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Ford’s 2.0/2.3/2.5 litre engine family guide

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Kenneth S, Dec 14, 2008.

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  1. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    Flyguy there is a special set of "tools" that are needed to remove those bolts on the EAO 2.0 (they are 12 point) http://www.lislecorp.com/divisions/products/?product=524&division=1&category=6 You also might be able to get them off with a "good" metric allen wrench, but be careful if you try using an allen wrench so you don't strip the inside of the bolt head.

    Guest user, the Lima (Ranger) engine is a totally different engine than the 2.0 Escort engine.
     
  2. denis4x4
    Joined: Apr 23, 2005
    Posts: 4,198

    denis4x4
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Colorado

    Here's a shot of my 1.8 SOHC engine with round exhaust ports. Intake is a Lynx setup for a pair of 40 DCOE Weber side drafts. Modified the pan for 2 extra quarts of oil. Transmission is an aluminum ZF 4-speed. This is going into a Model A huckster I'm building. Took the cam to Crower for a regrind and they had a new unit on the shelf. Silva domed pistons are .040 over and again, off the shelf.
     

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  3. Guest user
    Joined: Aug 25, 2010
    Posts: 16

    Guest user
    Member
    from On Maui

    Thank you for the information. Saved my making a huge mistake.

    Do you happen to know off hand what would interchange with the Escort 2.0, or is it all on its own?

    Thank you again...
     
  4. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    Ford redesigned the Escort 2.0 in 98 so you have to get a 98 or newer head.
     
  5. Guest user
    Joined: Aug 25, 2010
    Posts: 16

    Guest user
    Member
    from On Maui

    Thank you.
    I was able to find some information on the engine on Wikipedia. Nothing real technical mind you, but enough to see I had a problem, in that the engine is kind of rare, at least when compared to the 2.3 - 2.5 engines.

    I think this is best left alone. I never cared for interference engines anyway, so that alone reason is enough for me to walk away from this project.

    It would appear that you saved me from needing lots of Advil!

    Thank you for your time, and help.
     
  6. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    Not a problem.
     
  7. Guest user
    Joined: Aug 25, 2010
    Posts: 16

    Guest user
    Member
    from On Maui

    Hello again,
    I do not mean to be a pest, but I have a couple of questions about the 2.3.

    I removed the head from a '94 2.3 with 200k miles because it had no compression in #3 & 4, and it was pinging really bad. What I found once the head was removed kinda has me stumped. The #3 exhaust seat had fallen out of the head and was caught between the valve and the head, and the head gasket was blown between 3 & 4.
    What may have caused the seat to separate from the head? Is this a normal thing with the 2.3?

    And, how does a guy adjust the timing on the 2.3 / 2.5?

    Thanks for any input.
     
  8. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    It got overheated, more than likely the #3 cylinder, bad/plugged injector. You need a "camshaft position sensor tool" to realign the "cps", the "cps" is down where the distributor used to be untill 95 when they changed that part of the block.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2011
  9. denis4x4
    Joined: Apr 23, 2005
    Posts: 4,198

    denis4x4
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Colorado

    Question.....does the 2.0 head interchange with the 1.8 block? The reason I'm asking is that the exhaust ports on my 1.8 are round instead of square. According to one header manufacturer, I have to use the 2.0 headers.
     
  10. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    On the 1.8, and 2.0 engines like you have are alot different than 2.0, 2.3, and 2.5 that I'm used to messing with. Did the engine you have come out of a Ford Courier truck, or ?
     
  11. finn
    Joined: Jan 25, 2006
    Posts: 1,280

    finn
    Member

    The seat failed because it was overheated by running with no coolant above the deck surface. When the engine is running with low coolant, the water pump forces what coolant is in the system to circulate into the head. When the engine is shut down, the coolant circulation stops and the coolant that is in the head drops below the deck surface, and the deck temperature rises rapidly, overheating the valve seat inserts. The inserts are a different material than the block / head grey iron, and have different coefficient of thermal expansion.
    The difference in thermal expansion allows the hoop stress in the insert to exceed the compressive yield stress of the insert, resulting in collapse of the insert and loss of the interferance fit of the insert to head counterbore, and an insert drop.

