the great ones are dropping like flies......

[Farmer]

I was down in Salinas, Ca. the other day and called up Andy Southard Jr. and went by his house for a while. For those who don't know who he is, he was photographer for Hotrod magazine and other magazines and was a pinstriper in the 50's. He has alot of color photos of times when most folks weren't taking color photos. He is friends with all the big names. He is author of several books, such as "Hotrods of the 1950's" (m.b.i. publishing). We talked for a while and went out to his garage to look at his 40 Merc. custom. He had alot of cool stories to tell, and what a nice guy he is! He don't know me from adam and he invited me into his home like an old friend. It was sad to hear him say though that all his friends are dropping like flies. We were thumbing through Hotrod's of the 1950's book 'cause I had alot of questions for him about those pics. He would say, "oh this fella used to live here, but he passed away this last year"...over and over I heard that. Andy's in his
late 70's now and I'm glad to have spent time with him. I would say this to all the young guys such as myself out there. If you have a chance to go meet these old hotrod guys
big names or not, go meet them. Hear their stories and look at their pictures. They are glad to pass it on in most cases. They won't be around forever. If you look around, Them old hotrod legends live all over the place, you might have one living near you.

[fab32]

Excellent advice Farmer. I'm wondering if it would be possible to start a list of all of the old timers and their addresses. Then if a bunch of people were traveling through an area where some of them lived someone could call ahead an see if it would be OK if a group (or individual) could stop by and chat for awhile. I'm sure most of them wouldn't mind, but just politeness would dictate a call first. Maybe someone here could take the initiative to get it started.
Like you said, the old guys are passing on and it would be a shame if some of us missed a chance to meet them and talk. It would be one way to pass the torch.
I'm wondering if someone like av8 could take a project of this scope on. He must know a bunch of the old timers.

Frank

[Hot Rod To Hell]

I know what you're saying! There's a couple of local "old timers" that I like to sit and chat with whenever I get a chance...

Seems one of 'em was into super stock Drag racing back in the day... I saw one of the cars he used to wrench on at a car show this weekend. It was a 67 (68?) Camaro S/S car... "SHAKER ENGINEERING" I believe is what it said on the door. This particular guy also built headers for this car (and a bunch of others) when he was working for a company called "OK Headers". It was pretty cool to sit and BS about all that stuff (and everything else he lets me ramble about!)

Any time I talk with the "OLD TIMERS" I feel like I learn a bunch of stuff that you won't find in any books...

I appreciate every minute of conversation I get with them tremendously.

To any of you that are listening, thanks a bunch! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Farmer]

Andy Southard Jr., lives in Salinas, Ca. and he's listed in the local phone book there. that's how I got his number. He
has a box or two left of his out of print books that he sells and he'd be glad to sign the book for you. He signed mine.

[Farmer]

Art Himsl the pinstriper/painter lives in or around Concord, Ca. too.

[safariknut]

That it all too true.My son(my wife's first marriage)got married a couple weeks ago and the reception was held on Saturday.His biological dad brought his father(John's grandfather)to the reception.John's grandfather is Fran Hernandez;an old hot rodder from California whose 32 3-window was the first coupe to grace the cover of Hot Rod Magazine back in April of 1949.He used to race a Russetta and el Mirage back in the 40's,was a founding member of the Coupes Club,worked with Alex Xydias,Vic Edelbrock,and Bobby Meeks to name a few.One of the first to use nitromethane,worked as a crew chief on the Carrera PanAmericana Lincoln teams,ran the Kar Kraft facility at Ford when they built Boss Mustangs.This guy's done everything and at 81 is still a gearhead.Unfortunately he had a stroke some years ago and his short-term memory is gone.Still remembers the old days though.We had a great talk for about an hour.
What is sad is John knows that his grandfather was into cars but he doesn't really care;he's into Fantasy football and Metallica(go figure!)and his dad is a skydiver and gives two shits about cars.
Well dinner just arrived so the computer goes for awhile.End of rant.

[Pist-n-Broke]

I sit here behind my compuiter and hit this site several times a week. I reaolize there are many different points of view and opinyons out here on the H.A.M.B. board. For the most part a pretty good group of people. Respect goes a long way getting us older guys to share our past. I don't read everything but seeing the way Alicia was "Ripped Up by many of you makes me think keeping my distance is a wise choice.
My last event was the Un-Finnished nats in Elma Wa. The guys doing the 2 tops were very involved so I didn't bother them. However, I made several attempts to start conversations with younger (30 ish) people and pretty much got shined on. I feel I'm open minded and belive every one has something to contribuite. You just never know who you might be in contact with.
The Wizzard

[Peter Pan of Chicago]

That is awesome Farmer and Safariknut. There's alot of living history still around. Hopefully some of it can still be recorded.

