Register now to get rid of these ads!

Tech - JB Weld Patch Panel

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by George G, Mar 14, 2007.

  1. George G
    Joined: Jun 28, 2005
    Posts: 1,274

    George G
    Member

    The lower 1/4 panels on my 28 roadster have rust perforations and deep pitting but they are small diameter holes. Nothing you could put a finger through. I know the right thing to do would be weld in a new panel but I can't weld sheet metal very well and I would have made a big time mess.

    My son made a metal patch panel that fit nicely on the inside of the body. We cleaned up all the rust then laid in a coating of JB Weld on both the body and patch. Lightly clamped it in and let it set. I put some duct tape over the rust holes on the outside so the JB Weld wouldn't run out. Real solid.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Good idea. I had the same problem a couple of spots but used some fiberglass mesh and POR15 instead of the normal resin.
     
  3. ambman
    Joined: Sep 9, 2005
    Posts: 197

    ambman
    Member

    Aaaaarrrrghhhhh! No offense but you need to make friends with someone who will either weld that for you or let you borrow their welder and let you practice until you get good enough to fix it right. IMO Seems like a waste of time doing it that way. If you lived close enough I'd let you borrow mine.
     
  4. Band aids don't heal wounds.
     

  5. Mudslinger
    Joined: Aug 3, 2005
    Posts: 1,964

    Mudslinger
    Member

    Just remember your just screwing around with a temp fix, plan on doing it again.
    Its not going to last like a steel panel welded in.
     
  6. I guess that's better than sculpting spray foam. :O

    Maybe a 6 on the half-ass scale.
     
  7. Whatever it is.... it isn't "tech".

    JH
     
  8. T-Time
    Joined: Jan 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,627

    T-Time
    Member
    from USA

    I disagree with the skeptics. While I do not know how well JB Weld will hold up (I suspect very well and I intend to do some testing of this myself), "gluing" repair panels instead of welding is a process now approved and endorsed by most auto manufacturers for accident repair. It has been thoroughly proven, and is superior to welding in some respects (no heat on those large expanses of metal, for example). Just don't use it on a panel that is under a structural load.
     
  9. haring
    Joined: Aug 20, 2001
    Posts: 2,335

    haring
    Member


    True, but that requires using the proper materials, and JB Weld is not the same thing. You need to use an actual panel adhesive.

    JB Weld is pretty cool stuff, but as most have said, this repair will fail before too long.

    A long time ago, back before I knew anyone with a welder, I used JB Weld to fill some trim holes on a scooter. That repair lasted 5 years with no shifting or popping, even after I crashed the darn thing. After that, I stripped the body to bare metal and properly welded all the holes.
     
  10. SinisterCustom
    Joined: Feb 18, 2004
    Posts: 8,277

    SinisterCustom
    Member

    I've doe this as well on floorboards that were 'thin'....works good.
    Autobody supply shops sell various epoxies for panel replacement...VERY strong....you'll tear the surrounding metal before breaking the bond if done correctly..
    I used some to 'glue' wheel tubs to the 1/4 panels on a '67 Camaro drag car that had nice paint...couldn't weld 'em in.....
     
  11. T-Time
    Joined: Jan 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,627

    T-Time
    Member
    from USA

    I guess I didn't make that point clear enough?:confused: But, I do intend to do some long term testing with the JB Weld to see what the life expectancy is. If it holds for five years, like it did with your hole filling, I'd be satisfied.
     
  12. Automotive Stud
    Joined: Sep 26, 2004
    Posts: 4,302

    Automotive Stud
    Member

    I don't think the issue is even whether or not the JB weld will hold. (ok, that might be an issue too). I see the problem is that the pitted metal is still in place, and rust can come back. The patch is just going to make it harder to fix right next time.
     
  13. T-Time
    Joined: Jan 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,627

    T-Time
    Member
    from USA

    Yes, rust can come back, and it can start anywhere...even on the new virgin metal that has been welded in. In fact, the weld itself can start to rust. Treat the metal properly, whether rusted or new metal, and rusting is not a problem. This is something on which I have already done long term testing.

    Why would this repair make it any harder to fix next time? JB Weld (and most glues) are dissolvable with the right solvant. Even if not, you would have to cut that area out anyway to weld in the new panel.
     
  14. THX_138
    Joined: Nov 11, 2006
    Posts: 290

    THX_138
    Member

    Does it really matter if he did his repairs up to anyone's standards???????

    He did what he wanted with his son... realizes it should have been done with a welder to be correct....but shared his technique with all of us...probably for the some that are short tooled such as himself that still want to do something.

