Resurrecting a Vintage Fiat Topolino drag car built in 1964

[INLAW MODEL A]

I Saw It And Thought It Was Way Cool. A Friend Of Mine Had It About 2 Miles From Me. It Was Last Raced In Union Grove Wisconsin In 1972 A/A Class. It Was Also Raced In Northern Illinois. It Had A 283 Bored To A 301 With A Three Speed. The Chassis Was Built Joe Schubeck. The Guy That Raced It Was From Berlin, WI. I Am Still Trying To Get Some History And Time Slips Etc. I Would Really Like To Go Do Some Nostalgic Racing With It. It was the Indoor Show Car Association show circuit from 1972-74.























I spoke with Mike Gish that raced the car from 1968-1974 and he said the car was built by R&B in Kenosha. It was raced mainly at Great Lakes Raceway aka Union Grove. In 1973 the car was in a indoor show car circuit. It was in New York, Cleveland, Dubuque, and others. The car took third place overall that year for best comp car. I also have a video with over an hour of vintage union grove racing showing this car race along with many others. It is really neat! I will try to post a link to you tube.

















Here are some progress pictures. I found the ansen bellhousing along with a magneto. The master cylinder is from a Triumph Spitfire I discovered. I am ready to reassemble the rear axle. The framed cleaned up nice with a little soap and water. Once I make some front mounts I can remove the engine, paint it, and put it back in for good.










I have been scrounging parts for a while now and I have just tonight dropped an engine into the Fiat. I was pretty stoked and thought I would post some pictures. I called Mike that raced the car in 1972 and I am sending him pictures. It is the first time there has been an engine in the car since 1974. I have located the Hilborn unit from the car. I think the hardest part to find was the 1962 Chevy 3 speed. It is very short and was necessary to use to drive shaft from the car. I plan on installing the body this weekend. I can't wait to fire it up!!!!!!!!

[Royalshifter]

I envy you....that is beautiful.

[1939fiat]

thanks for the update..keep going !!!

Rick

[swade41]

Nice ! Good to see you trying to keep it true to it's origins

[Speedwagen]

Good to see the progress,keep up the good work!
I LOVE FIATS

[HemiRambler]

AWESOME!! I love it!

[Falcon Gasser]

I really like that. i wish i had those wheels for my Bantam Altered. I can not wait to see more.

Jon

[WhoDoYouFink]

Plllllllllease post body picks when you get them. I loves me some fiat drag cars. The wife says no, but i am keeping the hope alive.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by WhoDoYouFink

Plllllllllease post body picks when you get them. I loves me some fiat drag cars. The wife says no, but i am keeping the hope alive.

[Littleman]

Great video...thanks for posting....now go buy that injection unit!!!...Have fun..Littleman

[WhoDoYouFink]

I remember seeing that first thread now. You do have a nice piece of history there. Good luck with it!

[BAD ROD]

Very nice! That is going to be one crazy ride!

Mike

[SteadyT]

Holy Crap that thing is wicked. I will be eyeballing this thread.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Ok, here is a better copy of the video. This is original 8mm film of my car racing at Great Lakes Raceway in Union Grove WI from 1968-1972 or so. It was yellow when they bought it.

[krooser]

Hobo sez that thing was a real monster to drive....he said their regular driver was a little crazy and he's the only one who never noticed...

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by Littleman

Great video...thanks for posting....now go buy that injection unit!!!...Have fun..Littleman

I just got the original injection unit this morning. I will post pictures later today. It is a Hilborn unit with 12" staggered stacks. Very neat looking unit.

[Littleman]

Originally Posted by INLAW MODEL A

I just got the original injection unit this morning. I will post pictures later today. It is a Hilborn unit with 12" staggered stacks. Very neat looking unit.

Kool, even if you do not use it.....its with the car!!!.........Littleman

[INLAW MODEL A]

Here are some more pictures. I got the injection unit from the guy that "found" the car. He was looking for a hilborn unit and from word of mouth heard about one in a shop about 30 miles away. When they went to check it out, they discovered that the hilborn unit came with a car. He bought it and kept the hilborn and friend bought the car. I had to trade another hilborn set-up to get this one. The stacks are 12" on this one, and he wanted 6" so it worked out good. I still need a shut-off valve and a filter along with a relief for the pump in order to run it.

[KING CHASSIS]

Really cool!!

[INLAW MODEL A]

It lives!!!!
I had problems with the magneto, and trying to find some of the fuel system parts, but today I got to start the car. It has been dormant for 35 years. Now I need to build gas pedal linkage. I can't wait to run it!

[BAD ROD]

Absolutely great! I want to see that thing do a wheel stand.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Here are some more pictures from Saturday. I hope to get some more info on the car from Mike that raced it. Here is some of the history I have now.
The car was previously owned by Jerry Adams from Kenosha. The tunnel for the parachute was made by Roger Jackson who also was from Kenosha. His shop was in the back yard and he was nicknamed the Mole, and the shop was the mole cave. Mike Gish bought the car from Power Automotive in Kenosha in 1968. It was raced in Comp A/Altered class @ Great Lakes Raceway in Union Grove, WI. It was raced the full year in 1972. Dave Straw also drove the car. The car was painted in 1970 or 1971. It was in the ISCA show circuit in 1972 and won 3rd place overall for best comp car. Magnum Racing Engines was speed shop out of Milwaukee,WI owned by Jim Luker. It later became Magnum Diesel Machining. The car ran mid 9 seconds. The engine was a sbc 301 with aluminum rods and domed pistons & camel hump heads. The rear is a 57-63 chevy with 4.56 gears. The trans is a 1960 3 speed. The show motor had chrome headers, and it was a broom stick motor. (no internals, the broomstick kept the balancer from falling off. At the Madison show, people claimed the car did not run and it was started and drove out of the show and blued the chrome headers. It was the only tim the chrome headers were run. The race headers were black.
The car was disassembled and never put back together until now.


