Do you have "Overheating" problems? Are you Sure?

[FrameDragger]

As some of you may know, I have been fighting an "overheating" condtion in my Terraplane for a couple of years... A couple of times I have wanted to puke watching my Stewart Warner Gauge's needle climb to as high as 230 F (once waiting in a long line to get into the L.A. Roadster Show, and once trying to get into the parking lot for the Hot Rod Reunion Banquet).

Well, in anticipation of heading back to Bakersfield, I finally got the Bright Idea of checking the temp with an infrared Thermometer...

The thing is running 40 Degrees Cooler than the SW shows!!!

Ice Cold... No wonder my high-idle would kick in at "190" http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I highly recommend getting one of these guns if you don't already have one... These are also killer for checking individual cylinder performance (each exhaust port should be pretty close to the same temp...), looking for high resistance in wired circuits, etc...

Mike

[REJ]

One of the best tools I have purchased. It dropped the temp in my 48 by 15 degrees also.
Also good on late models with a converter, you can tell when its plugging up.
And like you said, checking header temp on each cylinder.

[choprods]

a chefs thermometer in the radiator core is a cheap way to check it too.
STEWART WARNER had ought to be prosecuted for the inferior quality [or lack of] quality -I would say!......since they are made out of the US now they SUCK BIGTIME.......some sets include as many as three of the five instruments that were defective when installed NEW. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif
one time I had a car tha was equipped with some no name guages and it was always hot[I thought].....turned out I solved the accuracy problem of that set one day I was looking in at the dash and the temperature guage was PEGGED!.....Trouble was it had not been started in a week! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

[tommy]

My first car was a 58 Plymouth. I put a 383 in it. I hooked up the stock gauge and spent hundreds of 1964 dollars trying to get it to cool. When I finally put the 58 sending unit in the 63 block my over heating problem disappeared.

I think my buddy wore out the batteries playing with his infra red thermometer. They are a handy tool now that they have come out of the price stratosphere.

[plan9]

err umm... never heard of this infrared thermoblopper... howz it work?

[FrameDragger]

Plan, y0u hold the gun about a foot away from whatever you are trying to measure the temp of, and it sends back real time temp readings... If you think you have a problem with a hot spot in the radiator, you can move the gun across the whole thing watching the temperature differences. Most have a "max" reading also, so you can also find the hottest temp reading on whatever component you are trying to diagnose...

Chop... It is really hard to find a "traditional" looking gauge outside of SW... any suggestions?

M-

[Thirtycoup]

hey mike, i put the new sbc in this past winter after running an old beat up 305 which ran a constant 180, even in the heaviest traffic it might have climbed to 185. the new sbc seems to run at 195 under normal driving conditions and in traffic it creeps up into the 210 range. one time this summer i was in super heavy idiot infested traffic and by the time i finally pulled into my spot and shut it down the temp was at 235 but it didn't puke. so at least i now know that it will go that high without getting into too much trouble. i did switch out my flex fan and installed a 6 blade steel racing fan which definately helped. but the best thing i've done with it? i stopped looking at the gauge! good luck with it man, mike

[Baron Von Mike]

Get Em Here (http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=40076)

They sell others there too. Sounds like a fun toy.

[Morrisman]

Just like a ray gun that you point at your motor or rad or whatever. It picks up the infra red rays (heat)emitted by the object and tells you exactly what the temperature is.

You can buy them in ther grainger catalog, or web site, from a few bucks up to l00s of bucks. I use them at work, with a laser beam indicator to show exactly where you are pointing the gun. Like some sort of Star Wars toy
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Grainger Infra Red Thermometer (http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/productdetail.jsp?xi=xi&ItemId=1612667458&ccitem=)

[FrameDragger]

I just ordered a Raytek St-125. I liked the fact that the temp range went to 999 Deg. F... Some of the lower range units can't be used to read exhaust temp ranges (Commonly over 600 Deg. F)...

[squirrel]

I discovered that I can bend the needle on the stock temp gage on my 55 to make it stay off of the H end of the scale.

as long as it's not puking, it's not too hot.

[Junkyard Dog 32]

My coupe has shown an average of 230 on my guage... up to 250+ at times, and has yet to overheat.

Fuck the guage... when there's a green puddle under it, I'll know it's hot.

I'll have to try a temp gun, if I can get my hands on one.


JOEhttp://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[plan9]

framedragger, thanks for the explaination... very handy tool when it comes to quarky cooling systems. gonna have to get one of those.

[ELpolacko]

FYI concerning these infared thermometers,,,,,,,,,,they measure surface temps!

