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Old 12-01-2009, 10:11 AM   #1
c-10 simplex
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Default Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Here's another thing i've "heard," and i've checked wiki, but i'm still unclear:

i heard that toyota copied/or was licenced to produce the chevy straight 6 and that supposedly all the parts are therefore interchangable.

Could you please explain, in great detail, the complete history of this engine(s)?

One of the reasons for my asking is simply my own curiosity.

BUT, another reason is i work with a few teenagers at my other gig and most of them are irrefutably convinced that the Japanese produce superior quality cars---one of their favorites is the toyota supra. Even though, by their own admission, they know little about cars. (Could they be getting this mentality from their parents?)

If it's true about this engine, then i want to "lay this info on them" and see how they react, because among other things, i'm pretty sure the supra had a straight 6 for most,possibly all, of it's production run.
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Old 12-01-2009, 10:27 AM   #2
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

I think the F series of engines (2f, 3F, 3FE) in the landcruisers were similar to the chevy 6
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Old 12-01-2009, 10:28 AM   #3
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

irrelevant
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Old 12-01-2009, 10:29 AM   #4
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

From Wiki-Pedia

The Type A engine was a straight-6 engine produced from 1935 through 1947 by Toyota.
The Type B was a technically more advanced version of the Type A.
The Type C was a straight-4 engine derived from the Type A.
Many parts were interchangeable between the Type A, Type B and Type C engines (eg pistons, valves, rods). Many of the same parts were also interchangeable with the Chevrolet Stovebolt engine, from which it was derived.
The Type E was a copy of a DKW engine.
The Type S was a straight-4 engine that replaced the Type A, B and C in Toyota's passenger cars.
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Old 12-01-2009, 10:31 AM   #5
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

i believe toyota also bought the rights to the 305 small block back in the 80's but never used it....i think.
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Old 12-01-2009, 10:34 AM   #6
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

You dispute Toyota making superior quality engines? Sorry Bubba, but their quality as far as tolerances and assembly go is off the charts good...it's a pleasure working on well designed and executed engines like Toyota inlines...now that that's said, this topic has nothing to do with traditional hot rods and customs...so, expect the worst...
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Old 12-01-2009, 10:36 AM   #7
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Not a 6 answer but look at Toyotas nascar engine SBC 1st design
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Old 12-01-2009, 10:41 AM   #8
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Never heard of this relationship before, but I could believe it.

Every time I see a yuppie in a Range Rover I ask them how their Buick is running....
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Old 12-01-2009, 10:56 AM   #9
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Ive seen how much they look alike and thats why guys had a easy time of putting SBCs in 60s lancruisers and does it apply here yes if that motor can be used as a inline replacement in 50s and 60 chevys and guys wantin to run a inline.............its a fair and good question,Ive wondered this from time to time
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:03 AM   #10
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

To answer the OP's question, read the three-page Toyota article here:

http://blog.hemmings.com/index.php/2...-the-overpass/

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Old 12-01-2009, 11:30 AM   #11
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Do a search here on the HAMB. This topic was covered several years ago. It was thought that the cylinder head was superior on the Toyota, but for whatever reason, it turned out it was not a bolt on fit for the Chevy block.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:46 AM   #12
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by slefain View Post
Never heard of this relationship before, but I could believe it.

Every time I see a yuppie in a Range Rover I ask them how their Buick is running....
they haven't used the buick motor for about 15 years.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:57 AM   #13
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

In the early years before World war 2 Gm had a plant in Japan, they made the chevy 6 among other parts and cars. When the war broke out, Gm flew as qiuck as they could leaving everthing behind. Later after the war Japan opened the plant under lics. from Gm.--TV
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:54 PM   #14
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Toyota bought the design from Chevrolet, but made changes before production. The bore spacing is longer on the toyota version so they won't interchange.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:57 PM   #15
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

