Hey Guy's, I have a question about putting a Volare front clip into a 1958 Ford F100. I am wanting to drop a 500ci Caddy motor in this truck, and have heard of people swapping out the straight axle for a front clip from a mid-80's Volare. Is this the best route to go, or are there other clips that will give me the braking/steering & weight toloerance needed for this motor? Also, which year clip is best suited? Any help you can give will be appreciated. The King
I'm thinking you may have problems with a couple of things....the caddy mill is probably pretty wide and may give you headaches with clearing the steering box. Also the weight of the caddy motor may be a little heavy on the volare clip and will probably be a little mushy.
My son and I put a 472 cad and a Volare clip in a 47 International pickup. It worked out great, drives great, handles great, stops great, with the Volare disc brakes. Would recomend it to anyone with a 40's or 50's pickup. Ude the Eldo pan with the rear sump.
The Volare front clip has some replacement parts which are hard to find. Another alternative might be better. Here is a link to the Ford Trucks site with a discussion about Ford truck front end alternatives. The link takes you to part one and there are links there to get to the other parts of the article. http://www.ford-trucks.com/article/...ives_for_1948__1960_Ford_Trucks_Part_One.html A good alternative using a truck suspension is the Dodge Dakota. It uses the 86-96 Dakota suspension components to a welded in crossmember. The HAMB's very own El Polacko sells the crossmember. I'm using the Dakota suspension on my 48 F1. I'm still getting the frame ready for Steve (El Polacko) to put the crossmember into.
El Scotto is correct. 500 Caddy's are very light. Also, they are about 100-pounds LIGHTER than a Big Block Chevy. I'm pretty sure that the Cad 500 is LIGHTER than the Y-block that came out of your '58! Width is not a problem with them. Especially in an F-100. You will need to secure the end of your steering column to the firewall and use a couple of U-joints to connect to the Chrysler steering box in any case....as in almost any steering box conversion. My '53 F-100 (pictured) has a 500 Cadillac in it. I used the Gibbon front crossmember, (which I THINK is available for a '58) that is a direct bolt-in requiring no welding or modification to the original F-100 frame. It then allows a comlete bolt-in of a 70's Chrysler Cordoba torsion bar front suspension, steering box and 11-3/4" front disc brakes. It is a slightly bigger and stronger front end than a Volare. The Volare installation requires very serious and critical cutting and notching of the F-100 frame and welding in the Volare crossmember and suspension. The cutting, welding and notching determines the final alignment, ride height, and caster of the front end....so it's quite critical to get it right. By the time you get the desired ride-height, you have notched your original F-100 frame down to only about 1-inch in depth on the side rails!!!! In the Cordoba suspension, the torsion bars run parallel to the main frame rails and give easy adjustabillity to the ride height after the unit is installed. In the Volare suspension, the torsion bars run across the frame at right angles. I believe it is also adjustable for ride height, but does not have the same 'range' of adjustabillity as the Cordoba. I took mine to an alignment shop and had it aligned on their machine after completion and the guy was shocked how close to perfect the alignment was! It required only very minor adjustment. I am extremely happy with my Gibbon / Cordoba installation. Braking, steering and ride are all EXCELLENT! JG
On the FTE (ford truck enthusiasts) site a popular IFS and IRS swap is 80's Jag which can be had very reasonably with a crapped out motor.
Yes, the Jaguar is a VERY simple front end swap, I've done my '46 pickup and as soon as I can get my mits on a LHD Jag steering rack I will be doing my '53. couple shots of my '46 pickup chassis
Wasn't there an article somewhere on doing the front suspension from a late model (03 and up) Crown Victoria? If I remember correctly, it bolted in with like 6 bolts, gave you rack and pinion and discs, and the parts are EVERYWHERE. Plus, it's aluminum and you connect your stock steering with u-joints.
I appreciate all of the ideas. The Gibbons route looks like a winner. There is a wide range of donor car that I could use for that set up, plus it looks affordable. (That's always a plus!) Is there any welding to do at all, Magoo?
