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Mechanic gets crushed by car

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by LOW LID DUDE, Dec 5, 2009.

  1. skwurl
    Joined: Aug 25, 2008
    Posts: 1,620

    skwurl
    Member

    At least he chocked the wheel
     
  2. furyus
    Joined: Sep 30, 2009
    Posts: 68

    furyus
    Member
    from Virginia

  3. HOT40ROD
    Joined: Jun 16, 2006
    Posts: 961

    HOT40ROD
    Member
    from Easton, Pa

    Coming form the fire service and being a rescue instructor. I now use wood cribbing along with the jack stands. I have a bunch of 6X6, 4X4 and 2x4 cut to 20 inch lengths. I build a box crib with set 2 one way and setting the next set the other way until i get the heights I want. Then I set the car down on them and put jack stands next to them as a back up. When building the crib you can go as high as the lengths of the wood. I also make sure I shake the car to make sure it does not move.

    You would be suprised how much a car will move when you are trying to put the center section in the rear housing.

    Years ago we were get a 67 comet ready for the races. I had the rear apart with only the housing under the car. The car had two jack stands holding it up. I just got out from under the car and went to the tool box when I heard a crach. Turned around and the back of the car was on the ground the the gas tank was punctured and gas was running out on the floor. I look back on that and think if the car landing on top of me would not have killed me I could have burn to death. I was the only one in the garage at that time.

    That day was the last day I used just jack stands alone.
     
  4. 64Cyclone
    Joined: Aug 30, 2009
    Posts: 1,496

    64Cyclone
    Member

    Safety is very important...but that video is clearly a fake.
     
  5. Ramblur
    Joined: Jun 15, 2005
    Posts: 2,101

    Ramblur
    Member

    My dad never did much in the way of helping me build my high school hot rod
    but ALWAYS harped on the jackstand issue. Threats,horror stories,etc...good
    to know he cared. My worst experience was while still in school outside the
    local speed shop I had my 57 Chevy jacked WAY up and jackstands under
    the frame near the front leaf spring eye. I'd broken the spring perches on the
    axle and a buddy and I were surveying the damage on our backs when the
    old man across the street started backing his Gremlin out of his driveway
    and hit my rear bumper.:eek: I still remember watching the whole time,sure that
    he was going to stop. Neither of us moved till he made contact and then
    we were out from under in an instant. It never did fall off but I'm not sure how
    as it swayed back and forth a bunch. Thought we were being safe but
    sometimes shit happens.


    Here's the offending Gremlin...
    [​IMG]
     
  6. 4ever18
    Joined: Nov 1, 2007
    Posts: 555

    4ever18
    Member

    I faced this issue about 15 years ago. A friend was using the typical stamped steel tri-pod jackstands under his pickup truck (he was replacing the rusted steel brake fluid lines, on the rearend housing). He climbed out from under the truck to get a different tool and while walking away from the truck, he heard a crash. One of the spot welds that held one of the "tie straps" (this is the piece of metal that ties the legs together) came loose and the stand collasped... A few seconds earlier and Bill would have been killed (he'd been lying under the rearend housing). That day, I welded the seams of my stamped steel jackstands and began work on making my own stronger stands. I don't trust the cheap, imported cast iron pieces, either. I know that the ones that I made are "over kill", but don't even consider them as being possible to fail. An engineer friend tells me that the grade 8 (1/2" diameter) pin is the weakest point of my stands. I prefer the tripod design, because they always fit an uneven surface (even concrete floors don't have a perfectly flat surface). A four legged stand will "rock" if the surface supporting it isn't "dead-on" flat. This is why photographers use a "tripod" to support their cameras. I've included photos of my welded, stamped steel stand and my homemade stand. The homemade stands are heavy (25 lbs each) and are time consuming to make (I built a jig so that they would all be the same size - base and heigth), but I use them without worrying. Besides making something safer for me to use, who ever gets them when I'm gone is also going to be more safe.
     

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  7. And to think what your life is worth.............The jack stands and rubber chocks are a great gift for that fellow rodder who is up and coming in the hobby, show your love and give freely and educate the uninformed, please, tis the season.
     