Mike Gish had the car all this time. It was a roller though. Mike has cancer, and that is why he sold it I think. I have reassembled the car and located many of the original parts like the Hilborn unit. The car was in a garage in Coloma WI. I just got it running today. I have original footage from 1968 on dvd. I want to go back to Union Grove with it on labor day for the Time machine nationals.

[30roadster]

That is just Awsome! great thread!

[Kiwi Kev]

Fantastic time machine! It's great that you've kept it as it was. Drag cars from the 60's had so much personality. Thank's for keeping us updated.

[INLAW MODEL A]

I just wanted to see if this works. I just uploaded pics to photobucket.

[INLAW MODEL A]

I finally had a chance to build the throttle linkage. It is all 1/4" rods with spherical rod ends. There are 4 bell cranks so there is a lot going on when you press down the gas pedal. I took it out for a short drive tonight. I wish I had a parking lot close by. I don't think the cops would like me on the road. Here is a video of it.

[hog mtn dave]

I love the car and the commentary on the video. You're gonna have to clean that up. Ha Ha.

[decker]

Your dad was here at the shop this morning... he said that it's
REALLY LOUD!!!!!

I really have to get over there to see it in person one of these days. Looks good man!

[Rich Venza]

Just came on the video and finally noticed the doors hinges have been reversed. All Topolinos has suicide doors, but in a drag car that can get exciting and expensive. Is the grill shell steel or fiberglass?

[1939fiat]

Hi Rich;
Good to see you again..
I have a couple Topolino bodies..One on a car ,one "spare"..
Have bought and sold a few over the years..
"Fix It Again Tony"..

Gotta run.
1939fiat
(Rick)

[INLAW MODEL A]

7"chop got me fired up today, he had this picture of my Fiat at the Speed and Custom show in 1972, not sure where yet. Also, I met the guy that raced the car and his right had man. There was a car show in Hancock, WI back in late June that Hobo put on, so we went with the car. It was a suprise when we showed up. Hobo called Mike that raced the car and he came over to check it out. Mike is on the right in the picture and Hobo is on the left. A bunch of people were thanking me for saving the car and putting it back together. It made my wife and I feel pretty darn good.

[LZ]

In law:

That is a great car and it looks like it fell into good hands.
I just noticed that it has a 3 speed in it .
Thats got to be a handful trying to steer with a Butterfly wheel with one hand..
Will it Tech?
Are you going to run it?

I am doing a Fiat also but its to embarrassing to post pics of it yet. Plus its a more modern Fiat not a Correct one like yours.

On a side note when I was looking at youtube with your video. Saw this on the sidebar.. Very interesting and another great Fiat Altered..wonder who bought it??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxiGA_AFcPA

Good luck and be safe

[krooser]

Originally Posted by INLAW MODEL A

7"chop got me fired up today, he had this picture of my Fiat at the Speed and Custom show in 1972, not sure where yet. Also, I met the guy that raced the car and his right had man. There was a car show in Hancock, WI back in late June that Hobo put on, so we went with the car. It was a suprise when we showed up. Hobo called Mike that raced the car and he came over to check it out. Mike is on the right in the picture and Hobo is on the left. A bunch of people were thanking me for saving the car and putting it back together. It made my wife and I feel pretty darn good.

Mike Gish isn't doing too well with his health so he was pretty stoked to see his old car running again. I don't think anything could have been a better tribute to him and his crew than getting this car back together.

I kinda wish I could have gotten there a little earlier with my F100 so I could get a picture of everybody together..

[dwrfab]

Guys around Union Grove Raceway:
In 1965 My brother and I sold a Fiat altered coupe to a man that was going to run it at Union Grove. We advertised it in 1965 Hot Rod mag.
The body was cut out at the top like one that had a sliding roof. It was painted black outside and white inside.The frame was 32 Ford rails bobbed at the wheel wells and had a tube roll bar system welded on to the 32 frame. The rear end was mounted solid to the rear braces of the roll bar and had 1/4" X 3" ridged torque arms. The trans was a chevy three speed using 2nd. and high with an Anson cast steel scattershield. Almost all parts thet would come off were cad plated . It had a Ross center steering box with a hand formed bowtye made of 1/4" aluminum. The front end was a chromed 33 plymouth axle with Ford spindles, spring and spring hangers adapted to it we had two small 5/8" radius rods to keep it straight.
I don't have any photos of it, but would like to know what happened to it.
dwrfab Don Ross 214-327-7312

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by dwrfab

Guys around Union Grove Raceway:
In 1965 My brother and I sold a Fiat altered coupe to a man that was going to run it at Union Grove. We advertised it in 1965 Hot Rod mag.
The body was cut out at the top like one that had a sliding roof. It was painted black outside and white inside.The frame was 32 Ford rails bobbed at the wheel wells and had a tube roll bar system welded on to the 32 frame. The rear end was mounted solid to the rear braces of the roll bar and had 1/4" X 3" ridged torque arms. The trans was a chevy three speed using 2nd. and high with an Anson cast steel scattershield. Almost all parts thet would come off were cad plated . It had a Ross center steering box with a hand formed bowtye made of 1/4" aluminum. The front end was a chromed 33 plymouth axle with Ford spindles, spring and spring hangers adapted to it we had two small 5/8" radius rods to keep it straight.
I don't have any photos of it, but would like to know what happened to it.
dwrfab Don Ross 214-327-7312

I AM NOT SURE WHAT YOUR ASKING, BUT I'LL TAKE IT. This is from February 1965 Hot Rod.

[dwrfab]

Originally Posted by INLAW MODEL A

I AM NOT SURE WHAT YOUR ASKING, BUT I'LL TAKE IT. This is from February 1965 Hot Rod.

