bad urethane experience-need info

I was painting my car outside with Eastwood flat black urethane, over a 3 day period. Used brand new charcoal mask 3M, broke job down into parts per the 3M recommendation. First day painted underside of trunk, hood, doors, back filler panel on sawhorses, removed from car. Day 2 painted topsides of those panels. Day 3 pulled car out of garage, painted front fenders, rear quarters, front bumper, roof, rear tail panel. Just before leaving, BANG, I got really dizzy and lightheaded. Had my mask on from time I opened paint can, until I got in car to leave. Had gloves, goggles, painter's cap, long sleeved clothes- and all painting done outside.

4 days later felt better, mixed up some epoxy 2K and primed side view mirrors, hood scoop, and 3 door hinges- that night BANG had a big chest paint, trouble breathing, had to go to the ER at hospital- they gave me breathing treatment, sent me home with bronchiodialator prescription.

Use the 'script for 2 days, felt better, decided to spray other side of mirrors, hinges, hood scoop. Thought screw it, no more 2K paints for me, bought a spray can of satin black enamel just to finish them. Put new charcoal filters in a mask with new prefilters, painted the small parts in 2 minutes outside.

later that day got tight chest and had to use bronchodialator spray again. I can't even spray regular paints now ?

anyway, I'm ok and functioning , but have some problems with coordination hand/eye and speech- slight. also some cold/tight feeling in chest and hands/foreams. Also a lot of stomach gas after I eat, guts not working quite right. I'm not a full time painter, but have painted a few cars off/on in the past 25 years, mostly for myself.

question: has anyone else here had this experience with urethane, and if so how long is the recovery period ? since this is only my first exposure I'm hoping it's not too bad.

after this I returned a few gallons of urethane paint for a refund to 2 vendors, I don't want that crap in my house or garage- or around my family. Doing research online that stuff is as dangerous as uranium almost, if you spray it. IMO to hell with paint holdout, this never happened with the old lacquer or enamel paints. This new urethane is way to dangerous for the home hobbyist. Even with a supplied air suit you're at risk and what about the kids, family, neighbors nearby. Bad stuff

anyone reading this with painting experiences like this, please post here, I'd like to read them to know what I'm up against. It's been 8 days now since the first incident and I'm still not fully recovered.

 

Hey,

My suggestion to you is NEVER SPRAY PAINT AGAIN! .........

This is you body's way of telling you NO MOE!!!!! Everyones "system" is alittle different! No two of us react to chemicals the same. There is nothing in paint material that is organic, or ment to be in the human body.
As a result, your body thinks it's under attack, which it is in this case. One of the reasons Dupont Imron isn't available as readly as it once was is because of similar experances with other painters. In the 70's when Imron first came out, stories of guys shootin jobs, walkin outa the booth and droppin dead were common!
Shooting aircraft epoxy makes me feel like I have a gin hangover for a couple days after use, even with a sperm suit and a half face resperator,
thus I won't shoot it anymore!
You may do well to check with your physican, but I doubt you've done any long term damage. Just avoid future exposure.

Swankey devils C.C.
"Meanwhile, back aboard The Tainted Pork"

 

I sprayed for many years with all kinds of paints, but it seemed that once I had a bad dose of Urethane poisoning, that it made me extremely sensitive to everything.

We were in a hurry spraying the desert race truck in our new sponsor's colors right before leaving for a race and I did not have a mask with me and the team owner begged me to get it done that night, so I pushed it as close to the open door of the shop as I could and had at it. Yeah, real smart...

I kept having black-out sessions for days afterwards. I would be sitting on the couch and all of a sudden start feeling dizzy again and as I passed out the room would smear/blur on my way to the floor and when I came to, my vision was still that of the smeared room - freaky - then I'd crawl outside and puke.

Never again paint without proper equipment.

But now I am super sensitive to everything.

The only good thing that came out of it was that I finally realized that my old friend/race truck owner didn't give a crap about anybody but himself and I bailed after many, many years of being taken advantage of.

Urethane is scarry shit.

 

It's called solvent poisoning.Afterwards your sensitive to any solvent.Gas,turpentine,etc.You can't be careless around this stuff that is sprayed on cars these days and,your right about the family neighbors etc.I think that it does go away after a length of time.How long depends on the individual.

