TIG welder recomendations.....what should I buy?

[Nimrod]

I've been telling myself to buy one for years but keep putting it off. I've used a lot of nice industrial machines at work but never one of the smaller hobbyist type machines.
I'm leaning toward the Miller Syncrowave 180, its only about $230 more than the Econotig, has square wave and seems like it would be a better quality machine. Also considering the Econotig. Other similar machines like the Lincoln TIG 185, Hobart Tigmate, and Esab Heliarc 161.
Looking for an AC/DC machine to run on 220 single phase.

What are y'all using and how do you like it?

[Nimrod]

And has anyone bought a machine form Cyberweld.com?
Seems like good prices and free shipping!

[The37Kid]

I'm an electrical dummie, I'll freely admit that. Does a TIG welder throw out some waves that screw up TV and computer reception? I've always wondered if that would be a problem having one in a home workshop.

[IBUILDM]

I've got a new Lincoln Precision TIG 185. It works much better that the old Lincoln 175 I had before. I paid $1535 for it at my local Lincoln dealer.

[thirtytwo]

id go with the syncrowave i have a friend who likes his, i really like my miller stuff

[Tackett]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm an electrical dummie, I'll freely admit that. Does a TIG welder throw out some waves that screw up TV and computer reception? I've always wondered if that would be a problem having one in a home workshop.

[/ QUOTE ]

A month ago I would have said no...
I was at a friend's shop and using his computer while he was using his TIG welder. His computer started screwing up badly (seemed to just be the USB keyboard).

I've used his computer before and after that, and it never repeated that behavior. I'm convinced it's related to the welder, although I don't think it should making that much interference.

However, it only seemed to happen while actually welding - noting was wrong afterwards. Live alone and weld all you want.

[Anthony]

Can't speak on the TIG.I did buy a MIG from Cyberweld last year and will look to them for my next purchase. Good pricing and prompt shipping.

[cosmo]

I have a Miller Syncrowave 250 and I love it.
If you can, take a course at your local college where you will be able to use a few different machines. This way you can choose which one you like to use for the price of the course.
Cosmo

[modernbeat]

Nimrod, I was going to buy the 180 also, but was able to trade a couple Stanley Planes for a nearly new Econotig. I've been happy with mine. The newer versions (in the last 4 or 5 years) have square wave and it's been fairly easy to work with compared to 15 year old TIGs. But for $200 extra, I would have got the 180.

FWIW, I'm usually at 25% or less when welding .12 inch steel with my Econotig.

Bonus, pawn value and resale is much much higher on a Miller ;-) and I've been able to purchase accessories and add on parts at a dozen stores within a few miles of my place. Should it ever need repair, that's close and cheap too.

[lucky 7]

i just got a lincoln tig-185..i tried a bunch of welders,then decided on it..built in pulse..the others had the pulse as an option..anyway it works great..go try some first...

[Nimrod]

Thanks for the advice everyone, keep it comming.

I Think its the high frequency you use to stabilize the arc when welding aluminum with AC that screws with TV reception. The high frequency with some machines is really loud also.

[Killer]

I have a Miller 180.

Love it. Need to add a water cooled torch though...

Gets hot after awhile.

[scrapmetalart]

I think the Lincoln 185 is the way to go!!

[Spitfire1776]

I have an Econotig. I got it because I got a good deal on a practically new unit. Honestly though I would go with the Synchrowave for the difference. Econotigs decent enough but for finer stuff you wouldneed to get high freq hook up(whihc is what I'm gonna do when I get some money).

Miller is the safest bet for the money.

[The37Kid]

Nimrod, Thanks for that TV-aluminum welding info. Years ago the only thing I ever TIG welded was aluminum body panels. I've always wanted to TIG steel just to see what it is like. If you can TIG aluminum is steel harder or easier to weld?

[Junkyard Dog 32]

[ QUOTE ]
I Think its the high frequency you use to stabilize the arc when welding aluminum with AC that screws with TV reception. The high frequency with some machines is really loud also.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi-freq will tear up a computer... and anything else it can. I've read, that, hi-freq waves can travel "backwards" against the flow of current. I, honestly, don't know the ins and outs of it, but it will have an effect on anything that isn't shielded.
I have a Miller add-on hi-freq (I don't think the make them, anymore) that I use with my portable Miller Legend, and people have complained about TVs, computers, telephones... etc. being screwed up.

I just put my old computer out in the shop, I'll let you know if I kill it.

As far as welders go, I like any and all of the Miller products.
Lincoln would be my second choice.
If you go with Snap-On or MAC tools brands, you'll just be paying extra for the name and getting a regular brand, anyway, so don't bother.

