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Just destroyed the crank sprocket on a brand new Cloyes timing set for SBC....

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Hitchhiker, Sep 20, 2012.

  1. So I just got done installing a new Cloyes double roller timing set on a SBC. Something wasn't right so it came back apart....

    .....This is what I found.

    Any ideas?

    PS. This isn't a bash on Cloyes. I've been using them for years and never had a problem till now, and will continue to use them if I can.....provided this doesn't happen again. I am more just interested in what went wrong.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 20, 2012
  2. What did you use to install it?
     
  3. My hand? I had the whole thing assembled and running but the oil pan developed new leaks so I took things back apart to reseal EVERYTHING. It had only been around the block.
     
  4. That happens pulling them off with a two ear puller.
    Did the same thing to a brand new gear.

    Now you'll have a extra chain and a top gear. Ask me how I kniw
     

  5. It happened before I took it off.
     
  6. Ooooohhhh!! That's not good.
    Thank goodness for a leaky oil pan
     
  7. There appears to be a nick of some sorts at the area of the break. This is probably the start of it. Now I have to ask (not accuse).... Did you use a hammer when installing?

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Don's Hot Rods
    Joined: Oct 7, 2005
    Posts: 8,319

    Don's Hot Rods
    Member
    from florida

    Hmmm, Cloyes makes some good stuff so I would suspect something was misaligned or the chain wasn't in the groove right or something. Not saying you did anything wrong, it just takes a bit of torque to pull teeth off like that.

    I would call them tomorrow and run it by them. The problem now is that you are going to be wondering if the new one is ok hidden under the timing cover and it will bug you.

    Don
     
  9. I know! right!
     
  10. Yea, I have a cloyes on a new motor that hasn't been fired yet. I'm worried.
     
  11. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,933

    squirrel
    Member

    Did someone sneak into the box before you got to it, and beat on the sprocket with a hammer?

    I have no clue what really happened. That's definitely odd. Is it possible something got stuck in the chain?

    is there any evidence of wierdness on the chain, or the cam sprocket?
     
  12. Well, I am in contact with them and have sent them the pictures. I'm hoping it is just a isolated incident, as I want to continue using their products. Another thing is that this gear DOESN'T have USA stamped in it and it is a weird color compared to the 20 year old NOS Cloyes double roller timing set I have on the parts shelf and the replacement single roller I used on it IS stamped USA and similar in color to my NOS one. I wonder if the gear missed heat treatment? I'll have to get a picture up of the NOS one I have.
     
  13. There isn't really any other apparent damage. I have wondered if someone replaced it with another then returned the part....but it has a Cloyes part number on it, just no USA stamp like I am use to.
     
  14. Don's Hot Rods
    Joined: Oct 7, 2005
    Posts: 8,319

    Don's Hot Rods
    Member
    from florida

    I think Jim might have a very good point. Any more parts stores take back stuff without checking it and put it back into inventory. You may have gotten a return that some neanderthal beat on with a hammer to make it go on.

    All of us have been handed parts at the parts store with stuff missing and greasy fingerprints all over the box. I make them go back and give me one that is sealed when I catch that.

    A while back I found a part hanging on a peghook at a store that had been returned damaged so I mentioned it to the store manager. He said thanks, but 3 weeks later when I went back for something else the same part was hanging in the same place ! :mad: So much for employees caring about their customers any more.

    Don
     
  15. here is the NOS set I have.
     

    Attached Files:

  16. If I used a hammer I wouldn't be asking this.... It slid right on.
     
  17. MRTS33
    Joined: Aug 17, 2011
    Posts: 207

    MRTS33
    Member

    Look like it was hungry!!!

    Really it looks like something got caught in chain and broke the teeth. Where did all the little dings in the gear come from? Whats the chain look like? You pulling the pan? Curiosity would get me
     
  18. Hmmmm possible. I am the same way though....and the box was clean before I got it.....now it's a oily mess since I didn't clean it before I stuck it back in. ....but that is besides the point. :)
     
  19. Hmmm good point. The little dings were in it when I got it. Pan comes off tomorrow....
     
  20. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,933

    squirrel
    Member

    I think I would have stopped when it slid right on, they're supposed to be a press fit, aren't they?
     
  21. It took some muscle, it's not like it was easy and I can't get them off with out a puller.... I've never had to hammer one on.
     
  22. I am with the group about it being something other than Cloyes.
     
  23. last picture. NOTE" no USA stamp
     

    Attached Files:

  24. afaulk
    Joined: Jul 20, 2011
    Posts: 1,194

    afaulk
    Member

    What do you bet that sumbitch was MADEINCHINA ?
     
  25. Don's Hot Rods
    Joined: Oct 7, 2005
    Posts: 8,319

    Don's Hot Rods
    Member
    from florida

    Here is a picture off the internet of a Cloyes S 289 sprocket. Note the USA stamp.

    Don

    [​IMG]


    My question to Cloyes would be, do you stamp 100% of your sprockets with USA. If they say yes, I would be back at the place I bought the set originally asking for a refund.

    BTW, what does the timing chain itself look like ? Damage ? I just noticed, your sprocket doesn't even look like the one I pictured. The face is more rounded, not flat like the Cloyes.
     
  26. In fact now that I think about it only once have I ever had to use a harmonic dampener installation tool and a piece of pipe. Chevy's seem to go on pretty easy....or all I work on are pieces of shit....which I'm not denying :rolleyes:
     
  27. Original parts place returned the chain, Gave me oil, filter, and gaskets. I saved the coolant. basically made it right except for the labor. I haven't found obvious damage to the chain but will check closer tomorrow.
     
  28. Thorkle Rod
    Joined: May 24, 2006
    Posts: 1,392

    Thorkle Rod
    Member

    The one that broke appears to be two pieces (but I may be wrong) with solid center and the outer gear appears to have been heated and sweat over the center section, The other gears pictured are all one piece forgings. Has Cloyes claimed that the unit that broke is actually thiers?
     
  29. I have built a bunch of SBCs (hundreds) and used Cloyes, Dyna Gear, Melling and they should never "just slide right on". I see your problem as a mis-alignment issue or an abused part. I will also add that I have never seen one fail like this.
     
  30. outlaw256
    Joined: Jun 26, 2008
    Posts: 2,022

    outlaw256
    Member

    damn hitchiker that could have gotten messy if you hadnt caught it.but since you did show us i went out to the shop to check a couple gears i have, all made by cloyes. thay all have usa stamped in them just as pretty as you please.sure hope they didnt start with the china shit. if they did me and cloyes are done.let us know what they say if you talk to them.oh and by the way ive only had a couple that would just slide on all the way. i usually have to use this big ass socket i bought just for that.
     

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