INLAW MODEL A:
Thats it, Now where is the car? Thanks for the phone call Model A.
My brother and I owned and built it, Danny Borland drove it to a BF/Coupe class win and made it to semi finals at 1964 AHRA Nat's. At Green Vally Raceway Near Ft. Worth TX. I don't remember why we didn't run it again we just pulled the engine and My brother(Dick Ross) put the 327 into a roundy round car. I got the 65# flywheel and Put it into a 27 "T"modified roadster. This started a partnership with Tony Fite and Skip Hearder that lasted till 1967. We ran a AA/FD at the end called the Us Kids, running around the Dallas and Texas area.
What I am asking is where is it now. No realy I don't remember what we got for the car.
dwrfab Don Ross

[dwrfab]

Btt

[D.W.]

Oh HELL YES!

[decker]

best heard as loud as possible... but still way better in person...

[INLAW MODEL A]

Here we are running the car at Great Lakes Dragaway, Union Grove, WI

[zapp69]

Was awesome to see it run on Saturday, wanted to get back to talk with you but things on the bleaches got messy.

[INLAW MODEL A]

I went to see Mike Gish that raced the car, and he lent be his photo album to copy the pictures. Here they are. The first one is how he bought it as a used roller in 1968. It was painted the way it is now in the fall of 1971.

[Kiwi Kev]

Very cool stuff! Thanks for sharing.

[bigchuckstud]

what size wheels and tires are on the rear and how wide is the rear end wms to wms? what is the wheel base ?
I got a steel body a while back and just gathering specs and parts to buid a chassis.
thanks chuck

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by bigchuckstud

what size wheels and tires are on the rear and how wide is the rear end wms to wms? what is the wheel base ?
I got a steel body a while back and just gathering specs and parts to buid a chassis.
thanks chuck

I know it's been a while since you asked but better late than never. The tires on the rear 10.00-15 M/T Dragsters on 15 x 10 wheels. I will need to measure the axle width. The wheelbase is 96". Good luck with your build!

[INLAW MODEL A]

After I got the old photos of the car I thought it would be cool to duplicate the signs used next to the car on display at shows. Here are the two originals. They are not very good quality but it is all I had to work from. The first is from 1968 and the second is from 1971.


I talked to a friend that recommended a local sign painter. I e-mailed him the above originals and this is what I got back. I was very impressed! I am having copies made to protect the original. It was hand painted on corrugated aluminum.

[Dean Lowe]

Originally Posted by Royalshifter

I envy you....that is beautiful.

Times 2!!!

[pan-dragger]

oh yeah!

[AA/Fuel34fordpu]

Just one word WOW!

[INLAW MODEL A]

It is finally time to breath new life into the old 301 sbc that used to be in the Fiat. I got the two original engine blocks, one was bare and the other was a long block. I disassembled the long block and I will be reusing what I can. I was suprised to find Isky aluminum rods and TRW forged pistons!! The rods are nice wall hangers but the pistons I can reuse. I bought some h-beam rods already. The pistons were undersized so I had them knurled and just got them back today. Now I need to order some rings and bearings so I can get the rotating assembly balanced.

Here is a picture of the Isky rod. They are all pretty chewed up. I was told this style was one of the first designs and was later changed because of rod bolt failures due to all the load on one bolt.

[JC Sparks]

One of the first big cars I wrenched on was a Fiat. It had a blown alcohol early model in it, all iron as i remember. We where down in Columbus running pro comp, we put the rods out of it in the lights on the first qualifying attempt and had a big old fire. The guy that drove it only had one leg [ the left one was lost in a crash ] so standing at the starting line I figured it burnt off his left nut for sure. You know no heat shield!! HEHE!!
So, we went back and put the Donavon short block in it and couldn't qualify it. But it was something to remember. JC p.s. pro comp was bad ass. But,,,,,,,Fuel is badder.

[7"Chop]

I found another picture it is from the 1971 down town Milwaukee Show.

[blackout]

This thread is great.

[bigchuckstud]

thanks please pm me when you mesure the rear end

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by bigchuckstud

thanks please pm me when you mesure the rear end

The axle width, mounting surface to mounting surface, is 40 1/4" Thanks for reminding me.

[chris55]

That thing is awesome.

[oldmuleskinner]

I pulled these pics out for another thread and remembered this post. I think these may be you car in the early 60's at oswego

[jangleguy]

Wow! Thnks for posting this!!! Made my day... I love the HAMB!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by oldmuleskinner

I pulled these pics out for another thread and remembered this post. I think these may be you car in the early 60's at oswego

Neat pictures! I can't tell if it my car or not. The chute "box" was custom made so it may identify the car. Do you have more pictures? Thanks alot for posting them!!!!!!!!!

[bobwop]

did you see the GY blue line slicks for sale in the classifieds?

[krooser]

The Fiat will be at the Symco Shakedown this August... too cool!

[oldmuleskinner]

Unfortunatly those pics came of a guys site that no longer is up. On top of that they started off small. I do beliver you can see the chute box is the same if you look close. try looking up Norb Locke I think they came of his old site.

[fenderless]

Great history!
Very coool car!

Happy easter!
You don`t need a book when you have the HAMB!


..............................
Taildragger&fenderless

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by oldmuleskinner

Unfortunatly those pics came of a guys site that no longer is up. On top of that they started off small. I do beliver you can see the chute box is the same if you look close. try looking up Norb Locke I think they came of his old site.

I am sure it is not the same car. The car in the pictures has a drivers side door, and the front wheel arch stops before the body. Still very cool and I appreciate the help!!