Andy Southard Jr. is a RULER! On account of his vision and the time he spent recording what was his reality, it is now the history we all cherish.

Joel http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

I don't sound too gay do I? http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[cadlights]

I get the same feeling as Pist-n-Broke. There are times I see a question about things that I know about or what happened years ago so I try to answer from what I have experienced over the years just to get what I feel is pushed aside. Kinda like what does that old fart know.
Maybe that's not what's happening but that's the feeling I get. I'm here to help not to try and turn you one way or another. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[slammed]

Yep Cad, I see it too. Click's rule, and apply to other's. Rule's apply to some but not other's. Keep reading though, you can learn alot about people by what they write. Good thread, to talk and learn from the people who came before us. TRUE old hand's!

[Tman]

Fuck That! If you found guys that wont talk to ya, they ARENT HAMBers!!!!!!! Or, you just have no social skills. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

As for the gist of this post, yes, it is fun to talk to ANYONE older that holds history in their head.

Cool post Farmer!

[Pist-n-Broke]

So T-Man inlighten me. I stand looking at your ride and start with small talk like "I like your headers, did you build them yourself?" The answer is "Ayea" as you turn and walk away. Or another one. I really like the way you hung your front axle! Any you just give a sneer and go uh ha. Who's lacking social skills? Now I'll give you that I'm just an old Gray beard. Mater of fact my beard Is down to my tits. What did I say that made you shine me on?
The Wizzard

[photoman]

Andy is a great guy. I got to meet him at the 50th Oakland and he was super nice. He's photo'd more cool cars than I'll ever hope to see.

[Tman]

Pist, maybe your lack of humour is part of it? Did you see that smiley face? I got you riled up over NOTHING!? Comon, you are bigger than that petty drama you probably hold a disdain for on the net and in person.?

[Pist-n-Broke]

T-Man. I'm not riled up. I just don't get it. And the statements I made are direct wording of actual conversations last weekend. My question to you was, how can those words not start a conversation about your car?
The Wizzard

[Tman]

Because those dudes are not real HAMBers, lets clear this post, if you want to talk about it, PM me or try Zekes Chat.

[Hackerbilt]

People like that are just assholes. They're EVERYWHERE!
But Pist-n...your looking at it the wrong way!

The guys are talking about SEEKING conversation and knowledge from the older guys...not brushing them off like dirt. What was done to you was wrong...but don't let it jade your whole experience. Keep trying.
The one young fella you finally connect with just might make it all worth it. I know I've learned much from conversations with older experts!
You just have to filter out the scenesters etc to get to the core, and yes...some scenesters ARE capable of building headers, so just having built something doesn't make them sociable people. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

[safariknut]

Just figured I'd post these two pics before hitting the hay.The first is part of the article HRM did on Fran's coupe.There is also a Rex Burnett cutaway in the same issue.The second is yours truly and THE MAN! taken at John's wedding reception.

[safariknut]

2

[Peter Pan of Chicago]

That's so very cool, Ray! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif
Joel http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[oldandkrusty]

Man-oh-man, you couldn't be more right. The old ones are dropping like flies and if we don't get with thewm ASAP to record their experiences and contributions to this hobby of ours, we'll all be scratching our butts trying to remember what the hell it was that got this whole thing going.
I'm 60+ years old and I know for sure that there are guys I wish I could still talk to about their experiences when this whole thing got started. They are gone and with them their experiences. It's wrong that we just can't seem to "get around" to sitting and talking with these pioneers while they are still with us, rather than wailing about their loss when they are gone from us.
Having said all that, I highly reccommend that anyone in the LA area stop by and see Dean Jefferies if they are able. Last I knew, he still putters around his shop on, I believe, Coehngha (sp?) Blvd., the same shop he has been in for over 40 years. When I first met Dean, he didn't know me or me pals from a bag of assholes but, he invited us all in for a chat. We were there for a couple hours and Dean couldn't have been more hospitable. Now, whenever I can when I'm in the LA area I stop by and see Dean. He is an American treasure.
Sorry for hijacking this thread but, I feel strongly that the "old guys" still have something to offer.

[Brootal]

Hate to say it safariknut... but the old guy looks better than you! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Farmer.. too cool. I've a couple of Andy's books and they are amazing, inspirational even. Part of the reason I take so many pics is that in years to come I hope they too will be looked upon as a cool history of Hot Rodding.

