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Old 02-28-2008, 12:14 PM   #21
McKee
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

Here ya go Ryan,...Miller fonts.
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Old 02-28-2008, 12:20 PM   #22
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

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Originally Posted by McKee View Post
Here ya go Ryan,...Miller fonts.
...and the early one from the Golden Submarine...
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Old 02-28-2008, 12:23 PM   #23
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

maybe you could get a hamb discount on this:

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=246348

T
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Old 02-28-2008, 12:35 PM   #24
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

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Originally Posted by paperdog View Post
WAY TO GO DAD..start a pedal car design yet ?
Loren Richards makes them.
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Old 02-28-2008, 12:54 PM   #25
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

Congrats, to both of you Ryan. That's a very cool and strong name. I am sure he'll carry the same passion for this as you do. As for those cars. That's the reason that I'm on this site. I have little knowledge in this area so every chance I can get to learn more is great.
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Old 02-28-2008, 01:15 PM   #26
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

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One of the books...I think the one by Grif Borgeson...calls out the Miller cars that went to Europe as the evolutionary nudge moving Bugatti from single to dual cam, I think...
A great circle of evolution, if I'm getting it right...Peugot pent-roof DOHC design to USA, about WWI, setting off a long period of copies and evolutions, then back to France as a highly evolved descendant, influencing Bugatti evolution. Is that connection accurate/reasonable?? Borgeson brought one of those Millers home to restoration and legal controversy.
There were two FWD Millers sent to Monza in September 1929 by Leon Duray - the so called 'Packard Cable Specials' and Jean Bugatti (Ettore's son) traded both of them for three Bugatti Type 43 chassis. Jean Bugatti shipped them to his father's factory in Molsheim for "analysis" - see signature below for an explanation of "analysis". One of them was subsequently brought back to the U.S by Griff Borgeson and now resides in the Smithsonian.
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Old 02-28-2008, 01:24 PM   #27
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

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Originally Posted by Bruce Lancaster View Post
One of the books...I think the one by Grif Borgeson...calls out the Miller cars that went to Europe as the evolutionary nudge moving Bugatti from single to dual cam, I think...
A great circle of evolution, if I'm getting it right...Peugot pent-roof DOHC design to USA, about WWI, setting off a long period of copies and evolutions, then back to France as a highly evolved descendant, influencing Bugatti evolution. Is that connection accurate/reasonable?? Borgeson brought one of those Millers home to restoration and legal controversy.
Absolutely correct! Leon duray took two Miller front drives to Europe to race. Ettore Bugatti was so impressed by the design that he traded Duray three Bugattis for the two Millers. The subsequent Bugatti DOHC designs such as te Type 57 borrowed heavily from the Miller design. Grif Borgeson found both of the Millers under tarps in the nearly abandoned Bugatti factory in the '50s and was able to acquire them and bring at least one back to the US. One of the cars went to the Smithsonian.

Kurt O.
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Old 02-28-2008, 01:24 PM   #28
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

Hots dayum, I dig them Junk Formula Fords. The ultimate hot rods.

One of my favorite Miller-related Indy cars were the 2 run by J.C. Agajanian back in the mid 50's. The bottom end of the engine was the new Studebaker V8 block, and Leo Goosen designed the overhead cam heads and intakes. They rev'd up to 7500. As best as I can determine only a half dozen sets of the Studebaker OHC head were ever made; Gale Banks scored a pair in high school and put them into a hot rod. As far as I know the only ones to survive are displayed at Speedway Motors in Lincoln.

BTW - Congrats Marcy and Ryan on the coming new heir!
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Old 02-28-2008, 01:27 PM   #29
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

One of the Packard Cable FWD cars went to the Smithsonian, the other wound up in the Harrah collection for a while- I got a chance to see it up close at the Atlantic City casino some years back.
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Old 02-28-2008, 01:38 PM   #30
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

Just found this one, Miller Offenhauser logo
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Old 02-28-2008, 02:30 PM   #31
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

The history of Miller and the connection with Bugatti have always been interesting to me. They must have had a strong underlying respect for each others work. The appearance of both their efforts show the results of a very clear vision and thoughtful execution.
Love those '35 Fords.
All the best for the new 'Miller' coming to your family.
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Old 02-28-2008, 02:49 PM   #32
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

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Originally Posted by McKee View Post
Loren Richards makes them.
Are these a continuation of the Miller pedal cars made by Richard Graves' Miracle Pedal Car Co in the mid 1990s? I was at his shop several times before and during production and, as I recall he had limited the run to 100 units only.