 

Pimpin Paint hits it right on the mark. Modern paint technology is dangerous and has to dealt with accordingly.
I've painted for most of the last 45 years and am now feeling some of the effects of long term exposure; a nervous twitch her, a nervous twitch kind a thing. The key to remember when using paint products that require a catalyst( or any paint, actually) is that if you can smell it, it's causing damage.(this includes anyone who is around the paint area that can smell the fumes). If it gets on your skin, or the fumes enter through your eyes (tear ducts) it is causing damage. The question is.. how much damage and how long it takes. Usually not an instant thing... can take a long time for symptoms to show up. Some guys never have problems, others have 'em pretty quickly.

Point is... Paintin' can be dangerous if your not properly set up.

In your case, you might be having an allergic reaction that brings on your symptons right away... not necessarily the same as long term nerve/blood disorders and hopefully only temporary til the chemicals are out of your body. I'd definately recommend NOT painting anything any more. Maybe have a talk with your doctor.
A lot of guys laugh about the safety issues, probably because the effects are almost always long term and not immediately recognizable, so you might be lucky in the long run by discovering the pitfalls early on. I personally know several guys from the old days in the trade that aren't "right" anymore. At least one is dead long before his time.

If you can't avoid painting I'd get a fresh air system and clothing that completely isolates you from the chemicals and do your painting in an environment that protects anyone who might be around you.

Rich

 

Man,
thats some scarey shit there.
Here some information I found on this search.
ISO Cyanides and urethane.
http://www.autobodystore.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12035
http://www.autobodystore.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12011&highlight=urethane+exposure

 

wow..good information..
maybe I will not paint my own car in my garage.
Thanks for the heads up.

 

All good information here. I would never spray at home in an attached garage, my shop is seperate from the house. For days after painting you can still smell it, so I'm sure it's not good. Safety is important, use the proper equipment guys...your kids will thank you.

 

I only paint with a paint suit, sata fresh air hood, turbine air pump (fresh air supply) and gloves on. Mixing paint I have the same but a charcoal mask in a paint room. Look at surf board shapers... one look at them and their shakes... and you never be around solvent with out max PPE

 

I still try to spray my own stuff but after years of doing it and also being in contact with tricloretehylene (spelling) in a degreasing unit replaced with methaline chloride (spelling again)unit i get all kinds of wierd reactions to shit... The degreasing shit messed me up more than the paint did and i didnt have any control over it.. You did what the boss told u do. Its funny now we have a regular safety guy and everything is on the up and up instead of get inside and fix it cause we need parts ?...
Watch yourself with any chemicals...
Dave

 

I painted my 60 f-100 over the course of two days in my detached of course, all i wore was a dual cartrage resperator and had no issues, maybe a little head ache. But i took two squirle cage fans and put filter boxes on them and placed them in the windows pumped that shit outside and it went well.

 

You are most likely alergic to the isocyanates that are in the paint.I used to work with a guy that painted for 20 years and one day he walked in the shop and could not breathe.They tell us in paint school that it can happen like that but you never think it wil.I would not suggest that you get around paint or other such solvents unless you have no other choice.The effects will get more severe and can cause death.

Ben

 

The human body has no way to metabolize isocyanates.

You must use a proper fresh air system, with the proper protective equipment,
or you will pay for it sooner or later.

Charcoal filters are not good enough, doesn't matter who says they have gotten away with it for years.

 

thanks

MD followup is tomorrow 8 AM

yeh, when I can't handle a rattle can on 2 sideview mirrors, I'd say that's "sensitized"

