View Full Version : 57 368 c.i. Lincoln motor. Which bell housing will fit


Dirt Dobber
01-26-2009, 08:31 AM
I have a 57 368 lincoln motor and want to run a ford 4 speed tranny, But I am having trouble finding a bell housing to fit. Any suggestions!!

low-lincoln
01-26-2009, 08:35 AM
Let me know if you find something that works, I'd love to put a 4speed behind my 56 Linc.

RichFox
01-26-2009, 08:50 AM
Can't say from personal experiance but I have read here that an FE bellhousing will fit except for dowel pins which will require attention.

Beep
01-26-2009, 08:52 AM
Contact Unclescooby..............he's a Lincoln man.

d2_willys
01-26-2009, 09:03 AM
I have a 57 368 lincoln motor and want to run a ford 4 speed tranny, But I am having trouble finding a bell housing to fit. Any suggestions!!

I think you need to sell me the 368! Looking for a good one.:rolleyes:

pacman
01-26-2009, 11:02 AM
those "big y-blocks" came in heavy trucks too, so theres a bellhousing/flywheel for ya. the truck tranny would be a bit big, but theres a large mounting face you could make work for any trans.

i have not done this myself, yet. I bought an edmunds 4x2 intake for one of these motors the other day from a guy who talked with me about this truck bellhousing idea. He has a truck bellhousing and flywheel/clutch setup and was intending to do the same - adapt a decent 4-speed to that bellhousing.

so its out there and its do-able, so dig in!

pacman
01-26-2009, 11:15 AM
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=5171&pictureid=44022

not posting to brag, posting to live'n up the thread!

tommy
01-26-2009, 12:30 PM
http://fototime.com/%7B1633D2BD-AE7F-4E8B-A25B-89AD5B122291%7D/picture.JPG

Cragar made a bellhousing for the Lincoln. Pretty hard to find but they were available.

I do know a guy that adapted the truck bellhousing and flywheel to work with a top loader. I think it required a centering ring for the trans. Not rocket science but it does need some machine work to make the smaller diameter car trans work.

Homespun91
01-26-2009, 04:41 PM
There are a couple of ways to adapt manual transmissions to the 368, none of which are particularly cheap or easy...but all are doable.

1) Use a factory 368 Turnpike Cruiser bellhousing...fairly scarce. Supposedly the 368 was also offered in a few police option Fords in '57 as well.

2) Use the Cragar bell...very scarce.

3) Use a truck bellhousing...see this thread & take a look at my last two posts: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=146956

4) Yes, someone here has said that the FE bell will work "with just a few mods". They have been asked, a couple of times, to demonstrate it, and haven't. In a quick 1 minute mockup I did by holding a FE bell to the back of a Lincoln Y, it looked like more than "just a few mods" to me, but I freely admit I was in a hurry right then. :D I am not a FE guy and don't have another FE bell sitting around, but one of these days I will try to do this officially & take pics.

I have since compiled some additional info about the Saginaw swap & can add a bit to that thread info...it's by far the easiest way to get a manual trans that's not a truck transmission.

2Hep
01-26-2009, 04:45 PM
FE block bellhousing housing... what a bitch it is to find one...looked and looked for an adapter to bolt up my '57 Lincoln block to my '39 Ford 3spd... finally found after 4 years of searching, its a cragar too. But it does bolt up to the FE block aswell, so the bellhousings are the same.

d2_willys
01-27-2009, 08:48 AM
FE block bellhousing housing... what a bitch it is to find one...looked and looked for an adapter to bolt up my '57 Lincoln block to my '39 Ford 3spd... finally found after 4 years of searching, its a cragar too. But it does bolt up to the FE block aswell, so the bellhousings are the same.

Hmmm, very interesting! Seeing is believing!:eek:

pecker head
01-27-2009, 01:57 PM
Btt !

RichFox
01-27-2009, 04:13 PM
I have a 368 Lincoln and a Lakewood blowshield for an FE Ford. If anybody is interested enough to come here (San Mateo, Ca.) and give me a hand I'll drag them out and try to fit them and take pictures. If not I won't.

