Hot Rods Does Preformance Really matter anymore

Or look as good!

 

I don't know about that but I do know I race a guy who is 86 still drivin his Flattie FED and I still get a kick out of runnin mine...... and passin it along to my grandson.......

 

ladyhrp expects performance. HRP

 

Does performance matter? Good question, my 36 ford pickup has a built 327, 30 over, flat tops, 300 horse cam, camel hump heads, just like I woulda built when younger, goes good, BUT, my duramax is a friggen good race for it, my gmc weighs a tad over 6500 pounds. The average Honda will wax my old girl, BUT, there aint a car on the road today that sounds and looks like what we drive, and I got bragging rights to those that matter. Yes, performance still matters, that's why they're called hot rods, they may be outmuscled by technology, but they're way more fun to drive, and by the way, still good ways to make time with girls who like excitement. Try that with a Honda.

 

HA! When I was 16, [1964]he 55 chevies with later 283s were considered high performance. Hell, even my folks' 55 olds with a 202 HP 324 was a pretty hot performer.
Now, my kid cruises a 560 HP 'vette ZO-6 with a pro charger...he considers it pretty hot but when we go over to the 1/8 mile drags on Friday nights, the kids performance cars have 4 and 6 cylinders, all wheel drive and one or two hair driers and they'll kick the shit outta his 'vette, my 34 and anything else either of us drives.
He's trying to keep up with the new performance with a 49 ford coupe with a 427 cu.in. twin turbo LS/6 speed. If he ever gets it to hook up, the kids with AWD and 2600 lb subarus with traction control will be smokin a cigarette at the end of the strip.
My idea of performance for my hotrod is still dual quads, headers, high compression and a 4 speed. And I LOVE it! ....I'm sooo far behind!

 

It matters to me!!! Run what you brung and hope you brought ENOUGH!!!

 

I think a flaw in the way you are viewing things and asking your question is that you're looking at hot rodding through the narrow "traditional hot rodding" point of view that those of us on the HAMB love so much. True HAMB'ers that really follow the pre-1965 cutoff most likely do lean towards a reliable engine that stresses reliability over all out power. Vintage speed typically costs a hell of a lot of money if you stray too far from SBC's. Try building a truly fast nailhead, Olds or hemi on a budget. A Ford flathead isn't worth talking about if you're discussing real performance on any type of sane budget.

Those with a broader view of hot rodding today are making more power than ever for what can be a reasonable amount of money. Chevy LS and other late model motors are extremely popular today. They just aren't the focus of the HAMB. If you shut the door at 1965 it's only natural that you create a bit of an exclusive/isolated club. The price of entry is typically high if you want a HAMB friendly car that was actually considered cool back in the day. 4 doors and off brands get built now but they're not what almost anyone wanted 50 years ago. It's just the reality.

I like that the HAMB has the focus it does, but it's a bit niave to be surprised that there arent as many VINTAGE high power motors being used today as back in the day when motors, cars and speed parts where plentiful and affordable. Today's mainstream hotrodders are building Mustangs and Camaros that will embarrass most of what we thought were fast street cars in the 50's through the 70's. Times change for most. We on the HAMB like things the old way. I'm willing to sacrifice all out performance for traditionalism as much as I can financially justify.

 

its also pretty naïve to assume that everyone on here is a one trick pony, and only has a vested interest in "traditional" or as I prefer to think of them, "period correct" hot rods.

 

Old cars just can't compete with modern performance.

The last Cadillac CTS-V we rolled out of the shop had 785-hp, with enough rubber to get it to stick.

Performance matters, just who's performance, from when, and at what price?

 

I agree it would be rough to see a flathead or any other vintage engine with a rod sticking out of the block which is probably why most guys don't build for performance anymore and would hate them selfs for leaning a little too hard on an older engine they spent a barge load of cash on and may be hard to find parts for or even another useable core for rebuilding, except sbc's because they made a godzzllion of them.

 

I don't need Hi-performance...8mpg 500 hp simply to beat some kids honda to the next stoplight..pppffffttt, too damn expensive for me.....where are you going to use that kind of power publicly?
I ain't no quarter miler either....so no, I would rather have a nice dependable power plant for cruising that won't leave its guts on the road and my wallet in my pocket.

 

I care about horsepower to a point; cars are about application. With old cars most cruisers needs no more than 300 horsepower to be fun drivers, race cars as much as you can get. Sure, some guys blur the lines, that's great. It fits their applications.

I find it interesting all the comparisons so of y'all make between new and old cars. It's not really an argument worth making, we know already. Late model muscle is stoooopid fast. Pick up a HotTurd or CarCrapped mag and you'll get all the wet, sticky and creamy late model lovefest you craze. LSx, Hemi, and whatever Fords calling their latest V8.

Personally, I'd rather drive a clapped out slow hoopty than a VW TDI or Audi TurboDouche. That's why I'm on the HAMB.

