Looking for info. / pictures of T-BUCKET DRAGSTERS like these...

Storm King,

I did a search on Joel Gruzzman but didn't turn up anything. Wo is he? Are you talking about this car?

http://images6.theimagehosting.com/HRP6 298.bc7.jpg

 

How's this for ideas and inspiration?

 

Could you give us more information on this car. I am a huge fan of New England drag racing history. Thanks

 

WSDAD, no, Joel runs this thing on the west coast. I met the guy back in '01 at the March meet (super fun guy, by the way; reminds me of Mel Brooks) and this thing was really honkin'. His driver kept getting in trouble with track officials becuse the car runs so straight, he was taking his hands of the whhel at 200 plus to do victory salutes, etc. like we used to do in the old days. I'll see what I can dig up on it.

 

Goober, that thing is cool, even has a great engine (BBM). Any details?

 

I agree! That is pretty cool. Any more details would be awesome.

 

It was for sale on eBay about 4 months ago and here are some comments made by the seller to someone on the NTBA bulletin board:

"One bidder wanted to know if I drive it on the highway, I personally have never taken the dragster on the highway, or on a road rally. I have only driven it locally around town. The dragster starts every time and it hasn't ever broke down on me. The 440 Big block does create a lot of heat (440 trait) and it is difficult for the T-bucket radiator to keep up with. So it will run up to 220, but for most people that's not a problem. I can let the dragster idle all day long and it will not overheat. I just took a bidder for a ride the other evening and it lifted the front wheels up a few inches when I shifted to second gear. So keep in mind, that this is a toy that demands respect. Oh, the tunnel ram is really for racing, but it looks great on the dragster. So when you get on it, very very briefly it will stumble before it comes alive, but this is typical with using a racing tunnel ram for street driving. I'm sure if someone was to take the time to tune the carbs and timing you could reduce that slight stumble."

"There is no driveshaft. The trans couples directly to the 3rd member. The engine, trans and rearend are mounted on a radius rod/swingarm type setup that swivels from the frame ahead of the motor."

"The T-Bucket was built in San Antonio, Tx by Roy Thomas. It had a Blown Hemi in it, ET rear wheels with slicks and wheelie bars cause it needed them! One of the prior owners used to street race it in the 70's and 80's. He had also been known to set the wheelie bars high and wheelie the car down some of San Antonio's main streets. It has been to several Rod Runs and in several mags."

 

That thing needs a pair of Cragars!

 

Try Joel Gruzen?

 

I was a member of the Eliminators car club in Pawtucket in the early 60s and were were operating the staging for Charleston drag strip back then, I was the alternate starter in our group.

One member and friend that lived in Seekonk and I joined together and built the rails and fitted the competition fiberglass body on the rails. The motor was a 427 cross bolted big block Ford that we bought from Tasca ford racing. The trans was a 57 ford telephone truck (short tail shaft) that we only used 2nd and third. The fuel injection was an ALGON and we had a vertex magneto, Iski cam and solid lifters the heads were ported and polished ford. We ran at Connecticut drag-way as either B-dragster (with the body removed) or A/Comp with the body.

We also raced the 1/8 mile in Foxboro MA on Wednesday nights plus New England Drag way in New Hampshire, plus Epping in New York.
Sold the rails and body in 69 when I moved to Florida and i build a T-bucked and used the motor in it with three deuces.

 

You are correct, Dr. J

 

Are those shit stains on the seats?

 

Hi Dean, Thank you for the information on your car, it is realy nice. There just hasn't been enough written on the old New England drag racing scene. I realy enjoy hearing from the guys who did it and seeing the photos you have tucked away. It sounds like you have not been up here in a while. The 1/8th mile strip was actually in Norwood, MA, just north of Foxboro. It is now an industrial park. New England Dragway is still there in Epping, NH. Lebanon Valley Dragway in NY still there. Connecticut Dragway closed around 1982, the strip and all the buildings are still there, but no racing. Consumer Reports Magazine owns the property, and test vehicles there. Thanks again Dean

 

Mike Minnett (SP) built one in the Dallas area in the early 70's. Long and black with a big block. I have photos somewhere. He towed a ratty little trailer behind it to Tulsa in 73 for the NSRA Nationals. There was also one in the Houston area about that time that was driven a lot.
I need to dig those albums/photos out so I'll see if I can find some to post.

 

sorry if this is a stupid question, but are these "rail jobs"? i never heard a clear definition of one. thanks

 

Thanks for the corrected info, You are correct it has been a long time and the names are difficult to remember as time goes by. But the cars and good times memories are still with me.