Bernardarama
01-27-2009, 04:21 PM
fe is spose to work but there isnt to meny choices wilcap makes a adaptor for lincoln y to 700r4

Bernardarama
01-27-2009, 04:29 PM
one more thing i think that late 50's 368 motorhad a option called turnpike cruisers that had a manual option but it would be impossible to find i would honestly just run the hydromatic transmissions they had ro go with the wilcap 700r4 adaptor

bluebolt
01-27-2009, 04:51 PM
You should be able to use the Bendsten AOD adaptor to use a SBF manual bellhousing and flywheel. It's not cheap though. http://www.transmissionadapters.com/Lincoln_Edsel_Merc.htm
317/341/368 OHV Linc/Mer to Chev OR AOD
52-57* $ 995.00
*Can use with Manual OR Automatic Transmissions just by changing the flywheel

Homespun91
01-27-2009, 10:53 PM
You should be able to use the Bendsten AOD adaptor to use a SBF manual bellhousing and flywheel. It's not cheap though. http://www.transmissionadapters.com/Lincoln_Edsel_Merc.htm
317/341/368 OHV Linc/Mer to Chev OR AOD
52-57*$ 995.00
*Can use with Manual OR Automatic Transmissions just by changing the flywheel




I know of several people who have used the Bendtsen adapter to run automatics, and had no installation issues.

I know of at least one case firsthand (and have heard of others) where the adapter would not work "out of the box" to adapt a manual trans, specifically a T-5. It will work with a moderate amount of machine work, which is fine...but that's not as advertised.

When the builder (a machinist & professional engine builder) called Bendtsen to consult with him, the response was, and I quote, "You must be an idiot."

I have seen several other posts (as reliable or unreliable as anything on the Net goes) about the poor customer service from them.

I have been reluctant to mention them for manual trans applications for that reason. It is an option, though. ;)

redbeard
01-28-2009, 12:04 AM
that was me pac man, I guess the hamb is everywhere.

i do have the lincoln manual bellhousing, and flywheel and clutch, and I think it would be easy to adapt a four speed behind it, that is what I was going to do.

I was going to make a spacer ring for the hole in the bell, and redrill the bellhousing. Change the clutch disc, and pilot bushing. There may be length issues depending on what tranny you use, but honestly this is pretty much standard fair for adapting trannies to motors.

Hell, if you guys saw what zibo built from scratch, you would realize this is the easy route.

good luck, and I hope you use that intake.

if you want the other lincoln stuff let me know.

cheers

those "big y-blocks" came in heavy trucks too, so theres a bellhousing/flywheel for ya. the truck tranny would be a bit big, but theres a large mounting face you could make work for any trans.

i have not done this myself, yet. I bought an edmunds 4x2 intake for one of these motors the other day from a guy who talked with me about this truck bellhousing idea. He has a truck bellhousing and flywheel/clutch setup and was intending to do the same - adapt a decent 4-speed to that bellhousing.

so its out there and its do-able, so dig in!

KULTULZ
01-28-2009, 01:28 AM
The 368CI was STD in the 57 TPC and optional on the rest of the line. A series of 100 57 MONTEREYS were released with the factory competition M-335 Engine to qualify for NASCAR. It was an 8V rated @ 335HP. The M-335 cars were all STD, the TPC optional with a STD.

The later M-335 option was available factory assembled and over the counter.

There was a 56 FORD S-CODE 368 CI released for POLICE (Engine VIN S).

The engine (takeout) shown on the referring thread has 56/57 LINC MARK II rocker covers.

The 63/64 -CORRECTION- 1963- 332 has the intake manifold with the correct pattern for a 4150/4160. A FORD Y-BLOCK distributor can be used with a drive gear change.

IN ADDITION- If you notice on the LINC Y-BLOCK intakes, the carb pad sits very low for vehicle hood clearance. This affects flow as the runners turn upwards from the plenum and then back down to hit the head runners. The 1963 332 4V intake has a raised pad to correct this.

