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Hot Rods A 40 Ford Coupe for Uncle Mike Build Thread

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by The 39 guy, Oct 27, 2014.

  1. 40LUV
    Joined: Dec 30, 2003
    Posts: 1,883

    40LUV
    Member
    from Mid Jersey

  2. The 'authorized by WRP' probably referred to the War Production Board, who controlled who/what could be built during WW2. Ford was busy building tanks and planes, and somebody made a good case for replacement grills, so...
     
    lothiandon1940 likes this.
  3. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Thanks Crazy Steve, I was wondering what WRP Stood for. And I may have read the lettering wrong since the imprint was very shallow and hard to read.
     
  4. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    40 LUV read your build thread and left a few comments. That is a nice car!
     
  5. Man, this just gets better and better. Awesome layout, and awesome work...of course. I can see what you are doing, and am thankful for the seats ! Great show man !
     
  6. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Thanks for the kind comments Kidcampbell. I will keep trying to make posts worthy of such a billing.
     
  7. This thread is "textbook" for anyone working on a '40 Ford........Don.
     
    40fordtudor likes this.
  8. Nice work on that grill assembly. Looks like a piece of jewelry! :)
     
    lothiandon1940 likes this.
  9. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Thanks for textbook comment Don but it comes more from reading textbooks. Most of this stuff I have picked up on the HAMB or from the thousands of magazine articles I have read over the years.

    Ol55 thanks for the compliment on the grill it was a challenging project and since it did come out so nice I worry a little about how close to the ground it will be when installed.......
     
  10. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Replacing 39 Ford Door Handles with 40 Ford door handles. I prefer the 40 door handles over the 39 so I bought a set of handles and new latch mechanisms from Bob Drake. The project is not too technical but has the usual drama and required some research and careful measuring.
    DH1.jpg
    You can see two things in this picture. One is the poor door alignment evidenced by the body trim line misalignment. We took care of that later in the build. Two is that hole for the 39 handle is round and there are two threaded holes to mount the handle.
    DH2.jpg
    DH8.jpg
    You can see that the 40 handle had bulbous body that protrudes inside the door skin and has a screw that inserts through the door jamb into the body to secure it. The 39 handle simply bolted to the face of the door.
    DH3.jpg
    So i got out my trusty dremel tool and and carefully ground out the hole to an oval shape. Notice that you grinding away the door skin and the welded on boss for the 39 handle.
    DH6.jpg
    I checked out a 40 to see where the hole for the mounting screw should be drilled.
    DH4.jpg
    After much time spent measuring ( several times) and figuring out the angle I drilled the screw hole and fortunately got it right. I ended up having to use a longer screw than was provided with the handle.
    DH7.jpg
    I am not very proud of this cut out but it fits the handle and will not be seen when the handle is installed.
    DH5.jpg
    So there is the handle installed. Notice the 5 degree down in front attitude of my brand new handle.
    The latch mechanism is installed tight to the door and is brand new from Drake also. So why does it have this list. Looks like a 70 year old latch and handle to me. I think it is installed correctly. I called Drake and asked them if anyone else had commented on a problem like this. I got the standard answer of no.

    So my fix will be to clamp the square handle shaft in a vise heat and twist the square handle shaft to get it 90 degrees to the door during final assembly. The other side has even more droop.

    So it was a simple project but not without the usual problems with reproduction parts. Don't read me wrong here I am thankful that people like Drake and Carpenter are out there making these parts for us and I know it is difficult to make one part fit all of these cars that were produced 75 years ago and lived such varied lives and suffered numerous reincarnations and abuse.
     
    quickrack-alan likes this.
  11. 911 steve
    Joined: Nov 29, 2012
    Posts: 678

    911 steve
    Member
    from nebraska

    WOW, what mastery at metal work. I have a 40 standard sedan that I got out of the body shop in July after lots of body work & paint. cost a lot, but worth every penny. yours looks great!!!
     