The older Nissan Patrol from the 60s had a 6 that was a dead ringer for the GM six.
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Old 12-02-2009, 12:10 AM   #16
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hitchhiker View Post
they haven't used the buick motor for about 15 years.
No, it was discontinued in the Range Rover when the 2003's came out with a BMW engine...2006 they went to Jag, and for 2010, they have a 5.0 Jag motor, with a supercharged ,510hp option...The buick motor (derivative) was used until 2004 with the end of the Discovery run...
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Old 12-02-2009, 12:28 AM   #17
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Toyota and GM had a relationship before WWII and the Toyota L-6 engines were reduced size copies of the Chevy 216 L-6 of the 30s.
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Old 12-02-2009, 12:36 AM   #18
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruiner View Post
You dispute Toyota making superior quality engines? Sorry Bubba, but their quality as far as tolerances and assembly go is off the charts good...it's a pleasure working on well designed and executed engines like Toyota inlines...now that that's said, this topic has nothing to do with traditional hot rods and customs...so, expect the worst...
Did you see the ABC coverage? Lots of people dieing in Toyotas because of their accelerator problems, Frames so rotten after 4 years the spare tires are falling out. I think, and that's me, their quality image is all due to the press they've been given and the fact that everyone is walking on eggshells around these people and others because they're so afraid to insult them. PC crap.. I wouldn't ever buy anything but American made stuff.
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Old 12-02-2009, 01:00 AM   #19
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragtop View Post
Did you see the ABC coverage? Lots of people dieing in Toyotas because of their accelerator problems, ... PC crap.. I wouldn't ever buy anything but American made stuff.
This accelerator problem is because the car owners didn't use the factory mats which have holes in the rear edge so the floor mounted retainer keep them from ever sliding forward to jam under/over the accelerator pedal, or didn't hook the factory mats over the hooks as noted in the owner's manual which nobody ever reads. Even the news report noted the policeman's car, a Lexus I believe, which became the hingepin for this story did not have the factory floormats installed but DID have some other mats in the car.
I don't think you could say "lots of people" are dying because of these problems.

Auto makers and every other industry in this country has been under the gun of lawsuits filed by lawyers on behalf of stupid people. Remember the TV news stories of that most dangerous appliance in your home, the gas-powered water heater. Seems these stupid people let their kids play with puppy in the utility room with a glass jar full of gasoline sitting next to the water heater and when the rambuctious little critter knocked it over just as Dad turned on the shower...well, you know the story.

"Stupid people" laws have increased the cost of goods and services to everyone for almost everything and guess what? They still manage to outwit the most clever preventive devices and kill or injure themselves in the same numbers as before. Nature's own process of natural selection at work.
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Old 12-02-2009, 01:03 AM   #20
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Hit me offline and I can tell you what you need to know. They are kind of the same...but way different..Only a few things can be modified to interchange.
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Old 12-02-2009, 01:08 AM   #21
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pasadenahotrod View Post
Toyota and GM had a relationship before WWII and the Toyota L-6 engines were reduced size copies of the Chevy 216 L-6 of the 30s.

The 2Fs are 4.2 liter L6 engines which is a 262 cubic inches I believe.
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Old 12-02-2009, 01:08 AM   #22
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

The supra inline six is a dual overhead cam engine.It looks a lot like a Jaguar six.
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Old 12-02-2009, 01:15 AM   #23
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

We recently rebuilt a 2F toyota for an '85 landcruiser, a chevy 216 and a chevy 235. If toyota didn't copy a few things, then it must be some sort of miracle. There are so many things that look damn near identical, but are just slightly off. The shape of the front cover, shape of the plate behind the cover, side cover, etc etc.. to an untrained eye they would look thee same except of course the toyota does not have siamesed ports.

As far as the "toyota quality" that ruiner mentions.. there was nothing so exceptionally great about the 2f we rebuilt compared to any chevy 235. It wasn't some beautiful casting , perfectly square deck, or any less worn that any other engine with 86k miles on it. In fact in my opinion considering the toyota engine was a 1985 model and the chevy was a 1962 model (designed in 1936)... the Toyota was kind disappointing and archaic.

