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Adhesives vs. Welding for floor pans

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Skeetum, Aug 22, 2010.

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  1. Skeetum
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    Skeetum Member

    Hi, I am researching doing my floor pans and rockers on my '54 Ford. Someone I contacted with parts for sale suggested using adhesives over welding. He says it is quicker with less problems from dealing with the heat. And Lexus and Mercedes use adhesives. He recomended 'Fusor' or a similar product. I looked on the Web and it is made by a company called Lord. The information is interesting. I was wondering if anyone has used adhesives and what they thought about it. All comments are welcome. Here is the site....thanks...larry
    http://www.lord.com/Products-and-Solutions/Adhesives.xml

    http://www.baremetalseamsealer.com/?gclid=CPySvLqczaMCFQvs7QodkzN5ug
  2. Slag Kustom
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    Slag Kustom Member

    stock replacement parts in floors and rockers i would not use it. on an old car there are too many areas that will need little brackets and seams that need replacement along with the pans.

    i have used it on late model stuff for collision repair and it works great. but on a quaterpanel you still need to weld the seam.
  3. ronk16
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    ronk16
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    paint and body guy by trade and I say glue `em up. It`s really a matter of time versus looks. The new adhesives are stronger than welds and much cleaner with less body work needed after. Got to make sure your prep work is also clean and pay attention to the working time for set up of the panel bond you use. Fusor products are really good and I use them on a daily basis. Read the reccomendations on the instructions sheet, some ask that you weld into the over laps and glue the rest and some don`t. Hope this helped..
  4. re-animator
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    re-animator Member

    they glue airplanes together........it should work for a car!
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  5. 36tbird
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    36tbird Member

    I glued the rockers on my '36 Ford p/u with flush pop rivets. Probably overkill but I was able to paint the inside of the rockers for rust protection and it would not get burned off if I had welded them in. I think that it turned out great. Read up on the products though because the amount of working time you have varies and can bite you on the butt. See if you have a friend at a body shop that has the special caulking gun so that you do not have to purchase that. Seems like 3M charges a premium for the damn gun.
  6. Retro Jim
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    Retro Jim Member

    Always WELD ! That's the way it was built , right ?
    You can get away with an adhesive if it's a small piece in a quarter or a non stressing place but not a floor ! I know some use adhesives when replacing a door skin instead of spot welding them on but even then I still weld the door shins too .
    Just my opinion !

    Retro Jim
  7. ems customer service
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    ems customer service Member

    airplane are done in a very controlled enviorment, cars in barns and home garages are not a controlled envoirment for structural use.
  8. Paul
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    Paul Editor

    sounds like a viable solution to something like a totaly clapped out '50s car
    that you just want to get a little more use from

    but I'd never use it on something I cared about
    and wanted to last and hold it's value
  9. Swifster
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    Swifster Member

    If this was a newer car, and rust in surrounding panels wouldn't be an issue, I'd say go for it. In this case, I'd glue the panel in and weld the seams as mentioned above. I've used the Fusor on my Jap race car while attaching carbon fiber to steel and it worked great. For non-structural items I'd use it without the welding. I may even try this on the fender replacement for my Studebaker. I just don't think I would use glue alone on my floors.
  10. ems customer service
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    ems customer service Member

    the official policy of ems automotive is that structural glues should not be used for primary fastening method of patch panels. which includes floors rockers, 1/4 and the like, and in our published catalog using adhiesives will void all warrenties by ems.

    it can be used on non primary parts, like lower door skin patch to prevent warping, trunk lid or front hood to inner structure.

    it is great for attaching moulding where die cast have broken off

    and for attaching custom type bracket for say power windows or other assc.

    fyi: there is also some issues with paint as the glue will leave a small discoloration after a year or so not bad for every day cars but not acceptable for custom cars
  11. killbilly
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    killbilly
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    The T2000 Kenworth...1997 til present day is built on a 2" thick balsa wood subfloor sandwich ...with SMC on both sides and the whole cab is glued together with Lord Fusor or 3m adhesive. We see the all the time with a million and 3/4/5 hundred thosand miles They take a beating
  12. 39 All Ford
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    39 All Ford Member

    If you have a welder, welding in the floor is easy enough and will be cheaper than adhesive.

    I know I had to change a few things on my floor after replacement, this was little more than an inconvenience with my welded in floor, I want to think that it would have been harder if I had to worry about an adhesive bond.