I've been putting my cars in primer since 1983 at home in the driveway or garage- used lacquer thinner in moderate amounts, worked in a used car lot garage and we did a good deal of lacquer repair blow-ins, but I always used a mask- also did a lot of engine parts cleaning with solvents- never had a problem, and was usually very resistant and tolerant of the stuff- did 2 complete paint jobs using acrylic enamel, one used a hardener- another time lacquered my car with 10 coats of single stage- another time enameled it with Rustoleum- no problems with charcoal masks, that was back in the 1990's

now I can't help thinking if I stayed with the "old technology" single state lacquer or enamel, I'd be just fine

the problem with urethanes is they are hyped by advertising so much, but not much is said about how deadly they are- this paint came right to my house mail order, imagine some 16 year old kid with a '72 Nova spraying this shit in his dad's garage with a dust mask, he'd be dead

there's a big misconception here about these paints, the label on the can says used supplied air, but the MSDS sheet says charcoal mask is allowed for one hour with ventilation, being I was outside I thought, no problem- I followed 3M's recommendations to the "T"- but still got bit by the iso's- another problem is, they didn't give me the MSDS sheet with the paint, I had to call them to fax it to me, after I had the bad incident- what's up with that ? what good is info after your already hurt- these companies need to get their act together- it's like selling a loaded gun to a 5 year old, who thinks it's only a cap gun

I did a good amount of research, and IMO the urethane just isnt' worth messing with, it has a long history of hurting people, here's what I found- the 2 main catalysts for urethane are TDI and HDI, both are deadly- one was removed from market before, but corp. pressure keeps this information stifled- anyone out there considering home paint jobs, don't use urethane, I would not even ask anyone to paint with this stuff without a professional booth and suit/supplied air. Home paint jobs should be Rustoleum, Zero Rust, or synthetic/acrylic enamel, or straight lacquer in the driveway. The painting industry got carried away with "paint holdout" and resistance to acid rain, etc.- what good is it, if the paint becomes like uranium to use.

The catalysts have a lot of bad chemicals in them like sulfuric acid, chlorine, phosgene (gas used in WWI warfare to kill in trenches), nitric acid, benzene- but they don't list that on the label, they just call it by it's generic name "TDI" or "HDI"- after I read what was in that catalyst, I realized that urethane is actually "acid cured"- it's like mixing ammonia and bleach with enamel paint, then spraying it through a spray gun while it's still reacting with the paint- and becomes hard on the car- the big paint co's like Dupont, etc. should pull this shit off the market already, if I had painted that car inside, I'd be dead