Your Miller gonna be a V16 Ryan? Congrats in advance of the happy event.
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Old 02-28-2008, 02:57 PM   #33
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

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Originally Posted by Weasel View Post
Are these a continuation of the Miller pedal cars made by Richard Graves' Miracle Pedal Car Co in the mid 1990s? I was at his shop several times before and during production and, as I recall he had limited the run to 100 units only.
I just took a wild guess at Loren Richards,...it's more likely it was Richard Graves,........I knew it was Richard something....
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Old 02-28-2008, 02:59 PM   #34
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

Here are some earlier threads, all appreciations of the Miller-Fords:

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...ht=miller+ford
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...ht=miller+ford
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...ht=miller+ford
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...ht=miller+ford
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Old 02-28-2008, 03:08 PM   #35
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

A great thread but I would be remiss if I did not add something additional about the Chevrolet Brothers. They attempted the partnership so to speak with the Blood Brothers (Howard Blood was one of the brothers can't remember the other off hand). The innovative thing in my opinion about the Cornelian was that it was a monocoque which may be the first (can't swear to it though). It was a good thing they failed as this forced the Chevrolet brothers to open their own shop originally on Grand River Avenue in Detroit before moving to Indianapolis. In 1915 they had built the first of their overhead cam fours with the extensive use of aluminum, body,engine, oil coolers and even part of the frame. He also added fuel tanks down low in the chassis and one on each side of the frame, ala formula one practice of recent vintage. Chevrolet's racers were extremely fast and were the very first car of any marque to win back to back in the 500 at Indy (1920, 1921). If it wasn't for bad luck -you know the rest. Gaston wins at Indy in 1920 and the next thing he dies at LA on the boards. Louis is devastated. His next big venture besides the Ford after market heads was an aircraft company in 1929 and the black Tuesday hits. Truly a tragic figure but a great racecar builder.

The junk formula was in my opinion a great time in American racing and after watching the belly button cars today I only wish they would take a page out of history and try it again. They actually may even put people like me back in the seats.

The Sampson looks great. What is the relation to the Sampson in the Indy museum and to Frank Lockhart's LSR Blackhawk? Any history worth sharing? Also who is doing the work-looking good?

No one can deny that Miller is a great name, be it a car or future American hot rodder-Jim
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Old 02-28-2008, 03:10 PM   #36
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

Sweet topic, and congrats to you both........is he going to be a welder?

Cheers,

Drewfus
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Old 02-28-2008, 03:15 PM   #37
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

There is a really dead on reproduction running around here in Palm Beach County, Florida. It is way cool. It has a flathead powering the front wheels and as I recall a drive shaft from the front axle back to the rear end. The guy that owns it has driven it in the Great Race. He also has a 1912 Chevy powered repro race car (also a veteran of the Great Race), dunno the name of it but it looks like a Chanti bottle laid on it's side. The next time I see either car, I'll try to get some pictures. Both cars are on the road and he isn't afraid to drive them.
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Old 02-28-2008, 03:18 PM   #38
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

My favorite race car of all time was the Miller 91. Clocked at Bonnie. @ 170mph in the mid-late '2o's and powerd by a 1.5 liter supercharged streight 8, the 91 was as fast as it was good looking.

Dynoroom's pictures are fantastic.

Congratulations Ryan. Little boys are worth the extra effort. I hope all goes well with Miller Cochran.
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Old 02-28-2008, 03:49 PM   #39
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

I seem to remember a murky and depressing end to Borgeson's own restoration...I think he lent the car to the L.A. Museum, which decided to keep it, and during tangled legal proceedings B. commited suicide.
I was just reading a Borgeson edited "Little Book" of rodding, and in a little article on tools he is pictured demonstrating use of a Plomb/Proto puller on a Miller hub.
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Old 02-28-2008, 03:56 PM   #40
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Default Re: 1935 Miller/Ford Indy Cars

Ryan,

Here are some bedtime stories you can read the little guy.

http://www.king-of-the-boards.com/ra...drensbooks.htm

Congrats,
Kurt O.
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