proper tool for installing( Not a large rubber mallet)it still required a long wrench with a lot of leverage and lots of elbow grease ..
one fact and one question :
1. I read the reviews from people that have bought a harmonc balancer( installer,)the proper tool for this purpose,bought from various sources and many of the purchasers say the installer broke while pressing the balancer on leaving part of the threaded portion of the tool still threaded in the crank,even after putting lubercant on the crank end.Not good if it broke off flush!!

2. How does one hold the engine from turning over when your pressing on the balancer. One tool mention is one that screws into a spark plug hole and pushes against the piston.Seems scarey to me ?
Any thoughts or suggestions ?

Gene

 

The installer tool should have flats on the bolt, so you can put a huge Crescent wrench on it to keep it from turning. Then you will be using the tool as designed, and you won't break it.

 

I have had good luck clamping a pair of vice grips onto the flex plate. Then rotating the crank until the vice grips hit the bottom of the block.
I haven't had any problem with damaging the flex plate or ring gear. This has also worked for me when taking the balancer bolt out.
So far I haven't had the opportunity to try this with a manual transmission.

 

I have a proper installer from snap on because what good mechanic doesn't. Mine has flats on it just like @squirrel described. I have had cheaper ones that did not and used a screw driver to pinch the flywheel or the crank on the tail end of the engine.

The balancer should not go on so tight as to break the bolt or one should not be so ham fisted as to break the bolt. That suggests that there is a problem that needs to be addressed like a small burr or the balancer is going on crooked.

I should not admit this but I have had good luck with a piece of pipe and a light hammer too.

 

All dampers are not created equal , some of the aftermarket ones are not sized correctly , you have to check the crank snout & balancer to be sure they're compatible.
dave

 

I've also done well on small blocks with a big hammer and a 2x4.

 

I could tell you big hammer, these other yayhoos not so much.

 

what gets me is how many dampers I've removed that were hammered on without the benefit of a 2x4 or piece of pipe.

 

I don't think I would have told that brother.

I once torqued a set of heads with a socket extension and a pair of vice grips. That was I had in the part of the jungle I was working in, I guess I must have gotten lucky the guy made the 1500 mile trip to the mid west in his damned old truck.

Guys like you and me always work with what we got, I think we are better mechanics for it.

 

I've run them down with an impact wrench set on stun for years, then reverse the bolt and set it properly with a torque wrench to 60 Ft pounds. I use a flywheel tool to hold the crank during torqueing.

 

Sounds like an excellent way to strip a crank !
dave

 

Hmmmmnnnnn I wonder if it will work on a fat chick. I really like fat girls.

 

You gotta get your head above your belt !!
dave

 

I made a press device using a stud screwed into the crank. This protects the crank threads from damage. I filed 2 flats in the shank portion of the stud for ez removal when complete. The exposed threads of the stud are fine thread. I use a ball bearing with a washer smaller than inner diameter of the outer race and lube the thread with never seize. I adjust the length needed by using different 1/2" impact sockets. I normally run manual transmissions and use a 3/8" long cap screw installed on the engine side of the flywheel clutch mounting threads to stop the engine from turning over.... System never fails or damages any threads..Good Luck.

 

I would think that hammering would flatten the thrust bearing.??

 

before they had a bolt we hammered 'em home...big brass drift & bfh..
dave

 

Always measure! Some aftermarket balancers need some time on a connecting rod hone to size them up correctly or they will be too tight and break shit trying to force it on. Been there.

 

I had pioneer brand balancer that was too tight on a Scat crankshaft. 30 seconds with some fine emery cloth solved the problem.

Mine takes about 30 lbs. torque to install the way it is now.

I used different length bolts to get it started then ran it up with a breaker bar
socket.