Is the syncrowave air or liquid cooled?
I'm planning a tech post on turning an air cooled TIG welder to liquid, as soon as I get some part numbers, so if anyone ends up with an air cooled machine...
The total cost, including the liquid cooled torch, pump, etc. is about $150-$200
Chillers can cost upwards of $500, and unless you're welding for hours on end, mine works slicker than snot on a doorknob. I burn some heavy aluminum, too.
I'll post it, soon.

JOEhttp://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Nimrod]

The Syncrowave comes with an air cooled torch too...I think. I was going to use it for a while and see how it holds up. I was thinking I would make my own cooler when I got around to it.

And 37Kid, I'd say steels a lot easier than aluminum. The arc is a lot smoother with DC, and the puddle is a lot easier to control.

[TimW]

I've got an older Miller 250 with high freq and love it. The first machine I started out with didn't have the high frequency or the foot control, it seemed O.K. but after I got the machine that I have now, I don't think I could ever be without the foot control or the high frequency start. My torch is an air cooled one and does fine unless I try to do aluminum or a whole lot of welding continuously, then the torch does tend to get hot. You just cant beat the looks of a good tig weld. Good Luck!

[Paul]

I have the Lincoln Squarewave 175 Pro,

I'm just learning and it's the only tig I've used so I have nothing to compare it to but,

I just got a hand Amptrol for it and like it a LOT better then the foot pedal.

Paul

[OGNC]

Just got an Esab 161. It is small and user friendly. Haven't really used it enough yet to tell you the pitfalls. You could say we're still in the honeymoon stage. But I do like the watercooled units, cause the torch of the gas cooled units tends to get a little warm after a while.

[Junkyard Dog 32]

[ QUOTE ]
I just got a hand Amptrol for it and like it a LOT better then the foot pedal.


[/ QUOTE ]

What the heck is that? Like a slot car trigger? That would be TITS.
If I'm welding under a pontoon boat or almost any vehicle, I run my foot pedal with my knee and sometimes the back of my knee or elbow... I've even run it with my head... whatever works. It kinda sucks, sometime, but I'm used to it.

Tell me about this hand job of yours, Paul.
I might have to get one. How much are they? Do they hook right to the torch?
Are they adjustable under load or do you have to break your arc?

JOEhttp://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Paul]

like I said I'm just learning so I'm prolly not the best source of advice here,

I looked at a couple different styles and went with this one because it was in the price range

I was expecting (about two and a half yards) and is the same brand as the welder.

it clips on the torch handle, I played with it so I could work it with either the finger or thumb and seem to have best control using the thumb.

it works just like the foot control, you can adjust it as you weld.

looks like this

[Paul]

makes the torch a little more cumbersome and the cable just a heavier,

but after a little while I hardly notice that,

it just seams easier

[Junkyard Dog 32]

Thanks, man! I'm going to look into one. That's perfect for welding under boats, and places where you can't drag a pedal.

Thanks for the time and the pix, too.

I should mention... I live about 100 miles from an actual "welding supply", and haven't seen the inside of one in about 8 years. I buy my gas at Car-Quest (30 miles) and my steel from the guys that run the scrap yard (45 miles)... They get what I need when they haul scrap to a bigger yard.
I, honestly, didn't know these existed.

JOEhttp://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[river1]

if it's important to you (not to start any debates) millers are made in America.

if cost is not an issue http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif go with the miller dynasty DX it's the cadillac of TIGs.


if you want a welding meesage board go to http://www.hobartwelders.com/mboard/.
lot's of good info there.


later jim

[olskool37]

It all comes down to $$$ if ya got it spend it. If you dont later down the road you'll be wishing you had. Also, it depends on what kind of duty is this rig gonna see. If your going to use it alot get one that will hold up for long welds, if your getting it just to bugger welp up some Alum. and stainless go for a cheepy and stick your cash into some other part of your project. Thats just my two pennies worth.

[Buzz]

I have a Miller Syncrowave 180 SD. It's a great machine for small production. If you have a welding business or going to weld Thick aluminum, the 250 is the way to go. I'm TIG welding FED Chassis so the 180 is all I need.

[Slide]

DOes that hand control use a slider to vary the amps? The only one I have ever actually seen with my eyes was one that was like a rotary knob with maybe about 110 degrees of it exposed.

I grew up with a foot pedal so I couldn't see myself getting used to the thumb/finger control easily. I got pretty good at using pretty much anything except my feet to control the pedal.

Also, do you still have to scratch start, or can you just crank your thumb control to a zero amperage, then go from there?

[Nimrod]

Has anyone on here used one of the Miller Dynasty machines. I've used a Powcon (I think) AC/DC inverter machine at work and loved it. I'm not on an unlimited budget but am considering one. I've thought about welding as a side job might not be a bad investment. And at 45 lbs is a lot more portable than a traditional 250 - 450 lb. machine.