Here's a pic of the 2f on our site
http://www.daycustomengine.com/Galle...=picture&id=34
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Old 12-02-2009, 01:15 AM   #24
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

actually if Gm was making engines there before WW2, then it's on topic as far as history of American car makers, I never knew they made engines there though. Not sure on old Toyota motors, not a Yota fan, but I know old Honda motors copied British designs a lot,with improvements. I still like my old iron block with 500000 miles on it and still has hone marks. Whats ironic is a lot of people hate Japanese cars, but the Japanese absolutely love old American iron, and hot rods. American culture in general as a matter of fact.
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Old 12-02-2009, 03:34 AM   #25
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

I should have added a caveat to my statement, the only toyota motors I've worked on are from the 90's on up, like the DOHC MR2 and 2JZ Supras...as for car quality, that's another story, I was only digging through the motors...the only issues I had were the lack of insert bearings on the aluminum heads for the cams (common on newer motors I'm told) and threads could have been stronger had they used a rollform style tap rather than traditional cutting taps...the tolerances and castings I came across were great in my experience...
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Old 12-02-2009, 03:48 AM   #26
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruiner View Post
I should have added a caveat to my statement, the only toyota motors I've worked on are from the 90's on up, like the DOHC MR2 and 2JZ Supras...as for car quality, that's another story, I was only digging through the motors...the only issues I had were the lack of insert bearings on the aluminum heads for the cams (common on newer motors I'm told) and threads could have been stronger had they used a rollform style tap rather than traditional cutting taps...the tolerances and castings I came across were great in my experience...
Honda has been using overhead cams without bearing inserts since the 70's, and somehow they have always held up great, mine has 500000 miles,and not a bit of wear on the cam journals, I believe it's high pressure oil to the head that forms the barrier between the cam and head, I have never quite figured it out.
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Old 12-02-2009, 04:44 AM   #27
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Best of my knowledge, NOTHING goes from Toyota engine to 235 or 261. LOOK similar, but thats it.
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Old 12-02-2009, 05:49 AM   #28
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragtop View Post
Did you see the ABC coverage? Lots of people dieing in Toyotas because of their accelerator problems, Frames so rotten after 4 years the spare tires are falling out. I think, and that's me, their quality image is all due to the press they've been given and the fact that everyone is walking on eggshells around these people and others because they're so afraid to insult them. PC crap.. I wouldn't ever buy anything but American made stuff.
Yep, those rotting frames on Tacoma trucks were made by Dana Corporation right here in the USA. There's a massive recall on them where Toyota replaces the entire frame with a better designed one.

And the people dying, like was mentioned is from poor aftermarket floor mats.

Every company has issues, some more or less, but your post is full of half truth and fear mongering.
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Old 12-02-2009, 06:16 AM   #29
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Run for your lives, there's reasoning and logic going on here!!! Ahhhh!!!

People will take any moment they can to cut down something they don't want to know about...nevermind that US automakers have had the same issues with floormats, or Ford's magic self-igniting wiring, or the thousands of other recalls from every manufacturer, let's just concentrate on freaking out about the import ones, because those pose the biggest threat to our economy...oh, wait...what do you mean Toyota employs Americans? But how am I supposed to hate them then?
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Old 12-02-2009, 06:28 AM   #30
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by slefain View Post
Never heard of this relationship before, but I could believe it.

Every time I see a yuppie in a Range Rover I ask them how their Buick is running....
hahaha i do the same thing ever time i see someone in a duramax ..hey how ya like that isusu ?
ive owned 11 toyota trucks and 4 runners in my life and they are hands down better than any other car or truck ive had i never had to work on them ..the 22r 4 banger is a hell of a motor ...

as far as the 6 being related to toyota never heard that before but that is also a hell of a motor so it may be true ..
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Old 12-02-2009, 08:51 AM   #31
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Not to interupt all of the U.S. vs. import whining going on here, but back to the original question.....years ago, when I worked in a machine shop, I came in one morning to find a 235 block lying on the floor, except it had integrally cast motor mount ears in the '55-'57 mount position. Come to find out, it was a '67 Landcruiser block. As already stated, the important dimensions are off just enough to make any Chevy/Toyota parts mix and match impractical.
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Old 12-02-2009, 09:08 AM   #32
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Living in Arizona, I suspect our Toyotas don't have the frame rot problem. I've never heard of it until now. We are 99% USA in our fleet
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:45 AM   #33
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by c-10 simplex View Post
One of the reasons for my asking is simply my own curiosity.

BUT, another reason is i work with a few teenagers at my other gig and most of them are irrefutably convinced that the Japanese produce superior quality cars---one of their favorites is the toyota supra. Even though, by their own admission, they know little about cars. (Could they be getting this mentality from their parents?)