  8. jimi'shemi291
    Joined: Jan 21, 2009
    Posts: 9,499

    jimi'shemi291
    Member

    Quote 39AllFord: "Fuck that, cement blocks or cinder blocks, I don't give a shit. If you want to work under a car, support it well and use double redundancy."


    AllFord, please re-read my post. I said I DO NOT USE concrete blocks in order to EVER get UNDER a car. I have SEEN them break under the weight of a car. So I'm with YOU and everyone else here about the right things to use. And what I called "back-ups" you call "double redundancy." It's all GOOD, because you obviously want the same thing I want: SAFETY for everybody who works on their own cars. SAFETY IS COOL. The best way to avoid an accident (and death) is to take the extra time to do it right.


    I'd rather be a live car nut and a dead macho, ya know?
     
  9. AlbuqF-1
    Joined: Mar 2, 2006
    Posts: 909

    AlbuqF-1
    Member
    from NM

    I have one of those, too, and I would not use it for anything bigger than a Harley. There are a lot of linkage pins in them, allows side-to-side sway. The lifting surface (2 rails) are not heavy steel, maybe 12 ga at best. The hydraulics on them are wonderful, but the latching mechanism is only meant to prevent it leaking down slowly, it couldn't possibly hold against 1,000# load -- look at the pins.
     
  10. c-10 simplex
    Joined: Aug 24, 2009
    Posts: 1,371

    c-10 simplex
    Member

    This brings one of those "business light bulb" ideas i often get:

    Is there a source where railroad ties are purchasable by the general public? i mean, i know where i can get a boatload of them, but that would most probably be stealing.

    Someone should come up with a simple yet compact device to put underneath a car to prevent it from coming completely down, but make it attractive in someway so that people will buy it.

    What i would suggest (i'm not going to do it because i don't have time, money and/or most importantly, the guts) Is to have a product as solid and about the same size as a railroad tie, BUT, make it look like either the front(or rear) facia of a car--do a fiberglass copy or something---i will post an example---some company sells these as bookshelves or something.

    So, now you got something that is attractive enough to buy (i mean no-one is going to buy a plain railroad tie are they?).
    IN ADDITION, CHECK THIS OUT the lights on this "fake" front end work, so now you got lights so you can see when you're working underneath your car!


    http://www.uberreview.com/2007/07/classic-car-wall-shelves.htm

    they also sell them at summit:
    http://www.genuinehotrod.com/Products.asp?DepID=7&SecID=30&PLID=1236

    If you decide to do this, then i want 10% commission off the gross sales for the first 2 years (i'm generous). SERIOUSLY, I'M NOT PLAYING. i gave you the idea, you should at least be cool enough to give me my commission.

    i really think this is a winner idea.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2009
  11. 39 All Ford
    Joined: Sep 15, 2008
    Posts: 1,531

    39 All Ford
    Member
    from Benton AR


    After looking back, I was a little heavy handed. I have to keep reminding myself that it dosen't take anyone special to be an asshole.... Sorry!
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2009
  12. oilslinger53
    Joined: Apr 17, 2007
    Posts: 2,500

    oilslinger53
    Member
    from covina CA

    Remember, when under a car, on your back, working with tools over your face, keep your lips tightly sealed. Rather have a split lip than a chipped tooth... assuming you have teeth :) Also undercoating tastes like shit...
     
  13. c-10 simplex
    Joined: Aug 24, 2009
    Posts: 1,371

    c-10 simplex
    Member

    i disagree, you need to be an a-hole about safety; You can never be too much of an a-hole about safety.

    But more importantly, let's consider my business idea(s).
     
  14. c-10 simplex
    Joined: Aug 24, 2009
    Posts: 1,371

    c-10 simplex
    Member

    P.S. here's an even better idea---put a t.v. screen in the "railroad tie!" You know, where the licence plate should be.

    i come up with a lot of ideas, and one of these is going to break big time.
     
  15. i shake the crap out of it, i even do it on the lifts at work.


    how about these stands 10-22 ton style

    also it's hard to find one's made in the usa, Hein-Werner, us jack and SOME of otc.
     

