Rapid Rabbit #112 Build Thread

[64 DODGE 440]

Well, the time has come to put this out here and give the rest of you something to giggle at.

We finally have enough parts to start laying out the car and making it creep towards reality.

Looking to have a shot at having the oldest pile of parts competing when we get it up and running. Feel free to try and be more vintage.

Chassis: Model T Ford, year unknown

Engine: 1934 Dodge 218ci flathead 6

Transmission: 1934 Dodge

Front axle: Lincoln Zephyr, year unknown

Steering box: Small aluminum, unknown parentage

Progress will be slow, but the build has started.:)

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/3696/61607015evx9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Shot at 2007-08-06

[Joe Hamby]

With that frame and engine combo, will you go with ford mechanical brakes or the plymouth hydrolic brakes, a small aluminum steering box, if it has a big S on it, it might be a saganaw, corvair. Maybe you can just use that band brake on the tranny.

[Godzilla]

Don't worry, we won't laugh. We have all been there. Here is Rodan at that stage. Looking good.

323264

[Old6rodder]

She already has a "feel", looks like a well balanced layout.
Nice to see another "frame" job going up too.

Didn't waste any time before playing house with the new parts did ya? I see you have a selection of seats, that tall stool would make for one "unique" ride. :eek:

Tranny brake? You trying to sneak in a disguised slush pump, boy? (If so, that's gotta be the ugliest one I ever saw. :p )

Good start, Tom.

[REJ]

Ain't no way we are gonna laugh, we all started that way, at least I think everyone started that way?:eek:
Looking forward to a bunch of progress reports on this one.
How many of you guys in California are planning on the HAMB drags?
It would really be great if a bunch of you could make it.

[GMC BUBBA]

Light years ahead of those that havent started. You know they made a factory two one barrell for that engine in a truck?:)

[Mr. Mac]

You have to start somewhere,and I think you have a great start.

[64 DODGE 440]

With that frame and engine combo, will you go with ford mechanical brakes or the plymouth hydrolic brakes, a small aluminum steering box, if it has a big S on it, it might be a saganaw, corvair. Maybe you can just use that band brake on the tranny.

Right now the rear axle seems like its going to come from a '60s Dart, at least I have a friend who has offered one from a car that's being upgraded to an 8 3/4 and a 360, so the brakes will be "modern".

The steering box appears to be Fiat or such. definitely metric sized bolt holes in the mounting flange, and about 2/3 the size of the Corvair box. Very light weight.

The band brake on the tranny will probably go away to prevent it turning into a "smoke generator" as I have seen in previous old Mopars.:)

Thanks for the kind words and support, we're definitely having fun.

[moparsled]

YAY!!! somebody I can have an even race with!

I can see that it's time for me to "come out" and post some pics of mine.

cool start- I was looking (not real hard mind you) for T rails for mine, but ended up going tubing.

[Rand Man]

I'd like to see the old Dodge run. I like the T rails.

[Ryan]

LOVE the choices you are making here... This thing is going to be RAD.

[64 DODGE 440]

I'm trying my best to keep the spirit of The Bug alive. Looked it over many times at the NHRA Museum when we have gone to the cruise there and love the concept of the early rails.

[ThingyM]

REJ.. As it stands right now, We have about 6 cars in the planning stage, A couple that the chassis are done. and another couple that are close to running.. And yes, I would love to go to the HAMB drags next year. And might drag another one along.....Dick....

[64 DODGE 440]

Here's our latest progress shot. got a pair of vintage 1 3/4" SUs to feed the flathead 6 and did a rough mock up of the frame taper that I'm looking at. The white tube down the back side of the picture approximates how the frame rails will taper, front to rear. The front crossmember will be about 8" wide.

Also have the fuel tank mocked up to make sure it will fit. Should hold about 2 gallons, it's being fabricated from a couple of vintage military aluminum food cans.

Damn, this stuff is fun.

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/6783/71607012edz4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Shot at 2007-08-06

[Old6rodder]

A carb named SU ?

Them side suckers sure look purty on the flattie ............. :cool: (though I think your "manifold" might require just a skosh more porting).

