HAMB drags parasite digger?

RYAN - Can you contact your connection at MoKan, and get some official word on getting these cars teched in???

 

Since the original post showed a 4 banger,
would OHV 4 cylinders be welcome to run against flathead V8's ?
Would they be competitive against a mild flathead ?

Specifically thinking later model carburated 4 cyl motors.
Real cheap,real easy to find.

No computerized bullshit.

If the rules specified a very narrow rear tire,and/or an open diff,
then HP is less of an issue.

Everyone knows racers are their own worst enemy,
when it comes to spending money to go faster.

Just thinking out loud.

 

A couple of ideas about this "class" . . .

Limiting the intake to a single two-barrel carburetor and requiring stock heads would be good cost-containment specs that would still permit some creative motor building.

I also suggest that new, scratch-built frames be allowed. Sound, original bones aren't as affordable as they once were, and building with an old trash frame can be pretty risky.

 

Do they have scales at Mokan ?

 

I love ther idea ,but I am afraid that if the demand gets very high, someone may get wind of it and shut it down. It would all be due to liability I'm sure.
I hope it gets rolling though.......

 

On the in/out box: Those were used in two flavors--clutch only type, like AV8's, and so called dog clutch, used in many sorts of race cars. This is simply a coupler in a gearless trans case allowing a choice of in gear or neutral, a useful convenience. If you want that sort and have a junk trans, all you would need would be the upper front and rear shafts and the synchro. The synchro could be early or late, and wouldn't have to be in good shape as it is just a coupler and doesn't have to actually synchronise. Actuation would be just pulling the lever from neutral to high. Cluster gear could be entirely omitted, along with slider and a hatfull of miscellany.
Many early diggers ran early Ford boxes with 2nd and high, shifting once in the run. This requires somewhat more numerous surviving parts in the trans, but might bbe better. High tech types cut away unused gears that couldn't be removed to reduce rotating weight to the minimum.

 

I'll send him a picture of the car I pictured and the "bug" and ask him if something like this would be allowed to race...
Sam.

 

While we're talking about 4 bangers, how about inline 6's? Maybe somone has a spare chevy six lying around? Just throwing ideas out there. As far as transmissions go, I think a modified stock would be OK but a T5 is stretching it IMO. The more simple we keep this, the more people can compete.


I'm also for new fabricated frame rails, I have seen a few good frames on here recently that would be perfect for this.

 

You're reading my mind Grim, I want to build a roadster or T or something in the future, and these race cars are just a hot rod without a body.

Too bad Sam already has the BFD name, that would be perfect for the class. Basic Flathead Dragster. I can hear it now -

"I have a race car"
"Big Fuckin' Deal"

 

I would like to see a front engine digger class with under 300 cid. Cast iron blocks and cast iron heads. Keep it affordable and fun. You could have a fuel class and a gas class. WB limited to 140".

That way you could build your own chassis, still be safe and have a ball. Who knows maybe NHRA would taking notice if enough guys started making the events. Have a small circuit that travels with some of the bigger events and put on match races....heads up........ no freaking bracket cars.

 

I actually have a good idea to follow up on Roothawgs idea... that is, a FED class... sponsored by someone like Kragen Auto Parts. They have their re-man engines... you get to the race, plop $750 down for one of their motors... bring it back... add a cam, intake and headers... and then install it in your digger... then have a heads up race.

Could be fun.
Sam.

 

Would be a good use for the inline six and PG from my old Malibu.

 

Sam - thanks for contacting Ryan. At our nostalgia drags up here, they have a class where they put all the flatheads and inliners. No dial, no index, just let 'em run, and it's a total riot! The pits are full of good natured challenges and finger pointing all day, and I hear a helluva lot of laughter coming from over there...What you guys propose here could be even better. And I hope you can find some way to make an A-frame mandatory in every pit. I miss A-frames. It's why I go to Bonneville........

 

Oh... and about this thing we have going here...

I think we need to be real careful that it doesn't get out of hand. If we start making allowances for OHV 6 cyl motors, OHV 4 bangers... this motor, that motor... the next thing you know, the playing field is uneaven. I say if we want to allow OHV motors... there needs to be another class.