John356
01-29-2009, 06:00 PM
I am in the process of having my friend Brett the machinest convert an Fe Lakewood to fit a 368,the FE is close but no bolt-on. He first made a fitment to bolt to the crank so he could center the input shaft.Then he plug welded all the bolt holes.Then he re-drilled the holes a little oversize to match the 368 block.Then he drilled the dowell pin holes oversize. By indexing off the crank fitment he can adjust the bell
so that the input shaft is on center. Then after everything is bolted down on center,he will weld correct washers over the oversize pin holes to locate the bell on that plane.If the transmission drop is not correct,the blocksaver plate can be shimmed.Flywheel wil be fitted with an FE ring gear to allow the use of a late style
starter.

rob lee
01-29-2009, 07:36 PM
Used a truck bell on my 341 and adapted a t5. A ring to center it and sleeve use the throwout bearing for the lincoln pressure plate,made a pilot bearing. Only had to egg out a couple holes and redrill 1 hole. Hope this helps Rob

d2_willys
01-30-2009, 08:31 AM
I have a 368 Lincoln and a Lakewood blowshield for an FE Ford. If anybody is interested enough to come here (San Mateo, Ca.) and give me a hand I'll drag them out and try to fit them and take pictures. If not I won't.

Is it for sale?

RichFox
01-30-2009, 08:43 AM
Is it for sale?Don't know which one you want but the answer is the same. No.

d2_willys
01-30-2009, 08:49 AM
Don't know which one you want but the answer is the same. No.

Just checkin!:cool:

BillBallingerSr
01-30-2009, 05:30 PM
The 332 mentioned earlier, just to clarify, is a Lincoln Y not an FE, I believe there was a 302- Lincoln based also used in N-Series until the FT (FE like but has a bunch of differences) 361 came out. The small N-Series trucks could be had with a six even. The truck bell could be fairly common if they haven't shredded all of them, but if you are running it hard, a cast iron bell is kind of dangerous. If you blow a clutch, it thows some big chunks of iron around very destructively. A steel scattershield, even custom, might just be better in the long run. Expensive yes, but your legs are worth something too. An Auto adaptation may be cheaper, they had a Hydramatic, and a heavy Cruisomatic. Another thing too, is the truck manual bell should have mount bosses that will hang down and be a hard fit in some chassis. The FE one in my '65 F250 4X4 (mid mounts with a front plate like the big trucks) is a heavy son of a gun.

JMO

havi
01-30-2009, 06:08 PM
You should be able to use the Bendsten AOD adaptor to use a SBF manual bellhousing and flywheel. It's not cheap though. http://www.transmissionadapters.com/Lincoln_Edsel_Merc.htm
317/341/368 OHV Linc/Mer to Chev OR AOD
52-57*$ 995.00
*Can use with Manual OR Automatic Transmissions just by changing the flywheel


I was gonna say give these guys a call.

cornernfool
01-30-2009, 06:34 PM
I have a top loader 4 speed behind my 368. I modified the FE bell to fit, used an FE flywheel and 11 inch clutch.

I never offered pictures, but I'll explain it again. Built a fixture to locate center off the back of the crank. Purchased a Lakewood indexing kit which consisted of longer dowells and steel donuts to locate off of them. Opened up the FE dowell holes and centered the bell on the fixture, clamped it tight to the block checking that the crank would still spin. Elongated the bolt holes and respotfaced them. Bolted bell to block making sure crank was still centered and would spin. Punched in the longer dowells, dropped the donuts over the dowells and tig welded them in place. That is the simplified version, but it wasn't that tuff. I redrilled the crank pattern into the flywheel, the 368 and FE pilot were the same diameter. If someone is local and want to shoot pictures, come on down. Any questions, P.M. me.
Take care, Mike.

BillBallingerSr
01-30-2009, 08:55 PM
I have a top loader 4 speed behind my 368. I modified the FE bell to fit, used an FE flywheel and 11 inch clutch.