'Course I may be just a bit prejudiced. :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Here's another picture from the rear that shows the frame taper better. The rear will be wider allowing a bit more room in the cockpit, and the seat will be offset to the left.

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/5218/71007002egz6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Shot at 2007-08-06

[sgtlethargic]

So you're gonna widen the rear of the frame and narrow the front? As in, if I imagine a 2nd white tube on the opposite side. Why is your chair gonna be offset?

Thanks,
Kurt

[64 DODGE 440]

By offsetting the seating to the left, (as the original "Bug" was done), and spreading the rear of the frame, it allows for more room in the cockpit and the shift linkage can offset to the right rather than being directly under the steering.

It will also allow the steering drag link to run down the left side of the engine without needing to extend the steering box shaft.

The triangle is an inherently strong shape and the overall layout will help in my goal to keep the car as light as possible.

[Old6rodder]

Now that's just far too rational. :cool:

[64 DODGE 440]

Now that's just far too rational. :cool:

I'm sure I'll get quite a ration before I'm done.:D

[ThingyM]

Build it like YOU want it. That is the neat part of these things...

[348chevy]

You know Tom weight or lack of it equals horsepower. Several years ago Car Craft magazine ran a test. They took a 80 something Cadillac sedan and ran it through the quarter. It went something like 78 mph and about 18 sec. et. they then took a cutting torch and started cutting pieces off ala Bug. They finally were down to the frame which was heavy enough, and they were over a 100mph and in the 13's.:p Roy

[64 DODGE 440]

You know Tom weight or lack of it equals horsepower. Several years ago Car Craft magazine ran a test. They took a 80 something Cadillac sedan and ran it through the quarter. It went something like 78 mph and about 18 sec. et. they then took a cutting torch and started cutting pieces off ala Bug. They finally were down to the frame which was heavy enough, and they were over a 100mph and in the 13's.:p Roy

Pounds per horsepower has always been the name of the game. Back in the high school days I had a '50 Chevy coupe and couldn't afford speed parts, so the car got gutted. Beat a friend in a street race with a similar car with two carbs and duals and he couldn't figure out how.

All that steel on the garage floor had a lot to do with it. :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Small progress update:

No visible changes so no pictures yet, but the back yard engineering is progressing nicely and I hope to have some "engineering shots" to add in the near future.

Got the front suspension figured out and the chassis will be a major triangle. Wheelbase looks like it's going to come in around 110" or slightly shorter.

Need a top cover with the shifter for the '34 Dodge trans if anyone happens to have one lying around.

[Old6rodder]

Pounds per horsepower has always been the name of the game. Back in the high school days I had a '50 Chevy coupe and couldn't afford speed parts, so the car got gutted. Beat a friend in a street race with a similar car with two carbs and duals and he couldn't figure out how.

All that steel on the garage floor had a lot to do with it. :D

Why TOM. You've STREET raced? Tell me it ain't so ........:eek:

ps. Don't discount Tom's creative engineering streak. A tall Coors can "velocity stack" may look funny but it certainly gets a bunch more top end out of a Rochester pig when you capture that annoying standing wave with one.

[64 DODGE 440]

Why TOM. You've STREET raced? Tell me it ain't so ........:eek:


I think most here would agree.......if you built anything in the '60s, at one time or another you probably did a bit of back street drags.

Besides, as I'm sure you remember, we had that nice marked off 1/4 on Valley Center above the high school, and it would have been a shame to waste it.:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Been a while but we are starting to make some progress.......getting the chassis layout done and if all goes well, we should start welding stuff by the end of the year. Here's some pictures of where we are at.

First shot is from the right rear,
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/3647/11212007rr02up3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Next is a side profile showing the height that the engine will sit above the rails,
http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/6001/11212007rr03dr6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Third shows the nose in better detail, front suspension will be by a single quarter elliptic spring to the center of the axle,
http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/9508/11212007rr04xe6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Last picture shows the seat position offset to the left, may even be enough room for a passenger.:D
http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/9761/11212007rr05oo7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Yes.......we are having fun with this. Hope to have it up on the wheels sometime in the spring of '08.

[Ron Golden]

I think those flathead Chrysler, Plymouth, etc look great. When I lived in Riverside, Calif. I built dune buggies and used those engines cause they would pull at a low rpm.

