Early Hemi I.D--Anyone???

[andysdeuce]

I'm confused. I have an early hemi that I thought was a "354" Chrysler. The numbers stamped into the top side of the block..in front of the valley cover..are C542-8-4014. The C stands for Chrysler, I think. The numbers I can find show this as a '54 "331" Chrysler. The engine does not have the extended bell-housing. I have the tranny that came with the engine and the bell-housing is bolted to the tranny. Also the front of the heads do not have the water connections for cooling. What in the hell do I have here!!! Maybe a BIG aircooled VW motor. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif Can any of you early hemi guys give me any info or maybe I.D. the engine with the block number?? Can't figgure out if it's a "331" or "354". Any help would be appreciated.

[Assdragger]

I knew the answer to this question at one time but thats been TOO long ago. Industial...marine...? If I could find my damn books, I could tell ya.
Hey Rocky, dig out the books and tell us what it is.

[laverda]

From Hot Heads Hemi specs (http://www.hothemiheads.com/research/hemi_guide.html)

It may be a ...
C542 - 8 - 1001 1954 New Yorker 331

Quite a rare manifold if it has the original 4bbl on a 331. Gotta love a hemi!

Later,
papa al

1979 Laverda Jota
1928 Ford Cdan

[cadlights]

You have an early 331. 55 had a 331 with the cooling outlets in the head. I had a 51 New Yorker that had the same motor you're talking about. There was an aluminum
adapter between the engine and trans, It was hooked to a powerflight trans. I've still got the adapter, I used it for a pattern to make the adapter for a 350 turbo.
I hope this helps you out.

[Assdragger]

54,331 according to my books. They didnt have water journals in the head, drag racers liked that head because of the lack of water journals...it was prettier, and lighter than the 354 and 392 heads.

[andysdeuce]

Thanks for the fast replys guys. I had always been told that the "331" hemis always had the bellhousing as part of the block. According to the info I was able to find it is a 230 h.p. and it has the four barrel intake with it. The aluminum bellhousing that is bolted to the torqueflight looks like it's original equipment. Are these hemis good ones to build or hot rod??? It's ptetty much all there and what is'nt I would probably replace anyway. Could I get 350-400 h.p. out of it easily?? Thinking about starting to build it but I want it to RUN GOOD!!! Maybe I should wait to find a 354 or 392 instead of foolin with this one. What do you guys think?? Where is Rocky when you need him?? Probably out in the garage beating on that OLD CHEVY!!! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[cadlights]

Ask Don Garlits. That's the motor he started out with.

[TexasDeuce]

Hey Deuce,
check out these websites. I know you already got the info you needed but, this might help you out next time.

www.disgruntledpunk.com (http://www.disgruntledpunk.com)

http//clubs.hemmings.com/clubsites/cowtownmopars/HemiSpecs/.html#casting (Sorry so long)

www.hothemiheads.com (http://www.hothemiheads.com)

Hope this helps...TD

[andysdeuce]

Thanks for the links texasdeuce. I've been checking 'em out..might just build the 331 after all. Will any of the 354 parts interchange with the 331?? Maybe it would be a cool motor to build after all. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[andysdeuce]

Does anyone on the board have any parts for this 331? Maybe someone that has built one before to give me some ideas of cam profile...pistons...bore...etc. I never built one of these before. Does 331 and 354 use the same intakes...do they interchange?? How about it hemi boys...Rocky where are you when I need you. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[Bugman]

331, and 354 intakes will interchange. Trucks! tv did a 331 buildup a few years ago, bored it out to 350. Most of the parts will interchange with a 354, but the 392 has larger crank journals, and longer rods. Depending on who you ask, the late 331 and 354 heads are the best ones to use because the intake port is shaped better. the 331 has a long nose cam in it, and performance cams of this style can be expensive. However, you can easily convert it to the 392 style cam with a HotHeads kit. If you haven't done so already, get and read Tex Smiths Complete Chrysler Hemi Book. It's about the best early Hemi resource out there. I'll type somek more when I get more time. I have to start class now. Have a nice day http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
-Bugman Jeff

[andysdeuce]

Thanks Bugman I'll try and find that book and check it out.

