flathead guys,,,i have some questions..

i have a flathead that was given to me by a friend a couple of years ago..it was pulled from a running/driving 50 ford..its a 59 ab,,he also gave me a pair of finned edelbrock heads with it (i believe they are the older ones (at least that is what ive been told) because the lettering is not script, but block letters....i kinda just put the engine in the corner of my shop and figured i'd use it "some day" in a project..
most of you know i recently bought a 40 merc convertible that was originally chopped back in the 50s (bodywork is done in lead)..the car needs a floor (similar condition to the one mazdaslam just did)...and some quarter patches,,the rest of the body is really pretty decent...i plan to do a frame off and put the body on a rotisserie,etc..
one of the things i have been pondering is what engine to run in it,,,somewhere along the way someone mounted a small block ford in it (just for mockup purposes),,i thought about putting a 55 lincoln engine in it, but decided against it for a variety of reasons,,,i was standing in the shop the other night and i happened to glance over at the flathead gathering dust in the corner and started thinking "why not use that engine in the merc?"..
ive also got the 3 speed tranny with floor shift that came along with the engine,,
i know next to nothing about flatheads except that they look cool and sound great,,which is all i really care about since im a kustom guy..ive heard stories about flatties running hot, etc...
i know there are a LOT of flathead fans on here, so maybe i can get some of you guys to answer a few questions i have and maybe add some advice on things that i didnt even think to ask,,
i assume that the first thing i need to do is have the block magnafluxed to check for cracks,,assuming the block is good and the cylinder walls aren't all scored,,could i rebuild the thing myself without too much trouble?
what advice can you give me on ignition, intake, headers, cooling system?
the engine did run and drive, but since its out of the car,, i want to make sure it will be as reliable and trouble free as i can make it...and would this be a good choice for the 40 merc?
sorry for writing a novel here, but i wanted to make my questions as clear as possible..

 

ive been driving mine in my 53 effie every day including in some dain hot weather and its never overheated other than when the new thermostats stuck closed . which reminds me its gettin purty cold need to put some in again . oh and yeah mines an 8ba . she's never failed to start or go where i want despite many irritating wiring issues , and other trivial stuff that comes with a vehicle drug outta a barn after 25 years . i will say this and i tell everyone who will listen , my flatty 53 is a 4000 pound green happy pill !!! nothing like that lil v-8 .

 

That engine sounds like a great candidate for your Merc. Have you measured the stroke in your flathead to see what crank is in it? Pop the manifold and heads and see what the valves and cylinders look like before you tear it all down. If it's clean inside, you may be okay to run it. They have a rep for running forever...

Flatman

 

Use the flathead. They will always be my engine of choice. Nothing is better for what you're doing. But that's just me....

 

flatheads usually only run hot if the timing is wrong, cooling system is sub-par, or there's cracks in the block letting combustion gas into the coolant

 

Make up a run stand for your flattie. It will allow you the freedom to check for various problems(water pump leaks. etc.), sort out the ignition and actually see the oil pressure at idle and at speed.

 

thanks for the info guys,,,

 

A flathead would be way to go for that car.

Great car!

 

For some reason it sounds odd to me that somebody would put a 59 flatty in a 50 Ford. Just wondering, since you mentioned that you're not very familiar with them, if you have a later block with the early block style Edelbrock heads. Those things are rare enough that I can see somebody wanting to show them off on whatever flathead they're running.

I agree, go for it. Too bad you don't have the original Merc engine (99A). Those are among the most sought after flatheads.

Be sure to tear it down and have it tanked and magged before proceeding with the build. Good luck.

 

Yeah I didnt even think of that, that would mean someone put a early block into a later Ford. Definately wierd.

Where are the waternecks on the motor? Mid head? In front? The earlier are mid head, later (49-53) are in front.

See you tomorrow, we can chat more then.

 

the engine definitely came out of a 50 ford,,,was probably transplanted years ago,,the waternecks are in the front,,,,the heads say 59 ab on them,,maybe someone just used 59 ab heads..is that possible?,,would they have bolted up to an earlier block?

 

I would use the flatmotor.. Where is the dizzy ? Is it on the top side, or on the front of the motor. Does the clutch housing unbolt, or is it cast with the motor block?

 

Hmmmmmmmmmmm . . . 59AB heads had waternecks in the middle, not the front. I imagine the heads say 8BA on them.

I'd run the flathead - especially in a custom like you're building. Flatheads are not any more difficult to build than the other engine -- as long as you know a bit about what you're doing, have a machine shop that knows a bit about the valve system of a flathead, etc.. Buy a couple of the books on flatheads -- and you'll learn all that you need to know. If you have any specific questions, just drop me a PM.