[50mercfan]

i've been giving this subject quite a lot of thought latley. it truly sadens me to think about all the masters getting older. some day they'll leave us, and then what? i guess a few of us will carry on the tradition.

i guess we are pretty fortunate that alot of the big names are still around. winfield, barris and bailon make it out here a couple times a year.(kentucky,ind,tenn.) i always try to go see them. there are tons of guys that are not so famous or not famous at all that don't get the credit they deserve. we may never even know thier names but they were there plugging away just like the big names.

i have found that winfield is the easiest to talk to. but you have to keep in mind that my conversations with these guys has been very brief. if you ever get the chance to talk to bailon please do, i think he's in his eightys and he has a memory like a computer. he hasn't forgotten anything.

[Hot Rod To Hell]

Hopefully I didn't offend the "old timer" that I was referring to (he's a HAMBer!) buy calling him one! He's not that old, But hey, he's over twice my age... that makes him an "old timer" to me, right? http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[porknbeaner]

Funny thing about the "Old Timers" is that they are just people too.
My experience is that most of the time they don't even let you know that they are famouse.I guess I've been pretty luckey to have been in the right place at the right time to meet a bunch of the old timers, some of 'em were old when I was little. Most of the time I never new they were anything more than just other hot rodders that knew more than me 'til they were gone.
A few years back I was talking with Mr Roth at a show. He took time to just visit, and we had made arrangments to have a meal the next time he was in town.
Then he passed that following spring. Ya just never know when or who is going to check out. I never ever pass up a chance to visit with anyone young or old.

[Pist-n-Broke]

Pork-n-Beaner, You said it right. We are just people too. I don't feel Old yet but reaolize I've been doing it longer than I now have left.
The Wizzard

[Roadsters.com]

I too was fortunate enough to be able to spend some time talking with Andy Southard at the 50th Grand National Roadster Show. His knowledge of and appreciation for hot rodding coupled with his generousity and small ego make him an outstanding human being.

During the awards ceremony, it was neat to see Art Himsl being presented with an award for recogintion. Here's a man who had a great influence on custom painting, and he turned out to be a humble man.

At the same show I was able to talk with other people that I had been reading about for decades, including Ron Atterbury, Jim Jacobs, and Jack Stewart. They are all good people. Here's how to reach Jack:

Jack Stewart
11734 Rives Avenue
Downey, CA 90241

Jack is the author of the book L.A. Roadsters, A Retrospective, which is available for $30.00, which includes $5.00 for shipping and handling.

As far as preserving hot rod history, the American Hot Rod Foundation looks promising. Here's their site: http://www.ahraf.com/

I've compiled links to many survivors on my site's Pioneers of Hot Rodding page, at http://www.roadsters.com/pioneers/

Yes, while they are still with us, it's good to let people know that we appreciate what they did.

Dave Mann
http://www.roadsters.com/

[Farmer]

Thanks for your reply's fellas! I'm glad this post is still around, more young guys like myself around 30 years old now should go out and hear those stories and learn those old tricks. I've only come across a few "vintage" hotrodders that are dicks, most of them are super humble and even surprised that I care to hear what they got to say. I really
dig talking with those guys. What made me realize how important it is to talk to these folks was when I'd go around with my Mom who was a Hospice Nurse. A Hospice Nurse is an RN that takes care of terminally ill patients in their
home till they pass on. I would go with her and meet and talk to alot of these people, some of whom were over 100. I talked to an old black woman whose Parents were slaves! Now she had some stories. I also talked with a gentleman whose dad fought in the civil war. He was a Tad older than me....haha. Now most of the hotrod's older fellas aren't that old, but they are gettin there and alot of them are as sharp as tacks, full of stories, memories and such. A New dog can Learn Old tricks, and should! I hope that this post has helped restore faith in some of you "old timers" for us
young bloods, some of us realize we don't know shit....haha
john

[fab32]

HRTH, I think I might know who you are refering to and if so I know him also. He can be a real asshole at times but I doubt it would hurt his feelings to be called an "old timer". In fact I'm thinking you could call him just about anything and he would appreciate just being recognized.

Frank

[Farmer]

The recent post about Andy Southard Jr. got me to thinking.....man, didn't i post pretty much the same thing 5 years ago?.......

[UnIOnViLLEHauNT]

Cool post. Our new place is in a rural setting (we are NYC suburb transplants) and our next door neighbor is a good 1/8 mile away. Long/short he is an older guy (70s) and didn't strike me as too friendly. I heard his tools mid winter, thought he was working on wood the whole time. Well, spring rolls around and his garage door is open, dude has been building a rodded out 40 Ford pickup! Who knew! Well, long short I go next door and there wasn't a single woodworking tool in sight! (And he was in there day/night over the winter, I could tell by the wood stove)

Last week I had the garage door open while we were finishing some 50 Merc doors and he came over to see what was cooking. So far on my street alone Ive met 4 or 5 old hot rodders, and its pretty darn neat!