 

"Rail job" is a nickname for dragsters because the early ones weren't much more than a set of frame rails, an engine, a seat, and the adventurous soul sitting in that seat. Do an Internet search for "The Bug" to see what I'm talking about.

Since these are basically "street dragsters" I guess you wouldn't be too terribly wrong to call them "rail jobs". (I'm still looking for the magazine I have that had an article about a couple of cars where they called them "street rails".)

 

thanks for clearing that up. found these if anyone is interested about The Bug
http://www.nhra.com/museum/features/feature10.html
http://www.driveonline.com/content/view/155/86/
http://images.rodandcustommagazine.com/thehistoryof/p154351_image_large.jpg

 

sorry bout that last one, dont know what thats all about

 

That'll do just fine!

I have a few questions: Do you have any pictures of the frame or suspension? When you drove it, did it pick up any rocks, mud, water, rubber or armadillos and throw them at you or the passenger? Did anyone ever get hurt when they inadvertently touched the tires as they were spinning? How comfortable are the seats and driving position? Did you slide around in the seats? If you had it to do over, what would you do differently or better?

That is a cool ride. Thank you for posting it!!!!! Now I can't wait to get mine together! That looks like pure adrenalin!

Edit: Oops! I just read your next post where you say you saw it on ebay so "never mind" about all those questions.

 

That's what I love about the HAMB. Whenever an idea pops in my head, I come here and, viola, it's there. Someone has asked, and there's awesome responses. What I wanna know, is how are you guys getting in my head?


Ironically enough, while unpacking some stuff today, I came across a 1995 issue of Popular Hot Rodding. In the "Reverse Gear" section, there's a picture of what you're looking for, evidently from the August 1965 issue. It's a red T altered, for the street, with a blown 283 and ran 10.71@ 138! It also sez it has a Halibrand quick change, Potvin cam and Offy X shift trans. The owner was Dave Brackett of Fullerton, Ca. The other headline, which I thought was cool too, is Art Arfons Green Monster!

I don't have any way of scanning it, but there's another place to look.

Jay

 

There has got to be a huge number of people on the HAMB. Every time I think I have a new idea, there's always someone else who's thought of it first and has already built it! That's OK, I can learn from them and build on their successes. I wonder how many HAMB members there are?

 

42,000+

 

wsdad, it's been 30 years since I was around that car. I will try to get some info from the owner and builder soon to post on here. I don't have build photos but they might.

Think of the chassis as a regular hot rod frame with extra long ladder bars running up to the center of the engine position. Then realize that the engine & trans are actually mounted to the ladder bars (cradle). The weight of the engine is centered very close to the hinge point of the bars (cradle) so it is nearly neutral to the unsprung rear section. Look at the photos and note how strongly the chromed cradle is built. This set up works best on a long wheel base to minimize rear section travel angles. The rear axle is just suspended at the back with coilovers and a panhard rod like a street rod.

You are correct about the wide rear trac. I didn't ever like the look but it was cool at the time. Roland ran current tech Goodyears slicks on it. I assumed the rear was posi - but I also don't recall any scrubbing on turns either. The trick was to light-up the rears enough to get some speed on before the tires bit - but it got interesting when they did, even at speed! You might say he "peddled it" out!

The slicks didn't really throw much stuff - pebbles and such but on plane with the tire rotation. It didn't take much brains to keep your arms inside the car at all times! The bees in the face at 80 where much more trouble (he didn't have the windshield then).

Ro will smack me for this, but he was always comfortable in the car 'cause he is right at 5 feet tall. I pretty much was stuffed in with my knees in my face!
And you didn't have to worry about sliding around when you have a passenger - the body is just 47" wide.

If I was gonna build a dragster style car today, I would put a real narrow axle out behind the body and tuck the trac down to 45 inches or so. The thing is, this type car is not gonna be a long cruiser deal. So why not put a big 4:88 gear in the rear, build a small, noisy high reving motor and just enjoy the stoplights? Keep it light weight - oh, and run front brakes!!!! Seriously - light cars just "skate" under hard braking with only rears! Trust me on that.

Great to relive some of that shit, thanks and good luck.

 

I imagine the cradle looking something like this...

 

Well, same idea, but just a bit more sophisticated

Keep us posted on what you come up with.

 

Would you lose anything (other than comfort) by solid mounting the engine and rear axle to the frame? Is there an issue with traction on cars with solid mounted rears?

Justin

 

Out of town right now, but will post some images of my uncle's 60's rail that has what you are looking for. Car and article in a 60's mag (Have it at home and thionk it was Car Craft). Car's name was Agitation ! and a really neat piece. Been trying to find it, but to no avail. Will post in the next day or so.
Neat thread!