Dale

 

The number 59 ab doesn't mean the year of the engine. It's just the number for the heads on a 49 - 53 flattie which is good news because it's the block you can bore out the most if you want to get max cubic inches.I agree with Flatman. Pull the heads, pan and intake and see what kind of shape it's in.You would be surprised sometimes. I had a buddy buy a used one and he pulled it about and everything looked good and it's been running for years now. Once it's apart you can measure the cylinder bore and the stroke. Maybe you will get lucky and find it's got the mercury crank in it.If it was me I would use the flattie.Just make sure the cooling system and timing is right.I'm pushing 300 hp out of my flattie and have had zero problems for the last 9000 miles.Good luck

 

Do a search here for "flathead" - you won't be able to read it all.

There are some good threads in the tech archives too.

I drive my stock 221" '40 flatty everywhere. It's reliable, runs cool, and it's pretty neat when (knowledgable) folks ask me if I still have the original engine.

 

That car NEEDS a flatty.

 

here are some pictures from today,,,,,i was wrong,,the water outlets are in the middle,,,i was thinking of the heads,,can these heads still be used on the engine?..

 

edelbrock block letter heads?

 

haha,.,,,,must be getting senile,,,,OFFENHAUSER,,,,
(told you i dont know much about flatties,,)

 

thats ok man, we all gotta start sometime.. looks like you have an 8ba style engine with 59 ab heads.

 

59A and 59AB engines were '46-'48, though the post-war heads were often used as replacement heads on earlier engines, so yes, someone could put a 59A head on an earlier engine.

'49- to early '52 Fords were 8BA, Mercs of the same years were 8CM and trucks were 8RT. Late '52 and '53 were EAB (Ford) and EAC (Merc)

Go to www.vanpeltsales.com and you will find loads of good info on flathead Fords. The website owner is also a HAMBer, and is as knowledgeable about flatties as anyone on the planet.

 

oh and earlier intake. thats a pretty cool setup the way it is.

 

Forgot to mention, I run an 8BA in a '46 Ford pickup and I have no overheating problems, even in the hot Arkansas summer.

 

so, does that mean i should be able to run my offy heads?

 

sure can, but to keep the cool factor for that merc (this is my opinion guys) try to locate or maybe trade out those 49 53 heads for earlier style heads. once again just an opinion.

 

Kustom 7777,
Run the flat motor! Only fitting mill for your KOOL Merc.
A snap of my f/h engine test stand.
glider.

 

It looks to me like you have a later engine with earlier heads. The 49-53 had the distributor like yours does, and the 49-53 did not have the bellhousing cast as part of the block, like yours. '48 and earlier engines had the bellhousing cast as part of the block. So the Offey heads you have would actually be correct for your engine.

 

Look at 265glide's picture, see how his bellhousing is part of the block, which is what 48 and older looked like.

 

Those heads should work just fine - as long as they are in good shape on the under side. ( Lots of used heads are very corroded or have been milled too many times ). Attach some pictures of the combustion chamber side. In my opinion, since you're building a 40 Merc, it would look a whole lot better to have the early style center-outlet heads, water pumps, intake and ignition -- but that is a "how it looks" opinion, nothing based on performance or reliability.


You can run the earlier 59AB ( center water neck ) style heads and early style manifold on this engine -- but there are a couple things to note.

1) If you're using the 59AB heads, then you'll have to fabricate a method to hold the distributor in place. Given your current setup, they must have done something? You'll notice on your 49-53 Offy heads that there is a threaded tab on the passenger side head - used to tie down the distributor so it doesn't turn.

2) Water Flow: The 49-53 blocks have larger water passages at the rear of the decks -- whereas the 32-48 motors pulled more water from the middle of the decks. Some guys will rework the rear of the 39-48 heads to flow more water in the rear - like your Offy heads do. If you compare 39-48 heads and 49-53 heads, you'll see what I mean.

3) The crankcase road draft system is different from a 39-48 to a 49-53 style flathead. Late intakes have a provision for a road draft tube on the front of the intake - 39-48 ones do not. If you're using an early manifold, then you need to make sure that you setup the entire crankcase ventilation system to work - which is some work. (Air flows differently from 32-48 to 49-53 . . . bass akwards). You can find this information on the HAMB or FordBarn, etc..

4) If you decide to run the early style ( front mount ) timing cover and distributor, then you'll need to change the CAM as well as the crank/cam gears. The 39-48 cams thrust toward the block, the 49-53 cams thrust toward the timing cover - with an oiling provision to pump oil to the front of the cam (where it rubs on the timing cover). Some say that it it important to have a cam ground that is designed for a 49-53 motor (valve angles are slightly different) - though you'd need the front of the cam to be the early 39-48 style (tang for front-mount distributor). Just some more things to consider!

There are other litttle things, but the above covers some of the basics.

Hope this helps . . . though your head is probably spinning now!

Dale

 

Dale I believe the valve angles were the same from '45 (59AB The 5 denotes 1945; the 9 denotes 239 cuin) through '53. Pre-'46 blocks had different angles side to side.