[Flatdog]

I've been TIG welding with my Econotig for a couple years now and it really did a fine job on any steel up to 3/8" that I could throw at it. I started doing some projects in 3/8" aluminum with the machine and found it simply lacking in the power department though. It served its purpose valiantly, but my needs pretty quickly outgrew the little machine.

A couple weeks ago I was fortunate enough to pick up a new Syncrowave 250DX TigRunner setup. There is one word for this machine: Beautiful. Every part of it screams "High Quality" from the torch to the control panel. It can handle just about any job I can think of ever wanting to do from sheet metal to 1/4"+ aluminum with ease. If the Syncrowave 180 is anything like the 250DX i would highly reccomend it.

As for the Dynasty machines, I personally haven't used one, but I've heard nothing but good things about them. If the Dynasty is the Cadillac of TIG welders, the Syncrowave would be the Mack truck. Built like a rock and doesn't stop for anything.

[LUKESTER]

I use an older syncrowave 180, It really needs a coolmate(RADIATOR) I use both the foot control(for bench welding) and the thumb control for under the car welding..... If money was NO object I would buy the liquid cooled dynasty DX. I used to use an econotig, but that machine could not even make 1/8" aluminum puddle up........ The 180 is a good machine for the "garage builder"..... LUKE

[river1]

i've used a dynasty but not enough to get a real feel for it. i've been saving my nickels and will be getting one in the next few weeks. i'll report back after i get.

alot of guys from the hobart/miller message board who want a dynasty went with a thermal arc 185 for about a 1000 bucks cheaper. they liken it to a poorman's dynasty. i would rather go american and get the REAL dynasty.check the link for one on ebay.

ebay thermal arc (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=57039&item=3821659 784)

later jim

[Nimrod]

Hey thanks river1. I think thats the inverter machine I've used at work (an older version) that I liked. I'll look into it. Through cyberweld the Dynasty is about $2200 but dosn't come with torch, foot control or regulator. Let me know how you like the Dynasty.

[Tman]

Hey thanks river1. I think thats the inverter machine I've used at work (an older version) that I liked. I'll look into it. Through cyberweld the Dynasty is about $2200 but dosn't come with torch, foot control or regulator. Let me know how you like the Dynasty.

Nimrod, I also posted an INVERTER post this last week, missed/forgot yours in the search.

We just got a Lincoln 185 at the shop. We are using it with the foot control, thumbwheels is on the way. I have used both and think I like the foot control for most normal work. I found with my buddies thumbwheel, I just cranked it up and didnt regulate like I do with the foot pedal.

The new Lincoln has the "pulse" feature. Most of the welders in our industrial complex and others prefer to weld without it. Granted, we just got the Lincoln this week but 4 of us at the shop spent many hours learning the new machine. We all like it with the pulse off!

I thought I wanted an Inverter, after using this machine, I dunno? It is nice, and FWIW, I threw down better beads than the boss and our main fabricator:D Several of the regulars and shop guys really laid into the fact that the office guy spanked em!:cool:

[392_hemi]

The Synchrowave 180 is a decent machine, but if you can afford the extra cost, go with the 250. If you plan on welding aluminum, I'd recommend a water cooled torch. The inverter machines are nice if you have power limitations, as they can be run off 110 and still put out plenty of amps. Some of the early inverter machines were junk, but the new ones are pretty decent. I've been using a Miller Dynasty 300 setup for about six months, and it's pretty cool. The downsides are that the inverter machines cost a bunch more and are not as durable. High frequency will screw up all kinds of stuff, but you only use continuous high frequency for aluminum. For steel and whatever else, it's only used for start up.

[Tman]

Here is a thought? Are we overbuying with our welders?

Case in point, the new Lincoln 185 we have at teh shop has a digital readout. If you use the handy slide-chart they supply and set it up like they say........................I have found we use a fraction on the amperage you would think you use!

We just got this thing, the new ones have a digital guage, shows the desired MAX amps and while actually welding, it shows true amps. I was watching the guys play with stainless exhaust, hell, the machine was really working in the 60A range!

Makes me wonder if wee need all the power if sheet metal and frame work is your main work? Just a thought.

[river1]

Here is a thought? Are we overbuying with our welders?

Makes me wonder if wee need all the power if sheet metal and frame work is your main work? Just a thought.


more power ar ar ar ar ar

in my best tim allen


my first welder i bought to small and out grew it. i am comfortable that i'll never out grow my dynasty 200.

later jim

[Tman]

more power ar ar ar ar ar

in my best tim allen


my first welder i bought to small and out grew it. i am comfortable that i'll never out grow my dynasty 200.

later jim

Jim, I agree, but, it blew me away how LITTLE amps you really used!

We were sampling 18G steel yesterday, like I said, we just got this new machine...............damn, we were throwing 40 amps at it on a butt weld!

That said, I am now looking at the inverter styles or a larger Miller or Lincoln.

