air suspension question...shock valving

[ray]

i read in an article that i came across, discussing air suspensions on heavy trucks, and in this article it stated that damping was not necessary on the compression stroke, only on the rebound stroke. considering the nature of an air spring, being progressive, this seems to make sense to me. might it be that most people are using regular shocks with airbags, thus the common testimonial that air suspensions ride harsher than standard? anybody got results of running adjustable shocks, what settings they ended up at? or how about recommendations on affordable adjustable shocks? do they go low enough in damping, to equate say a 90/10 drag shock? or are there even any adjustable shocks that have independant adjustment of bound and rebound, that are reasonably priced?

[sawzall]

ray

I dont feel that my air suspensions ride "harsh"

I will say this though, when the wife and I were road tripping this summer I managed to break one of the lower shock mounts off of my front control arm. (so I had no shock on that wheel for about 500 miles)

all in all I dont even feel that a shock does that much on a airspring car.. i hardly knew that the shock wasnt there..

[flt-blk]

check with an off road shop for adjustable bound/rebound shocks. Some of those baja cars have pretty trick setups.

If you know what rates you want, I bet someone like Bilstien, Edelbrock, etc. could valve a set for you.
TZ

[haring]

This is an interesting discussion, though I don't know anyone who uses adjustable shocks in the way you have described. While I don't have any science to support it, I would suspect that only dampening the rebound stroke might actually feel harsher, and would not let the suspension return to the uncompressed state fast enough.

I sometimes like to run a little lower than the "optimized" ride height on my car, and that means lower air pressure in the bags. That, of course, can lead to some harsh jounces as things bottom out. While the shock is not really doing much as a spring, I think that it does lessen the blow somewhat.

I have heard of many people having the relocated shock mounts rip out eventually after some abuse. On my car, the guys who fabricated the mounts made a full bar that extends the entire width of the control arm -- it's not just a tab on the side, so that the mount is firmly attached to the arm.

I don't have any real advice as it pertains to your question other than the fact that I think some people might think air spring suspension might feel harsh to some people is NOT because of the springs or shocks, but more because the suspension movement is compromised and near the end of its travel, resulting in the car bottoming-out more often. If you don't notch or relocated the frame, trunk floor, driveshaft tunnel, etc, it will hit there. If you DO provide more clearance, then you will scrape the exhaust, bumpers, body, etc. Damned if you do no matter what.

Here is a picture of my front suspension. It's a lousy quickie pict, but it shows the system bottomed-out. The strut rod hits the frame. The shock mounts are more closely aligned but look wonky in the photo. Note shorter shock.
http://fedora.net/falconaut/various/falcon_shock_A01.jpg

[drgnwgn289]

I know a guy that didn't have any shocks on the front of his 64 caddy with airbags...its fixed now, but had been that way for years...and he didn't have any problems, you have to be careful not to over extend the bag though

[MoFoMOD]

what I have found it on a heavy car or on the front of a car normal shocks seem to be just fine, but on the rear of a truck or a lighter car it is bouncy. I had my buddy at fox racing shox make me some custom cut down race truck multi adjustable shocks and turned the rebound all the way up and the compression all the way down. the car rides like a dream... I just hope they last because he dont work there no more!

[four-thirteen]

A 90/10 drag shock wouldn't work, as the 10 part is the expansion, and the 90 the compression; Exactly the opposite of what you want. I've got a friend who built his own airbag suspension. Works damn good, and although I haven't been in it, he says it rides fine with standard shocks. Dave

[Tman]

Of topic ray, that steel place in Denver is Ryerson Steel or something that is spelled similar. They have the DQ-drawing quality or AK steel.

[onelow48]

I agree with sawzall! I've been dowing the air bag thing
as farback as my first mini truck. I've made a lota mistakes. The best setup I have found sofare is the one
Glasshole and I found a few years back.

[ray]

drag shocks...no reason a shock can't be turned upside down. problem solved!

thanks for the thoughts guys, i'm trying to make a simple airbag setup using many cheap/original/junkyard parts, that handles excellent. stops like its supposed to. and most important, lets me put the power down to the pavement!


Tman, thanks, yes Ryerson (J.T. Ryerson & Sons Steel Co. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif)is one of the big steel suppliers, i dealt with them quite a bit when i lived in MN, purchasing materials for my jobby-job. that should make it fairly easy to obtain the stuff. the trick is to find someone who has an existing account with them, and sweet talk their purchasing agent. your average joe will get nowhere dealing direct.