Hey guys, Been working on the Buick lately, spent a little time yesterday wiring the motor to start. No dice, and I'm not sure where the problem is, I'm sure I'm overlooking some strange Buick thing. I'm using a separate starter button an ignition switch, I am not using the accelerator-engaged starter thing. Positive side of the battery to the starter motor (big wire), positive side of the battery to one side of the starter button switch, other side of the starter switch to the "S" terminal on the starter solenoid. Positive side of the battery to one side of the ignition switch, other side of the ignition switch to the "+" side of the coil. "+" side of the coil to the "I" or "R" side of the starter solenoid. Negative side of the coil to the distributor. What am I missing? With the ignition off, I could only get the solenoid to click. With the ignition on, one of the times the starter would crank the motor, but it was very slow and barely doing anything. I should have enough power to really whip that thing over, but it's not happening. Buick gurus and electrical wizards- what's up?
motor tight? battery dead? bad battery connections? bad starter? Sounds like you have it wired right, you just need to go thru the normal "car won't crank" troubleshooting.
Bypass everything. Run 12V from battery to the starter. Ground the block to the battery. Run 12V to the coil with a jumper from the battery. Use a remote starter switch to crank the engine. Should fire if timed correctly. If not, check point gap and condenser. Check for fire at plugs. If no start, look at fuel supply. Once you get it running in the bypass mode, wire in each bypassed system individually ONE AT A TIME. My Buick uses an ignition switch (12V to HEI) and a separate starter button (12V to starter solenoid), replacing the funky stock accelerator/starter system. This works very well and is a sort of anti-theft system at the same time. Most people are not familiar with separate ignition and starter switches. Once you get yours running, you'll need to have two voltage sources to the coil: full 12V during the START cycle; reduced voltage during the RUN cycle to allow the points to survive. Good luck!
I got the starter to turn over, but it's cranking very slowly- not hard enough to fully turnover (at speed) or start the motor. I think it may be a bad ground, so I'll have to get a really good one to make sure.
Clean connections, strong battery charge, good starter... If you've done what I suggested above, this is a very simple circuit. There's not much else to go wrong...unless there's undue drag on the engine itself. Pull all the plugs out to minimize engine drag. It should spin fast and steady. If not, take your starter to O'Reilly's and have them check it out. The test is quick...and free. Good luck! Eric
My bet would be the starter! I had an issue with an old starter that cracked the plastic around the solenoid. it would turn slowly, so I replaced it and it was good to go!
Thanks for the reply guys. The only thing that is throwing me, is that I started this motor when it was in the Roadmaster, with this starter. I haven't messed with it, just swapped it over into my Super, and now it's no-go. I'm using a good battery, with a charger pumping more juice into it. It has to be the connection. I remember reading something in the manual about something having to be wired to the generator, but I can't imagine that's necessary, but Buick has some weird voodoo. I probably won't get to try anything today. Happy Thanksgiving everyone.
The reference to the generator is when you're running the accellerator pedal starter system. You have by-passed this so it should no longer be relevant. Mart.
I'm sure it's not this, but i will pass it along, many years ago I couldn't start a 1932 Pontiac.... Problem was... I had the plug wires from the distributor reversed clockwise/counterclockwise firing order ... Fixed it, fired up.
Found a different ground, made sure it was good, same thing- solenoid clicks but no turning over. I pulled the starter, going to take it to get checked at the auto parts store. I don't see what's wrong. I started this motor up with this exact starter. I took the starter out when I took the motor out of the original car, is it possible I messed something up? So now that I put it back in, it won't work? Don't really see why I'd need to take the plugs out, the motor turns over super easy, I just can't get the starter to do it...
Ok, you have just about the simplest wiring setup that anyone could have on an engine. That takes care of that. You can most likely pick up bushings and brushes for that starter for under 10.00 at the Napa store The brushes are http://www.napaonline.com/Search/Detail.aspx?A=ECHR503_0059665860&An=599001+101957+50008+2008006 The bushings are http://www.napaonline.com/Search/Re...ngs&Ntk=Keyword&N=599001+101957+50008+2008006 There is a simple trick for getting the bushings out of the end plate and end frame and the brushes are simple to change. I'd still be checking for bad connections or bad grounds. Did you paint the area of the block/bellhousing where the starter bolts up? It's those simple things that usually cause issues.