[INLAW MODEL A]

I am currently in the process of putting the original race engine from the Fiat together to put back into the car. Along with the car I got the original race 301 engine that was complete but in poor shape. Mice moved into the engine block and it was full of mouse nest. The 1962 283 block was already bored out to the max so we just honed it. The 301 pistons were usable but I had to have them knurled to fit. The crank was turned .020 & .020 and I bought new eagle h-beam rods. The rotating assembly is fresh from being balanced. We had to add 3 pieces of mallory metal to the crank to make up for the heavy h-beam rods compared to the aluminum Iskederians that were in it. Big weight difference there I'll tell you. The next step is to assemble the short block and then do the heads. They are double hump 461's and we will run 2.02 and 1.6 valves. Tight fit in the 52 cc chambers. The cam will be a big solid lifter one. Not sure on the specs yet. We guess the horsepower at the crank will be 350-375.
I ran the car and my fast time was 11.4 @ 112 mph. The car weighs around 1400 pounds. When I use the e.t calculater that comes up with 180 horsepower which is close. I was running a junkyard 350 with 8.5:1 compression on 7 cylinders! When I use 350 horsepower, I calculate a 9.74 e.t. That would be a handfull!
Here are some current pictures taken in my buddy's dyno shop where the engine is now. Here is a link to his website. http://www.doneriteautomotive.com/

[bobwop]

when will you have it back together and ready for the strip?

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by bobwop

when will you have it back together and ready for the strip?

Hi Bob, I should, I finally got rid of some projects so I might have some Fiat time. I saw the bluestreaks, but I need 15". Eric (Falfasnightmare) says he has some with my name on them. M/T et drags. They will work for now.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Well slow but surely I have been working on the Fiat again. Today I made a water filler for the Hilborn manifold so I can pressurize the block and add an overflow for the track. Last week I buttoned up the short block for the 301 and now I need to do the heads. I recently tracked down the pieces to install the Sun tach. I needed a eb37-a mag transmitter and finally found one along with the tach bracket. I just reinstalled the rear axle and now I am going through the Airheart disc brake calipers. Oh and I finally found the correct shifter that was in the car. The problem I am having is that back in the 1980's some kids decided to steal a bunch of stuff from the car while Mike, the previous owner, had it instorage. The police got alot of it back, but not everything.

[bobwop]

looks good!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Well I finally got the original engine back together. It is the same 301 from 1968. I had to change the a few things that were problems but nothing major. I am running a 30/30 solid cam with .485" lift and 254 deg duration @ .050". The compression is around 12:1 or a bit less. We are running it on E85. I have a few more bugs to work out yet.

Here is a short video. The sound on the camera does not do it justice. See for yourself.

[bobwop]

fix it again, tony. LOVE the direction you have taken. Am I the only fan?

Will you have the Fiat at Back to the 50's?

[slayer]

Its nice to see that you have saved this cars history by not doing to many updates. You have a real time capsule there.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by bobwop

Will you have the Fiat at Back to the 50's?

No I am taking the model A. Maybe next time.

Oh by the way Bob, since I too am running E85, can I call the Topolino the corn fed mouse? And aren't elephants scared of mice?

[bobwop]

I thought the mouse pulled the thorn from the elephant's foot? See you at B250's

[fergenboysinc]

WOW! Very cool car and great story! I love those old Fiats.

[swade41]

Originally Posted by INLAW MODEL A

Well I finally got the original engine back together. It is the same 301 from 1968. I had to change the a few things that were problems but nothing major. I am running a 30/30 solid cam with .485" lift and 254 deg duration @ .050". The compression is around 12:1 or a bit less. We are running it on E85. I have a few more bugs to work out yet.

Here is a short video. The sound on the camera does not do it justice. See for yourself.

>

very nice !

[AHotRod]

Great job !

[tricky steve]

now that is bitchin' !!
also like the bantam altered with the pontiac engine.. that's different !!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Well I finally got the Fiat running again. I got the heads too hot during the last break in run and seized 3 exhaust valves in the guides. I reamed the guides to .343" and put in 4 new exhaust valves. I also put in a set of push rods and keepers. So here is my test run after getting it kind of tuned. It still needs some fine tuning but it runs.

[Kerry]

Awesome!

[INLAW MODEL A]

I stopped by Mike Gish today and dropped of some pictures for him. He said he had the aluminum slots off the Topo in the garage and I could have them if I could find them. Well needless to say that after about 6 laps I could only find one. He said the other is there and it will show up.
I did spy this though!

My wife said what is that? and your not bringing that home I hope!
Well I knew when I saw it that it was the tool tray for the Hilborn.

It is homemade, but still it belongs with the car. Anyone else would have tossed it. It is very cool and it is in the video I have. Mike said he was happy I was doing what I am doing with the car and he could see I was having fun with it.

[krooser]

See you at the Shakedown... can't wait to have you DRIVE the car in the show!

[jangleguy]

Congrats on getting it going! I love this thing...

[AA/Fuel34fordpu]

I love the car and what your doing with it.

[bobwop]

you found another gem!!! Congrats, Paul

[VA HAMB]

Wow! I don't know what else to say. Congrats on what you are doing with it!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Thanks for all the positive feedback. We are having a blast with it. I am pretty sure that Karma would not be happy with me if I did not preserve it, race it, and do what I am doing with it.

[INLAW MODEL A]

I finallly got to make a few runs on my buddy's dyno. 4 to be exact. I still need to add some fuel on the top end. I runs lean after 5500 rpm. I made about 290 horse at the tires with a 20% loss through the drive train and tires. It should be around 400 horse at the crank when we can rev it up all the way. Here it is:

[bobwop]

looks like fun, Paul. I didn't like the guy standing in front of the car...safety?
Did you get your slicks on?

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by bobwop

looks like fun, Paul. I didn't like the guy standing in front of the car...safety?
Did you get your slicks on?

Hey Bob, That guy is Ed, he is the owner. He knows what he is doing. He is careful and ties down the cars very well, but I do see your point. The slicks are on the car in the video. I got a fire suit and new harnesses the other day so I should be ready to run. Will you be @ Da'Grove on August 9th? I sent my dues to Bob at Midwest Gassers but have not heard back from him yet.