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    Last edited: Dec 6, 2009
  16. frank spittle
    Joined: Jan 29, 2009
    Posts: 1,672

    frank spittle
    Member

    Bumper jacks were the most dangerous and they were in the trunk of every new car until manufacturers were forced to start using low speed crash devices called bumpers that you can not use to raise a tire off the ground. One time I had a flat in my '52 Chevy and was changing the spare. I had the rear jacked and was sitting on thr ground with my legs under the wheelwell to raise the spare to the axle. As I was pushing the spare on the axle the jack started tilting away from me and as I am sitting there with the spare in my hand it fell to the ground. My feet were still under the wheelwell but I had place one foot on each side of the axle and my feet were in the opening. Luckily no harm done. Bad thing is I had to jack the car up and do it again but this time standing up.
     
  17. jimi'shemi291
    Joined: Jan 21, 2009
    Posts: 9,499

    jimi'shemi291
    Member

    39AllFord, man, you are NOT an asshole. I knew you were/ARE just fired up about the safety thing, as I am (this is my 6th post on this safety thread alone). A lot of guys either don't want to take time, or they think talking (or DOING) safe things is for sissies. It take a MAN to let others know, usually, that a certain topic isn't wimpy but COOL.

    Gotta keep harping just a bit, too.
     
  18. Rich1028
    Joined: Jul 12, 2008
    Posts: 222

    Rich1028
    Member

    I have been quilty of doing oil changes in my cars with nothing more than a floor jack.
    but that was when I was younger,and had nothing to live for!
    now that I made it to get old (45) I plan on being around for awhile more,so now a days I always use jackstands.
    I had those old style ones that all have talked about,the tube type,and yes I too have had them collapse.
    I had a friend about 20 years ago make me up 4 jackstands.
    you can not see them that well in the pic but there square tubing that slides inside of the other one,with a c-channel on top.

    [​IMG]
     
  19. Kustom Komet
    Joined: Jun 26, 2007
    Posts: 640

    Kustom Komet
    Member

    I'll never forget it.

    Back in high school, a guy I knew through a mutual friend was working on his mid '70s Camaro in his mothers' driveway using just a floor jack. The jack blew a seal and sank, and he tried to get out from under but didn't have time. His head was crushed sideways by a front lower control arm to about half width, and he was still conscious - and screaming. A few neighbors came over with another jack and got him out, but the accident had caused horrendous brain damage and as he was being loaded into the ambulance, he was still screaming at the top of his lungs and wouldn't stop.

    Same thing at the hospital, they had to sedate him to keep him still and perform surgery, but there was too much brain damage and he died about two days later. Since then, I won't even stick a toe under a car without really good jack stands, and testing the sturdiness by trying to rock the car sideways and ensuring that it's evenly loaded on all four stands.

    Keep safe.

    -KK
     
  20. Oilcan Harry
    Joined: Mar 3, 2001
    Posts: 906

    Oilcan Harry
    Member
    from INDY

    I'd had my license about a year and read in the paper about a guy that raced at the jalopy track near my home. He was getting ready for the Friday night event and had his car on cider blocks. Yep, it fell and killed him. I went out the next day and bought jack stands. I know now, 40 years later, that the ones I got are NOT safe, but they were safer than nothing at all and all I knew to get as a dumb teenager. I have better ones now but I still have the old crappy ones. I think I'll do as suggested above and mark them so they don't ever wind up under a vehicle.
     
  21. 48bill
    Joined: Mar 27, 2001
    Posts: 387

    48bill
    Member

    I don't have a photo but I use steel wheels.

    Eight wheels paired and then welded together provides you with four stands that can be placed under each tire and get the vehicle a foot or more off the ground depending on the width of the wheels. I've used them for years and they pass the shake test handily. They definately won't fail like a cement block will if misshandled. The vehicle won't roll off of them either due to the concave nature of the wheel.
     
  22. CruiseOrDie
    Joined: Apr 29, 2008
    Posts: 80

    CruiseOrDie
    Member
    from Cincy, OH

    Sorry, I've NEVER gotten under a car without a jackstand. I'm young, but dammit I know better.


    I had a good friend who has a nice scar on the back of his melon to remind him why you use jackstands. Lucky for him it was a lifted truck, or it would have killed him.
     
  23. 64Cyclone
    Joined: Aug 30, 2009
    Posts: 1,496

    64Cyclone
    Member

    Maybe it's already been said...but NEVER trust blocks or anything other than stands. I had a Crown Vic on blocks once and it fell to the ground right in front on my eyes. Lesson learned!!
     