Running flatheads aren't THAT hard to come by! Just put your feelers out. I don't expect to be building a motor for this thing... and I don't expect anyone else to.

So that being said... I make a motion that the engine for THIS class of car be a flathead motor, no overhead valve motors. It can be a four, a six or an eight. In the spirit of the first event... what do you say we keep modifications to things that can be done externally? Heads, intake and carbs... and headers.

If you want to keep it stock... there will probably be more than one guy with a stock motor. I for one have a stock flathead 8... and a two x two intake that I'd like to put on it... and run it like that.

As far as the cars go... rules should be simple...

1. Stock frame rails or 1 1/2" x 3" .120 square tube rails.

2. Flathead in-line or v8 engines ONLY

3. Stock internals. The only modifications to motor allowed are Intake, carbs, heads, and headers. Magnetos ok, no "electronic" ignitions.

4. No automatic transmissions.

5. Stock width front and rear ends only, no narrowed rear ends allowed.

6. No "slingshot" chassies. Driver and engine must be positioned entirely between the front and rear axles. Engine and driver placement can vary.

7. Cars must be self starting.

8. Batteries must be mounted in a tray made out of angle iron and have 3/8" studs or bolts with a 1" x 1/8" (or larger) strap over the top.

9. Cars must have rims no wider than 5.5" and in the spirit of the event, bias ply tires or vintage slicks are required. No radials or modern "wrinkle wall" slicks allowed. Tire tread may be no wider than 6".

10. If a cooling system or water tank is used, car must have a radiator cap and an overflow (catch can) system.

11. Closed drive lines are encouraged... but not required.

12. If an open drive line is used, driveshaft must have an 1 1/2" x 1/4" "driveshaft loop" AND be totally covered/ sealed off from driver with a sheet aluminum or steel floor pan.

13. Cars must have floor boards and/or belly pans. If a belly pan is used, car must have a sufficient structure to prevent drivers legs from pulling a "Fred Flintstone" if the belly pan is torn off or if it falls off.

14. All cars must have a firewall.

15. All cars must have a cowl or body to prevent drivers legs from exiting the vehicle in the event of a crash.

16. All cars must encorporate some type of "roll bar" (we'll need to discuss this further)

17. All cars will be inspected for general soundness and safety. Things like sound steering, all lug nuts in place and safety belts required.

18. Fuel line(s) can have no single piece longer than 24", has to be fasted by hose clamps and may not be cracked.

19. Cars must be built in the spitit of "The Bug" and other early "rail jobs".

Well... what do you think? I can e-mail these rules to Carl along with a pic of the car I posted earlier... and let you all know what he says. Now is the time to make adjustments to the rules... I think it would be nice to have a few cars built... and the rules should be put in place by those building cars...

Sam.

 

I actually have all the parts to build one... except for some tires... so, yes, I am. The only problem will be financing a trip... but, that can always be figured out.

Is there any way we can have the HAMB Drags earlier in August? Maybe the week before Bonneville?

Sam.

 

I think Raven is gonna convince me to build one, sounds like alot of fun. We'll be runnin' Inline though.
Rules look good so far, lets see how this progress. Wish I could see some of the pics from here at work, firewall bastards...
MONGO

 

That rules me out. I can't afford the bolt-on pieces and don't have a stock block (nor would I spend my machine-shop budget decking one).

IMHO, this is antithetical to what the HAMB is all about. The spendy external pieces look trick, but add very little in performance improvement with stock internals.

I will admit that a converted GM HEI or MOPAR e-distributor isn't as cool looking as an old H&C mag, but I fail to see why a fifty-buck home-made conversion should be excluded when it's okay to run a pricey vintage fire-lighter.

I'd like to see some more discussion of this area of the rules before they're writ in stone . . .

Mike

 

Mike, the last thing we want to do is exclude you or anyone else who is serious about building a car and towing it to MOKAN. So maybe we should either say "engines must remain stock" or "engines can be built _________"

We need to talk about this. I don't want anyone who is on the fence about building a car to NOT build a car because of some silly rule. It's about havin' a little fun. I'm thinking nobody should have any more than $1000 in any given car.