[bobwop]

I will be there with more than one car...weather and help permitting

[INLAW MODEL A]

Well I finally got back to working on the Topo again. I pulled apart the rear end and ordered axles from Moser, and spider gears from Nitro. Both stock olds axles are twisted and I blew the spider gears out in August. I will post pics Friday when I get the parts. I am also thinking about adding a battery so I don't have to push start the car all the time. It is a real hassle. I am hoping that Mike Gish finds the hamb and will post some info and stories about the car. I just spoke with his wife tonight and was going to tell him. I am keeping my fingers crossed on this!

This is what stock spider gears do eventually. I hope nothing else breaks on the car.

[bobwop]

better tighten that loose nut behind the wheel

[INLAW MODEL A]

Today the UPS lady stopped over with some parts. Moser axles and Nitro Gears spider gears. You can see the twist in the old axles and well you get the problem with the gears.
Now I need to assemble the rear axle.
I am also going to replace the starter with an era correct hi-torque one.

[bobwop]

how about the Ice Drags tomorrow. Best get thrashing!

Can't wait until it is done and you are ready the beat on it. Good luck with the repairs, Paul.

[Topolino Kid]

the new axels look very sweet!!! i'm running an olds rear..but it is loaded with old Henry's axels..been told they are really stout..but i don't intend on putting the ponies you are to em...maybe a few years down the road that might change...is yours the 3 ribbed center??also i have not seen an olds housing that has a rear center that looks like mine..i'll get pics up tomorrow......

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by Topolino Kid

the new axels look very sweet!!! i'm running an olds rear..but it is loaded with old Henry's axels..been told they are really stout..but i don't intend on putting the ponies you are to em...maybe a few years down the road that might change...is yours the 3 ribbed center??also i have not seen an olds housing that has a rear center that looks like mine..i'll get pics up tomorrow......

I have a 55-64 Chevy housing with Olds housing ends welded on. I guess it was a popular choice in the early 60's. I will post a picture for you.

[INLAW MODEL A]

I called Mike Gish today and talked with him for a while. I told him that I had the rear end apart on the car and that I was fixing a few things. I said that he drive the car when ever he is ready to and he laughed like I was kidding. I said I was serious and that he is welcome any time to drive it. I am hoping this works out! I was thinking about trying to make it happen at Symco this summer because it is close to his home.
I also spoke to Mike about writing down his experiences with the Fiat. He does not do much on the computer but his daughter does so I hope between the two of them they can post on here some of the history of the car. He told me today about the time they drove to Philedelphia to show the car and the truck had a bad wheel bearing half way there and when they got there, it took 10 hours to thaw the car out due to the ice from driving in winter with an open trailer. He also said they never really had major problems with the car. He broke an axle once and had valve spring issues with the motor but nothing serious.
I sure hope Mike looks up the Hamb and can add to this post!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Today I was able to mock up the rear end on the bench. The new axles are not bolt in and require a little custom machining on the lathe. I have to also make a bearing spacer to space the axle farther out of the housing. The wheel studs will not work because the axle flange is thicker so I got the closest wheel stud I could find and I will need to machine it in the lathe as shown. The silver one is the replacement. It is much easier to set the axles up this way than in the car. I figured it was going to be easier to put in new axles. Not bad though. I am close to being done now.

Here are some pictures of it on the bench:



The width axle flange to axle flange is 40.5"




Here you can see where the Olds housing ends were welded to the Chevy housing.




Note the Cragar mounting brackets for the Airheart 4 piston calipers.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Well tonight I managed to machine the wheel studs. The originals were too big for the axle holes plus the knurled shoulder was not long enough, plus they don't make this one anymore, so I found a close one and machined it to fit. They work great. Now I can do the final assembly.

Here are the old and new studs:

[bobwop]

you have talent!

[INLAW MODEL A]

So the moser axles I bought were made to the dimensions of my old axles and were "bolt in's" but I soon discovered that they base their axles off of oem 58-64 Olds and the critical measurements are from the outer face for brake drums. I need the critical measurement from the backside where the aluminum Cragar Brake hat bolts to. So when I test fitted the new axles, the disc brake rotors touched the caliper brackets. I needed to space the axles out .17" on each side so I got a piece of 2" od 6061 aluminum and made 2 spacers in the lathe to do that. It was a lot of messing around but it turned out fine. Now the rotors are centered in the calipers.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Today I managed to install the rear axle back into the Fiat. I also bolted in the starter that I had rebuilt. It is the original style starter that bolts to the bellhousing and it is a high torque. It looks better than the late model starter I had in it. I will post pictures later on.

[Chuckles Garage]

Threads like this are why I love the HAMB. Awesome.

[INLAW MODEL A]

I have just determined I have been ruined (or saved) by the Hamb. Tonight I found myself working on my vintage race car, drinking Pabst Blue Ribbon, and listening to the Hot Rod Hucksters. Gee wizz!!!!!!! 10 years ago ago I would have never seen it coming!

[29hotrod55kustom]

uuhhhhhhhh-mazing. love it. wish i had the wherewithall to build/own a drag car.. im green with envy!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by 29hotrod55kustom

uuhhhhhhhh-mazing. love it. wish i had the wherewithall to build/own a drag car.. im green with envy!

Thanks! I love it too! It is a pleasure to work on it.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Here is the new fuel shut off bracket I built. After watching the Hot Rod Reunion video where the fed could not shut down, I got to thinking the one I had was not very stout. I made this one from some scrap aluminum angle iron. I used my bandsaw to cut it out and then drilled some holes in it. I sanded it on the belt sander to give it some grain, and bolted it on.

[bobwop]

looking good

[INLAW MODEL A]

Tonight I made a sting of tennis balls for the injection stacks. I bought 1/8" nylon cord from the hardware store, and drilled a hole in the balls and used a wire to thread the rope through. I think they turned out pretty good. The people in the store probably didn't get me buying tennis balls in winter though.