So using that knowledge, pick and choose the surface you want to get a reading from. The top tank of the radiator is a good indicator of engine temps, You will usually see a hight temp there over the water passage on a cast iron intake manifold. Same goes for exhaust temps, headers are going to emit more heat at the surface than would a set of iron manifolds.

Great tools for trouble shooting and if you get the one with the HeNe Laser pointer in it you can drive you dogs crazy. I routinely use mine to check temprature drop across a radiator or condenser for effectivness. And once you are savvy with reading temps with it you can spot blockages in AC lines, check for potential shorts in wiring and such.

[hanginlow58]

GREAT! I wish this post would have came up a few days ago I just ordered a set of SW guages, couldnt find any traditional looking guages and always thought those were the best.

[deuce]

stewart-warner gauges are still the best looking gauges out there, unfortunately the quality is not as good as the looks. they do have a two year warranty, and i've had no trouble from speedway when i've had to return two defective speedometers in a row. now that i'm on the third it is working properly. don't hesitate to send bad ones back, maybe s-w will get the message.

[choprods]

I like the VDO and Classic instruments guages better than stewart warner myself....Idont know if they are really a lot better though.......just my limited personal experience with installing both.

[brokenspoke]

Is it good for telling if a lady is in heat???

[old beet]

I got my SW gauges from speedway. When the temp gauge reaches 195o the needle drops to zero. I can turn on the fan and it will start again at 190o. Would this be the sender or the gauge?? Also this 460 Ford will idle all day in trafic but wants run hot the faster you go. Has a stock 49 Merc radiator. I can turn on the fan at speed and keep it at 190o. Has a 180o thermostat. I would think it got enough air at 70mph to run cool, but the fan really helps???..........OLDBEET

[DrJ]

I really like the SMITHS white on black face temp guage in my MGB GT.
It has a "C" on the left an "H" on the right and an "N" in the middle of the needle's sweep range.
Except for when it's cold and on "C" and the time the AIR pump siezed up and broke the waterpump belt it's stayed on or near the NORMAL "N" for the entire twenty years I've been driving the car.

I always take what the numbers say on a guage with a grain of salt.
What really matters is if it changes drastically from where it stays most of the time, from whatever is "Normal"
I was working for Pontiac when they started putting basic computers in the cars and had a temp controlled electric fan on the radiator along with an 18 pound pressure cap raising the boiling point way up there, (as long as the seams held,) of the Phoenix.
The shop manual said the thermal switch turned the fan on at 210ºƒ but if you sat in the car and watched the temp guage, the guage would only say 190ºƒ when the fan came on.
We asked the factory rep if this was a bad switch or a bad guage and he said something to the effect that "people" were used to their cars running at 160º to 190º but would get scared if the guage said they were at just two degrees below "boiling" when the fan came on, so they just lied on the guage numbering... :rolleyes: :cool:
Now this is the opposite variance from what Mike has but it points out what can happen with guages.
Where the temp pickup is located can make a difference too.

When I put the T350 in my truck hooked up to a rear end with who knows what gears relative to the gears in the tranny and way larger tires on it, I had no idea what speed I was going when the speedo needle quit wagging around so I just lettered the newly "restored" face "SLOW," "FAST," & "WOW."
I later figured out that 40 mph was around the L on SLOW, 70mph is around the F on FAST, and the S on FAST is where the guy in the Testarosa got white nuckles and backed down on the Newport freeway,and also about when it felt like that "wing" of a flatbed was wanting to rotate, so I backed off too... :eek:

Adam and Eve started it, (Well, If you don't count Lillith) and after that it's all RELATIVES :D

[snapper]

Another place to get the same model as Harbor Freight, $79.99 (Raytec #MT2), but $35 cheaper at $45.95.

http://www.tooldiscounter.com/ItemDisplay.cfm?lookup=RAYMT2&source=froogle&kw=RAYMT2

[racer5c]

we used to use em after the races at the bar to see which girl had ther "hottest" ass

[C9]

VDO makes a Heavy Duty series of gauges that look very much like S-W's.

Go here:
http://www.egauges.com/vd2_main.asp




The pics show a couple of HD VDO's on the gauge panel.

[sawzall]

sears hardware sells a nice small infrared thermo as well. and I recently used it to check squarecats exhaust temps on his smf powered model a.

Its so small i could (and should) carry it in the glovebox of the 40..

Other IDEAS..

checking hub temperatures (front and rear hubs) could help spot bearing problems quickly.. (something I learned from my fathers race team...)