 

Maybe I should't even say this, but I've NEVER used a press-on-threaded-bearinged-professional-installer. There, I said it, and I know there are lots of guys who do this the same way, to this day. I have a 3 inch thick, 3 1/3 inch diameter, piece of steel stock I've had for almost 50 years. I use it with a BFH to drive them on, more like tap them on; there's a distinct sound when they seat. It's all I use that chunk of steel for; well that and installing grease seals into brake hubs. The crankshaft flange end gets backed up with a chunk of wood driven between it and the engine stand. I always use some lube on the snout and inside sleeve of the dampener. I have worn out two dampener PULLERS removing as many dampeners as I have; they don't even make THEM like they used to; seems they bend, not strip. I have had to dress the snouts of a few cranks left by people before me, and I have polished a few dampeners inside the sleeve for the same reason. I guess I got started doing them ALL this way because I started out with the ones that HAD to be done this way when there were no dampener bolts even holding them on. I've never even thought about buying an installer tool, I can't see doing so now, and I've assembled a lot of engines. I am Butch/56sedandelivery.

 

I too have never used the proper tool. For me it was a 4 lb sledge and a 8 inch chunk of 4X4 of hardwood, preferable from a shipping pallet. That's some good oak. Like was already said, you can hear when the balancer bottoms out.
Never harmed a thrust bearing. Never had a balancer came off either.
Tip.....don't hammer on the outside ring.

 

Hey I made mine..first for the GMC 6 which uses a 5/8" fine thread caps crew. Coverted it for a Chev V8.. I am not against pounding. All the old Chev 6's had a nose piece for a hand crank just like the old flathead Fords, we all hammered them on.

 

I always use a 1/2 inch impact on the tool after making sure the balancer is clean and oiled. If you bang it on the crank will be hitting the thrust bearing with the crank and could cause damage.

 

I was installing a torque converter and used a breaker bar on the crank bolt to turn the engine over. I felt the bolt stretch. Eeeeek! Luckily I was able to back it out and replace it with a new, longer, grade #8 bolt. I don't know if it was the shortness of the bolt, bolt quality or if doing what I did was even proper. I had seen it done so many times that I never really thought about it. After that I resorted to one of those PIA flywheel grippers.

 

There's the book way, the gorilla way, the Army way, etc etc. Ever wonder why shops don't let the customers watch? Bam! Bam! BAM! BAM!

The problem with the pullers and installers these days is the quality of the steel is schitt. They all come in nice blow-mold carrying case and different size hardware, but it's junk. It is true you're not supposed to be pounding on the crank with a BFH. One thing I never tried on installation is apply a hunk of dry ice on the crank snout and the damper in a slow oven. Be sure to wear mitts. The missus usually don't like truck parts in the oven so wait till she's at her sisters or tell her to go shopping.

If you have a manual transmission, put it into reverse for installation. You can wedge a block of wood in the flywheel. The manuals used to suggest filling a cylinder with rope. That always sounded a little sketchy to me, but I guess it works OK.

 

Installation tool
The people that are breaking the installation tool when pressing the damper on, I bet the tool was made over seas,not U.S made, poorly forged metal..
I see Summit has one that is sold by Moroso MADE IN THE USA Gene

 

How about using a little emory cloth on the crank if you see it's going to be a issue ?

 

Driving the damper onto the crank was the OEM procedure in 1955.
V8 -
http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1955/55csm0662.html

6cyl -
http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1955/55csm0620.html
http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1955/55csm0621.html

I think the risk of thrust bearing damage is minimal
I agree pulling the damper into position is gentler, and the axial clamping is way better than relying on the interference fit to lock the damper hub to the crank ( as well as the timing sprockets ) and providing extra bending stiffness and strength for the snout.

Confirming 0.001" diametral interference is always a good idea. You just never know.

 

It will always be "an issue" because they are designed to fit with extremely close interference fit or tolerance. No way around it. So honing out the damper is a no-go.

I'm not in a hurry, so can choose to do things the right way. I've never had a problem with the BFH method but given a choice don't want to push my luck either.

The Ford manual shows an installation tool similar to what you can buy today (though undoubtedly made of better stuff); and specifies to coat the crank snout with "white lead and engine oil".

The torque on V8 Ford is something like 80 or 90 lbs, damper bolt will turn until damper bottoms out, so that is proof that it is seated as far as it will go.

 

done that a few times

 

heh...I looked at that too, but didn't post. I also have a 1966 Chevy shop manual here, it has pics of installing the damper on the 283/mild 327 using a BFH, and using a threaded installer tool on the HP 327 and big blocks (which were drilled and tapped).

I don't really understand how the thrust bearing is supposed to be damaged by beating the damper on. It's job is to take the thrust load on the crankshaft. That's what it's there for. It will handle it!