[bobwop]

The people in the store probably didn't get me

I would guess that happens often

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by bobwop

The people in the store probably didn't get me

I would guess that happens often

So are you saying I am special?

[Topolino Kid]

the injection is such sweet ass eye candy....your balls look great, even if they look a bit green...one of these days i'll get over you way to check it out....very nice peice of history,,,,,,,,,wish i could find some of the background on mine

[Kan Kustom]

Fun Stuff!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Here is a shot of my freshly built starter, Bellhousing mount, hi-torque Delco. It looks way better than the one I had. Not as much power though so I hope it will start it.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by Topolino Kid

the injection is such sweet ass eye candy....your balls look great, even if they look a bit green...one of these days i'll get over you way to check it out....very nice peice of history,,,,,,,,,wish i could find some of the background on mine

I wish my balls were red instead of green. I will have to keep lookin'. Why don't you go to the Hunnert Car Heads Up May 8th? Otherwise you can come and visit anytime.

[Topolino Kid]

i'ld love to do that one on the 8th...even though i really don;t see me gtting mine done by then..or i guess i should say road-able...think i start looking for options...
but yeah, i'ld love to see mine setting along side of yours...that would be cool......

[INLAW MODEL A]

Check out Ol Skool Rodz issue #40. Page 24 has a small picture of the Fiat on it. It is an article about the Symco Shakedown!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Well today I got bad news: Mike Gish past away April 25th. Rest in peace Mike. Thanks for the memories and the help.
Mike is on the right.

[bobwop]

that is too bad. He would have been proud of the article in Gasser Wars.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by bobwop

that is too bad. He would have been proud of the article in Gasser Wars.

I spoke with Mike about 3 weeks ago and told him his car made the cover. So he at least took that with him. I was calling him today to tell him his copy of the magazine was on it's way when I got the bad news. He was 59.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Well I had some good luck today. I talked with Dave that drove the Fiat. He said he will post some history and stories about racing the car. I can't wait to hear more about it!m Yesterday I spoke to Mike's brother and I hope to get some info from him as well. Just when I thought I would hit a road block, we make a 180 turn.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Yesterday we went down to Da'Grove for the Hunnert Car Heads Up. We had a great time and met more cool people. I even took my Dad along. We really didn't even care that it was cold and rainy.
Here is some video and pictures of it:

[Norb]

I just happened to see this and thought I would let you know that the site is still up. I had to move it when AOL killed the Hometown sites. This will put you on the site; www.norbsplace.com it's over a year behind in putting up new pictures. Been busy with my new dragster "Grandpa's Toy" and just haven't had the time to update the site.
Norb Locke

[need louvers ?]

Hey INLAW MODEL A, What is the wheelbase on your car? I'm planning the chassis for my fiberglass trends body and I like the length of yours. Thanks Chip Quinn

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by need louvers ?

Hey INLAW MODEL A, What is the wheelbase on your car? I'm planning the chassis for my fiberglass trends body and I like the length of yours. Thanks Chip Quinn

Hi Chip, It is 96"

[Birdy]

Hello there,
Here are some pics of my 1500hp topolino.
Personal best time 1/4 mile 7.703 sec

Wilco

[Roothawg]

Bump, because this car is right.

[need louvers ?]

Bump for the same damn reason!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by need louvers ?

Bump for the same damn reason!

Originally Posted by Roothawg

Bump, because this car is right.

Thanks guys.

Here we are racing a Pontiac powered slingshot at the Meltdown Drags in Byron, Illinois. We made 3 runs and this was an 11.0 @120 mph:

[41PICUP]

Dorricott & Sheehan, Elmwood Auto Club, Fremont Drag Strip circa 1961

[INLAW MODEL A]

Today was a great day. Not only was it my b-day, but I went to visit a friend that gave me this picture that he got from a friend of his. The story goes that this guy was at a car show with a cool afx car, and this old timer gives him about 40 slides from 1965 at Great Lakes Dragaway. He has had them for a while and was showing my friend when he spots the Fiat. He gave it to him to give to me. I am very happy to get it. I hope to have the slide blown up to a larger print I can frame. This is about 3 years earlier than I have any info on the car. I think it was built in 1962, 3 years before this picture was taken.
It looks like it is being pushed by a 1965 Pontiac Catalina.
Here it is:

[INLAW MODEL A]

I just realized that the engine in the car is the 348 it was rumored to have run. I was told this by two people but could never prove it.

[povertyflats]

Far out---love this car and story

[BOWTIE BROWN]

its like being above ground every morning ......awesome .
they got one down in oklahoma that will be at mo-kan next year ....right guys.

[INLAW MODEL A]

I just got this today from Hilborn, It is the original sales order for my injection set-up still on my car!

[swade41]

That's cool that you keep getting peeks back into the history of your little mouse, no matter how many times I see it I still stare at it soaking in the details.

[INLAW MODEL A]

I did not know this existed until Cliffy sent me a text today! Thanks John for looking out for me. This is some awesome stuff! What a week so far!

[Cliffy]

Originally Posted by INLAW MODEL A

I did not know this existed until Cliffy sent me a text today! Thanks John for looking out for me. This is some awesome stuff! What a week so far!

It's not yours yet Paul. he he he. And Jon has the goggles and the fender cover!!

If you look at one of your old photos in this thread, you can see the driver wearing this helmet!

[poopeye]

Don't worry Cliffy......He'll get it.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by poopeye

Don't worry Cliffy......He'll get it.

Thanks Jon!
Do you see it in this picture?

[poopeye]

Cool. Now, get the fire suit!!!!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Here are the teasers that Jon sent me pictures of today. I can't wait to see this stuff!

[redhawk74]

That helmet is awesome.....