  12. 51farmtruck
    Joined: Jul 23, 2007
    Posts: 894

    51farmtruck
    Member

    Neat project Sam. Great work! Can't wait to see it finished. That powder blue coupe sure was a cool car.
     
  13. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Thanks Sam! I can't wait to see it finished either. It's been a long term dream and project.


    911 Thanks for the compliment but I am by no means a master. Just a hobbyist having fun and trying to keep the build within my financial means. I still depend on my painter to give the parts that final touch of class many of us desire
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2014
  14. okiedokie
    Joined: Jul 5, 2005
    Posts: 4,778

    okiedokie
    Member
    from Ok

    I have used three sets of the Drake handles with none having the droop. I can't imagine what about your door mods would cause that though. I had been leaning towards 39 doors on my 40 tudor build, but may return to my intial plan to mod 40 doors for one piece door glass. Worked fine on my coupe but I thought it would be neat to have glass open like 39's do.
     
    40fordtudor likes this.
  15. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Okiedokie, I don't think it is the actually the handles causing the problem. I think it is the door latch assembly. It just looks like the easy fix will be to twist the handle shaft a little to make everything look square.

    I actually would have preferred to have the 40 wing windows on this car. I always enjoyed the fresh air they could deliver on a warm day. But since I have the 39 doors I will at least appreciate the 1 inch of air I can get when the window initially rolls back. You won't gt that with the 40 modified option. Of course if you will have AC that won't really be a problem.
     
  16. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    We did all of the structural body work with the car on the frame. But I wanted to move the body to a dollie that was made to support the body the same way the frame did. I wanted the dollie to work with the rotisserie also so I came up with this plan. Of course the original plan was modified several times before it was finished.

    It was fairly easy to make and cost less than $200 bucks. You might say that is a lot of trouble to go to for one car. Well maybe it is but since I have two more 39's that will hopefully be mounted on this dollie I thought it was worth the trouble. Yes I did think about putting this in the home tools thread and I may do that in the future. I think it is too basic to score well in a tech week.
    FrameDiagram1935-40 with Body EDIT 2.jpg
    I was fortunate to have the use of an Adobe Illustrator program to do the design work. I wish I knew more about how to run this program. With this program I was able to take the Wescott 35 to 40 40 Frame diagram and put it on the first layer of this drawing. I also somehow pirated a photo of he 40 coupe body and scaled it to fit the frame. Then I built the frame work on top of the frame diagram on a third layer. Anyway when I was done with the frame diagram I made that layer disappear.So here it is if any of you want to copy it.
    FrameDiagram1935-40.jpg
    Some of the measurements on this diagram are not accurate. Ask me how I know.
    40 Body Only.jpg
    I think this came from a Dennis Carpenter add.
    Dollie Modifications.jpg
    This is how I know that pile of parts on the floor is from design modifications after the first trial fit.
    Dollie Finished.jpg
    Here is the finished dollie.
    Dollie Wood Shims 1.jpg
    I ended up using wood shims on the first three stations They allowed for easy body shimming and also are easy to remove for painting and sand blasting. They also space the body above the dollie frame work to allow for easier access to the floor. This is station 1.
    Dollie Wood Shims 2.jpg
    Station 2 , you can see that the floor was sandblasted with the frame on first. Then we went back and finished the blasting on the dollie. That way we got the whole floor . Dollie Wood Shims 3.jpg
    Station 3
    Dollie Wood Shims 3A.jpg
    Another view of station 3.
    Dollie Station 4.jpg
    Station 4 is a 3x2 block
    Spreader Beam 1.jpg
    I didn't want to ask 6 of my OLD buddies to come over and lift the body so we designed a spreader bar system to pick the body. I wanted a system that could be used when the car is painted also. I Thought the points we picked would easily support the weight of the bare body and provide good balance.
    Spreader Beam 2.jpg
    I was a little Leary of this rusty old 1" tube but it worked fine. Lifting Body Off Frame 1.jpg
    We left the frame on the rotisserie , lifted the body off , rolled the frame out of the way and lowered the body onto the dollie for a test fit.
    Lifting Body Off Frame 3.jpg
    I have a pick point in the ceiling for the front and the cherry picker work good for the rear of the car.
    Body Dollie on Rotissery.jpg
    Don is removing one of the wood shims so we can sandblast the area.
    I will have to post a few more pics on the next post. Ran out of photo space again.......
     