Conceptual Issues in Health Policy and Occupational/Environmental
> > Health
> > Professor Dr. David Egilman
>
> > Introduction to the Isocyanate Documents
>
> > Isocyanates are used in the manufacturing of foams and some
> > specialty paints. They are also used for hard plastic. All of the
> > plastic parts of cars are made from isocyanates except for the thin
> > plastic coverings of the seats the door handles, which are made from
> > polyvinyl chloride. Plastic bumpers, plastic steering wheels,
> > plastic armrests, and the foam in the seats are all made from
> > isocyanates. In addition, cars and boats and large industrial
> > structures frequently use isocyanate paints.
>
> > Isocyanates become a plastic when reacted with a catalyst and
> > alcohol. They are also used as intermediates in some chemical
> > processes. The largest chemical exposure disaster was due to
> > exposure to isocyanates at Bhopal, India in 1984. Between two and
> > ten thousand people were killed as the result of the release of
> > isocyanate gas.
>
> > Health effects from spraying isocyanate paints and using it in the
> > construction of foam were first noted and published in the medical
> > literature in 1951. In 1953, one type of isocyanate, HDI, was
> > removed from the market in some western European countries, due to
> > deaths that occurred amongst users of the material. Isocyanates are
> > quite dangerous when sprayed into the air and then inhaled into the
> > lungs. Once they harden into a plastic or foam, there is very little
> > hazard. (There is occasionally off-gassing from foam cells in
> > automobile seats and other seats and this may cause some individuals
> > who are “sensitive” to the material to have respiratory problems).
>
> > The most common health effect from isocyanates is the induction of
> > asthma. The asthma induced may become permanent and progressive.
> > Some people may die from the progressive development of increasingly
> > more severe asthma and chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, even
> > after a single exposure. Isocyanates may also cause death shortly
> > after exposure.
>
> > All of these health effects were well known to the companies that
> > make isocyanate paints or that started to make isocyanate paints in
> > the United States in the late 1960's and 70's. Beginning in the
> > early 70's, deaths among users of these paints led the National
> > Paint and Coating Manufacturers Association (NPCA) to hold a series
> > of meetings amongst major paint manufacturers. The main purpose of
> > these meetings was the concern by some paint manufacturers that
> > other paint manufacturers might label their products as requiring
> > supplied-air respirators for use. The companies essentially
> > conspired together, probably in violation of anti-trust laws, to see
> > to it that no one labeled their product more accurately than anyone
> > else. They were concerned about liability problems and not health
> > problems. They felt that if any single paint manufacturer
> > acknowledged the health effects of paints, it would have an adverse
> > impact on other manufacturers. The proper labeling of the paints
> > would have required the use of supplied-air respirators (not
> > generally available in most auto body shops) and would have reduced
> > sales. DuPont, in one memo, stated that sales would have dropped by
> > 80% had they properly labeled their products.
>
> > Despite the resistance to proper labeling, many industrial
> > hygienists at participating companies suggested stronger labels. A
> > series of memos back and forth between the lawyers running the
> > labeling department and the industrial hygiene safety people at
> > DuPont is quite illustrative of the conflict between the
> > safety-oriented hygienists and the profit-oriented and
> > liability-concerned lawyers. The lawyers, unfortunately, won,
> > supplied air respirators were not recommended and workers got sick.
> > Some died.
>
> > As predicted in the early 1970's, many workers did get sick and some
> > eventually sued the offending companies. In order to try to defend
> > law suits, DuPont engaged in some experiments in the mid 1980's to
> > try to show that normal cartridge respirators could be used
> > effectively against isocyanates. They conducted a series of nine or
> > ten experiments with different concentrations of external exposure
> > to isocyanates. All of these trials revealed that the cartridge
> > respirators failed to protect the user from exposure. Nonetheless,
> > by rigging the conditions of the studies, they were able to create
> > one experiment where most, but not all of the respirators were
> > effective against the use of isocyanates. They published this single
> > trial in the American Industrial Hygiene Association Journal in
> > 1985, as evidence that cartridge respirators could be used to
> > protect against the known adverse health effects of their paint.
> > They did not report any of the other trials and they intentionally
> > altered the result that showed that, even in this trial, the
> > cartridge respirators didn't work. The specimen that found an excess
> > exposure to the user in the trial was labeled “contaminated” and not
> > reproduced in the published paper. In fact, the lab notes do not
> > indicate that it was contaminated at all.
>
> > What can be found here are a series of memos back and forth between
> > DuPont, their industrial hygienists and their lawyers, as well as
> > some excerpts from Mobay and NPCA memos. To view these memos, click
> > here. Also located in this archive are an article on DuPont's
> > corruption of medical literature regarding the ability of cartridge
> > respirators to prevent damage from isocyanate exposure. To read this
> > article, click here. To view DuPont's official response, click here.
>
>
> > Relevant Isocyanate literature
>
> > LABEL FAILURE TO WARN HISTORICAL REPORTS
> > WARNINGS TYPES OF RESPIRATORY EFFECTS
> > MEDICAL MONITORING FREQUENCY EVIDENCE OF PERMANENT ASTHMA
> > KEY HYGIENE PRINCIPALS EVIDENCE OF CHRONIC BRONCHITIS
> > DEATH COMPARATIVE EFFECTS OF DIFFERENT
> > ISOCYANATES
> > THE HISTORY OF A COVER-UP
> > COMPARATIVE EFFECTS - ASTHMA
> > PERMANENT ASTHMA
> > HDI TOXICITY
> > POTENCY
> > HDI Versus TDI Chronic
> > SUPPLIED AIR REQUIRED Bronchitis & Asthma

 

I know guys that have the same thing to Latex, took a bit but now they can't get near it at all.... Bummer, sorry to hear about it. But really some of the old paints are just as dangerous. Just a bit different. Take care of yourself.

 

I remember Imron from the 70's---I used to paint contruction machinery with it for my father.Nasty stuff. Ended up with a cough that lasted 9 months from one job. Painted all my own cars and cycles,thought acrylic enamel was safe in the 80's. Spent 20 years degreasing starters and alternators by hand with degreasers. I now have cirrossis of the liver now and I know these things caused it as I never hardly drank. Be careful .