I like your idea of the single spring in the front.

Ron

[64 DODGE 440]

I think those flathead Chrysler, Plymouth, etc look great. When I lived in Riverside, Calif. I built dune buggies and used those engines cause they would pull at a low rpm.

I like your idea of the single spring in the front.

Ron

I really like the engine. previously built a 230 in a military M37 B1 that I did a frame up restoration on, (sold the truck last year after lots of fun trips at 55 MPH and below:D ), and had a friend back in the '60s with a built 230 in a gasser style '50 Plymouth coupe, that was major quick. They have a sound all their own, and with the shorter stroke I figure the 218 will turn up pretty well.

I feel that while we may not be the fastest when we get done, we are doing everything we can to keep the car light and the car should be pretty quick, and a bunch of fun to run on a limited budget.

[348chevy]

Being the quickest and fastest does not always determine the winner. Luck and misfortune play a lot in it. I love building things with my own hands. You can build that car on a limited budget and have fun and win sometimes. I really like this class because it is built for having fun. I think each one of us would help a fellow competitor even if it meant he would get a competitive edge. That is the whole idea to have comradeship among all the players with racing fun thrown in. Strike up the welder and let the sparks fly. :D Roy

[storm king]

I certainly agree with that! On cars limited to 6 inch tires, the baddest motor has nothing to do with it.
I'm pretty sure we're going to begin building one, using a 170 inch slant six. I'm thinking about 6- 1 barrel carbs just for fun!

[64 DODGE 440]

WOW.......

As the saying goes, life is what happens while we are making other plans. Sorry to have been away for a bit, but you guys seem to have kept the fires burning.

The Rabbit build has suffered a short delay, but it will be done once I get past this minor setback. First, here is a copy of the e-mail I sent out to my friends yesterday to bring you all up to date.



"Many of you have heard some of this already, though some probably have not, so now that I'm home and on the mend I'll send out my official "not dead yet" E-mail.

At approximately 0200 on Monday morning January 7.2008, I had the "wake up call of my life", and woke up my wonderful wife, Patti and said that we really needed to go to the hospital.......I really didn't know what was wrong but my body was telling me after many years of not seeing doctors, that the time had come to see one.

On arrival at the ER, my blood pressure was174/120 and my pulse rate was 174 and I felt like my body was running in hyper drive.

After getting admitted and having many tests it was determined that my arteries were not clogged, (despite my eat anything way of living), but the Mitral Valve in my heart was torn and would need to be fixed.

On January 10th I had open heart surgery, they were able to repair the valve, and Wednesday afternoon I was able to come home and now the healing begins.

Having never previously had my chest pulled apart, I must say that the experience of coughing in the smallest way will really open your eyes wide.

Don't expect a lot of communication from me for a while, my voice is still weak from the breathing tube that I had in my throat, and doctors orders are no driving and no lifting more than 10lbs for the next six weeks.

Thank you all for your good thoughts, prayers and continued support.

Life is good on the lunatic fringe, and much more appreciated these days, hugs and love to all, Tom"



I believe the line in the song says something to the effect of "if you want to hear God laugh, tell him your plans". MAN.......I haven't heard that kind of laughter in a long time.

I guess I have some extra engineering time for the project that will help with the progress when the welder gets fired up. This is still gonna be one kick ass race car, and I plan on running it as much as I can, heads up, against anybody that will take the other lane. It ain't if we get there first.......it's the getting there that makes it all worth while. I've been given the chance to live the dream, and it's keeping the smiles working full time.

Maybe not as soon as we planned, but we'll be seeing you in the pits and staging lanes.

2008.......the start of the Wild Hare Racing "Not Dead Yet Tour!!"

[Ron Golden]

Tom,
Glad to know your still kickin....maybe not too high, but still kickin.

Ron

[348chevy]

I know what you mean about the cough. I had bypass surgery and afterwards I developed a little chest conjestion. What would be considered a mild cough is like someone kicking you in the nuts only the pain is in your chest. I found by hugging a pillow it helped. Do what the Doctor says you don't want to go back. Get well! :)Roy

[Rand Man]

Get well soon. Get to work on that "to do' list when you can.