The late model Crown Vic suspension with the aluminum cross member is pretty much a bolt in certain year F-100 trucks but it is extra wide and one has to run the Crown vic or deep inset (look like front wheel drive) wheels to get it to work. One thread on the subject here http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/716058-buildup-06-crown-vic-front-suspension-into-67-f100.html The Volaire was popular in the 80's when those cars were really common but as a couple of the guys said they are getting hard to find pieces for even for the guys who drive the cars. And as mentioned there is critical trimming to be done to the frame to make it work. I think that the Cordoba style or the Dakota style would be the way to go. If you go with the 500 Cad you might want to look for a 75/76 Eldorodo pan and oil pickup for clearance.
a friend has this website. some pic's of different front suspensions(installed in Dodge trucks)www.dodgestepsidesandsweptsides.com
King Karl, The Gibbon Crossmember requires no welding whatsoever as per the directions included with the kit. They even give you a couple of special bolts to use in certain factory- drilled holes to get the initial alignment right. The crossmember IS a little pricy....around $400 if I remember correctly. I got everything off a Cordoba that I needed for $50 at the local 'Pick-A-Part. The Cordoba front bolt pattern is the same as the Ford 9-inch that I used in the rear. New shocks, wheel bearings, seals, and brake overhaul parts were all available over the counter at NAPA. Surprisingly, the original Ford front axle did NOT locate the center of the front wheels precisely in the center of the front fenders on the '53 - '56 F-100's!!! Don't ask me why! I don't know about the '57 - '58. The Gibbon Crossmember corrects this apparent screw-up by Ford and relocates the front wheels exactly in the center of the front fenders. Check it out.....WIERD!! You never notice the difference unless you park next to a stock one. Gibbon is in Nebraska. You should be able to find them with a Google search. JG
I also have a 58 f100 that needs to be clipped, Im just not sure what route to go. Also I dont want to spend a fortune on the swap either.
That sounds like a really slick setup. I learned something on this thread-- Caddy motor included. Although I wanted to stay with the straight axle on my '58 F100, this is one way that would have swayed me into an IFS mod. I'm in the middle of Z-ing the frame right now, and installing the CPP drop axle. Just got the front springs back from the spring shop- reversed and slightly de-arched. I do like the way that I was able to stay basically original and get a 6-7" drop with what can be considered full suspension travel for a car, tho. ...But I'm going to catalog this for future reference- great stuff!
I would suggest you use the Dakota swap over the Volare swap. The Volare suspension is a bit less then the best design going. The pre 91 or 92 Dakota will have a 5 on 4 1/2" bolt pattern. The 91/92 to 95 have a 6 bolt rotor, but the older 5 bolt one swaps on just bu changing the rotor out. The 95 and newer also have 6 bolt rotors, but you need to swap more then just the rotors to get the 5 bolt pattern. You will have to cut off your original frame and splice on the Dakota frame. The Volare clip is actually an "F, M & J body" suspension system. All the F,M & J clips have the entire front suspension mounted on a removable K member. Originally introduced on the Volare in 1976, was used up to 1989, and was the only front suspension used on rear wheel drive Mopar cars built after 81 (until the new rear drive cars came out). If your looking for one of these, the best bet would be a mid 80s rear drive Chrysler 5th Ave. Those had cross torsion bars that were hight adjustable, (but not much) and only had one size torsion bar available. The Cordoba suspension refered to above would be a "B body" suspension last used on the Cordaba/Charger body from 1974 until 1979. This straight bar suspension has a few bar diamater choices still available. The B body suspension has a bolt on K member the lower control arms mount to, but the upper control arms mount to brackets originally welded to the seperate unit body frame. There is also a rear torsion bar anchor cross member that bolts to the car body that is seperate from the k member. The B body suspension is far better system then the F,M & J system, but more work to install, unless an aftermarket crossmember is still available. Of these 3, I would personally go for the Dakota. Dakota's are still in production, parts are going to be available for many years to come. The other 2 choices have been out of production for at least 20 years, parts are already getting harder to locate, but are still available. Gene
They will work but the other options tend to work better on the F-100 trucks. One big advantage of the Dakota pieces is that the setup is all Dakota from A arms, springs, spindles, rotors, Calipers an the little pieces. M-II setups usually take quite a bit of mixing and matching to get what you want as far as bigger brakes.