    BUT..... the important thing is...HE DID IT......and with HIS SON none the less!!!!!!

    Large Kudos for that alone!

    Myself, I wouldn't repair it like that, but I have ALL the tools. Personally if I didn't have them I would use panel adheasive....I doubt JB Weld will hold the panel on for long...the panel will however have acted as a good "mold" for the JB to fill the rusted cavities.

    Hats off for the effort and a handshake and a beer for involving your son!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  15. 49ratfink
    Joined: Feb 8, 2004
    Posts: 18,828

    49ratfink
    Member
    from California

    If it holds for five years, like it did with your hole filling, I'd be satisfied.

    I'm working on one of those 5 year cars right now. redoing everything the owner paid a bunch of money to have "repaired" 5 years ago.

    it is not fixed, it is not repaired, it's not tech, it's just different than it was before.
     
  16. SinisterCustom
    Joined: Feb 18, 2004
    Posts: 8,277

    SinisterCustom
    Member

    Well put THX^^^^

    I have used JB-weld to repair engine cases on my dirtbikes.....it holds up for years under way more abusive conditions than this.....also have used Caterpillar epoxy to repair cracked engine blocks.....
    Some people either don't prep it correctly or just don't put enough confidence in the products.....to each their own.
     
  17. slamdpup
    Joined: Apr 27, 2005
    Posts: 1,094

    slamdpup
    Member

    i wouldnt use jb weld..duramix is the best for something li8ke that....intime jb weld will start flaking away..duramix will never go anywhere..stronger than welding
     
  18. T-Time
    Joined: Jan 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,627

    T-Time
    Member
    from USA

    And, Duramix (a 3M product) makes products specifically for metal body panel bonding. See products number 4179, 4178, and 4176.
     
  19. G V Gordon
    Joined: Oct 29, 2002
    Posts: 5,713

    G V Gordon
    Member
    from Enid OK

    Interesting thread. I am considering using something similar on one of the doors on my sedan. It is very rusted and pitted, pinholes along the beltline etc.. Inner structure is fair, really needs a complete skin at least. But for now it fills the hole on the left side of the car until a better door is found.

    Things I have learned from the thread, A. Duramix is the best product to use and B. don't post a tech thread when I do. lol
     
  20. A few corrections
    1. JB weld is not a panel adhesive, and to the best of my knowledge is not approved by ANY OEM.
    2. While many auto manufactures recommend panel bonding, most of them only accept weld bonding (adhesive with resistance spot welding).
    3.Panel bonding is done at flanges, not lap joints on exposed outter body panels. Panel bonding a lap joint on an exposed outer body panel is not recommended by either OEM, or by most adhesive makers, due to the different expansion and contraction rates of steel and the adhesive. A "ghost" line will show through at the seam.
    4. I don't know about you but I don't think 5 years is an acceptable life for a repair. I have several restorations that I still still see around that are ten to twenty years old, without any failures what so ever.

    I use these products all the time in restoration, and hot rod construction, but there is a time and place for everything. IMHO installing patch panels with adhesive is just one step above filling rust holes with kitty hair.
     
  21. BRENT in 10-uh-C
    Joined: Apr 14, 2004
    Posts: 502

    BRENT in 10-uh-C
    Member

    I personally think so.

    I think this attitude is very much why the "rat rod" persona has a stigma against it. If you do not have the time to do it right, then don't do it at all!! We all learned that in the 1st grade. Have we become lazy? ...or is it that we have no respect any more??

    I actually cringed when I saw that "repair" --and to think someone is proud of their so-called accomplishments. Where I personally see the line drawn is here. When we must "MacGuyver" something to get us home, ..or get us out of a jamb for the moment even when we know it is incorrect, then it is OK for the moment because a responsible person goes back and makes the proper repairs as soon as possible. If we do something like this because we just didn't know any better, even though it is not acceptable, --it is excusable although we are still accountable. We have all done it and are guilty. Maybe kinda like telling a lie but you sure don't go around bragging about it!!

    I agree with someone else when they say that George needed to find a friend that can weld. I just finished hosting a free Weekend Seminar/Workshop for people that wanted to learn about that very subject. George's project is/was not in any such hurry that he cannot take time to do it properly.

    T-Time, I am shaking my head that a fellow Model T-er would even condone such butchership, ...and George, I am impressed that you had the courage to step forward and make that post. I personally believe if you would have purchased a tube of Fuzor and properly done the repairs, your project would have been accepted by most. IMO, the JB Weld epoxy is really no different than suggesting the use of Elmer's Glue, Silicone Caulk, or Liquid-Nails construction adhesive to make the repairs.