 

Some people get "sensitized" to certain chemicals in the paint and every exposure just makes them worse. I've heard some guys get so screwed up they can't even go near a car that was painted several days ago.

Could you smell anything through your respirator? Sounds almost like it was leaking badly or something. If a good respirator fits tight, I can't even smell the paint at all. There are little flapper valves that serve as one way valves for exhaling, and I wonder if yours was jammed part way open or something, or if your mask was leaking badly around your face or through a beard or something.

Hope you get better soon. It sounds like you're doing the right thing by staying away from paint though.

Thanks for the post. It's a good warning to the rest of us that think we're invincible to that kind of stuff.

 

thanks all for the replies- the mask was brand new, so were the filters, no it didn't leak- here's the thing, the MSDS sheet says, maximum one hour on filters with that paint- but Eastwood didnt' send me the MSDS sheets until afterwards, then it was too late

companies like Eastwood, 3M, and Dupont all know, if they listed ALL the safety info on the labels, who would use the paint ? No one. 3M also is being a little dishonest, they stated their masks would stop the ISO's and it didn't- only partially stopped them.

I didn't smell the paint at all, the mask was a tight fit. And to boot, I was outside in the open air. For it to get to me outside in open air, that's very toxic shit. Yes, I went down there 4 days later, and just being around that car smelling the little bit of fumes coming off it, bothered me. A new paint job will outgas for a week. Now it finally doesn't smell.

what's in the catalysts is the best kept secret in the auto hobby for some reason, here is what is in them, you will find the long iso name on the can, but not the "makings"- doing a net search reveals the two commonly used isocyanate paint catalysts are:

toluene diisocyanate, (TDI) made from chlorine, toluene, phosgene, sulfuric acid, and nitric acid, all hazardous volatile organic compounds (VOCs)

methylene diphenyl diisocyanate (MDI), made from formaldehyde, sulfuric acid, nitric acid, phosegene, and benzene.

chlorine- the same stuff as laundry bleach. Formaldehyde- i.e. bug spray. benzene- i.e. component of gasoline and fuel oil, my buddies' dad died frm benzene poisoning, he had a fuel oil/furnace business. sulfuric acid- the same stuff that eats the clear off your car, from acid rain- and comes out of smoke stacks burning coal

phosgene, is really bad shit too, but so is formadehyde ! this urethane paint is really a stew of noxious chemicals reacting like bleach mixed with ammonia in your spray gun, and on your car- the proper industry practice for phosgene, is put monitors on the workers, to measure levels- no paint shop does that:

http://www.inchem.org/documents/hsg/hsg/hsg106.htm

quote on phosgene:

"Symptomatic therapy may become necessary, and patients should be
followed and surveyed until pulmonary function has normalized and the
patient fully recovered. Depending upon the exposure concentration
and time, full recovery can take several months.

4.1.2 Health surveillance advice

Workers having the potential for exposure to phosgene should be
supplied with personal monitors. Workplace controls should be
initiated to lower the levels of phosgene to levels not detectable by
paper strip monitors (about 0.4 to 0.5 mg/m3). Preferably,
monitoring devices must sound an alarm or otherwise warn workers when
a concentration of 0.8 mg/m3 is reached.

Preplacement and periodic medical examinations should be given to
all workers with the potential to be exposed to phosgene. These
should include chest radiographs and pulmonary function tests."

why the hell do they put this shit in paint and sell it to us, in the first place ?

 

I was a body man for 6 yrs. (about 15yrs ago) In that short time I knew two guys who were exposed bad, (Imron got one of them). They can't be around the stuff at all now. Thanks for the thread, it's good to make people careful.

FYI: fresh air systems can be bad....when your buddies figure out they can fart into the air intake port....