    Besides, in another 20 years, a person welding on a car body might be as rare as a person doing lead work today....
  13. 1BADSLED
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    1BADSLED Member

    a friend of mine did a full panel on a late model, car was rear ended by a semi 6 months later. Bumper was into the back seat. The glued seam stayed together. I think that was a pretty good test.
  14. Bloodandmotoroil
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    Bloodandmotoroil BANNED

    glue AND weld and the glue agian! i will outlast the car! hahahahahahahahahahahah * twitch*
  15. langy
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    langy Member

    I glued the aluminium trunk skin onto the inner on my 32 with Lord Fusor 127 and it set like concrete, Expensive but excellent stuff although i'm not sure about using it on a structural part.


    [​IMG]
  16. langy
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    langy Member

    Thanks, I thought it was a monocoque he was doing :eek:


  17. prost34
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    prost34 Member

    i use 3m panel bond,pending on what and where,i will spot weld tight and panel bond in beetween the welds,or panel bond a piece but tack weld the corners,,,i also like to use it as a seam sealer on floors(inside),,,,,but be carefull,if its used outside the body,make sure theres none showing when you do your bodywork,it will model in the heat (see your repair thru the paint),i learned that the hard way long time ago,,but for the most part,nothing beats a welder,,,
    oh years ago when i worked in a production shop i saw a bodyman glue a bedside on a truck ,it came back the next week after h ebacked into something the entire panel unsnapped perfect,glue still intact,,it may be strong pulling but it has a weekness if you twist it,,,,3m rep told me that,,,good luck,,
  18. Da Tinman
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    Da Tinman Member


    Dude, you have no idea what your talking about.

    Once warped always warped no matter how much shrinking you try to do? Welding metal shrinks it, so you have to STRETCH it back to shape.

    A proper welded seam is as strong as before the patch was added and with a little time, effort and some practice a welded repair can made invisible from both sides.

    When offering advice, stick to things you know or you end up looking like an ass.
  19. Da Tinman
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    Da Tinman Member

    Because your telling the world that mine and many other professional builders repairs are substandard.

    and its not just the mix up of one word, everything you stated is incorrect. Welding metal ALWAYS does irreppairable damage? Only weld as a last resort? I would never buy a car that has had patch panel welded in?

    Good luck with that.

    Have a nice day.
  20. 29nash
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    29nash BANNED

    My dad can glue floor panels better than your dad can weld 'em. (whine-whimper)
  21. Da Tinman
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    Da Tinman Member

    Its invalid because its incorrect.

    Welds, glues, nuts and bolts all have their place and when used properly are all valid repairs.

    Blankets statements condemning one type of repair over another is not a good thing. It shows a lack of knowledge on the subject, and an unwillingness to learn how a proper repair is done.

    Thats enough drama for this thread and Sorry for the derail, I just thought I'd try and correct any misleading info provided by other posters.
  22. tommy
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    tommy Member

    I glued my first 32 Roadster together but it was made by AMT.:D

    I'm sure it's fine for Honda's and Kia's but I would feel guilty as hell to glue some sheet metal in a car worth collecting. Yeah it's easier and faster but it just feels like I'd be cheating. Just me.
  23. Rustys Rod & gun
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    Rustys Rod & gun Member

    The only reason I can see to glue in floor pans is not knowing how to weld.
  24. 4woody
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    4woody Member

    In the area between the firewall & the floor my Mopar (with a very heavy frame) has a toe panel. I made that in several pieces and screwed them in. Some spots where a permanent panel is not required it is nice to have access from above.
  25. fastrnu
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    fastrnu Member

    how about that traditional adheasive?
    Original Old School Period Correct Adheasive....
  26. zzford
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    zzford Member

    Welding is ok, but give me some Elmers.
  27. tedley
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    tedley Member
    1. 1952-59 Ford Social Group

    Nope don't care for it. Panels never fit that great to alow a nice clean job in most cases. Especialy bad on exterior panel patchs. Lazy mans way out. I would not buy a car with glued patches. Stuffs expensive to.
  28. thesupersized
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    thesupersized Member

    would these adhesives work good in a situations like molding 54 chevy taillight bezels(which are potmetal) to the body?
  29. langy
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    langy Member

    They are just adhesieves as far as i know, could you not get them cast in aluminium ???


  30. 56oldsDarrin
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    56oldsDarrin Member

    A Newbie will have much better results pulling a dual-mix trigger and laying a bead of adhesive, than pulling the the trigger of a wire feed and burning big holes in a floorpan.
    The fact that the pros here are arguing about it means that both are viable plans.
    If you factor the cost of buying a welder it make the adhesive A LOT cheaper.
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