  17. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Just a finish to the last post.
    Dollie on Trailer.jpg
    The dollie rolls well and with the shackle eye on there we were able to winch it onto the trailer saving our old backs.
    Arrival at the Painters Shop.jpg
    Here it is arriving at the painters shop. I was only a a year or two late in getting it there. I don't know why he is so excited......

    So far the only change I would make is to make the legs a little shorter. The body sits a little oo tall for even my 6 foot height.
     
    kidcampbell71 likes this.
  18. okiedokie
    Joined: Jul 5, 2005
    Posts: 4,778

    okiedokie
    Member
    from Ok

    By chance, is the house next to you for sale? Honey we're moving to WA.
     
    kidcampbell71 likes this.
  19. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Well the house next door isn't for sale but I would trade you my extra 1/2 acre for your beautiful coupe.:).
     
  20. This thread just gets better....
     
  21. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Thank you timwit, there is still along way to go on this build. I am close to being caught up with the current progress. But I still have the door gaps, hood fit and engine build to cover in the next few days.
    I will be able to get back on the chassis build in about three weeks. I already have the parts for the chassis build but will have to figure out how to mount the 3 speed OD tranny.
     
  22. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    The firewall is one of the first things I tackled on this car. I retrospect I should have scrapped the tar off the inside and sandblasted it before welding on it. I kept starting small fires on the inside and contaminating welds with the tar. But I eventually got it done. Mike the painter will have the unenviable task of making it look good in white.
    Firewall 1.jpg
    I think I counted over 100 holes in this thing. On top of that it was dented in several places. The metal in the firewall is much heavier than the body and because it has so many strengthening beads and bends in it ,it does lend itself to easy metal shaping.
    Firewall 2.jpg
    The passenger side must have been the host of several different heaters. It looked like the holes were made with dull drill bits hacksaws and and occasional chisel. I had to make a lot of small irregular shaped sheet metal patches to fill the holes.
    FW4.jpg
    The drivers side was no better. It had a deap dent where that huge fuel pump had been. Never could figure out how that dent got there short of a sledge hammer.
    FW11.jpg
    Here it is all cleaned up. The steel plate welded to the firewall is for attaching the fuse panel and wiring.The two square tubes on the passenger side are for mounting the heater.
    FW12.jpg
    Next time you see this it should be glossy white.
     

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  23. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    Since I am on light duty in the shop I decided to peck away at this grill chin pan. I had hammered one of these out before about 1980 so I figured I might be able to save this one and have it sitting around as a spare. Since this 40 will sit so low I am certain it will find a parking curb or speed bump at some point.
    CP1A.jpg
    Real UGLY
    CP1.jpg CP2.jpg CP3.jpg
    Getting started.
    CP4.jpg
    These are the tools I used. The anvil came in real handy and that hammer in the vice worked well as an small anvil too. I used the pick hammer and the file the most. I found that using the file as a slap hammer would flatten a high spot to contour real well.
    CP6.jpg
    I ended up making a slice on this edge because by the time I got this edge to contour it was to stretched and that made the top edge rise as it went around the corner. CP7.jpg
    Not a real pretty weld but I had to grind it off to contour.
    CP8.jpg
    This side looks pretty good considering it will eventually be sacrificed to the curb god anyway. The back side looks like a pin cushion from all of the pick hammer blows it took to get his thing back in shape. I must have put 15 or more hours into this thing. Considering you can buy a new one for $60 it is not really worth the effort. But I had fun and learned a lot in the process and to me that's what it's all about.
     