The Industrial Chassis setup is the cleanest by far and you're using components built for a truck. Steve builds a front crossmember that needs to be welded into your Ford frame and fits perfectly. Don't go whacking off the front of your frame and trying to graft on a Dakota front clip. It will look crappy and takes an experienced fabricator/welder to fit it on properly. Call Steve at Industrial Chassis and talk to him about his Dakota crossmember. And while you have him on the phone, have him explain why a Mustang II is NOT the way to go.
Gibbons still manufactures the kit. However the price has gone up since Magoo finished his project. Unfortunately the cost is now $575 instead of the $400 he paid for the kit. http://www.gibbonfiberglass.com/trucks/torsion_kit2.asp Again, great stuff here guy's. Thanks again for the schooling.
An FYI for you guys thinking about using the '73-'79 Cordoba suspension.... The torsion bars on '73 to '79 B-bodies (Cordoba, Satellite/Roadrunner, Charger, etc) are 2" longer than the more popular '66 to '72 muscle car B-bodies, so if you install the rear torsion bar crossmember 2" forward you have an incredible selection of torsion bar sizes all available new from a handful of vendors so you can tailor your front suspension rates from skinny drag race T-bars all the way up to track duty only road race stuff.
As I recall, the old mustang II didn't work well in the wider F100 frames due to geometry problems. Heidt makes an excellent kit which is designed for the F100 that I've been told by other owners is an excellent way to go. Pricey though. Biggest thing is not to buy any system that requires you to cut the stock frame off to install. The dog house alignment can be brutal. Try setting the spindle centerline about 1" forward for better fender/wheel appearance.
Volarie steering box interferes with exhaust if you use a SBC....most have to offset their engine to the passenger side as much as 2". Not sure with a caddy or other engines; but might wanna check that out.
Boy am I embarrassed, I could have sworn that the last time I looked I could not find Gibbon stuff anywhere. I wanted your rear end setup. Too late now. Well, now I know. Thanks for posting. Joe
Another vote for Industrial Chassis' Dakota setup. Mustang II (Pinto), and Volare are OK if all you care about is low ride height. Jaguar clips may be cool, too, except parts are pricey and hard to come by. Bolt-on crossmembers are fine for light duty (cruising). The kit Industrial Chassis makes uses actual pickup parts, and has the proper geometry, etc engineered into it. And for $100 I bought a complete front donor clip from a Dakota to supply everything else needed. So, if all you want to do is cruise the burger joints and fairgrounds, then put whatever is cheapest under your truck. But if you intend to do some actual "truck" things with it (or drive on the freeway), then get the Industrial Chassis kit. You won't be sorry.
I've put in dozens of Volare clips in F100s and every customer loved the ride, even have one in my own 57 F100. Installed just about every motor imaginable with it too, some are easy, some a bitch. Only down side to me is they are ugly but no worse the a Camaro clip. This was all 15+ years ago, they were a hot ticket then, I wouldn't do one now. Like someone said, these are all 20 year old now, can't run down and buy a clip out of a nice low milage wreck anymore. Too bad Detroit quit building us good Hot Rod parts cars so long ago
The Caddy 500 went in mine 'dead center' with no problems. You need to use an Eldorado rear sump oil pan is all. I used Cadillac cast iron exhaust manifolds and had them Jet Hot coated. Can't remember exactly which manifolds, but there really aren't very many of them. I THINK one was Eldorado and one was Sedan DeVille. The Cordoba powersteering gear bolts right to the Gibbon crossmember and uses all the stock Cordoba steering linkage. The stock Cadillac power steering pump works perfectly. You just need to get a hose made that's Cadillac on one end and Cordoba on the other. Ended up with plenty of room for a stock mechanical belt-driven fan too. I built a shroud for it. It cools great even with the A/C on and a HOT day. JGMagoo
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