[Rocky]

Here I am Don.....take your ridolin and count to ten.....there, all better?
ok, my 53 extended bellhousing 331 is my very first hemi project but I've got the Mopar Performance book and another hemi book...forget who wrote it but it's not Ron Cerridono's book...doesn't matter.
That 331 is identical to the 54 331 except for the bore. There is plenty enough meat in the block to bore the 331 out for 354 pistons.standard or oversized. Cranks are plenty beefy for a hot rod motor and 331 cranks are same as 354's.
About the heads...virtually all the aftermarket intake manifolds are drilled for the coolant outlets in the heads like the original manifold. This means you can use your old 331 heads and tap the holes in your new intake for fittings to run hoses to the radiator....
The 331 heads should support 300-350 hp with a little pocket porting...no problems.
I still wanna 6-71 blower setup for mine.

[Rocky]

Oh, yeah. Pop into the hotheads site to drool all over the cool shit they have for sale.....

[andysdeuce]

Thanks Rocky, getting ready to put this thing on an engine stand (heavy duty) and tear into it. Going to borders this weekend and see what kind of hemi books I can find. I found a couple of engine shops around here that are good with the older hemis, according to my friends.

I checked the hemi web sites out...have you seen the dollars they are asking for a complete rebuild set!!!!They should have a mask on and a big gun!!! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif I guess if 'ya wanna be COOL it's gonna cost 'ya!!
Now if you can find me a 4-deuce intake with rebuilt strombergs for about $75 I'll vote for you when you run for President. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif Thanks for the help.

[laverda]

If anyone comes across a 'reasonable' price for an early hemi rebuild kit I would like to know. HotHeads kits converted to CAN$ is ~$2000 http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif Hmmm ... the cdan looks to be a looonnggg term project. That SBC sure looks appealing to the pocket book http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Later,
papa al

[andysdeuce]

You can buy three major rebuild kits for a s.b.c for what it will cost you for one for a 331 hemi. Costs $$$$ to be cool!!! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[repoguy]

This is a cool thread.

A dumb question from a guy who knows nothing about hemis, and Chrysler stuff in general (if anyone cares to answer) -

What is the weight difference between the 331, 354, & 392?

oh, one more -

Mid to late 50's, what were the best tranny options?

[Assdragger]

I cant remember the exact wieghts but if I remember right an aluminum head hemi wieghs less than a small block chevy or not much more.
I still cant find any of my books!! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[Bugman]

Yeah, Hemi equals Expensive. I already have $2500 into mine, and I think I need at least $1000 more in just the motor. 'Course it is a 700HP a blown 392......

[beatnik]

Yea that's put the biggest delay on my Bantam project. For the price of the blower and fuel system for the Hemi, I could build a whole other budget project roadster using some of the parts laying around my garage.

[laverda]

Ahh ... the Ceridono book strikes again.
51-54 331 - 710lbs
55 331 - 729lbs
56 354 - 737lbs
57-58 392 - 767lbs

Some 'light' reading http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Hemi spotters guide (http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/96399/)
Some Hemi tips (http://www.thehemi.com/tips.php)

later,
papa al

[andysdeuce]

At the hamb drags Rocky told me you could get an adapter to put a 5-speed behind a early hemi. Maybe put a mustang or s-10 behind it. Would one of these trannys hold up to the torque and 300-350 h.p?? I was thinking s-10 to put the shifter in the right place for a model a roadster.

[HEMIrunner]

You could. But remember, the 1958 Chrysler 300c had 385hp from the factory. Your 331 may only be 250 to 320 hp back then, but once you build it up(depending on the build) that might double the original horsepower. Those 5 speeds in the chevs will bolt up w/adapter plates, but will ultimatly only stand what the 4.3L v6 was made to put out, maximum. Sorry , off my soapbox now. My hemi has the original trans w/push button shift on the dash. Talk about never to be made again. And it is coooool;)

[73RR]

Lets see now...1 post, no intro, and a thread that is 7 years old...

How about you go back and start over?


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