If it's true about this engine, then i want to "lay this info on them" and see how they react, because among other things, i'm pretty sure the supra had a straight 6 for most,possibly all, of it's production run.
Sounds like another batch of youth batptized into the Fast and Furious wannabe cult.. See if you can bring them back from the Dark Side

All kidding aside the turbo supra is a fun car to drive(i assume thats the one they are talking about) but i wouldn't call the 2JZ engine absolutely superior to all american motors..
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:51 AM   #34
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by slefain View Post
Never heard of this relationship before, but I could believe it.

Every time I see a yuppie in a Range Rover I ask them how their Buick is running....
That's funny! I do the same thing, nothing better that telling them they are driving a Buick V8!
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:53 AM   #35
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

As far as cam bearings go my Lotus 907 ran on the aluminum as did my Nissan 3 liter V6. My '32 Plymouth four cylinder ran on the iron without any bearings. Set SCTA records with all of them. My new (to me) '26 Dodge Bros. four runs on the iron also. Maybe that means another record?
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Old 12-02-2009, 12:46 PM   #36
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

What about Toyota built hot rods?

This one was built by the guys at Toyota,it's originally an FJ45 Landcruiser:


And then there's this Toyota A/Gas style Stout pickup built by RKM in Japan,it's even been converted to left hand drive:



Yup,Japanese are heavily influenced by American culture.
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Old 12-02-2009, 01:05 PM   #37
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pasadenahotrod View Post
Toyota and GM had a relationship before WWII and the Toyota L-6 engines were reduced size copies of the Chevy 216 L-6 of the 30s.
Then, post-war they proceeded to build better motors, comparable to the reliability of bavarian motor wurks (but at a cheaper price), and competing with all of Detoit, hands down.

That was a good thing, because otherwise Detroit would still be using old 1950s technology. The idea that without American designs to copy, that the Japanese would not have been able to compete with Detroit, is laughable.
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Old 12-02-2009, 01:14 PM   #38
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

As for those poor folks dying, dad panicked, plain and simple, some people cannot handle situations like that. You have to stay calm, all the guy had to do was slap her into neutral and he had tons of time, tons. It's a shame but I think most people when faced with life or death situations freak out and I'm not bragging here, I don't, time slows down for me and I think rationally.

That accident wasn't Toyota's fault.
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Old 12-02-2009, 07:52 PM   #39
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

all that crap u guys have bought from over seas is why there are no jobs in this country. japan didnt even know how to temper steel until harley davidson sold them the patent to an old design. they are copy cats in all the things they build. the american auto companies build design and promote new models and then they are copied. how would u like some to copy your design and then make there own and sell it????????
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Old 12-02-2009, 08:18 PM   #40
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

I had a 70 Landcruiser that the carb was giving me trouble (leaking, worn). I had a 2gc chevy carb and bolted on to the flange with a little file work. Ran great for the next couple of years before I sold it.
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Old 12-02-2009, 09:02 PM   #41
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Besides the copy of the Chevy 6 has any of you seen the Toyota hemi? Made for big trucks in Japan and never for our market. I built a frame for a T-bucket for a guy using one, if it wasn't for the Japanese writing on the valve cover you would sware it was an early Chrysler. Don't believe he ever got it running, missing a few parts he could never find.
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Old 12-02-2009, 09:21 PM   #42
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Just as an FYI, the early Toyoglide transmission was basically a Powerglide clone, just smaller. Had one apart once, and you'd swear that you were looking at a Powerglide.
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Old 12-02-2009, 09:25 PM   #43
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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Originally Posted by Ayers Garage View Post
Yep, those rotting frames on Tacoma trucks were made by Dana Corporation right here in the USA. There's a massive recall on them where Toyota replaces the entire frame with a better designed one.
Lest us not forget that these frames were built to Toyota's specifications. Funny thing Dana builds truck frames for other manufactures (Ford) and yet Toyota is the company experiencing problems. There are also plenty of S-10s that have Dana frames under them that aren't breaking in half.