[chevy3755]

another one is Gene Winfield........always cordial......lots of stories......Big Daddy Don Gartlets is another......

[vertible59]

It ain't just the young guys. There is a bunch of arrogance among some greybeards too. I spotted an old kustom, sectioned '59 Ford at a show last summer, and the guy driving it acted like it pissed him off when I asked him a question, so I didn't hang around to look at it. If everyone had an attitude similar to that of Gene Winfield, this world would be a better place.

[John B]

Has anyone done a recorded interview with Andy? Kinda like the Alexander Bros. interview that Piero and crew did for the Mad Fabricators DVDs. Those are always my favorite parts of any hot rod DVD.

If someone put out a DVD made up solely of interviews such as that, I'd buy it.

[hotroddon]

Has anyone done a recorded interview with Andy? Kinda like the Alexander Bros. interview that Piero and crew did for the Mad Fabricators DVDs. Those are always my favorite parts of any hot rod DVD.

If someone put out a DVD made up solely of interviews such as that, I'd buy it.

The American Hot Rod Foundation has done a bunch of interviews. Please help support them!
http://www.ahrf.com/

[theHIGHLANDER]

I hear ya...ALL of ya. I don't think I'm that old but I've rec'd both ends of the topic. I've been dismissed by a couple "legends" now and then, also had some entertaining and informative conversations as well. Guess what kids, a little humility and self respect goes a long way. Next is respect for what it is you are BOTH about. There's a guy I worked for with an underlying fame that would defy any HAMBer's imagination. This was 25 years ago. To this day we're still friends with mutual respect for each other's outlooks and knowledge base.

Told a nice long story to "Big Daddy" Don Garlits once that he was glad to hear and even confirm in a way. Spent quality time with the real "Big Daddy", the late Ed Roth. It can be hard or easy, your choice. I'm nobody. I just like what I do. I've been shined on by several youthful bulders just like Pist-n-Broke but I don't quit. Their loss at times, mine others. What interactions do occur can be priceless and permanent.

[Mr48chev]

It ain't just the young guys. There is a bunch of arrogance among some greybeards too. I spotted an old kustom, sectioned '59 Ford at a show last summer, and the guy driving it acted like it pissed him off when I asked him a question, so I didn't hang around to look at it. If everyone had an attitude similar to that of Gene Winfield, this world would be a better place.

I rather believe that the guy who was driving the Sectioned 59 Bought it from The guy in Oregon who restored it from something that most guys wouldn't touch on a bet. I visited with the guy who restored it (if the car is My Blue Heven) starting with when he hauled what was left of the origional car to Unfinished nationals one year and followed his progress for several years.

I've followed Andy Southard's work since I started reading car magazines 50 years ago.

Yes we seem to be loosing a great number of the "old guys". Guys who got into rodding and customs when they got back from WWII or Korea and stayed with it for the past 50 or 60 years. A lot of them are the same age as my dad would be or my mom is.

Gene should be a good example for all of us who follow behind him that hitting a certain age is no excuse for quitting doing what you enjoy and becoming a porch dog. Mom is close to the same age and has a hip replacement and she is go go go and I have a hell of a hard time keeping up with her but I see people my age who think because they can now draw Social Security, active life is over.

[oldandkrusty]

The recent post about Andy Southard Jr. got me to thinking.....man, didn't i post pretty much the same thing 5 years ago?.......

Farmer, thanks for bringing this back to the top. As I said back in '04, they're dropping like flies! Let's talk to and record what the old timers have to say. For some of them, there will be no tomorrow!!!

[Mr48chev]

I sit here behind my compuiter and hit this site several times a week. I reaolize there are many different points of view and opinyons out here on the H.A.M.B. board. For the most part a pretty good group of people. Respect goes a long way getting us older guys to share our past. I don't read everything but seeing the way Alicia was "Ripped Up by many of you makes me think keeping my distance is a wise choice.
My last event was the Un-Finnished nats in Elma Wa. The guys doing the 2 tops were very involved so I didn't bother them. However, I made several attempts to start conversations with younger (30 ish) people and pretty much got shined on. I feel I'm open minded and belive every one has something to contribuite. You just never know who you might be in contact with.
The Wizzard

I haven't been to unfinished since it moved to Elma, as I didn't have a car to take and I tend to not go if my car doesn't go. In the past though I have found that the guys who drag their projects out to the Unfinished Nationals are guys who really like to talk about them. You may have caught people at the wrong time or just caught people who are a bit too full of themselves to take the time to chat with someone.