    Bottom line is that the material specified for the seat was improperly selected to withstand shutting the engine down with low coolant levels.

    I worked for a global diesel engine manufacturer in a former life where we frequently saw this. Once we figured out the root cause (material spec selection) we could repeat the failure on the dyno at will.

    New material specs (higher compressive yield/ lower thermal expansion coefficient) fixed the problem
     
  12. denis4x4
    Joined: Apr 23, 2005
    Posts: 4,198

    denis4x4
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Colorado

    I have the Mazda 1.8 out of a '75 Courier with a ZF 4speed. I know that your refrences are for the Lima engines and the 2.0 Mazda is a mid to late ninties motor...I think!
     
  13. Guest user
    Joined: Aug 25, 2010
    Posts: 16

    Guest user
    Member
    from On Maui

    Thanks for the reply!

    Are these 3 separate possible causes? (injector, overheated, out of time)

    From what I've read, the timing for the most part is non adjustable on these engines. What might cause the CPS to become misaligned?

    I'll have the injectors flow tested.

    I'm trying to use the head from a '95 2.3 in place of the damaged '93 head. So far, the only problem that I can see is the coil mounting. Do you know of any other issues that need to be addressed, or if this head just isn't going to work on this engine in this application?

    Oh, almost forgot, how much can a head be warped before it needs to be cut?

    And one last question, another project finds me needing to use a '96 engine and transmission in a '93 body. Is this possible without major sensor relocation problems, or am I better off finding the same model year engine?

    I really thank you, and I am truly humbled by your vast knowledge of these little engines.
     
  14. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    The injector, overheating, and out of time can be separate causes.

    The CPS can get out of time by the timing belt jumping teeth.

    The intake ports on the 93 are supposed to be different than the 95, they made a few changes to the block, and head in 95. A 94 or earlier 8 plug head would be a direct bolt on.

    On the head a max of .003" warpage.

    You can use the 96 in the 93, you will need to use the 93 front pulley, and crank position sensor but it will take a little work but it can be done (look at my first post on this thread where "Clarky1966" asked that question, and you will see the instructions below the question).
     
  15. Guest user
    Joined: Aug 25, 2010
    Posts: 16

    Guest user
    Member
    from On Maui

    Thanks once again. I'll go back and read the thread over.

    At this point I think its best to look into having the damaged head repaired. On top of the problems with fitting the '95 head onto the '93, I've discovered that the '95 head is just out of the allowable limits for warpage. So, if I need to have a head surfaced, I may as well have the original head redone.
    Any idea of what a reasonable price would be to have the seat repaired / replaced, if it can be done. Pretty sure it'll cost upwards of a 100 bucks to have the head shaved. The machinist are really proud of their work here, to say the least.
     
  16. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    As far as prices I really don't know, it depends upon hard the parts are to get where you are. They should be able to replace the seat provided the head isn't cracked, but when you look at the head as a whole it's alot more work to put it into the machines (than say a head from a sbc) because of the cam towers, it's the extra setup time it takes to put the head in the machines that really adds to the cost of having the work done.
     
  17. CutawayAl
    Joined: Aug 3, 2009
    Posts: 2,144

    CutawayAl
    Member
    from MI

    The 1.8 that was around when the 2.0L was being made is the "Kent" engine. Over time those were made in a variety of versions. If you want an overhead cam Kent engine, there were at least two Lotus DOHC versions manufactured, and at least one aftermarket DOHC race head made for the engine.



    The Mazda 1.8L and 2.0L are in no way interchangeable with the 1.8L Kent or German 2.0L.
     
  18. denis4x4
    Joined: Apr 23, 2005
    Posts: 4,198

    denis4x4
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Colorado

    Thanks for posting that info on the Kent engine. Be that as it may, I'm pleased with the finished product and I'm still amazed at the off shelf speed equipment I was able to purchase for the Mazda/Ford 1.8.
     
  19. Guest user
    Joined: Aug 25, 2010
    Posts: 16

    Guest user
    Member
    from On Maui


    Gottcha. I'll be sure to let you know how it all turns out, I mean after all the information you've given me, that's the least I can do.

    mahalo.
     