 

Hope your feeling better.
The stories of what happened to friends and co workers are numerous in the auto and equipment painting business. Many of us in the business have taken the time to do our "right to know" safety training, attended paint training seminars put on by the paint mfgs and still we continue to see if the limit can be pushed. It sad that we have to hear of stories like this to get us to think about what we doing to ourselves or our employees. What I find ironic about some statements in this thread are " We didnt get warned. They just sold it to us and we assumed it was safe to use. " I was on the legislative comittee of the Illinois Garage Owners Association in the late 80's. When the shop owners realized the issues with the introduction of these paints into the repair shops ,they tried to get safe guards entered into law that would minimize this type of situation. The auto hobbists and those moonlighting at home protested vigorously and the legislation was defeated. There was another issue regarding this with the farmers and their painting of their equipment but my memory is a little foggy on exactly what it was. Several years later the purchase of paint was tied to having proper EPA waste generator identification numbers but some states allow distributors sell to the hobby and at home market through a loop hole in the law that allows the average person to paint one car a year. Sadly they dont have to tell anyone the hazards as part of the sale transaction.
Over the next couple of years as waterbourne paint makes its way into the market we will embark on a new learning curve again. Hopefully this product has been made safer for everyones best interest.

 

I remember Imron back in the day(80s) as the Ultimate Paint but that it'd kill you dead if you breathed it.

quote from scrounger"

":quote on phosgene:

"Symptomatic therapy may become necessary, and patients should be
followed and surveyed until pulmonary function has normalized and the
patient fully recovered. Depending upon the exposure concentration
and time, full recovery can take several months."

isn't Phosgene a poison gas used in WWI?

Must be some nasty stuff

I hope this thread encourages some younger guys to use protective equipment, as it *can* really happen to you. I know I hardly ever did, certainly not often enough!

EDIT: I forgot what I meant to write! Scrounger I hope you feel better soon, and thanks for posting this! I'm certain it'll help others.

 

The irony of all this is that the isocyanate paints were pushed because they used less VOCs (volatile organic solvents), and so the geniuses in the government outlawed the older paints which were less harmful overall, and replaced them with this stuff that'll kill you. I think I'd rather get a whiff of paint thinner than a whiff of isocyanate. I bet more people have died or gotten sick from breathing isocyanates in the new paints than would have ever died from breathing the little bit of VOCs that would have been in the air if they hadn't made the old types of paints illegal. That's pretty similar to when they put MTBE into the fuel without thinking about how it would wind up killing rivers and lakes. That's what happens when they create an un-elected government bureaucracy that's accountable to no one.

 

toluene diisocyanate, (TDI) made from chlorine, toluene, phosgene, sulfuric acid, and nitric acid, all hazardous volatile organic compounds (VOCs)

methylene diphenyl diisocyanate (MDI), made from formaldehyde, sulfuric acid, nitric acid, phosegene, and benzene.


PHOSEGENE. This is the real criminal here. Just like you said, this is WW1 chemical warfare. I wonder how they liquify it to get it into the paint?
I had a really bad experience with it years ago. It's manufactured by introducing freon into a flame environment. When you leak check an A/C with the torch sniffer, you make a little bit of it.
I had a condensor that was leaking freon fast into the engine air intake. The result was phosegene, LOTS of it. It was an amazing experiance. Absolutly intolerable.

 

you are done painting, leave that to somebody else.

My brother had basically the same reactions as you describe. Dr told him his body wouldn't take anymore. He didn't listen, kept on painting.
Three years late he died of copd.

 

Really glad to hear your OK. Thats scary shit.

When I first started spraying, I was just a dumb kid that thought nothing would ever happen to him. (I'm still a dumb kid, but that a diff story for a diff day) I sprayed without a mask all the time, no big deal. I finally wised up and won't even mix w/o my mask on.

Stories like this make my happy that I'm not as dumb as I once was. Thankfully I've never had a reaction to any product I've used.

 

I doubt that there is actual phosgene in the paint. I think they meant that they use those chemicals in a chemical reaction to form a new compound of that name. Like you could mix sodium and chlorine to make table salt, but it doesn't mean that table salt will expose you to deadly chlorine gas.

The hazards of toluene diisocyanate are what matters, not the hazards of the components used to make it. It's bad bad stuff though anyway.

Get an MSDS (material safety data sheet) on that chemical and it'll tell you all kinds of horrible things about it. A good measure of how poisonous something is is the LDL50 for rats or rabbits. That's the amount that would need to be injested or breathed in to kill 50% of the rats or rabbits that they tested. Really toxic chemicals might have an LDL50 of only parts per million, some even parts per billion.