[Dirk35]

As some of you may know, I have been fighting an "overheating" condtion in my Terraplane for a couple of years... A couple of times I have wanted to puke watching my Stewart Warner Gauge's needle climb to as high as 230 F (once waiting in a long line to get into the L.A. Roadster Show, and once trying to get into the parking lot for the Hot Rod Reunion Banquet).

Well, in anticipation of heading back to Bakersfield, I finally got the Bright Idea of checking the temp with an infrared Thermometer...

The thing is running 40 Degrees Cooler than the SW shows!!!

Ice Cold... No wonder my high-idle would kick in at "190" http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I highly recommend getting one of these guns if you don't already have one... These are also killer for checking individual cylinder performance (each exhaust port should be pretty close to the same temp...), looking for high resistance in wired circuits, etc...

Mike

Mike, just a heads-up...that temp your taking with the Infared Thermoter is only taking a temp of the metal on the outside of the coolant. Unless you actually opened the radiator cap with the thermostat showing 230, and took the temp of the coolant. I know that the heat transfer will be a lot closer to accurate since heat is transfered easily through metal (conduction)...but it will still be off a little.

[Groucho]

Maybe the gun's WRONG, and your car DOES run hot......................Just KIDDING, LOL.As some of you may know, I have been fighting an "overheating" condtion in my Terraplane for a couple of years... A couple of times I have wanted to puke watching my Stewart Warner Gauge's needle climb to as high as 230 F (once waiting in a long line to get into the L.A. Roadster Show, and once trying to get into the parking lot for the Hot Rod Reunion Banquet).

Well, in anticipation of heading back to Bakersfield, I finally got the Bright Idea of checking the temp with an infrared Thermometer...

The thing is running 40 Degrees Cooler than the SW shows!!!

Ice Cold... No wonder my high-idle would kick in at "190" http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I highly recommend getting one of these guns if you don't already have one... These are also killer for checking individual cylinder performance (each exhaust port should be pretty close to the same temp...), looking for high resistance in wired circuits, etc...

Mike

[Groucho]

Fuck, i had to have mine when they first came out at $129.00 plus shipping!!!!!!Another place to get the same model as Harbor Freight, $79.99 (Raytec #MT2), but $35 cheaper at $45.95.

http://www.tooldiscounter.com/ItemDisplay.cfm?lookup=RAYMT2&source=froogle&kw=RAYMT2

[loudpedal]

If it aint putting coolant on the ground, it aint overheating. That's what I've learned.

LP

[Groucho]

I use those 24-26lb NASCAR radiator caps on some of my Hot Rods, and you CAN overheat one of those without Coolant on the ground. PS-water cools better than, and runs cooler than Coolant. As much as 20 degrees depending how much Coolant you run. Just add a few ounces of water Soluable Oil to the cooling system. The ratio for cooling or machining is on the back of the bottle. Any GOOD Hardware store should carry it. My 54 Caddy runs cooler on a 90 degree day with water than it did on a 70 degree overcast day with coolant. And this is one of many examples i can talk about first hand. NOTHING cools better than water, PERIOD!If it aint putting coolant on the ground, it aint overheating. That's what I've learned.

LP

[loudpedal]

I use those 24-26lb NASCAR radiator caps on some of my Hot Rods...


Well, of course, if you are using a mega-pressure cap that would not be the case. Most vintage radiators cannot take that kind of pressure...

LP

[dixiedog]

I use those 24-26lb NASCAR radiator caps on some of my Hot Rods, and you CAN overheat one of those without Coolant on the ground. PS-water cools better than, and runs cooler than Coolant. As much as 20 degrees depending how much Coolant you run. Just add a few ounces of water Soluable Oil to the cooling system. The ratio for cooling or machining is on the back of the bottle. Any GOOD Hardware store should carry it. My 54 Caddy runs cooler on a 90 degree day with water than it did on a 70 degree overcast day with coolant. And this is one of many examples i can talk about first hand. NOTHING cools better than water, PERIOD!

I always heard a 50/50 mix with coolant and water is the best. But, this sounds like a better idea. Do you have any coolant or is it all water?

[TagMan]

Maybe the gun's WRONG, and your car DOES run hot......................Just KIDDING, LOL.

Actually, that's an excellent statement........how do you REALLY know if the gun is calibrated accurately ?? :confused:

[Groucho]

I'm saying a car runs HOTTER with coolant, so 50-50 half sucks. ALL water with the right amount (not much) soluable oil. And this DOES work. I always heard a 50/50 mix with coolant and water is the best. But, this sounds like a better idea. Do you have any coolant or is it all water?

[Groucho]

Good point.Well, of course, if you are using a mega-pressure cap that would not be the case. Most vintage radiators cannot take that kind of pressure...

LP