  20. deuce16ga
    Joined: May 22, 2011
    Posts: 9

    deuce16ga
    Member
    from arkansas

    Thanks for this great thread. I have been building a deuce roadster from scratch for several years now and collecting 2.3 Lima engines for nearly 20 years. i have finally came to the point that i'm trying to decide which parts to use for my roadster engine and i have a lot to choose from. i have several options and id like some ideas on sorting out the best options. I've got engines from mustangs, rangers , pintos and turbo coupes.
    i want to use the roller cam followers from the mustang but i'm not sure about the 8 plug heads. i don't have a lot of interest in the crank trigger ignitions unless i can get one to stand alone from the ECU as i wont use the factory feul injection. i plan to use the ford blue grommet duraspark ignition as it is has worked well on v8 s in the past for me but i'd love to find a one wire GM style HEI distributor that would work. i've got on on my 351 Windsor and love it! the mustang block has a distributor block off and the feul pump boss was cast in with no hole for a mechanical one. my ranger block has both deleted in the casting so it's crank trigger only. my turbo block got machine shopped and was bored .030 over and i'm too cheap to buy the new forged pistons i want for it. SOOOO which blocks are more desirable than the others and why? which heads are
    better? can i use an 8 plug head with a 4 plug ignition without problems. if so which side should i choose to fire? and should i machine blockoff plugs for the unused ports or just stuff them with plugs? i'm sure i'll stick the turbo on at some point just for grins and when i do will i need to change cams. ( i know i will need a forged piston lower when i turbo) I plan to have at least 2 complete engines to swap back and forth as i go, one a daily driver type with maybe 250hp and one much more radical kicks. i have a holley projection 2 that i will probably build a home made intake for and i wonder if the CFM is too much for the 2.3. after all that i'd like to tinker with the volvo head swap as it seams really tempting. I was wondering if it was related to or a derivative of the famous Cosworth racing heads. i've often gawked at those but they are either unobtainable or way out of my budget. i've been cam shopping but i'd like to hear from others about their experiences with different aftermarket cams before i break out the visa. and the same with pistons. can i run 10.5 : 1 compression without detonation if i do a good polish job on the combustion chambers? How far can i shave the heads before i have problems with valve clearance or timing belt lengths and geometry issues.
    I know that's a lot to process but i'd be happy to hear some wisdom on any bits or pieces of those questions if not the lot.
    Thanks ,
     
  21. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    All the blocks are pretty much the same (even the turbo block), except in 1988-89 when they went to smaller main journals in the block/crank, in 95 Ford did away with the hole for the distributor in the block. So you can use a block up to 1994 (as long as it has the hole for a distributor), and any 4 plug head will bolt on the block. The 8 plug heads have totally different intake ports so there are no after market intakes that will fit those heads. You can get a factory roller cam from 1988 and up Ranger from a salvage yard, it's a lot cheaper than getting a roller cam setup from the aftermarket. If you decide to go with 10.5 compression you can go with cast, or hyperutectic pistons (I've done it, but you will need to keep the engine out of detonation so you don't kill pistons). With todays pump gas I wouldn't go more than 9.0 to 9.5 compression. If you raise the compression by milling the head, or dome piston check your valve to piston clearance closely (also depending on what cam you decide to use) you will turn a non-interference engine to a interference engine which will bend valves or worse should the cam belt should break. A better alternative to milling the head would be to get the crankshaft out of a 97-2001 Ranger with the 2.5L. The 2.5 has a longer stroke than the 2.3, the only other difference is the 2.5 has a shorter compression height (the 2.3 and 2.5 use the same connecting rods), the extra stroke will help raise the compression.
    I don't think that the projection will have too much cfm because the injectors supply the fuel, it's not depending on the ventury like a carburator has to to supply fuel
     
  22. deuce16ga
    Joined: May 22, 2011
    Posts: 9

    deuce16ga
    Member
    from arkansas

    Thanks for your insight. i have a factory roller setup in a mustang head and a ranger 2.5
    complete engine with low miles. i actually got to drive the ranger engine just before i pulled it to do an electric conversion for a friend so i know its sound. is there anything special or version different about the balance shaft that drives the distributor?
     