The bad thing with some of those chemicals is that some people might be 100 times more sensitive to them than others.

 

Paint threads have been numerous on the HAMB. There has always been people that said " just use a mask, you'll be ok". I hope the moderators will make this a sticky and everyone will read it. There is a reason why we own forced air respirators. Depending on how your body is, that may not be enough. Please, everyone, pay attention.

 

I'm a Certified Chemical Hygiene Officer.....let me tell you all this one more time.

THERE ARE NO "SAFE" PAINTS OR SOLVENTS, PERIOD.

This condition is called "Multiple Chemical Sensitivity" and it will screw with you for the rest of your life. That is why you'll see folks in larger production shops (if they're smart) and in manufacturing areas (because they have too) wearing full suits and supplied air systems. Its not the 'one time' you used this or that chemcial that gets you but its exposure to various chemical irritants over time that eventually catches up with you. Its not just painters either. Shop rats that are spraying brake clean, carb cleaner and washing parts in solvent tanks are also at significant risk of health problems. Liver and kidney problems, nerve damage, brain damage and respiratory illness are the more common problems with painters and wrenches alike.

Old technology (i.e. lacquer, enamels, etc) was and is not even considered remotely safe. These sentitivity and respiratory problems still occurred over time with exposure to paints and solvents. Damage to your internal organs occurs EVERY time your exposed.

I seen a video where they took a breathalizer (OK, it was a gas chromatagraph) and had a person breathing into the tube feeding the instrument. They then placed his hand in mild mineral spirits (the "safe" stuff from Home Depot/Lowes, etc....the weak shit that doesn't do hardly anything) and within a minute the GC was picking up traces of the solvent/solvent by-products in his breath. Tell me now....how many of you have been cleaning car parts or spray guns could smell/taste the solvents/chemicals after you were done working with them. I have. This stuff gets into your body within seconds of coming into contact with it and will stay there until metabolized or 'flushed' out through respiration or perspiration. The key here is to minimize ANY and ALL exposures to chemicals at ALL times to avoid health related issues down the road. Its sounds like a panzy-ass thing to suit up or wear a mask at the parts washer but its something we all need to think about. I'm no saint either...and I'm sometimes more impatient than smart as I too will shoot the occasional panel/parts (non-iso materials) with a charcoal mask or dive into the solvent tank to grab parts out with my bare hands.

The thing to remember is that we're building these cars to enjoy them...wether its the build that turns you on or the ride after the fact, in any case, you still have to be healthy and alive to enjoy the fruits of your labor.

-Bigchief.

 

As many have already said, now that its started, this is a problem for life. I had a similar experience a few years ago with some poly fiberglass resin. I've used less than a liter of the stuff in my whole life, but it made me dizzy, hands swollen, eyes swollen, short of breath, etc. Bad news. Last year a friend bought a glass bodied A roadster. It was 5 years old, but when I opened the trunk, BAM there were all the symptoms again. No fiberglass for me, ever.
Used VHT heat proof paint once and lost all sensation in my face for about an hour, and felt strange for a week. With a mask.
A friend of my father's 2paked a car in a closed garage in the early 80s without a mask. He very nearly died from it. Pissed blood for 2 weeks. And to this day can't go near the stuff.
I work for a gas mask manufacturer, and see people doing the wrong thing with their PPE gear all the bloody time. Charcoal filters don't last long at all. Think ~40 minutes in a heavily contaminated area, like down wind of a spray gun. In my experience for the mask to be sealed against your face, it'll be quite uncomfortable. And much as I hate to say it, some masks don't work straight out of the box.

To anyone about to use a gas mask. Put your hands over the filters and breath in. Check that there are no leaks!

Like rusty bolts said, the component chemicals don't matter so much as the whole. But phosgene comes from many sources. Don't smoke while using paint stripper! Hitler got gassed ( mustard - similar to phosgene ) in WW1, and because of it never used gas in combat during WW2 - that's how fucked up this stuff is.

Hope you get well soon dude.

 

I must be dumb! I didnt know paint could mess you up so bad! im glad I saw this
thread, ill pay closer attention to the chemicals I mess with! ignorance can kill us!!!