I never offered pictures, but I'll explain it again. Built a fixture to locate center off the back of the crank. Purchased a Lakewood indexing kit which consisted of longer dowells and steel donuts to locate off of them. Opened up the FE dowell holes and centered the bell on the fixture, clamped it tight to the block checking that the crank would still spin. Elongated the bolt holes and respotfaced them. Bolted bell to block making sure crank was still centered and would spin. Punched in the longer dowells, dropped the donuts over the dowells and tig welded them in place. That is the simplified version, but it wasn't that tuff. I redrilled the crank pattern into the flywheel, the 368 and FE pilot were the same diameter. If someone is local and want to shoot pictures, come on down. Any questions, P.M. me.
Take care, Mike.

I think I would rather use a steel FE bell modified like you said than an iron truck one from a 317. It would be alot safer.

Merkonic
01-30-2009, 10:54 PM
El Gallo-I;m doin the same thing,i want to run a 53 317 in a 33 Ford .It took me awhile,I bougt an engine&bell housing out of a 54 Ford COE truck.The engine turned out to be a 368 from a 57 Turnpike cruiser.As someone else said the truck bell mounting face is so big you could put anything to it.I had a machine shop make an adapter plate to bolt up a T86 3spd Jeepster trans(an odd choice,I know) but it was easy cause the outer flange fits inside the 4 bolts,and the input shaft is the exact lenth.I had Ft.wayne clutch rebuild the pressure plate w/lighter car springs& make up a pilot bushing.They also supplied the disc-a common Chevy truck unit.I recently found one of the old aftermarket aluminum bellhousings on Ebay.Funny theres no name on it,only the # 52LF40.Fits 52-57 Linc to 32-48Ford & 38-51 Merc.The only other piece of speed equipment I could find was a Mallory dual point dist.Also Victoryheaderflanges.com has header flange kits now-just got a set.

cornernfool
01-31-2009, 12:05 AM
Everything I used for this conversion was out of a 67 FE Cougar, toploader, bellhousing, flywheel, clutch, t.o. bearing. Had to build a pilot bushing becuase the 368 crank has a larger diameter hole. Found a bushing with the right size O.D. and machined the I.D. to fit another bushing with the proper I.D. for the trans, then pressed the 2 together. Used the Cougar starter and FE blockplate which I relocated the holes in also.
I have the fixture to center the bell to the crank, which also doubles as the fixture to redrill the flywheel if some one else needs to do it. Just P.M. me if your curious and we can discuss it.

Doing this with a FE scatershield would be a walk in the park compared to this cast iron stuff. Take care, Mike.

Dirt Dobber
01-31-2009, 09:53 PM
thanks for the help ive found a 352 fe bellhousing and will pull the motor out of lincoln in the next week to start the machine work. I will take pics of project and post

mongo4u2
02-04-2009, 04:20 PM
Also , if you want get trick, plus light , use the aluminum bellhousing off the automatic, weld with stud bungs with plate ,for the stick of your choice , use a modern hyd. throwout bearing .

ocamocam
02-06-2009, 07:53 PM
i have a 332 truck bellhousing with a T5 adaptor plate and fork.Also have an aluminum Harvey flywheel for sale,but need a light car for that...rod,Cliff

Dirt Dobber
03-18-2009, 12:17 AM
I finally got around to pulling the auto tranny and bellhousing off the motor. I put the FE bell up to the motor and it is very close, but no straight swap. Cornernfool seems to know his stuff now just need to fixture to center the bell to the crank!!

KULTULZ
03-18-2009, 02:56 AM
Supposedly the 368 was also offered in a few police option Fords in '57 as well.

It (368CI) was offered as a Limited Police Option in 1956. Look for S in the VIN

In 1957, the Limited Police Option was the EDSEL 361, W-Code.

Just to help the guys that crawl through salvage yards... ;)

A HD truck bell is shown below-

d2_willys
03-18-2009, 09:08 AM
It (368CI) was offered as a Limited Police Option in 1956. Look for S in the VIN

In 1957, the Limited Police Option was the EDSEL 361, W-Code.

Just to help the guys that crawl through salvage yards... ;)

A HD truck bell is shown below-

Thanks for the information, I am looking for a 368 and will put this info in my wallet when I go junk yard hopping. (Cornerfool, haven't forgotten you have one)

El Gallo: 2nd that Cornerfool knows his stuff, Mike is a good source of information when it comes to Lincoln Y's.