  23. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    When Ford did away with the distributor hole in 95 they moved the oil pump to where the auxilliary shaft that used to drive the dist/cps. I haven't had a chance to get a good look at the 95, and up 2.3/2.5 blocks with the relocated oil pump (there hasn't been hardly any of them in salvage yards like the u-pull-it types around here).
     
  24. deuce16ga
    Joined: May 22, 2011
    Posts: 9

    deuce16ga
    Member
    from arkansas

    well i hope to tear this one down in a few weeks and if i can figure out how to attach pics to the post i'll break out my calipers and post some. it looks like i'll have the johnny cash Cadillac version of a lima before i'm cruising it. do you think 250hp is a reasonable goal for this engine in a daily driver or am i being unrealistic?
     
  25. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member

    Any more than 200hp without a turbo wouldn't be very daily driver "friendly", you can run 200/350hp with a turbo (just by adjusting boost pressure) and still be a good daily driver.
     
  26. Hey Kenneth, Hey Everyone,
    I just wanted a confirmation about some things said on the original post, and my questions, just to make sure before I make a move on real parts. This is about the 2.0. Is there an EAO and a non-EAO 2.0 (70's era, not later)?

    The 2.3 head (and therefore intake, exhaust, Ranger roller cam, etc.) fits the 2.0 EAO?

    Is the bellhousing bolt pattern the same for a 2.0 and 2.3, therefore allowing a 2.3 T5 to bolt to the 2.0?

    A 2.3 Duraspark will work on a 2.0? Did the 2.0 ever come with a Duraspark? I'm thinking no because it was older.

    I'm planning a high-MPG build and was leaning toward a Toyota 2T/3T hemi 4-banger. But, if I can swap 2.3 parts onto a 2.0 then I'm leaning ford again.

    Thanks,
    Kurt
     
  27. madragon199
    Joined: May 23, 2011
    Posts: 4

    madragon199
    Member
    from UK

    Hi all.. Very informative...
    I am building a 2 ohc (pinto) its the european version so i guesse its the 2.0 EAO, we have 3 choices of block the 2.0 the 205 and 200 block ,the 200 block being the best,,

    I was also thinking if a different head would fit the block.. i think from memory the bore centres are 4.014" spaced..


    Any ideas or advice ..cheers madragon
     
  28. CutawayAl
    Joined: Aug 3, 2009
    Posts: 2,144

    CutawayAl
    Member
    from MI

    There is a long standing SCCA racing class called Sports 2000. The cars use 2.0L Pinto engines with limited modifications allowed. Shops and racers in that class, and people supplying them parts and services, know a lot about the engine.
     
  29. Kenneth S
    Joined: Dec 15, 2007
    Posts: 1,527

    Kenneth S
    Member



    None of the 2.3/2.5, and the 1983-1988 Ranger 2.0 (Lima) engine parts will not interchange with the 2.0 EAO engine (the 83-88 Ranger 2.0 is a de-bored 2.3, and the ranger 2.0 block can not be bored out to fit a 2.3 piston). The bell housing bolt pattern between the 2.0/2.3/2.5 Lima engine is slightly different from the 2.0 EAO engine (The EAO engine was also available in Europe in 1.3, and 1.6 displacements, but they were never imported to the U.S.).
    Fords initial plan for the Lima engine was to make all the parts interchangeable with the EAO engine, but due to the newer manufacturing technology at the time in which the the Lima engine was being planned Ford determined that it was impractical to design the Lima engine to accept parts from the EAO engine.
    The best way to sum it up is that the EAO, and Lima engines are like identical twins at first, but once you get to know them you will notice minor differences between the two.
     
  30. Third DodgeBrother
    Joined: Apr 18, 2009
    Posts: 196

    Third DodgeBrother
    Member

    I'm retro fitting my 87 2.3 to carb/duraspark II. The guys at the parts store only know year/model. So.... what year/model will get me to duraspark?

    Lenny
     
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