Busted Toyota truck frames are nothing new. Living in the rust belt I used to see it all the time before they all got scrapped. I remember my first introduction to busted Toyota frames. My parent's neighbor up the road had bought late 70s Toyota Truck new, one day it busted in half (in 98 or so). Truck had less than 100,000 miles on it and the upper body looked fine. My friend's parents bought a brand new Toyota 4x4 in 1984, ten years later they didn't even need tools to take off the bed it was so rusted apart. A couple years later it busted in two which they sorta half-assed fixed it. I bought it for 50 bucks in 2005 and at that point it had less than 90,000 miles on it.

My friend bought himself an 89 Toyota truck, and predictably the frame was busted in two. Heck I have seen more 80s and early 90s Toyota trucks in my life with busted frames than those that didn't. I have no idea where everyone else has been since this has been a problem with these things since they were first imported. Maybe it is because folks then didn't expect vehicles to last as long as they do now. Those older Toyotas were all made in Japan too. No Dana corperation to tack the blame on.

Also Toyota had a lot of trouble with their 3.0 V-6 blowing head gaskets and them Toyota Tracels seem real hit and miss. Some are good and some toss their cookies at less than 50,000 miles. A lot of Toyota's reputation is built upon mindless drones who babble on about how reliable their Toyota is (also usualy the same folks who trade their car in every couple years too). I had a guy tell me his Toyota only needed one engine the entire two years he had it (bought it new). His mechanic told him it was normal maintanence. I wonder how many other folks fell for this ploy and go out beating the drum of Toyota quality
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Old 12-02-2009, 09:39 PM   #44
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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japan didnt even know how to temper steel until harley davidson sold them the patent to an old design

That's a joke, right?
Japanese heat treatment of steel was far superior to anything else for about 500 years (up to about 1870).

Ever hear of a Samurai sword?
Reports came back from Pacific combat in 1943 of U.S. soldiers blocking a sword cut by a Japanese officer, as they had been trained to do, with the receiver of their Springfield 1903A3.
It didn't work.
The sword, swung overhand by a man 5'4" tall and weighing 125 lbs., cut right through the hard-as-glass, best-in-the-world Springfield like it was a loaf of stale bread.

The Washington response was "Those are lies, told by spies and infiltrators - because it's impossible".
And then they got the rifles back - in 2 pieces.

The Japanese did a lot of things badly - making steel isn't one of them.
the sword cutting that was disproved on mythbusters
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:20 PM   #45
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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Japanese heat treatment of steel was far superior to anything else for about 500 years (up to about 1870).
The Japanese may have known HOW to temper steel, but none of that showed up in my 62 Landcruiser, and was confirmed by a bodyman who also owned a (67?) that he'd fixed as a total.

My old 62 had some of the softest fasteners I've ever seen. I was always drilling out junk down below and replacing with US bolts and nuts. That blessed thing STILL sits out back with some broken--off fasteners here and there.

I can't really comment on the Chev/ Toy 6 thing except that someone I knew CLAIMED he put a Chev distributor right into his Toy. He may have been drunk at the time, so I don't know. They WERE metric, though.......
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:25 PM   #46
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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the sword cutting that was disproved on mythbusters

Really?
They used a $10,000 300 year old family heirloom in the test?

The priceless ones do exactly that - the modern, military-supplied weapons carried by junior officers etc. were all machine-made production items, as are almost all the replicas, and no better than what we used.

Google "false causation".
Man I got some ocean front property in Arizona......
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:42 PM   #47
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

I guess I'll never learn, but I must admit - I'm still amazed at what passes for a rebuttal argument here.

"I saw it on a TV show" goes right to the head of the list.

This was reported as myth by Army Intelligence, and the discovery (interviews with soldiers, examination of damaged Springfields) that it did happen was so shocking that (despite the effect on moral) it was published in Yank in 1944 (it's in my copy) as a warning.