Voltage, ground and connections ok! Then check the brushes in the starter, if sticking or worn too short, it´ll pull a tremendous amount of amps. It´ll turn over slowly, and it feels like a bad battery
Does the starter ground to the engine properly? If you paint the starter or the part it bolts to the ground may be compromised. Mart.
Took the starter to the auto parts store today, came back with a clean bill of health. When I took the motor out of the previous car, I did paint the starter and the bellhousing, so that's my best guess as to where I'm losing the connection.
Ok, so school's out for the semester, and I have loads of time to devote to the Buick. I took the starter out of the car, cleaned the contact areas of paint on both the engine block and the starter. Put it back in, wired it up, thing cranked easily! So now I have new problems... When I pushed the starter button, the starter spins and the motor turns, but when I release the button, the starter keeps spinning. The only way to make the starter quit is to disconnect the battery cable. After doing this, if you hook the battery back up, nothing happens. Once you energize the starter, there's no way to get it to de-energize. My first assumption was that the solenoid contacts were sticking. I bought a new solenoid from an auto parts store and installed it, same thing. So now what? Keep in mind, I had this same engine running in the old car. It should work. I have two guesses: 1) The wiring is somehow wrong 2) Something is wrong with the starter button I don't know how anything could be wrong with the starter button, but it's the only thing that wasn't utilized when I had the motor running in the old car. I went from the floor starter thing in the old car, to the push button start on this car. What does everybody think?
Oh, by the way, I fired it up yesterday with the open manifolds, sounds good! Didn't get it on film, but will the next time around. I'm sure the starter isn't disengaging, so I don't want to really run the car until I get this sorted out. Any help?
Feedback from the 12V wire going (from the starter) to the coil? Try disconnecting it and see what happens. Wiring in a remote solenoid (Ford type) will fix the symptom, if not the problem.
Tried disconnecting the 12V wire from the starter to the coil, same thing. How would the Ford solenoid fix it?
The starter wire should go kinda direct to the starter solenoid - it needs to pass thru a neutral safety switch - the ignition wire goes to the coil. there is another wire that backfeeds the coil when engine is in 'crank' mode. remember, the ignition wire going to the coil should have a ballast resister in that circuit. The coil wire (ignition) is not the same wire that engages the starter because when the engine starts the generator/altenator feeds the coil and that would backfeed the starter solenoid and engaging the starter.
Mystery solved! Sort of... Buick has some serious voodoo. After reading the manual a bit more thoroughly, and after consulting with a friend with some electrical know-how, we have a better idea of what's going on. Apparently, you cannot successfully run a 1957 Nailhead with a stock starter with the simple wiring diagram I'm running. The starter has a "pull-in" contact and a "hold-in" The starter cranks until the engine starts, and then somehow the generator output automatically cuts the power to one of the contacts, and the starter stops to crank. So... I have a couple of questions: 1) How much work would it be to wire in the generator stuff? 2) For all the guys who have Nailheads in hot rods and don't use generators, how do you do it? Keep in mind, I'm not setting up the permanent wiring at this stage, the motor is in the car, but it's just a glorified engine stand. I'm just trying to get the motor run.
The floor starter has a contact on the accelerator mechanism that makes a contact. That sends 12V to the solenoid. The other side of the solenoid is not earthed. It is "earthed" to the armature contact on the generator or regulator. Thus when you stomp on the pedal with the engine stopped, the solenoid gets 12V, the other side is eathed, so it pulls in and starts the car. If the engine is running, the armature is at 12V (cos it's charging) and when you go full throttle it gets the 12V from the contact as before, but as the other side of the solenoid is already at 12V, it does not pull in. So, either connect everything up properly, or just earth the contact on the solenoid that normally goes to the armature. If you have retained the accel pedal starter you should not do this, only do it if you have a key start or temp bypass. I came across all this when I fitted an alternator to my 57 many years ago. Mart. Mart.
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