    Again, my 2 cents is we go to schools to learn how to do things better. Tech Week is just like a school. We should all strive to be craftsmen that future generations will look back upon our workmanship and say "we made a contribution" --not that "he did just enough to get by". Think about it!!


     
  22. T-Time
    Joined: Jan 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,627

    T-Time
    Member
    from USA

    And now a few corrections to your corrections. ;)

    I neither said JB Weld was a panel adhesive, nor did I say that any OEM approved of JB Weld as a panel adhesive.

    GM and Ford both approve of Fusor, without resistance spot welding. I don't know about the foreign manufacturers. I have personally seen and read the approvals and instructions from both GM and Ford.

    All true. No argument from me on this point.

    Adequate for me. Your mileage may vary. I can't get 5 years out of a paint job, whether I do it or I have it done professionally. Might as well redo body work at paint time.:(
     
  23. T-Time
    Joined: Jan 5, 2007
    Posts: 1,627

    T-Time
    Member
    from USA

    If it makes you feel any better, my testing will be done on a musclecar, not a T.:D
     
  24. HOTTRODZZ
    Joined: Aug 21, 2006
    Posts: 335

    HOTTRODZZ
    Member

    There are some really, really good glue's...

    Now more than ever - epoxy bonding is impressive.

    But its still glue.

    Light an Arc or flame & melt some steel bro.
     
  25. KIRK!
    Joined: Feb 20, 2002
    Posts: 12,031

    KIRK!
    Member

    I think there is a great underlying debate here, and some cool info about adhering panels.

    My two cents is that I am skeptical and would be pretty pissed if I bought that car and went to work on it a few years from now and had to remove that attempt so that I could do it "right". That would be a nightmare. I'd rather buy a car with visible rot than hidden questionable repairs.
     
  26. Goozgaz
    Joined: Jan 11, 2005
    Posts: 2,555

    Goozgaz
    Member

    In 1985 I shaved the turn signals off the front fenders in my VW bug. The turn signal holes (Golf ball size) were patched by tearing up a Budwiser can and using a hand rivet tool to rivet it onto the fender from the under side. The top of the fender was then covered with bondo. The car was smothed out and painted.

    I was 16 and that VW was slammed (the wrong way) and bouncier than jello on titties. I drove it everywhere. for about the next 6-7 years

    In 2003 I sold it. Budwaiser can still in place.

    Was it the correct way to do it .. probably not. Did it get me on the road... yup.

    Now.... please someone hand me my ass.
     
    richards69impala likes this.
  27. T time, I think we pretty much agree on #2, (this stuff is also gaining acceptance rapidly)and #1was aimed more at the general nature of the thread. Nice to see that somebody reads the directions;)

    FWIW Evercoat has come out with a line of two part adhesives, seam sealers and foams that come in a coax tube that can be dispenced with a regular caulking gun. It's also 10 bucks cheaper than the rest. I've only tried the seam sealer, (put 7 tubes on a 63 chevy) but I liked it.
     
  28. myke
    Joined: Dec 13, 2004
    Posts: 2,134

    myke
    Member
    from SoCal

    I love it when a nerve gets hit!

    I say as long as it does not effect safty and gets someone on the road with a hotrod so be it.

    Or maybe this thread is a set-up?
     
  29. MrNick
    Joined: Nov 4, 2006
    Posts: 302

    MrNick
    Member
    from Hemet, Ca

    I would not have done the repair this way but on the other hand I must come to the defence of JB weld. I have been using JB for about 30yrs and must say that it is remarkable stuff. I once did a test with two 1" long pieces of angle iron fastened togather with JB weld. I put them in a vice and then used a large cresent wrench to break them apart. They did break apart but only after bending the angle Iron. About 10 yrs ago I was rebuilding my sportster (motorcycle) and knew that the xmission case had come apart by the previous owner. He had fixed it by cleaning all the pieces, fastening them togather with JB and then fiberglassing with more JB. I had panned to break apart the xmission case, make new pieces and tig them togather. After myself and a harley mechanic examined the case, banged on it with a hammer, we decided to leave it alone. I'm still riding that sportster.
     
  30. 11secgen
    Joined: Oct 11, 2006
    Posts: 81

    11secgen
    Member

    come on guys like you never used j-b weld to fix somthing you know should m-e welded!j-b weld rocks and it doesnt give you welders tan.
     

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2021 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.