A useful lesson to take away: "I don't understand this" is not the same as "It didn't happen".
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:47 PM   #48
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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all that crap u guys have bought from over seas is why there are no jobs in this country. japan didnt even know how to temper steel until harley davidson sold them the patent to an old design. they are copy cats in all the things they build. the american auto companies build design and promote new models and then they are copied. how would u like some to copy your design and then make there own and sell it????????
Wrong,the reason why there is a lack of employment over here is undocumented workers being employed for a fraction of what a citizen works for,and the fact that the government has spent more than what the government has,causing a huge budget deficit and creating a financial collapse. Japan has been tempering steel long before Harley Davidson was around,just look at real Japanese Samurai swords,not the cheap show display ones. They are stronger than any tempered 440 steel out there. Educate yourself before you sound off about something,I always try to. Besides,China is the one making cheap crap parts,not Japan. I would buy something made in japan before i bought something made in China.
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.... I think it's short for the ancient Greek phrase "Hotilicus Rodimicus" meaning, Bad Ass Chariot
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:48 PM   #49
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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Originally Posted by panic View Post
I guess I'll never learn, but I must admit - I'm still amazed at what passes for a rebuttal argument here.

"I saw it on a TV show" goes right to the head of the list.

This was reported as myth by Army Intelligence, and the discovery (interviews with soldiers, examination of damaged Springfields) that it did happen was so shocking that (despite the effect on moral) it was published in Yank in 1944 (it's in my copy) as a warning.

A useful lesson to take away: "I don't understand this" is not the same as "It didn't happen".
Still doesn't explain why Toyota truck frames suck (and suck they did even before Dana got into the picture). Or explain any relationship between Toyota sixes and Chevrolet sixes for that matter.

Maybe Toyota should have hired Samurai warriors to build their frames...
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:52 PM   #50
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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the sword cutting that was disproved on mythbusters
Yeah,Mythbusters is a load of crap,like wikipedia. They didn't use a real tempered Japanese sword,they used the crap show swords that low budget collectors buy. Those aren't forged,they are cast. Originally,Japanese swords for high ranking officers and Samurai alike were made by a process of folding the steel several times while tempereing it,and basically strong enough to cut through lesser made "tempered" steel. Real Japanese sword makers take the highest pride in their sword making,and it would take years to make a handful.
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.... I think it's short for the ancient Greek phrase "Hotilicus Rodimicus" meaning, Bad Ass Chariot
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:52 PM   #51
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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Still doesn't explain why Toyota truck frames suck (and suck they did even before Dana got into the picture). Or explain any relationship between Toyota sixes and Chevrolet sixes for that matter.

Maybe Toyota should have hired Samurai warriors to build their frames...
Toyota couldn't get them,they were all working for Suzuki
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.... I think it's short for the ancient Greek phrase "Hotilicus Rodimicus" meaning, Bad Ass Chariot
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:55 PM   #52
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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Besides the copy of the Chevy 6 has any of you seen the Toyota hemi? Made for big trucks in Japan and never for our market. I built a frame for a T-bucket for a guy using one, if it wasn't for the Japanese writing on the valve cover you would sware it was an early Chrysler. Don't believe he ever got it running, missing a few parts he could never find.
Here you go:
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.... I think it's short for the ancient Greek phrase "Hotilicus Rodimicus" meaning, Bad Ass Chariot
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:55 PM   #53
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Originally Posted by slefain
Never heard of this relationship before, but I could believe it.

Every time I see a yuppie in a Range Rover I ask them how their Buick is running....


QUOTE: Hitchhiker - they haven't used the buick motor for about 15 years.
------------------------------------------------------------------

Thats OK, The last time herd the term "yuppie", It was about 15 years ago too!

LOL,
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Old 12-02-2009, 10:57 PM   #54
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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Toyota couldn't get them,they were all working for Suzuki
I guess that was the problem Well I think I may have to contact Toyota and tell them they need to have a talk with Suzuki
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:09 PM   #55
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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I guess that was the problem Well I think I may have to contact Toyota and tell them they need to have a talk with Suzuki
Not to go off topic,but a friend of mine had two Suzuki Samurai's that he bough on the cheap as a bash toy and parts rig. We bashed the hell out of the first one and could never break it,and we're talking heavy bashing with the intent to damage the vehicle(At $400 each running,why not). When the first one did finally have something break after 3 years of extreme abuse and routine maintenance,we grabbed the second one and abuse it for about a year,he ended up selling both off to some guys in to offroading and rock crawling,and last I heard they used both to make some insane rock crawler.
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.... I think it's short for the ancient Greek phrase "Hotilicus Rodimicus" meaning, Bad Ass Chariot
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:24 PM   #56
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

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Not to go off topic,but a friend of mine had two Suzuki Samurai's that he bough on the cheap as a bash toy and parts rig. We bashed the hell out of the first one and could never break it,and we're talking heavy bashing with the intent to damage the vehicle(At $400 each running,why not). When the first one did finally have something break after 3 years of extreme abuse and routine maintenance,we grabbed the second one and abuse it for about a year,he ended up selling both off to some guys in to offroading and rock crawling,and last I heard they used both to make some insane rock crawler.
Heh, I had a Suzuki Swift, tough little car. Had the four cylinder which I think is the same as the Samurai's.