[Zoomer]

enjoyed browsing your entire blog.... here's a link to my topolino http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...=170422&page=5
it starts on page 5 where I bought the little hot rod and goes until page... I think today it is at 17...

All my posts are under "Zoomer"... there's a few other of my prjects up there too

I'm looking for some sort of a new grille filler panel for my topo... the original is not that bad but I really don't feel like building a mold to hammer into to fix it and since my radiator is in the rear I don't need anything really for air...

any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Zoomer

[BigRy]

That is wicked. I hope to see a video of it running soon!

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by BigRy

That is wicked. I hope to see a video of it running soon!

I posted this earlier in the thread,
11.0 @ 120mph I beat the slingshot at the end. My fastest run ever in the car.

[INLAW MODEL A]

On Friday I spoke to Larry Sikora of Sikora bros. He worked at Lakewood Chassis in the early 1960's and said he tig welded the chassis under my car. He worked for Joe Schubeck and later bought the chassis business in 1970. He went on to build some well known chassis. He said he has some old catalogs in the attic. I hope he can find them.
Does anyone have a Lakewood catalog that shows altered chassis?

[INLAW MODEL A]

A while ago I was trying to find Jerry Adams the builder of the Fiat. I found a guy that said his father-in-law was Jerry, but he did not drag race. Well it did not add up so I asked him to double check with his Father-in-law.

Fast forward 3-5 months.
Jerry Adams called me tonight. He is the original owner and builder of the Fiat. He built it in 1964. This is him in the picture below. I told him about the Hamb and I hope he will post on here all of his stories about the car and racing it. Man and I excited!

[bobwop]

great news, Paul. What a wonderful photo

[INLAW MODEL A]

^^^^^^^^^Thanks Bob

More news from this week.

There is a magazine in Finland called Bellissima. It is a Fiat restoration magazine. In the back there is a 3 page article on the Fiat opposite a restored 1939 Topolino that was the 2009 car of the year there. The only problem is the whole magazine is in Finnish and I can't read it.
I will try to post the magazine after I get permission.

[woodienut]

Rogers & Nielsen Fiat from 1970 Late model 440 ci. (.060 over 426) checkout the rollbar! LOL Pic's from the stands at Indy 1970.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by woodienut

Rogers & Nielsen Fiat from 1970 Late model 440 ci. (.060 over 426) checkout the rollbar! LOL Pic's from the stands at Indy 1970.

Boy that first picture looks like the same chassis!

[INLAW MODEL A]

I got this email today from Jerry:

I have to open some stored boxes to get to pix, will do soon as I have been busy helping out a friend. Here is a brief history of car. Bought chassis and body in 1964, started racing 1966 and 1967, sold car in late 1967, moved to Tulsa,Ok. to be part of top gas car which we raced, I was crew member member, all over the west southwest lower Midwest and east coast, ran Nationals in Englishtown,NJ in 1968. Spent lots of nights getting to meets so that we could make enough money to keep racing, sponsor money was not that great back then. I have enjoyed the info and talk,let’s keep it up. More later

[INLAW MODEL A]

I just spoke to Jerry Adams again. He said he built the car with a 409 not a 348. It had Algon Fuel injection. In 1967 he put in a Hilborn injected 427 bbc. For a trans he had a direct drive box. The steering shaft in the corvair box was drilled and pinned to lengthen it. He then had it annealed to make the hardness even after welding in a section.

I talked to the guy he sold the 427 to in 1967. It is still in Kenosha. It is in a 49 Ford sedan that is chopped. The car has never been finished. The Hilborn injection is on the shelf.

[INLAW MODEL A]

More info from Jerry from today:

Sold 409 and all parts to a racer in Texas, don’t remember his name,used a standard Chevy trans for both 409 and 427, only used high gear,fuel tank was a Moon tank,don’t know what happened to it, no parts left, always towed behind 65 Catalina on a trailer, trailer went with car,don’t remember what paper I placed ad in, have heard about Power Automotive but know nothing about them. After I sold the car, I did see it in a driveway on Springbrook Road in Kenosha once. Hope this helps. One side note, mounting for both engines was the same, that is why I used the same trans in both, driveline did not have to be changed, I made the driveshaft myself, worked at Famco Machine at the time.

[1939fiat]

I like the story on your Fiat..and the history you have gathered..
Always cool to see car with history get in the right hands ,and not altered from from their originality.
here's ours..

Rick

[INLAW MODEL A]

"always towed behind 65 Catalina on a trailer, trailer went with car"



Here is a little more info I got from Dale about the trailer:

When I met Mike he had a ford hauler for the car but Mike did have a trailer there. When Joe Benton got the econorail from Freddy, Mike let us use the trailer but I dont know if he got the trailer with the fiat or where it was from. I think Mike had a different hauler befor the Ford. Jeff should know more.


I asked Mike's brother and got this response:

Mike did have a trailer. That may be the trailer Jerry was referring to. I don't have any idea were it now is. Cheryl, Mikes wife or Bob (Hobo) may know where it went. However we use to use a Ford truck custom made flat bed that my dad built. My father use to haul his modified stock cars on. I do not have any idea where the Ford truck went

[INLAW MODEL A]

Today I am like a little kid Christmas morning, I just need to wait for Santa, I mean the mailman.

I got this email today from Jerry: send me your address as I have some pix ready to send to you

Another response in regards to the pictures:
found 10 of the fiat plus some of Perry Seitz and Ron Matus, Ron did all of the aluminum work. Axle came with car I think, don’t remember exactly.


I just spoke to Ron Matus. He made the aluminum interior in 1964. He said he has a picture of it from when he was 16 out on the back roads of kenosha when they were testing it.

[Ricks Garage]

Now you will need to get a 65 Catalina.....LOL

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by Ricks Garage

Now you will need to get a 65 Catalina.....LOL

LOL That is funny, I need a bigger garage!