  24. Fe26
    Joined: Dec 25, 2006
    Posts: 543

    Fe26
    Member

    Those stands could do with some 3/8" plate supporting braces say 4" high x 4" wide cut diagonally and welded to the uprights and bases, four pieces on each stand. Also the pins look a little light.
    I have a similar set up with 5/8" pins. I also punched a 1" hole in each of the braces so I can push the stands in and pull them out with a steel rod with a hook on one end. The rod saves my aching back from doing more work than it needs to.
    Also on the safety equipment note, ears and eyes. Remember, if you are lying on your side or with your head to one side your ear makes a funnel, anything that falls and touches your ear can fall right inside. I once had a shit job that had me overhead welding for a week, found out the hard way about hot slag and inner ears.
     
  25. 48ford
    Joined: Dec 15, 2001
    Posts: 461

    48ford
    Member

    One of the few times I realy went off on my son is when I walked in on him and he had his car up on cinder blocks,WOW.
    A simple demonstration with a hamer hitting a block drove the point home.
    Use stands or Wood blocks bridged together.
    I lost s broth in law to a jack
    later russ
     
  26. Rich1028
    Joined: Jul 12, 2008
    Posts: 222

    Rich1028
    Member

    good point,I'll look into doing just that.
    thanks!
     
  27. Shawn M
    Joined: Sep 10, 2008
    Posts: 408

    Shawn M
    Member

    This happened to my wife's uncle a few years back. It was a tough deal for all of us. Do not take any chances, you never know when your luck will run out. Safety should always be top priority, we make light of it at times but it is serious stuff.
     
  28. Bruce Lancaster
    Joined: Oct 9, 2001
    Posts: 21,681

    Bruce Lancaster
    Member Emeritus

    In the real world...
    You might very well have bad workplace...sloping, dirt, gravel, mud, etc.
    You might not be able to afford a set of stands that cost more than your engine...never mind what you value your life, I mean actual money you have and can spend.

    I think your best bet is WOOD, Solid wood. Unless you use rotten junk, not significantly compressible or crushable, cheap and light enough that you can make a structure that is very wide in all directions in relation to height so that it cannot tip.

    If you can find huge solid chunks...I have some that are like 12X12X24 found by the road...perfect. If you cannot find such massive goodies, and I have no idea where to buy such, build a solid structure of landscape timbers that is wider in all directions than high, and WAY wider if you work on a poor surface.
    Make an extra at very least 12X12X24 as your safety.
    Use the biggies as jackstands, and spend a little time THINKING about how you place them.
    Keep the extra chunk, big enough not to tip or press into the dirt, pulled near you where you are working and under a frame rail or such, not under floor pan or muffler. This is your backup...if everything else fails, you hve something thicker that you to stop the falling/rolling vehicle. Most tires and wheels are a bit too narrow.
    Cement blocks are strong...but can be split. What if car is actually resting against the cement by a single bolt head or the knife-edge of a frame/rocker seam? Almost a chisel, driven by full weight of the car. Wood will just absorb any such stress in 1/8 of an inch.
     
  29. LOW LID DUDE
    Joined: Aug 16, 2007
    Posts: 1,223

    LOW LID DUDE
    Member
    from Colorado

    I hope you are right 64 Cyclone,I hate to see anyone get hurt,but stupid accidents like this (do happen daily).It sure makes ya think twice about the situation.In my 36 years working in bodyshops I have seen a bunch of stupid shit like this happen,nobody killed yet but too close for comfort.
     
  30. lostforawhile
    Joined: Mar 23, 2008
    Posts: 4,160

    lostforawhile
    Member

    I assume those big 4x4 chunks of pressure treated solid wood are safe? i have those heavy duty ramps, but since the car isn't under it's own power, i don't have any way to drive up them, i cut a 4x4 piece to fit in each dished area on the ramps and set the factory jack locations on the blocks in the ramps. it's been sitting on them for a while, but now i'm worried. I don't have a big enough jack to raise the car up enough to set the wheels in the ramp dished areas. thrse are some serious ramps a friend of mine told me i could permanently "borrow"
     

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