 

If performance didn't matter there would be no such things as these 785 Hp cars, a Cadillac yet.
My buddy took me for a ride in his 10.70 challanger. It was so well mannered on the street, the drive thru & in traffic that my mom could drive it to the grocery store every day, that is if she didn't mind crawling over the roll bar and could keep her foot out of it. Mash the throttle and you'd better know how to drive. He's a life long mopar nut at 70 now.

Hell my sisters little 6 cylinder Saturn aura will get after it in a way that's not expected.

 

agree

truth is, if an ls motor and all the trimmings were available as a swap back in the 50's and 60's, you bet your bottom dollar they would have been in the cars - so "period correct" is just another phrase for "limited by what the period had", not what they would have done had they had the chance.

 

OK, I know I'm not bulletproof anymore, but the day I say that a nice mild, reliable, and slow car is all I need or want, start shoveling dirt on me....

 

I have 2 327s. The first is a 1964 block bored to 336", 10:1, camel humps, solid cam, 3x2 intake and lake pipes. Backed by a 4 speed. Sounds wicked and runs really strong. My othe r327 is the 5.3ls in my daily driven '05 silverado. It has cnc ported heads, a mild cam, larger throttle body and occasionally long tubes and cat back exhaust and a good tune. Sounds almost stock. Backed by a trans kitted 4l60e and 2600 The truck probably weighs twice as much as the roadster and pRobably gets almost the same mileage. I'm sure the LS would stomp the gen1 on the dyno,but I get far less satisfaction from driving it. It is soulless in comparison. I also have a '99 e39 BMW 540i wagon that is super fast but you can barely hear or feel it running. If you're after absolute speed and performance, it's hard to beat modern engineering. I think as long as you can build the vintage stuff to go as fast as you feel is necessary and within your budget you will derive much more pleasure than what sheer numbers dictate when comparing old to new.

 

A couple of things.

Number 1 - Performance isn't necessarily brute acceleration. It's getting the best of the combination you are working with.

Number 2 - I can't ever remember being on a drag strip return road worrying about some problem I had to deal with in the "real world". Nothing like acceleration and adrenaline to clear your head.

 

These days I get more of a kick out of just driving something the average schmo looks at and wishes he could drive and be different instead of the other billion cars just like his that he just paid 50K for. At least that's what I hope he's thinking...

I haven't seen two cars square off on the street around here in many, many years.

 

The local kids still street race, but they're doing it with modern little cars.

 

Yeah, but traditional/period correct is all we are suppose to discuss on this sight. By Speed Gems posting on the HAMB I felt pretty safe in assuming he was referring to HAMB friendly cars. We don't come her to discuss late model motors and cars.

 

I guess the term can be defined many ways. I always want the best performance out of whatever I build or work on. I'll play with jetting and carb settings, ignition and a good charging system on a Packard so it can run to it's full potential. The cars I have in planning stages, while they can be considered high perf to a point, don't have anything on deck to modify or fully build into a fire breathing road car. My latest project has a fresh stock flattie in it and will probably stay that way for a while as I shake down the rest of the "performance" parameters. Road manners, fuel mileage, reliability, it all matters. Who cares about 550 lb/ft of torque if it doesn't steer or stop nice and straight? If it seems to want to boil over when the mercury pushes up past 80? I think it's better that you can cruise to a meet 60 miles away and not be worn out by the drone of the exhaust. That going to that meet doesn't mean your budget for the day has to include $8.00/gal race fuel. I was brow beat to hell when I got the 61 Chevy. "You gotta put a 409 in that thing!!" Sure I do. That's just what I need, a wicked high compression "W" motor that makes 400+HP and gets 6-8 MPG. Just driving to "Sins of Steel" from my place would cost over $100 in fuel. There may indeed be a way out of that cost, but then we're talking a low compression detuned pig that still sucks up premium fuel at the same rate. Doesn't sound like fun to me. Even the GTO project will stay all stock and tuned for pump gas, but I expect it will be less than stellar in the 1/4 mi dept. And I don't care if it is as long as it starts easy and runs cool, that I can rely on it to get me home from a 3 hr drive to a meet somewhere. Yet after all of that I still have that little devil on my left shoulder. I try to take in a local "heads up" race once a month at the track. I get there and almost feel like a little kid, in hurry to get up to the fence and see the racing. A couple years ago I almost scratched the itch and wanted to make the 61 a racer. The next morning I grabbed a milk crate with a cup of coffee and started measuring and looking, figured out how to run roll bar tubing down the rockers next to the floor under the car, then I grabbed a couple catalogs and started sorting out what I needed for the BBC I had in the corner. In my head I'm thinkin "I could do this." Then I was at over $5K in engine parts before any machine work. Gears and spools are more now too. While I could indeed do all of it I also came to my senses realizing that I'd end up racing it and tuning it alone like last time. That I really don't care for bracket racing any more which is about all that could be done with it short of professional level sponsorship or extended travel running with various nostalgia groups. I like fast, obnoxious, compression that rattles windows, but not all day any more. Even my sleds, I've come to the conclusion that a 175 HP 2 stroke is a dinosaur. Fussy little .8 liter attention whore. Scary fast when it's right but we don't race each other any more. Time for a 4 stroke (still powerful) so I can just sit on my fat ass and steer for most of the miles, but also since they're 4 stroke there's always room for a "blue bottle tune up", right? I guess it just matters less than in days past, but in some ways it does matter for sure.

