banjo Ford rear ends

[hillbillydeluxe]

Okay, I've asked this question before to no avail, but I though that after three cups of coffee, I'd ask again.

I'm looking for a rear end for an old Ford, but still have no way to identify the differing years (i.e. where do the radius rods mount, the shape of the axle housing at the wheel end, any detail differences in the 'rod ends, housings, etc.)

The reason I'm asking is that I don't have any rear ends to compare ('sept my hairy backside), and I'd like to know what to ask for when I go a-looking.

Thanks for any pics or details.

[Bigcheese327]

Simple guide: Model A - spring-on-top
1932-34 - spring behind/attached wishbones
1935-36 - detachable wishbones w/integrated spring hangars
1937-38 - Wide-5 bolt pattern w/mechanical brakes
1939 - Wide-5 pattern w/hydraulic brakes
1940-48 - 5 on 5.5" w/juice brakes

There are subtler variations, but that's the general guide I use. Maybe someone else can be more specific.

[Bruce Lancaster]

More detail...
MOST 1932--spring (V-shaped) behind, round pinion flange, detachable radius rods with brackets parallel to driveshaft.
'32-4 "Model 18" rear--hex pinion flange, detachable radius rod brackets angled like the rods, V spring.
'36 wide 5 with lever/rod brakes, '37-8 cable operated brakes.
'42-8 are wider than earlier, don't have measurement here. Earlier rears vary a bit in width but are all very close to same. All 1935 up springs go straight across without the forward sweeping V of '32-4, hence length of spring perches protruding from axle differs.

[Rand Man]

I thought it was '36-36 that had the "wide-five" bolt pattern. Wide meaning the wheel attaches along the outside edge of the brake drum.

[Bigcheese327]

The Wide-5 bolt pattern started in 1936, you're correct, but otherwise the '35-'36 rear is the same. "Wide-5" means 5 on 10.5" bolt spacing on the wheels - similar in appearance to an early Volkswagen. It was a two-piece steel rim that replaced the Ford wire. Look at pictures of early dirt trackers and you'll see a lot of them. Actually, look at the wheels on late dirt trackers and you'll see the same bolt pattern - albeit different wheels and now disc brakes.

[Bigcheese327]

Oh heck, I didn't see that Bruce had gotten involved here. I'll bow out now - he's forgotten more about early Fords than I'll ever know!

[Bruce Lancaster]

Also, most but not all rears have their original tooth counts stamped on passenger side bottom of banjo near the the pinion, in fairly big characters. Most 1930's vintage rears will be 4.11 (9-37 stamp), most 1940's will be 3.78. 3.27, 3.54, 3.70 (really), 4.44, and 4.56 are out there, and other ratios exist as well, all rare. Try to find what you want--gears and parts are expensive now, and look for a real good one as many have survived with good bearings and such and will need only new gaskets and seals to use. Ask for instructions when you get to gaskets--they control gear mesh!
If you are chasing 3.54's, they seem to have been standard in early Mercs and early 1946 Fords. Early Mercs have their own very strange rear details...

[hillbillydeluxe]

Thanks for the info guys. Sounds like a lot of black magic across many years. But I'll be sure to post a quick pic when I get home to see if we can tell what the heck I stumbled across.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Getting picky.... http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

"Wide-5" means 5 on 10.5" bolt spacing on the wheels..."

5 on 10.25" bolt circle.

[392_hemi]

There was an excellent article in Street Rodder magazine about 6 - 12 months ago detailing the specific differences of the early Ford banjo style rear ends. The article had lots of good photos of the different spring mounts, radius rods, etc. and had all the dimensions, spline variations, and other important stuff. If you can't find it, send me PM and I'll dig through my old copies to see what issue it was.

[pigpen]

You're gonna love this. I don't know about all of the years, but my '41 rear had the date (month and year) stamped on the INSIDE of the right hand housing. A nastier place to be, you will never find. Disgusting even for the pigpen.

[Foul]

FYI, I have a '47 rearend on my porch, so I went out for a quick measure - 13.5" diameter drums, 51.25" backing plate to backing plate, 5 on 5.5" bolt pattern. radius rods detachable, spring behind axle, torque tube. I have a '48 truck rearend in Ohio that I know is parallel leaves and open drive, don't know the dimensions, though.
dan

[J Man]

Is there a way to find out the gears with tearing the rear apart?

[392_hemi]

There are two numbers stamped on the bottom of the center section (on the ridge that runs forward toward the pinion shaft). These are the number of teeth on the pinion and ring gears. You just divide the numbers and it gives you the ratio. For example, my '40 Ford rear end has 11 and 39, the 11 being the number of teeth on the pinion and the 39 being the number of teeth on the ring. So if you divide 39 by 11, you get the rear axle gear ratio of 3.55. Hope that makes sense.

[hillbillydeluxe]

Here's what I have in the garage now. Thought I'd post a few pics for clarification. It looks like the radius rods connect to the tube about 1/2 way up the length of the 'tube. Besides that, here are pics of the housing area.

[hillbillydeluxe]

Another one here. . . .

[hillbillydeluxe]

Three of four. . .

[hillbillydeluxe]

Last one.

[J Man]

I am a little visually handicapped and can not find the #s to tll me the ratio on the banjos I have. Is there anyone that would be willing to post a pic of where it is?

I did find a "4" on the bottom center of one.

[KIRK!]

I think my banjo is a '37. It has 3:77 (34 divided by 9). Does that sound correct?

[SUHRsc]

Last one.

thats a 41-47
they have the shorter wishbones
37-40 have wishbones that go up near the end of the torque tube
48 has tube shock mounts

zach

[SUHRsc]

I think my banjo is a '37. It has 3:77 (34 divided by 9). Does that sound correct?

3.7777777 is commonly referred to as a 3.78 rear...rounded up
zach

[RodLand]

Street Rodder- ID early rears 1/2003 P.152
Street Rodder- Early axle ID (Banjo) 6/1972 P.26