View Full Version : Quick Change Rear Ends


modifieddriver
03-09-2005, 02:52 PM
I've seen so many posts on Quick Change Rear Ends lately that my head is starting to hurt, along with my rear end! Let's separate facts from fiction.

To eliminate the confussion about a V8, Sprint Car, Heavy-Duty, Midget, mini-Q/C, 3/4 ton Banjo style non-Q/C, open-tube, closed-tube, open-drive, closed-drive, double splined axles, flanged axles, 5 on 5, wide-five and other stuff (including a Hot Rod Q/C's) take a look at these web sites:

http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs.htm (http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs.htm)

http://www.franklandracing.com/ (http://www.franklandracing.com/)

Winters 2005 catalog is on line and it includes "Everything you wanted to know about Q/C's, but were afraid to ask your buddy 'cause he didn't know shit either!"

They tell ya' how much power you can run through one, axle splines, carrier types, 9" Ford axles etc.,etc.

A Winters is a Frankland copy. I can interchange Frankland, Winters, Jones and other makers parts, so long as they are the same style (and there are several).

In 1974 I replaced my worn out Halibrand with a new Winters. The Halibrand Championship rear is like a Winters Sprint car rear. A Frankland is like a Winters Heavy Duty. The same Q/C gears work in either one, so long as it's a 10 spline rear end. I know that three years ago that same 1974 vintage rear end was still seeing oval track abuse!

I have 10 of these Heavy Duty(HD) style Q/C's. Five are under cars and the rest are stacked up like cord wood. Oh yeah, I missed one little Halibrand open tube midget rear end. Now just about all the parts of these 10 HD rears will interchange.

These things aren't rocket science. It's easier to rebuild a Q/C than a GM 10 or 12 bolt rear end! Also think about how different they look and sound!!!!!

LOST ANGEL
03-09-2005, 03:41 PM
Thanks, Modified, excellent info.-MIKE:cool:

SamIyam
03-09-2005, 03:48 PM
Do they make open tube rear ends that would be wide enough for a street roadster?

I always wanted to put one in one... Got any pics of how they attach?


Sam.

modifieddriver
03-09-2005, 05:11 PM
Do they make open tube rear ends that would be wide enough for a street roadster?

I always wanted to put one in one... Got any pics of how they attach?


Sam.

Sam,

Go to those web sites and it'll show you what you need.

Remember, an open tube rear has no differential, and there's no provision to use one.

You'll have to use rear axle carriers that slide over the open tube with radius rods. Then ya' need to make sure the rear end center section won't rotate. This is where you'll use a torque tube drive or a torque arm.

Myself, I wouldn't run this on the street, especially on a small light car. Ya' turn the steering wheel and the car will still go straight!!!!!

Rand Man
03-09-2005, 10:07 PM
Thanks for the info. I had missed this post before.

Hot Rod To Hell
03-10-2005, 12:07 AM
Winters 2005 catalog is on line and it includes "Everything you wanted to know about Q/C's, but were afraid to ask your buddy 'cause he didn't know shit either!"

They tell ya' how much power you can run through one, axle splines, carrier types, 9" Ford axles etc.,etc.
Maybe I'm blind, but I couldn't find this information on either of those sites:confused:

modifieddriver
03-10-2005, 06:34 AM
Maybe I'm blind, but I couldn't find this information on either of those sites:confused:

Time to schedule an appointment with your optometrist.

Here's just a sample of what's on the Winter site.

Frequently Asked Questions

One owner since 1958, Winters Performance Products manufactures the best quick change rear ends ever made. Mostly used in circle track racing, quick change rear ends work very well in street applications. In most cases the Championship 10" Quick Change is more rear end than you'll ever need (800+hp). Our V8 Quick Change is rated at 550 hp while the 3.08 and the Heavy Duty Championship Quick Change can be used in more severe applications (1000+hp). Keep in mind severe shock loading (drag racing) will shorten the life of all drive line components.

All Winters Quick Change Rears use spiral bevel ring & pinions, the most efficient ring & pinion available. Pinion placement of a spiral bevel ring & pinion uses less power, is more efficient, and runs cooler than hypoid ring & pinions. Hypoid style ring & pinions create more sliding action, increasing heat and power loss.



•What type of oil should I use in my Winters Rear End?
Use a good quality lube, such as Winters 80-90-140 semi synthetic with moly.

•What oil level should I maintain in my Winters Rear End?
At two places. 1. The rear end cavity. 2. Quick change gear cavity. (see figure 1 below) Do Not over-fill!! Too much tube causes excessive heat!
Full Size Rears
Maintain oil level at 2" below axle center line. Make sure the car is level when checking oil.
V8/Mini
Maintain oil level at 1 3/4" below axle center line. Make sure the car is level when checking oil.




http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs/03StreetRodRears/images/faqArt.GIF









•How do I fill my Winters Rear End and quick change gear cavity with oil?
The fill plug is located on the left side bell. The level plug is in the right side bell. Optional pinion inspection plug in the right bell may be used as a fill plug. Do not use inspection plug to determine fluid level.

•Ring Gear Bolt torque specifications.
Threaded Ring Gear Bolts-60 Ft. Lbs. using red thread lock.

•Thru bolt torque specifications.
Full size rears (7/16" thru bolts) 35 Ft Lbs.
Mini/V8 (3/8" thrubolts) 25 Ft Lbs.

•Side bell stud torque specifications.
Full size rears (7/16" studs) 35 Ft Lbs.
Mini/V8 (3/8" studs) 30 Ft Lbs.

•How do I install a side tube in a side bell?
DO NOT TORCH! Bell cracking may occur. Place the tube in a 5 gallon pail filled with ice. Make sure that the bell is clean and free of chemicals or flammable materials. Heat the side bell in an oven to 270-300F. Vaseline the bell bore and drop the tube into the bell.