Just curious about something (Cornerfool chime in please). Will a MEL bell housing fit the 368 Y? I know MEL is for the big Lincolns (383,430,462's) but is it possible that FOMOCO kept the same bolt patterns?

Cornerfool: Started taking the 317 apart to get rebuilt, noticed that the flywheel (hydramatic) had some scoring like the front half of torus was hitting it, know anything about this?

Homespun91
03-18-2009, 10:05 AM
Just curious about something (Cornerfool chime in please). Will a MEL bell housing fit the 368 Y? I know MEL is for the big Lincolns (383,430,462's) but is it possible that FOMOCO kept the same bolt patterns?

The '58-'60 MELs have the straight FE pattern, so the same bell mods would be needed.

'61, '62-'65, & '66-'67 MELs all have various changes that make them individually unique, and they have a modified version of the FE pattern (and the '66-'67 also have an unusual trapezoid pattern as well)....but unfortunately none of them are Lincoln-Y friendly either.

Probably just as well, as the Lincoln transmissions are usually $$$, and have some swap issues in and of themselves.

Dirt Dobber
03-18-2009, 12:53 PM
What years was it offered in the HD truck bell?

Homespun91
03-18-2009, 01:53 PM
What years was it offered in the HD truck bell?

The Lincoln Y? '54-'63.

Dirt Dobber
03-18-2009, 06:50 PM
Was the Lincoln y standard equipment in the HD trucks

Homespun91
03-18-2009, 07:27 PM
Was the Lincoln y standard equipment in the HD trucks


It depends on who is classifying the truck, as sometimes what one person considers HD is not what Ford considers HD (or somebody else for that matter).

As a general rule, you find the Lincoln Ys standard in the 750 class & up...in other words, F-750, T-750, C-750, or B-750, F-800, etc. There are some chassis, and/or years, where they were available in smaller chassis, for example the T-700, as an option. There were also documented cases where dealers installed them at a customer's request for fleet purchases & so forth.

Again as a general rule, Ford considered the F-500, 600, 700, etc. to be medium duty, & anything below to be light duty (this means the complete truck; FoMoCo considered certain parts to be HD regardless of what they were installed in).

cornernfool
03-20-2009, 12:24 AM
El Gallo, or anyone else for that matter. I have the fixture to bolt to the crank to center the bell. It also doubles as a drill fixure to redrill the FE flywheel. I've got some time and money invested in this thing and I don't mind loaning it, but I would need a deposit to make sure it found it's way home. Hate to sound like a prick, but I could spend the rest of my life chasing down tools I've loaned out. PM me if you want to use it.

d2 willys, that trans and converter came from a 52 I had that had a 332 truck motor in it with ported 368 heads, intake and WCFB carb. I ran the motor, but could never drive the car as the fork lift driver made a pretsel out of the driveshaft. I saw the marks your talking about, and my only thought was the tourus did not fit tight in the 332 steel crank. I cant verify that as the 332 is in my car as a mock up with the FE bell and toploader. I know the fluid I spilled out of the trans all over the driveway looked clean and red, and not burned up. I have another 368 if your still looking, fresh bore, .040 over, isky cam. Let me know if your interested.

Take care, Mike.

Dirt Dobber
03-20-2009, 12:58 AM
Maybe a dumb question, But do you need the tranny for your fixture, or do you index off of the center of bell?

d2_willys
03-20-2009, 08:48 AM
El Gallo, or anyone else for that matter. I have the fixture to bolt to the crank to center the bell. It also doubles as a drill fixure to redrill the FE flywheel. I've got some time and money invested in this thing and I don't mind loaning it, but I would need a deposit to make sure it found it's way home. Hate to sound like a prick, but I could spend the rest of my life chasing down tools I've loaned out. PM me if you want to use it.

d2 willys, that trans and converter came from a 52 I had that had a 332 truck motor in it with ported 368 heads, intake and WCFB carb. I ran the motor, but could never drive the car as the fork lift driver made a pretsel out of the driveshaft. I saw the marks your talking about, and my only thought was the tourus did not fit tight in the 332 steel crank. I cant verify that as the 332 is in my car as a mock up with the FE bell and toploader. I know the fluid I spilled out of the trans all over the driveway looked clean and red, and not burned up. I have another 368 if your still looking, fresh bore, .040 over, isky cam. Let me know if your interested.

