C4 differences?? I need help.

[Killer]

is there a difference in the lenght of a 6 cyl. bellhousing versus an 8 cyl. bellhousing???

And would that difference happen to be 1 1/2 in.??????

TIA

[Flat Ernie]

Damn, been too long since I fooled with 'em - seems like the 240/300 uses same bellhousing as SBF, but 200/250 uses a different one...& I sure as hell couldn't tell ya the difference!

Sorry I'm not much help...

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[a/fxcomet]

The bastard C4 in my Comet is using a 6cyl bellhousing. Its a pan fill case, and the bell came from a mid to late 70s Granada with a 6. It is the same length as the 5 bolt bell that was in there with the old motor.

Can you tell more about what you have tried? or is it TOP SECRET? http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[yorgatron]

there's a V-8 C-4 in my garage if you need some measurements,lemee know...

[Killer]

No, it's not top secret.

When we were doin the mock up on Toothpicks street rod, i couldn't get the bellhousing to go over the flex plate. I took off the flexplate and went on my merry way figuring we'd figure out the flexplate deal later...

He had the trans rebuilt and asked them. They farted around with the torque converter and decided we had a 6 cyl. bellhousing... whatever I don't know... they swap it out, tell us we can use the flexplate we have...

I'm puttin the painted and shiny motor into the freshly painted chassis... tryin like hell not to scratch anything... and nothing lines up! Put it in the motor mounts and the trans won't line up... put it in the trans mount and the motor mounts won't line up...

After an hour or so, I remembered the bellhousing. SHIT!!! The later bellhousing moved the trans back about an inch or so... makes it that much tighter to the battery box and the brake assembly, the driveshaft is already done... etc...

I called my buddy who does transmissions and he said there was a small bellhousing and a larger one (basically, he was throwing around a bunch of terms, I wasn't listening much cause I was thinking about everything we'd have to redo).. we can swap back to the smaller bellhousing, buy a new flexplate, get a different torue converter... or I can make a new trans mount and we might have to shorten the drivesshaft again..

What a cluster fuck... he shoulda put a small block chevy in it...

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[choprods]

I agree Killer- I have always used chevys myself....
Last winter I built a 40 Ford sed with a 351 Cleveland and 4 speed........it was a pleasure to finally get all the little bullshit found and installed and matched up and see it drive away was the best part.....I will charge a lot more for the NEXT ford powered car!

[CharlieLed]

[ QUOTE ]
... he shoulda put a small block chevy in it... http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Yup, 'nuff said...

[Berdoo John]

BTTT

The C4 big/small bellhousing game:

The C4 actually came with three different bellhousings, but the third bellhousing is so rare that the chances of seeing one are so remote I won't touch on them. Now, the C4 basically came with two different size bellhousings, the large and the small bellhousing. With a C4, the converter, flexplate, and bellhousing all have to match, or it won't fit. The large bellhousing uses a 164 tooth flexplate, with a converter that has a 11 7/16" bolt circle. The small bellhousing uses a 157 tooth flexplate, with a converter that has a 10 1/2" bolt circle. To make things more interesting, the small bolt circle converter is 0.3" shorter than the large bolt circle converter, so you cannot redrill a large bellhousing flexplate to accept a small bolt circle converter and vice versa. Despite what the torque converter manufacturers tell you, you cannot tell whether you have a large bell or a small bell C4 by what style of dipstick (case/pan fill) you have. The large and small bellhousings interchange and both styles of dipstick came with both styles of bellhousings.

Another interesting note, the large bell (164T) flexplate is the same dimentionally as an AOD flexplate. So if you need a post 81 302 flexplate (50oz balance) for your C4, just get one for a post 81 AOD, and you're good to go. Unfortunately there were never any small bellhousing C4's used after Ford switched to the 50 oz offset, so if you need a 157T flexplate for your late model 302, you're stuck using aftermarket.

Dunno if this helps us or not...and NO I should have just used a SBC... http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

btw that was swiped from here:
http://fast351.com/tech/

http://www.fordmuscle.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?topic=7293&forum=1&7
http://www.fordmuscle.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?topic=18489&forum=13&6
This place has torque convertor, flexplate, and block plates sizes listed...
http://www.usaplaza.com/scripts/wcom_producttree.asp?StoreID=1078

[Dirk35]

If it makes you feel any better Jason, Im still playing the same damn game with my C4 in my 35! Toothpicks info is much appreicated!

So far, I have the 157 tooth flexplate 50oz balance weight, and the proper converter, but I have the larger bell housing and the larger spacer plate. I do happen to have another bell housing to try, but if that dont work, I think My cheapest route will be an aftermarket bell housing.

FWIW, the starter gear will not touch the flexplate at all if you have the larger bell housing with the smaller flexplate. Ask me how I know! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

Good Luck getting all ironed out the cheapest way possible. You might need it.

[k-member]

is there a difference in the lenght of a 6 cyl. bellhousing versus an 8 cyl. bellhousing???

I have taken 6 cyl. C-4s and put em behind my 289 2 times now. I just put the V8 bellhousings on em and slap them in. They work pretty good for about a year and then they start slipping because they can't handle the extra HP. The only reson I know this, is because I have been givin the 6cyl C-4s for free and that was cheaper than gettin one rebuilt. So I said WTF and tried it, and it worked. So to ansewer the question about the bellhousings 6 Vs.8 being a different length, I would say I don't think so, although I never measured, just slapped them in and it worked. I think there are two different types 64-70 and 71-81? Good luck with the Ford interchange game.