[myke]

I have a lincoln 185 tig and really like it. I never use the pulse setting. I also upgraded the tourch to a ck-17 when I bought it.

[J'st Wandering]

What do inverters do? Is it an add-on or built in? Looking at buying a TIG and any info will help. Thanks. Neal

[FRITZ]

Ok im gonna jump in here, I'm looking at getting the Lincoln 185......now for a new question ....to water cool or not.......as far as i know water is for weldding aluminium????.........do ya need to be water cooled if yer gonn be sitting for a long period of time weldding up a T-chassie or a chopper frame??
Im guessing the 185 is a fantastic unit for garage pimps like us to build chassies and crap of the like
FRITZ

[leadhead]

From what I understand, the water cooled model will just give you a longer duty cycle. Air cooled will just heat up faster. You can weld aluminum and steel just fine with the air cooled 185, that's what I used at their facility. I'm by no means the authority on the subject, so someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

[Nimrod]

What do inverters do? Is it an add-on or built in? Looking at buying a TIG and any info will help. Thanks. Neal

Its just a different way of converting the power coming out of your wall into something you can use to weld. Inverters are kind of the new high tech way, compared to a transformer machine. I'm not sure how different the arc charactaristics are but an inverter machine is just a fraction of the size and weight of a transformer, and I've read that they use the power more effitiently.

[river1]

Ok im gonna jump in here, I'm looking at getting the Lincoln 185......now for a new question ....to water cool or not.......as far as i know water is for weldding aluminium????.........do ya need to be water cooled if yer gonn be sitting for a long period of time weldding up a T-chassie or a chopper frame??
Im guessing the 185 is a fantastic unit for garage pimps like us to build chassies and crap of the like
FRITZ

water cooled doesn't increase the duty cycle of the welder.
theoretically you don't NEED watercooled until you reach 200 amps.
it keeps the torch head cool so your fingers don't get as hot. the most important thing (in my mind) about watercooled is the torch head is a lot smaller so you can get into tighter spots.

you can get a watercooler from ebay for about 1/4 to 1/2 the price of 'retail' from

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=11774&item=7517606336&rd=1

keep an eye on that seller he sells watercoolers all the time and is someone i'd do business with again.

later jim

[loogy]

Here's a description of an inverter use in welding.

http://millerwelds.com/education/tech_articles/articles31.php


Chris

[grapejuice1998]

I can't really help with new machines, but I bought a used Lincoln square wave 175 that does stick and TIG. I got it for $500 and it works great! I had to invest another $125 in a single phase 220v to 440v converter though, but it was worth it. It's an air cooled torch, which is a drag when you're welding thicker aluminum. Other than that, it's all anyone would even need for mild steel or stainless.

I've been telling myself to buy one for years but keep putting it off. I've used a lot of nice industrial machines at work but never one of the smaller hobbyist type machines.
I'm leaning toward the Miller Syncrowave 180, its only about $230 more than the Econotig, has square wave and seems like it would be a better quality machine. Also considering the Econotig. Other similar machines like the Lincoln TIG 185, Hobart Tigmate, and Esab Heliarc 161.
Looking for an AC/DC machine to run on 220 single phase.

What are y'all using and how do you like it?

[J'st Wandering]

Here's a description of an inverter use in welding.

http://millerwelds.com/education/tech_articles/articles31.php


Chris


Now I know. Thanks Nimrod and Chris for the response.

Neal

[30roadster]

I've been telling myself to buy one for years but keep putting it off. I've used a lot of nice industrial machines at work but never one of the smaller hobbyist type machines.
I'm leaning toward the Miller Syncrowave 180, its only about $230 more than the Econotig, has square wave and seems like it would be a better quality machine. Also considering the Econotig. Other similar machines like the Lincoln TIG 185, Hobart Tigmate, and Esab Heliarc 161.
Looking for an AC/DC machine to run on 220 single phase.

What are y'all using and how do you like it?

I have a sychrowave 180. I love it. Get all the different size collets for the handpiece so you can run a 3/32 electrode or a 1/16 electrode. The only drawback is duty cycle. I welded up a metal table and I spent alot of time waiting for the machine to cool off. But for most car related things I haven't noticed much overheating and waiting. waiting is an excuse for a beer:D

[Littleman]

I bought my Miller 250/250 water cooled tig machine for 1,450, off of a guy that repairs welders, he is always selling new and old and or repaired machines that he gets in. I would call around if anyone is in the market to buy a tig, I have had this one for the last five years and have had no trouble with itand it was a used unit. But like anything else you buy equipment wise, I always buy larger than I think I need. Because it never fails when you get what you think you need, down the road it turns out too small, and highly recommend the water kool get up, money well spent !!! Just my opinion.....Littleman

[Flat Ernie]

Just make your own...

http://classicbroncos.com/homemade-welder.shtml