Take care, Mike.

Thanks Mike, that probably is what happened, I am still contemplating the 368 u have, but money is tight. What I will probably do is have the flywheel balanced to the 317 crank from motor I have. That will ensure that all is well on re-assembly. thanks for reply.:D

cornernfool
03-20-2009, 08:56 PM
Maybe a dumb question, But do you need the tranny for your fixture, or do you index off of the center of bell?


No, just a block with a crank in it that you can spin, and the bellhousing.

cornernfool
03-26-2009, 06:19 PM
OK, pictures posted of the fixture. Will explain when i get home from work.

cornernfool
03-26-2009, 10:18 PM
OK, if you look at the 3rd picture close you can see 2 allen screws, this holds the tube to the base. Use the base to redrill the FE flywheel by pushing the register into the flywheel, make a transfer punch, remove fixture, and drill 1 hole. Then reinsert the fixture into the flywheel, bolt it together with the one hole you drilled, and drill the 5 remaining holes. The fixture has hardened drill bushings installed so you can't hurt it. Flywheel done.

Now bolt the 2 piece fixture back together, bolt it to the end of the crank, check it with a dial indicator to make sure it's running true and your ready to start. I used a Lakewood bellhousing centering kit which contained 2 longer block dowells and a couple steel donuts that fit over them. Now to remove the old dowells I welded a long 5/16 bolt head down to them, droped a deep socket over the top and let the threads pertrude thru the socket. Drop a flat washer and a nut on it and start cranking, pulls them right out. Istall the longer Lakewood dowells.

Now bore the dowell holes out in the bell and spot face a large area around the hole you just bored. Elongate the bell mounting holes and spotface them. Drop the bell over the fixture, start your mounting bolts and washers and tighten them as you spin the crank and make sure there's no binding. Once the bell is tight and everything spins freely, check fixture runout once more just to make sure nothing moved. Drop the donut over the dowells and weld. You know have an FE bell that fits your Lincoln Y.

This would be real easy with a scattershield because you could weld all the holes and start from scratch. I'm going to get some cast iron round bar and fill the holes in my next one and start from scratch on it. I'm going to work on a fixture next to do this without the block. Just a flat drill fixture that indexes off the starter holes, and I can transfer punch into the blank bell the correct pattern. I just wished I had as much time as I do ideas. If you have a question, or a thought to simplify, lets hear it.

Thanks, Mike.:)

Dirt Dobber
03-27-2009, 12:44 AM
Did you use a old flywheel for the base of the fixture, or did you use a super spacer?

cornernfool
03-27-2009, 10:18 AM
One chunk of aluminum, one large lathe, a few brain cells and a bunch of time. The whole thing was fabricated. I think I might have used the 368 flex plate to transfer the pattern. Braincells still sleepy this morning.
Have a good day, Mike.

d2_willys
03-27-2009, 10:51 AM
Nice job Mike, looks good. Smart dude!

cornernfool
03-29-2009, 06:58 PM
Thanks man. Now you know why I am hesitant to loan it out without some colateral. Take care, Mike.

aussiebill
04-01-2011, 06:49 PM
http://fototime.com/%7B1633D2BD-AE7F-4E8B-A25B-89AD5B122291%7D/picture.JPG

Cragar made a bellhousing for the Lincoln. Pretty hard to find but they were available.

I do know a guy that adapted the truck bellhousing and flywheel to work with a top loader. I think it required a centering ring for the trans. Not rocket science but it does need some machine work to make the smaller diameter car trans work.

I also have this b/housing to suit my 332 lincoln engine but was wondering what clutch fork fits, most of my ford forks just seem too short from pivot point to release bearing pivot area, anyone got a suggestion that really knows? thank you. bill.