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  24. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    OK, one more for this week. Grand kids are coming today so I won't be posting through the weekend.
    The door alignment on this car was so bad that the male dovetail was hitting well bellow the female dovetail. As result the sheet metal took a hit every time the door was closed.
    DT1.jpg
    I removed the female dovetail assembly for this repair. I didn't realize that it was riveted twice an spot welded 4 times. So if you can do this repair without removing the assembly I would recommend that.
    I flattened a piece of 3/4 inch water pipe and then screwed it down tight with a self tapping screw. The weld metal will not stick to the copper so this gave me something to build the weld upon and also kept the weld from bulging into the body cavity (A very hard place to grind or file).
    DT2.jpg
    DT3.jpg DT4.jpg
    DT5.jpg
    A little grinding and filing later and its finished.
     
  25. Creative techniques; nicely done!
     
  26. Pewsplace
    Joined: Feb 10, 2007
    Posts: 2,795

    Pewsplace
    Member

    Your skills are amazing and the end result is going to be worth the effort. Great inspirational thread.
     
  27. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    36 ROKIT and Pewsplace thanks for the kind comments.
     
  28. olscrounger
    Joined: Feb 23, 2008
    Posts: 4,770

    olscrounger
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Outstanding work on the 40--you are doing a top notch job !!!!!!!
     
    lothiandon1940 likes this.
  29. The 39 guy
    Joined: Nov 5, 2010
    Posts: 3,524

    The 39 guy
    Member

    I think it will take a few posts to discuss the hood fit project. It was very important to me to get a good fit between the body and the hood on this coupe. As you 39,40 owners know it is very difficult to get the hoods to fit on these cars. I think we spent a couple of weeks on this project. I took a lot of pictures as usual but I also missed some detail shots along the way.

    HF36.jpg
    The body (still on the frame) was assembled on steel horses with the weight centered over the spring cross members. We hope that this would replicate normal loading and flex that would naturally occur on the body. We also put the running boards and rear fenders on the car at this time to check their fit.

    Quite a bit of time was spent adjusting the sheet metal to FIT THE HOOD TO COWL INTERFACE. Every adjustment led to multiple checks at all gaps and the hood latch grill interface.
    HF6.jpg
    As I had predicted the hood fit was really bad. We installed all new stainless hood hinge hardware and spent quite a bit of time trying to fit the hood as it was. I had wanted to get the top gap between the hood and the cowl down to where you could not see the cowl lacing but we never did accomplish this.When we closed up the gap the hood would hit the top of the cowl when we were lifting the hood so we had to settle for the usual ford hood gap on top. By this time we had a good cowl to hood fit on the passenger side but the drivers side was way off. HF1.jpg HF2.jpg
    HR1.jpg
    We decided to cut these hood brackets loose repair them and then weld them back on. They had been bent out away from the hood skin and cracked. The area behind the bracket was cleaned and primered before the part was welded back on. HR2.jpg HF7.jpg
    It was not a decision taken lightly but we decided to modify the cowl to get the fit we wanted. This was done after we had repaired the hood brackets and moved the hinge hardware in every direction we could trying to get an acceptable alignment. HF9.jpg
    The cowl was sprung out until it fit the hood. Lousy looking tack welds but they were cleaned up later. HF11.jpg
    Next we cut that brand new Drake cowl and pried it out to match the hood. HF13.jpg HF16.jpg
    I didn't take a picture of the hood fit after this modification but it lined up well. Some more metal finishing was done to this area later. HF26.jpg
    These pictures are from opposite sides but you can see we had really enlarged these hinge mount holes trying to find that hood fit sweet spot . Once we had decided on the final location they were marked and the holes were filled with weld metal and re - drilled.
    HF28.jpg
    So was there something wrong with the new Drake cowls shape or did I install it wrong? I don't know but I also had to modify it again to get the door to line up. We will look at that later.
     

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  30. BadgeZ28
    Joined: Oct 28, 2009
    Posts: 1,165

    BadgeZ28
    Member
    from Oregon

    I am looking forward to your future updates.
     

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