Neat Early Rear Engine Dragster

[Tony Bones]

Thought people might find this interesting. If anyone has details, please share. Thanks.

[Sixcarb]

I think it belongs to Tom Wilford.

[old beet]

Is Tom still in Tacoma, Wash??............OLDBEET

[Bruce Lancaster]

There were lots of early experiments with rear engine dragsters, including at least one with a crossways engine, but all died out without much influence or success as front engine cars developed into the classic slingshot of the sixties. Then Garlits blew his foot off and he and the world shifted to rear engine overnight...what were the dynamics here, the problems/successes of old short wheel base cars with fron and rear engines?? What was going on with traction and stability?

[Sixcarb]

Originally Posted by old beet

Is Tom still in Tacoma, Wash??............OLDBEET

Last I talked to him he was but I guess that was quit a few months ago now.

[Tony Bones]

Due to short wheelbase, I'm sure it's a handful...but I'd feel more confident in that than the monster below. Talk about sideways, yeesh!

[stan292]

Originally Posted by Tony Bones

Thought people might find this interesting. If anyone has details, please share. Thanks.

Bones -

This car was restored a couple years ago and shows up at the CHRRs. I'm vague on the details, but the unique thing about it is that the frame is a Scotty Fenn design. Scotty had the old Chassis Research Company - the first outfit to produce ready-made dragster frames, way back in the '50s.

Fenn was quite the character, and had an ongoing battle with Wally P. and the NHRA over several decades. Stories about him are legend amongst the dragster guys. For instance, he was adament that the perfect wheelbase for a dragster was the circumference of the rear tire - hence the under-90 inch cars that were around for so long in the early days. I guess everyone just assumed he knew it all, since he was just about the only "pro" chassis builder in the very early days.

If I remember right, only a few were made. This particular one apparently had some success (in the '60s, I believe) - back in the midwest. I'll scoot over to WDIFL and see if I can find any more info there.

[Tony Bones]

Originally Posted by stan292

Bones -

This car was restored a couple years ago and shows up at the CHRRs. I'm vague on the details, but the unique thing about it is that the frame is a Scotty Fenn design. Scotty had the old Chassis Research Company - the first outfit to produce ready-made dragster frames, way back in the '50s.

Fenn was quite the character, and had an ongoing battle with Wally P. and the NHRA over several decades. Stories about him are legend amongst the dragster guys. For instance, he was adament that the perfect wheelbase for a dragster was the circumference of the rear tire - hence the under-90 inch cars that were around for so long in the early days. I guess everyone just assumed he knew it all, since he was just about the only "pro" chassis builder in the very early days.

If I remember right, only a few were made. This particular one apparently had some success (in the '60s, I believe) - back in the midwest. I'll scoot over to WDIFL and see if I can find any more info there.

Fascinating and pretty car. I'd love to know a little more. Thanks!

[tommy]

Coleman bros. speed shop had a big race car engine building reputation around here for lots of years. It was located just south of Baltimore on rte.1. If I'm not mistaken Ladd rented a building from them and was the man for head work in the Balt./wash area in that time period.

[AZAV8]

The Speed Sport Roadster, Old Noisey, was rear-engined as well. If fact it held national records in it heyday. Yes, it was and is noisey. I speak from experience of hearing and seeing it run at the old Tucson Dragway in the 60's. There were other rear-engined drag cars but none were very successful. Equipment failures and wanting to protect the driver's legs and feet pushed the rapid development of rear-engined dragsters. When Garlits lost most of his foot to a clutch explosion, he quit front-engined cars, built a rear-engined car and made it successful almost immediately. Then most everybody copied him. That's what I remember anyway. But who trusts an old guy's over-40 memory?

[Swingshift]

Marshall had a Speed Sport car at his shop for while.And I think that cars does belong to Tom Wilford as well as the Ks Pittman/Mazmanian Austin wich I saw for sale online the other day.That guy has amazing stuff.

[GasserGlass]

This car was built by my uncles Bill & Dave Coleman who owned Coleman Bros. Speed Shop in Elkridge Maryland..... This car has some real racing history.... One of the very first Rear Engine Cars that Worked! ....... Was once the worlds fastest Chevy powered dragster!...... I've been told by many of the local Old racers that are still around, that Garlits, Kaleta and other up & coming racers in the early 60's tripped and fell over each other in the pits while trying to run though the pits to see this car run at York, Capital etc...... Being from the east the car didn't get its true respect & props as the TRUE "First Rear Engine Dragster" .... That title went to one of the guys who just about broke his neck trying to see this car run!..... One Rag called this car/team " The Dark Horse From The East"

[GasserGlass]

built by Coleman Brothers Speed Shop Elk Ridge Maryland late 59 - 61?...... The True "First Rear Engine Dragster" Once the worlds fastest Chevy powered Dragster!.... Bill Coleman builds motors to this day!........ The Speed shop was on the same lots as LADDS PORTING and right down the street was another first " Ai Fiberglass "

[ol gasser]

When Big Daddy built the first rear engine he had problems with it.
Connie swingle said what is the matter Don ,he said i turn the wheel and it starts heading for the wall,connie said no problem Gar i will slow down the steering,and the long wheel base rear engine rail problem was solved. Connie was one heck of a mechanic that is why Big Daddy held on to him so long.

[tjm73]

Originally Posted by Tony Bones

Thought people might find this interesting. If anyone has details, please share. Thanks.

Beatiful in it's simplicity.

[Rootie Kazoootie]

Here's another early day (1960), short wheelbase r.e.d. out of Cali.

[red sled]

Originally Posted by Tony Bones

Thought people might find this interesting. If anyone has details, please share. Thanks.

Very similar to one I remember seeing at the Woodburn (OR) Dragstrip back in the '60s. It was bright green metallic. Called "Miss Demeanor". I seem to recall it being a sidewinder, though.
Thanks for the memories.

[moparsled]

here's another shot of the car, and, uh.... there were other rear engine dragsters before that car, successful or not.

I seem to remember some input from Pat Foster on Garlits' rear engined car too. Funny how stories change by point of view

[GasserGlass]

The Coleman Brothers Speed Shop Car from 1960-61.... Thats DAVID COLEMAN..Bill Colemans Younger Brother & Partner in the speed shop packing the chute!..... AND.... The car YEARS later now owned by Tom Willford...... THE FIRST... Rear Engine Dragster "THAT WORKED"


"http://41willyscoupe.home.comcast.net/Coleman 1961 red a.jpg"
"http://41willyscoupe.home.comcast.net/COLEMANcar1961.jpg"[IMG][/IMG]

[GasserGlass]