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View Full Version : A little cross member tech for the AV8 guys...


Kevin Lee
12-10-2003, 04:42 PM
I guess it's common knowledge that the preferred cross member for putting a flatty in an A frame is the 32 "K member". It is proven and there's no arguing that it looks great but a good 32 piece is getting harder to find. Factor in ebay and that means your chances of finding an original 32 Ford Deuce hot rod rat Guide 682c E&J 1932 cross member are slim unless you're ready to part with some dough. Repops are available and I've heard V. Tardel now makes one "precut" and ready to fit in an A frame which rules - but that's not what this post is about.

There are probably plenty of overlooked candidates for this but the one I'm covering is the '39 Ford. That's what I had so that's what I made work. Of course being a hotrodder yourself you understand this. I'm going to concentrate mainly on the pedals and the transmission & motor mounts. Hot rods being what they are I'm going to leave it up to you to determine proper placement between the frame rails fore and aft. This is going to be quick since the picture does most of the talking.

I'll start with the pedals. What you are basically doing is taking the front holes of the assembly and bolting them into the rear holes in the X. First you need to remove the stock trans mount as it is right where some of your linkage will need to be. You can grind off the rivet heads and drive them out with a punch but I have always had better luck just drilling them out completely. You will also need to drill two new holes in the X for the rear of the pedal assembly and cut a large hole for all of the linkage for the clutch and master cylinder to work through. The easiest way to accomplish this is to remove the pedal assembly and trace a cardboard template of the hole layout directly from the X. Move the front holes in the cardboard to the rear holes in the X and trace the hole placement directly onto the new location on the X. Drill the two holes and cut along the dotted line for the center opening for the linkage. Done. You could fill in the stock holes the linkage used to work through but they don't look out of place plus they mirror the matching holes on the opposite legs of the X. I'm a sucker for symetry so I left them.

Next is the trans mount. It's as simple as drilling two holes in the top of the X and inserting the biscuit hardware. You have already removed the stock mount (remember?) so there should be no clearance problems with the bottom of the trans. This whole operation moves the transmission back and up about three inches or so. Take this into account when building your engine mounts. It is probably easier to build from the front back concerning engine mounts but I can't tell you for sure since I just plugged along with everything falling into place. Serendipity. What you end up with is something that looks like this. As a bonus your clutch linkage lines up perfectly. I don't know how...it just does. This is the "magic broccoli" part of the photo. I just threw that in because I thought zibo's post with it was funny and I'm jealous because he's putting miles on his RPU and my car is still in pieces in a basement. Any questions?

Kevin Lee
12-10-2003, 04:54 PM
Another view.

Bruce Lancaster
12-10-2003, 04:54 PM
And it's even traditional--suggested by California Bill back in '52 and in the old HRM articles on building A-V8's.
I think one of the key attractions of the '32 for early builders was simplicity.
It could be slotted into a pretty much intact car. Using a '39 means your car most likely won't be together quick enough to get you to work Monday...

286merc
12-10-2003, 05:39 PM
Let me see if I understand this correctly.

You took a 39 X and fit it between A rails along with the pedal & brake stuff.

Did you section the X or is it full height? Cant get the perspective from the pic.

The engine sits 3" back or 3" higher? If back doesnt that put the firewall almost on your foot?

I also used a 39 X but preferred a C4 behind the flatty.
Used the Dagle Super X as a How-To instead of trying to reinvent the wheel. Cut and sectioned the 39 to fit.
With a T coupe body there wasnt a spare inch to give up, in fact I wish I had extended the body & frame 6". Maybe the next one.

Kevin Lee
12-10-2003, 06:07 PM
39 X and all of it's brake and clutch pedal bits between the rails - Yes.

I pinched the X on each end. I attached an old picture. Sectioning the height along the entire length would be insane work - you did that?

The engine sits where it normally should I suppose. I've got room for a radiator in front of the fan and I didn't have to recess the firewall so I'd say that's right. Haha - I don't measure much. The frame is stock length from the firewall forward. I had to move the TRANSMISSION back about three inches from it's intended mounts on the X and it's obviously higher than it was meant to be mounted on the 39 X. To be completely honest I welded in the 39 part before I had any idea what motor, trans, etc I was going to use. I knew the X would need some work but it wasn't until the moment raven61 and I dropped the engine in place that we looked at it and realized how easy this would be. DUMB LUCK. A few weeks later I had the pedals worked out. GOOD KARMA. Sometimes it seems like this car was meant to be. Other times I bang my head against a wall for weeks trying to figure out the smallest stupid detail.

TV
12-10-2003, 06:24 PM
Grim, I can't tell if the leg of the X member on the drivers side is in the way of stock location of a steering box,or would it go just in front?If you run a box way up front and joint it, it won't be trad and won't fit what you have, I think this is an important look to the overall feel of the car.--TV http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Unkl Ian
12-10-2003, 06:26 PM
I think the price of Magic Broccoli just went up. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Rocky
12-10-2003, 06:41 PM
Very nice.......when I got my 33 pickup, both legs of the X were hacked up sumthun fierce. I should have used the entire X from my donor 41 pickup [35-40 passenger car] frame but didn't. I simply cut the left frame leg out, with it's pedals and master cylinder. Grafted the leg into the 33 frame and called the junk guy to haul off the donor frame before I thought to save the right X-leg......next time I'll use your method. Nice goin, Grim.

Elrod
12-10-2003, 06:43 PM
Hey man! great post! I have been trying to figure out what the center section of my A-V8 would be, and until now I thought it was going to be a home built job. Why not an X member? Just a note to you all that Mopars of the 30s had a similar X. Might broaden the hunt.

Thanks Grim!

NealinCA
12-17-2003, 01:56 PM
Another one BTTT.

I didn't comment on this last week, but that looks great. You were really lucky that things lined up when you finally decided to go all early Ford drivetrain.

I look forward to seeing the finished product.

Neal

monkeybiker
02-09-2006, 02:59 PM
In the absence of the real deal, I fabbed up my own Clark. Glad I did - it's torsionally way stiffer - well, you've driven it!
If you bid on that piece and get it, and then change your mind (!), let me know cos I'm doing the same again on my T chassis...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v321/hotrodfil/my23T/t-chassis.jpg

Crusty Nut
02-09-2006, 03:29 PM
A friend of mine did this very thing last weekend. He said he whittled the X down to nearly nothing and took a long pie cut out of the rear legs to section them. All welded up the frame is really rigid.

loudpedal
02-09-2006, 03:48 PM
That’s what I’m doing to my Roadster thanks to a picture I saw of Kev’s frame a while ago… Good idea for sure!

monkeybiker
02-09-2006, 04:56 PM
Hey Clark! Planning a flathead 8 then?! VSCC ain't gonna like that, nosirree!

Tuck
02-09-2006, 05:07 PM
nice dude... that worked out sweet.

flathead31coupe
04-13-2007, 07:19 PM
great info, i guess i need to get the engine mounts in the right place, then build from the front back...

Chris Casny
04-13-2007, 07:41 PM
Nice, I will be using your tech on my next project.