•Can I weld brackets to my steel side tubes?
Yes. Weld a series of 1/2" long "tracks" along the bracket starting at the ends then alternate back and forth towards the center. Long continuous welds will heat and "draw" the tubing, causing distortion.

•Can I use helical quick change gears in my Winters Rear end?
Helical cut gears, although not recommended in racing applications, do have their advantages in street applications. Quick change gear noise at highway speeds can be reduced with helical cut gears versus conventional straight cut gears. Q.C. gear end play (clearance) must be limited to .010 max.

http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs/03StreetRodRears/images/faqFig1Oil.GIF
























Winters ensures the nostalgic racing legend lives on. Whether you're cruising across country or slamming rubber to the next stop, Winters has a passion for the basic combination that few others understand. High quality Castings ... Unsurpassed Workmanship ... Nostalgic Look ...

Hot Rod To Hell
03-10-2005, 09:18 AM
Where the hell was that?

http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs/2005WintersPerformance/faq.htm (http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs/2005WintersPerformance/faq.htm)DOES NOT have that information.

Do they have 2 Faq pages in different places???:confused:

Hot Rod To Hell
03-10-2005, 09:46 AM
Anyway, thanks Modified Driver... That information was very helpful, even if it was hard to find!:o

If the new version will handle 800-1000 HP, the older version should be good for the 500-ish I'll be putting down.:)

joeycarpunk
03-10-2005, 09:51 AM
Excellent info and timely in my case.

modifieddriver
03-10-2005, 10:11 AM
Where the hell was that?

http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs/2005WintersPerformance/faq.htm (http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs/2005WintersPerformance/faq.htm)DOES NOT have that information.

Do they have 2 Faq pages in different places???:confused:



They have several catalog sections. Make sure you scroll down on their home page.

Let's try this :) .

http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs.htm

http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs/03StreetRodRears/index1024.htm

I'm not a computer guru, so I hope this works ;) .



I just tried it and it worked for me. Good luck!! :D

Flat Ernie
03-10-2005, 12:25 PM
They have several catalog sections. Make sure you scroll down on their home page.

Let's try this :) .

http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs.htm

http://www.wintersperformance.com/catalogs/03StreetRodRears/index1024.htm

I'm not a computer guru, so I hope this works ;) .



I just tried it and it worked for me. Good luck!! :D

Dunno - I can't get to anything anywhere on Winters site. It just sits there with a blank page. I've tried two computers & two different days now - no luck (maybe the HAMB is jamming it up!) I'll keep trying...

modifieddriver
03-10-2005, 04:46 PM
Dunno - I can't get to anything anywhere on Winters site. It just sits there with a blank page. I've tried two computers & two different days now - no luck (maybe the HAMB is jamming it up!) I'll keep trying...

I just clicked on the web site address in your post and i went right through, no problem at all!!!

krooser
03-10-2005, 10:27 PM
Good info....don't be afraid of these cool pieces...

Hot Rod To Hell
03-10-2005, 10:29 PM
So with out trying to sound TOO retarded, does anyone make anything like a "service manual" for QC rears?

I have messed with GM 10 & 12 Bolts, and Ford 9" rears, but I don't even have the slightest clue where to start on inspecting my QC to make sure it's run-able...

Flat Ernie
03-11-2005, 03:18 AM
So with out trying to sound TOO retarded, does anyone make anything like a "service manual" for QC rears?


Speedway sells one for Halibrand Champ I think...

:cool:

modifieddriver
03-11-2005, 06:16 AM
[QUOTE=Hot Rod To Hell]So with out trying to sound TOO retarded, does anyone make anything like a "service manual" for QC rears? QUOTE]



Doesn't sound retarded to me.:) "You'll never know unless you ask!!!"

I don't recall an "official manual", but there's enough info in the catalogs that should get you going.

I'd call Winters or Frankland on the phone and ask. Maybe they have something online. I'm sure you aren't the first to ask this question.

Hot Rod To Hell
03-18-2005, 10:45 PM
Ok... now I have more questions!:rolleyes:

The axle that I have is a 12 spline, 32 1/2" from the INSIDE of the flange to the tip of the axle. (3/4 ton truck style)

I was told it was out of a 48 Stude truck, sound right?

Anything else that would fit?

The axle tubes are the same exact length from center section to backing plate, so the axles should in theory be the same too, right? (I'll double check to be sure)


There are no seals on the ends of the axle tubes... looking at the exploded views on the above mentioned websites don't show the axle tubes, but they show a seal just INSIDE the bell.
Are the axle tubes dry?
How do the outer bearings get lube?


Sorry if these are dumb questions... this is the first time I've ever messed with this type of rear...:o

Thanks guys!

wingnutz
03-18-2005, 11:07 PM
Sorry if these are dumb questions... this is the first time I've ever messed with this type of rear...:o

This board is awesome...!

No dumb questions except for the ones not asked..!

I bought my first Q.C. 28 years ago and my lack of information cost me dearly...!

Here you can get the straight scoop from some very knowledgeable builders and direct access to the manufacturer.:cool:

kellym
09-04-2007, 09:01 PM
How do I mount my P&J ladder bar brackets onto my winters qc? can I simply unbolt the tubes from the side bells? will the tubes just slide out? what do I re-torque the bolts to that hold the tubes to the side bells?

krylon32
09-04-2007, 09:29 PM
Split the ladder bar brackets and weld them back together. The tubes do not just slide out!

superjunkman
09-04-2007, 10:23 PM
I have an old Halibrand V8 QC. It still has key'd axles and needs lots of work anyway. I'm worried that even with splined axles and all that stuff that the 350 or so hp it will have to deal with will be just too much. Any experiences?