Did a little research on Katanas. The real deals sound like they are pretty tough to make. Only a few skilled sword makers in Japan still make them. The mass produced ones sound like they couldn't hold a candle to the real deal.

I also did some digging on Toyota sixes. The F engine sounds like it was based off of a GMC six. Made them right up until 92. Might have to find some Landcruisers to compare with.....
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:32 PM   #57
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

About the recent problems that Toyota has had with accelerator pedals,does anyone know if Toyota is using a drive by wire accelerator pedal system in there newer cars?if so and i think they might be,there problems could be attributed to this electronicly controlled accelerator pedal,rather than a out of place floormat?just asking.Gerry
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:43 PM   #58
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Thanks everyone for responding; i couldn't rejoin the conversation too quickly because of work schedule. On top of that i'm just a slow person regardless. Anyways, if i could address these particular points:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foul View Post
To answer the OP's question, read the three-page Toyota article here:

http://blog.hemmings.com/index.php/2...-the-overpass/

dan
Thanks for the link---very informative.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruiner View Post
You dispute Toyota making superior quality engines? Sorry Bubba, but their quality as far as tolerances and assembly go is off the charts good...it's a pleasure working on well designed and executed engines like Toyota inlines...now that that's said, this topic has nothing to do with traditional hot rods and customs...so, expect the worst...
i didn't mean to imply that i think Japanese quality sucks; i just don't feel and never felt they were "all that"----"the best," like a large portion of the population feels. i don't even feel that German Automotive technology (automotive technology only) is nessesarily the best.
Despite the present problems with managment, i think GM had and still has the top automotive technology in the world. Of course, the way things are going, i don't think GM is going to be around for too much longer, but that's neither here nor there..........


Quote:
Originally Posted by bloodyknucklehill View Post
Sounds like another batch of youth batptized into the Fast and Furious wannabe cult.. See if you can bring them back from the Dark Side
Yes, they think that this is their world. i told them if they wanted to see a real car movie they should watch the original gone in 60 secs (they didn't know there was an original) and watch bullitt. They didn't know what the heck i was talking about.

Back to the straight 6's:
OK, i guess what i was trying to get into was, i was wondering if the toyota straight six was the same as say, in the original 53 corvette?

So i guess what we need to do, in my opinion, is to break it down:
Is the engine that came with the 53 corvette the same as, say, the one in the 80 nova i used to own? And are these engines the same as from the 20's and earlier?

In other words, could we break down, in detail the history of the chevy straight six first(before comparing to the toyota)? Again, i checked wiki, but am not clear. i know that chevy had straight 6's for a long time, but is it basically the same engine---used all the way up to , i think 1990 in trucks?

2) RE: S-10 frames:
i was under the impression (apparently erroneously) that GM made all their own frames; i thought the s-10 frame was just a slighly narrower version of the G-body frame, which in turn is a smaller version of the A-body frame which dates back to 73?

3) i welcome all the tangents such as import vs. domestic and Japanese hemis etc., because it's all educational. Feel free to continue.

i think the bottom line was that even if the toyo 6 is not an exact copy, just knowing that it was based of the chevy design was good enough for me to tell the teeners that it was chevy that made toyota what they are today. i want them to think a little about who is really better. Again, i'm not saying at all that Japanese quality sucks---i think they've proven themselves. But i wanted to try to change the one-siding thinking that's prevalent in today's society--that Japanese carmakers can do no wrong. And domestic carmakers can do no right---i think the kids are learning it in large part from their parents.
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Old 12-02-2009, 11:48 PM   #59
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Default Re: Can you tell me about the toyota straight 6 and it's relationship to chevrolet?

Traditional Hot Rods & Customs....
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