History Auto racing 1894-1942

I just read through my copy* the "American Automobile Association Contest Rules Revised to Sept. 1st 1922" and there is nothing that I could find that mentions a requirement for a reverse gear.

* The original was donated to the International Motor Racing Research Center (IMRRC) at Watkins Glen and is now a part of their collection.

 

Hi, I bought this engine a couple of days ago. But i dont know what it is..I have now heard that it might be a racing engine and that it probably is quite rare. Does any one know what it is?

 

Thanks for the Eldred Norman snippets and the read McFire.

 

This pic of Carl Fisher at Harlem Chicago 1905 I'm almost certain is the Premier Comet which he raced a lot in 1904-5, it seems to be often confused with the famous holey 1905 Vanderbilt OHC four which is reputed to have been raced by Fisher only once at the 1905 Indiana state fair.



Griff Borgeson describes it as being built from two of the production transverse fours. I've seen no trace of these but for the Model F triple which bears a very strong resemblence to the Marion four





The Model L Premier looks like it has National DNA and Tone's Marion racer looks like it may have had a few Premier half siblings...

 

Barney Oldfield in the 1905 Vanderbilt Premier Chicago 1906...

 

Don, Thank you for the information regarding the AAA reference. You have cleared up a conflict of information for us pertinent to a book we are about to publish entitled: One Fast Car. The Birth of Hisso Racers: Adapting Hispano-Suiza Aero Engines to Dirt Track Racing During the Early 1920s.

 

That moniker Racemaker sounds kind of familiar and a historian to boot. Glad to see you have found your way to this site. Some pretty good stuff to read. I am sure you could add a thing or two on occasion. Welcome-Jim

 

Three photos that Twin6 found of what looks to be fairgrounds racing, came from North Dakota of all places.

The most professional looking of the four cars is the one in the first photo which appears as if it may have been based on some T ford components.

Does this car look familiar to anyone?

 

Welcome to the HAMB! I have some info on the Larry Beales HISSO, the one that was in the 1908 Mercedes GP chassis that was the Spencer Wisehart 1911 and 1912 INDY car earlier.

 

Photos of the still smoldering remains at the Mercedes factory when they lost all of their early 90HP?? cars and had to borrow 60HP?? customers cars to attend the next race.

If I remember correctly they did very well or won the race.

 

Please share any information you might have on the #24 Mercedes-Hisso, much appreciated.

 

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Racemaker, I recall reading something about a land speed attempt car having an electric motor driving directly on one of the tires to provide a means of reversing to comply with the international rules, it may have been the Stewart Enterprise.

 

Yep, the old brain cells haven't gone yet!

The Canstatt fire was in June 1903, just before the Gordon Bennett Trophy. Although The Autocar issued a successful appeal for the loan of 60hp Mercedes to ensure the Germans took part - Alfred Harmsworth and others offered their cars - the three cars used all came from the stock of the company's Paris agent Monsieur Charley.

The race was of course won by the 'Red Devil' himself - Camille Jenatzy. The other two, driven by Foxhall Keene and de Caters, failed to finish.

 

Thanks again.....Did you study the photos at all? I thought it was interesting that it got hot enough to melt the solder in the radiator but all of the brass tubes from the core and the parts of the shell are laying on the ground in front of the car.....Brass melts at about 1700 degrees.....

 

Here is Larry Beales in his Mercedes/HISSO at Pottsville, Pa June 7, 1924. I had the original photo that Larry had sold to Bob Brown in the late 1970's. The Isotta also has a HISSO, the #23 was powered by 1/4 of a Bugatti Areo engine.

 

Hello and thanks for the images, we do have this picture and the news reports on the race. We do know that the middle picture is of Earl Vance in the Hisso car numbered "1", it has been called the "Delage Hisso" and our assumption is that is because the aero engine was originally manufactured by Delage for Hispano Suiza. We had wondered if the chassis was a Daimler but were not set on that thought. We are interested to know your opinion on why it may be an Isotta.

 

E.M.F. 30, winner of the Medium Car Road Race held in Anaheim on July 4, 1912. We could possibly assume that W.J. Weisel the dealer owned or sponsored the car.

 

I thought it was the old Ray Gilhooley INDY Isotta. Could you post any info you have on this event? Sure would like to know were the cars finished. One T is a F.& J. Special out of Philadelphia.

 

For what it's worth:

Altoona Mirror, Sep 6 in 1927

The race in question was the "semi-professional" AAA 50-miler at Altoona Speedway on Labor Day. Ironically, in the "professional" 200-miler on the same track and the same day, Tony Gulotta was on the brink of being disqualified for using that same reverse gear!

 

Thanks Keith.
The gentleman in the photo has been described as Hope Bartlett in a publicity shot for an upcoming race on the outskirts of Sydney.

I did a little searching in what little time i had/have and came across these two later photos of a Dixon Brooklands car. As i said previously, the car was fitted with an IFS but i can't see whether this one has that same suspension and i don't know if this is the car that went to South Africa or Australia but i'm confident it's a 1936 model. Anyway, if you do come across a similar looking Riley on one of your outings, snap a photo of the car and suspension, if you don't mind.

Have fun at Shelsley.

Cheers. Ive.

 

Interesting engine.

Do you have any more information?

 

Racemaker,

Welcome to the HAMB.

 

There were only two 6-cylinder Dixon Rileys, successively modified by Freddie between 1934 and 1936, so you can't really call one a 1936 model. They ran with anything between 1.4 and 2.0 litre engines in period and there were only minor detail differences. If you look closely at those two modern photos, you can see they are actually different cars - compare the aeroscreens and front end treatment. The one on the left is the Majzub car, the one on the right Gillies'.

Neither car went to South Africa although one of Hector Dobbs' cars did. There was also a locally built South African special which may be a further cause of confusion.

This may help, but as you'll see what was or wasn't a "Dixon Riley" or a "Dobbs Riley" is open to interpretation. It also gets confusing when people talk of "Dixon Brooklands Rileys", because technically a Brooklands is a specific model of Riley Nine:

http://forums.autosport.com/lofiversion/index.php/t105987.html

 

Yes, i shoudn't have referred to the car as a '1936 Model'.

 

I like when you post things like this. I go straight to my results records to learn more of the early races but unfortunately this particular race is not listed.

However, the photo of the garage is most probably the first auto repair shop that P.J.Weisel opened after the death of his father in 1908. It was also the first ever auto garage in the Anaheim area. He also opened a Ford dealership later in the area and one of the first in So.Cal.

Perhaps you should post this photo on the E.M.F. site.

 

Kurtis....Good idea.... it is such a wonderful photo.