 

Totally agree with you Highlander. As I get older I'm not as concerned about all out acceleration and horsepower in my hobby cars. I still want good looking V8's with decent power but being able to cruise them out of state to shows without breaking my wallet on fuel is probably more important. I also want some comfort for my wife and kids (and me!). The fact that my late model (2006) daily driver has 450 HP and a 6 speed manual has also lessened my need for focusing on all out performance in my hobby cars.
I still admire the guys that build the crazy over the top vintage motors. They rule. Just don't fit my lifestyle and budget right now.

 

I'm not into big engines and terminal velocity anymore, if I can keep up to the freeway average I'm happy. That being said, I can look over at the Caddy, Vette, Mustang, or BMW, at a stoplight and think to myself, "I can buy one like yours, can you build one like mine." It has become more about "my" performance, not the "car's" performance.

Edit: my latest acquisition is an off topic Triumph Spitfire, it has a whole 67 hp, but is one of the most enjoyable cars I've ever owned. Why, because it makes my wife smile when we go for ice cream in it.

 

When I was street racing in the 80s all I cared about was the next engine build, used to change engines every year, bigger and badder. As time went on the racing stopped, decades flew by and gas prices made it crazy (for me anyway) to pay to drive a BB chevy every day to work and all over. I still have the big blocks under the shelf and they will come out again for weekend toy builds, but my old car daily driver builds now are made to run on junk gas and 300HP is enough. Just getting to drive the old iron and work on them is what love to do and nobody lives forever, so the more I can drive this old stuff the better.
That said I am not dead and do miss the "stupid" engines, so the current F1 build has much more power than needed and will be a noisy tire smoker. Thing is it is not my only hot rod so I dont feel so bad if I can only drive it once in awhile, but if I only had one I would stick with getting the most use out of it. For me anyway it is a lot of fun driving to car shows hours away in old iron instead of leaving it home or dragging it on a trailer.

 

Some of us on here, a very few, are still hot rodders. As for being a "traditional" hot rodder as defined by most of the members on this forum, I don't see anything traditional about it, and a lot of you, well we aren't even in the same hobby...
Joe civilian doesn't even look sideways at my daily,and the rod-a-billies look down their noses at it. But it will flat bury 90% of the cars on here, and when I poke the pedal, it gives me satisfaction that the 90% of you will never know about, and my guess is, never have known about. Its called "driving a hot rod" with the emphasis on the DRIVING, not "being seen in". Don't really give a shit about the latter, to be honest. Funny thing is, by my standards, and the standards of most of the guys I hang around with, it isn't even that quick.
When my '39 is finished, I'll be freshening my FE, adding a set of CNCed Rabotnik heads and a tunnel wedge intake, and dumping it in the O/T (oooooh the shame....) '65 falcon I just bought, and that will be a honest 9 second street car. Even the '39, which is 101% period correct, right down to the cam profile, should run 13's, just like a REAL (notice I didn't say "traditional", that word doesn't taste right in my mouth after reading through this steaming heap of poser dung) hot rod should have in 1961.
I don't buy this "I've outgrown performance" bullshit, I'm 55, Larry T is older than me, I've seen Hotroddon's convert on here, and I know he's older than me. My guess is, most of the guys that are 'bragging" (seriously, guys on a "traditional" hot rod site BRAGGING about not giving a shit about their cars performance, KEEERIIIIST! is THIS what this place has come to??) have never owned a car that would generate a 12 second time slip in their sad little lives, and really don't know what they are talking about.
As to the O/P, Performance is only dead here on the HAMB. On every other forum I am on, its primary, and the "look at me" guys are shunted off to the side. this is the only place where that is turned on its head.

Highlander still gets it in his gut, he just doesnt know it yet. Once you've danced with the devil, you always go back...

 

After reading this, I am PROUD to say I am not a true HAMBer.

I am a true HOT RODDER.

 

That's true but in the case of small block Chevys for example (which most cars have) and other more modern v8's we now have much better cams, and TON'S more aftermarket goodies for these engines that are still plentiful. The flatheads are pretty much played out with the Isky Max 1 and 400 jr. cams but other manufactures like Schaefer and Chris Nelson still grind cams for old engines and then theirs custom pistion's (metric rings) longer rods etc. etc. all relatively cheap so do you build it with a more moderns cam and higher CR or build it basically stock with a 9.5:1 CR and the latest rumpity rump cam in it and a "period correct" manifold, carb, and valve covers

 

Fuck, you know, I really cant get over this. Bragging, actually BRAGGING, in PUBLIC, on a HOT ROD forum about not giving a shit about performance... SWEET JESUS!! After reading this thread, I feel like I need a goddam shower...

 

Don't hold it in Falcongeorge!

 

I know YOU are with me Seb. Sounds like its time to man the barricades, the crybaby doll brigade has arrived! Its last goddam stand at the Alamo here guys, the bastards have been right under our noses, and they are storming the gates...Better boil some oil...