[INLAW MODEL A]

So I talked to Jerry again tonight. he said he went to Cleveland to pick up the chassis from Lakewood Chassis. He thinks he got the complete front axle set-up with it, and a fabricated bell housing too. The Body was one piece and came from The Hot Rod Shop in Milwaukee Wi. It took forever to get he said. He bought alot of parts from Mick's Auto Parts in Racine because he gave him a great deal. The 427 had Mondello Heads, cam and the headers were off Tom Mondello's fuel altered.
He said he raced a car out of Chicago area alot call The Exterminator. It was an altered running B/A class with a SBC They had a lot of pictures which included the Fiat. Anyone know the car?

I was told that this Crosley altered would run against my Fiat in 1966-1967 and there were alot of pictures taken of the pair at Da'Grove. Anyone know the car or who would have owned it?

I found this but the email is no longer active:

I am restoring a 1950 Crosley B/Altered and am looking for any info, pictures, 8mm movies or any other info pertaining to the car. The car was raced from 1963-1968 and was called the "Exterminator." It was sponsored by Edgewater Autoparts and had the number 27 B/Altered behind the rear wheels on the side of the car. The car was raced primarily in the Midwest such as Great Lakes Dragaway, US 30, and Rockford Dragaway. Besides being raced on the UDRA circuit, it was also shown at the 1964-1967 car shows that took place at Chicago's McCormick Place. The car started out in 1963, blue in color and then was changed to black from 1964-1966. In 1967 the car was painted purple and renamed "Psycho." My Email address is meanstreets1@juno.com. Any info pertaining to the "Exterminator "or the "Psycho" would be greatly appreciated! Thank You.

[INLAW MODEL A]

I just got the pictures Jerry Adams sent me. He went to Walmart and made copies of his originals. Wait 'till you see these! I will scan them in tonight.

[INLAW MODEL A]

NEW INFO:
This was the first day that Jerry Adams ever raced the Fiat down the 1/4 mile. On this day, Jerry Adams raced the B/Gas Stone, Woods & Cook Willys

[INLAW MODEL A]

Here are the the pictures I got today in the mail. The pictures with the BBC have the headers off of the Modello & Masturba Fiat. Jerry Adams called him and got to be friends with Joe and bought them of the car.


Not sure on the guy on the left, Tom, Blank, Jerry Adams, 1966 w/409 engine


Kenosha county road test drive


Ron Matus and Ed




427 bbc


427 bbc


427 bbc


Bill Maxon being pushed at Da'Grove


Jerry Adams


Ron Matus in front of Perry Seits Anglia


Perry Seits in Cowboy Hat, Fred Zalewski by the Bell & Zalewski Anglia @ Da'Grove

[J&JHotrods]

SO fucking rad! Big fan of those topolinos. And what a cool history! Subscribed!

[fiat gasser]

The tall injection stacks look so tough on the Fiat. Thanks for sharing

[INLAW MODEL A]

new poster

[INLAW MODEL A]

[Yo Baby]

I like it.
I wish I was closer but thems the breaks.
I gotta keep up with this a I'm building a Toppo for a guy right now.

[Curt R]

Originally Posted by INLAW MODEL A

So I talked to Jerry again tonight. he said he went to Cleveland to pick up the chassis from Lakewood Chassis. He thinks he got the complete front axle set-up with it, and a fabricated bell housing too. The Body was one piece and came from The Hot Rod Shop in Milwaukee Wi. It took forever to get he said. He bought alot of parts from Mick's Auto Parts in Racine because he gave him a great deal. The 427 had Mondello Heads, cam and the headers were off Tom Mondello's fuel altered.
He said he raced a car out of Chicago area alot call The Exterminator. It was an altered running B/A class with a SBC They had a lot of pictures which included the Fiat. Anyone know the car?

I was told that this Crosley altered would run against my Fiat in 1966-1967 and there were alot of pictures taken of the pair at Da'Grove. Anyone know the car or who would have owned it?

I found this but the email is no longer active:

I am restoring a 1950 Crosley B/Altered and am looking for any info, pictures, 8mm movies or any other info pertaining to the car. The car was raced from 1963-1968 and was called the "Exterminator." It was sponsored by Edgewater Autoparts and had the number 27 B/Altered behind the rear wheels on the side of the car. The car was raced primarily in the Midwest such as Great Lakes Dragaway, US 30, and Rockford Dragaway. Besides being raced on the UDRA circuit, it was also shown at the 1964-1967 car shows that took place at Chicago's McCormick Place. The car started out in 1963, blue in color and then was changed to black from 1964-1966. In 1967 the car was painted purple and renamed "Psycho." My Email address is meanstreets1@juno.com. Any info pertaining to the "Exterminator "or the "Psycho" would be greatly appreciated! Thank You.

I saw your Fiat at Milwaukee World Of Wheels tonight, didn't find you.

I talked with someone, tonight, at the show, that has an old drag car called "Exterminator, I will look for you this weekend and we'll talk.

Curt R

[INLAW MODEL A]

We had a good time at Milwaukee World of Wheels. We met the guy that has the above mentioned Crosley. He said he has a stack of pictures so we will see.
Here is our plaque that we were given because one of the World of Wheels guys liked our stuff. We didn't "win" any awards because we did the pay the $35 to be judged.

[INLAW MODEL A]

[Likeumlow]

Not to highjack your tread but check this out! Found it in a junkyard today.

[Church Key]

Originally Posted by Likeumlow

Not to highjack your tread but check this out! Found it in a junkyard today.

I hope you bought it !!! It looks like a 49 Fiat or later,they made great looking race cars.

[INLAW MODEL A]

Originally Posted by Church Key

I hope you bought it !!! It looks like a 49 Fiat or later,they made great looking race cars.

I already asked him and he said the old man said the car is not for sale, not now or never.

[coolstuff]