The idea here is to keep costs DOWN. Most everyone will probably get an old flathead six or v8, slap some more carbs on it and RUN IT. That's what I plan to do. I can't afford to tear this thing down and rebuild it... it'll run how it runs. As far as "stock" goes... I assume that you are referring to "blueprinting"... I can tell you that there isn't going to be ANYONE checking ANYTHING internally on ANY motor at MOKAN. We're on the honor system.

I'm not laying down any laws or rules by no means... I am just throwing this out so we have somewhere to start...

So, what should the motor rule be? Others?

Sam.

 

What about fiberglass bodies? I just found an old Almquist '32 roadster body from '59....

 

Nope... these are stripped down rail jobs from the early 50's... like the Bug and others pictured. A body like that would be in a roadster class...

Sam.

 

I didn't think you were. Just wanted to run up a red flag before folks get too deeply entrenched and in love with a particular set of rules. I'm working on a book outline and can't take a lot of time right now to set forth many ideas. Suffice to say that I feel flatheads of every stripe should be accommodated, from stock to full-race, if this idea is to have any legs beyond the '05 HAMB Drags.

I understand the part about keeping costs DOWN. That's what I'm talking about as well. If someone has all the external add-ons in their goody box they should certainly be able to use them, but for someone starting from scratch who wants to build a car and join in, the $1000-$2000 those pieces would cost would be more effectively spent inside the motor, involving some work the HAMBer can do with a time investment in place of some dollars.

I'll have to get back to you on that, gotta get back to work right now . . . Mike

 

I like the idea of stock flat head motors with only external modifications. As soon as you allow internal modifications you get the guys that are in it just to win. I know I wouldn't waste my time building a "bug" that I knew was going to be at a disadvantage from the beginning. Hell, if I build one, it is already going to be at a huge disavantage, I sure don't need some guy racing against me that has a tricked out flathead running against what ever heap I could find that ran.

Are you thinking about some kind of a wheel base limit? Anything I would bring would likely be something I found and removed the body and did what ever it needed to meet the rules. I think I know where a 30s Plymouth 4 door sedan and a 50 Plymouth sedan is sitting. Would either be a legal frame? Would spend enough just getting brakes on the to about break my bank. Never been drag racing before, this sounds like fun. Gene

 

We also need to add to the safety requirements those "safety hub" things that Vern Tardel makes for keyed axle'd rear ends.

Sam.

 

My car is already built in my head. It would already be done, or at least started, if I hadn’t started on some home remodel stuff, which is almost done, and been working weekends to double my bring home pay. I've had this idea in my head for a few months now. I was going to build it just for fun, and not worry about what else showed up at the HAMB Drags. But now it's getting interesting. This is what I want to build, Frame, scratch built, or probably use the late 20's Chevy rails I already have. Kicked in the rear, solid mounted early F1 rear, solid mounted front axle, that's right no suspension. Late Flathead, mild cam, heads, multi carb intake, petronix ignition, zoomie headers. Open drive 3spd tranny. Old late 20's Buick cowl, or the 26/27 Ford "T" cowl I have, unknown grille shell. Rear brakes only. Single loop roll bar with side rails tied into another loop under the cowl. 15" rear early Ford wheels, with NOS slicks I picked up at Turlock 4 years ago. 16" front early Ford wheels with motorcycle tires. Unknown early gas tank I won at the silent auction, at lasts years HAMB Drags. Owner built seat. Five point seat belts. Owner built cooling system. Basic side steering and pedal setup. That's it. Dean

 

I'd like to get a show of hands to see who would be SERIOUS about building one of these for the HAMB Drags 2005. If not, for HAMB Drags 2006.

If you are "in" send me an e-mail at [email protected]

I'm drafting an e-mail to Carl at MOKAN as we speak.

Ryan, if you're reading this... could you make up a class for these things?

I think if we had it for flathead 4,6 and 8 motors, and pre-60 six cylinder motors... it could be a lot of fun!

Sam.