[Oilcan Harry]

Been a while but we are starting to make some progress.......getting the chassis layout done and if all goes well, we should start welding stuff by the end of the year. Here's some pictures of where we are at.

First shot is from the right rear,
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/3647/11212007rr02up3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Next is a side profile showing the height that the engine will sit above the rails,
http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/6001/11212007rr03dr6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Third shows the nose in better detail, front suspension will be by a single quarter elliptic spring to the center of the axle,
http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/9508/11212007rr04xe6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Last picture shows the seat position offset to the left, may even be enough room for a passenger.:D
http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/9761/11212007rr05oo7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Yes.......we are having fun with this. Hope to have it up on the wheels sometime in the spring of '08.

My best wishes for a full and speedy recovery. I see you've decided to go with the cafeteria bucket seat. Great choice! Light weight, driver securing bucket style, and mustard and ketchup proof. Not to mention those handy seat belt mounts right on the side. Perfect! lol

[moparsled]

get well soon...
...
...so my flathead six can WHUP your flathead six!!!!!!!!!!!

[64 DODGE 440]

I'm baaaack.......after a bit over three months I opened the hangar today and the parts are still there.......so I did the logical thing and started tinkering and measuring a bit more. I'm even able to lift the transmission and such so things should start to happen now.

Need to scrounge a few more bits and then my first goal is to have a rolling chassis this summer or if I get lucky maybe even late spring!

Good to feel that things are starting to come together. No visible progress, but I'll put some pictures in as soon as the work shows.:D

We be havin' some fun now!!!

[Toymaker]

Glad to hear things are good, Lifting a Tranny:eek: What are you doing for a rear end?

[64 DODGE 440]

The tranny wasn't really that much, it's a 1934 Dodge trans and probably only weighs about 25 pounds.

Haven't really decided on the rear axle yet, I think I have a 7.25 from a '72 Dart being donated, but it will most likely be from a Mopar whatever it is. Brand loyalty.:D

[Rand Man]

Come on, build that thing.

[64 DODGE 440]

Progress is being made. It doesn't show yet, but will soon.:D

[97]

I'm baaaack.......after a bit over three months I opened the hangar today and the parts are still there.......so I did the logical thing and started tinkering and measuring a bit more. I'm even able to lift the transmission and such so things should start to happen now.

Need to scrounge a few more bits and then my first goal is to have a rolling chassis this summer or if I get lucky maybe even late spring!

Good to feel that things are starting to come together. No visible progress, but I'll put some pictures in as soon as the work shows.:D

We be havin' some fun now!!!


Hanger eh ,

Well that answers the question I was going to ask about the Lycoming parts lying around.

[64 DODGE 440]

Hanger eh ,

Well that answers the question I was going to ask about the Lycoming parts lying around.

Actually they are Continental parts, not Lycoming, but yes we have an aircraft in there too.

Our other toy is a 1946 Aeronca Champ, 90 horsepower conversion in military L16B trim.

Need to get some pictures taken so I can post them.

[REJ]

Tom, I know I am a long way from you, but I have a rear out of a 61 Dart laying around gathering dust. If you need it and can figure out a way to get it out there, let me know. I would be glad to donate it to the cause.
Robert

[64 DODGE 440]

Tom, I know I am a long way from you, but I have a rear out of a 61 Dart laying around gathering dust. If you need it and can figure out a way to get it out there, let me know. I would be glad to donate it to the cause.
Robert

Thanks for the offer, but I'm pretty sure that I have one now thats only a few miles away.

[64 DODGE 440]

Got some more parts collected, front wheels, 21"ers from a '29 A and a spring to cut up for the front quarter elliptic from a military dodge M37 truck.

Gonna start making parts this week and as soon as I have anything worth showing I'll post some pictures. :D

[Toymaker]

Right On!

[Old6rodder]

Tom, be sure you keep a before picture of those 21"ers.
And post it sometime. If you have the cajones .............. :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Tom, be sure you keep a before picture of those 21"ers.
And post it sometime. If you have the cajones .............. :D

Don't worry, I plan on leaving them "as is" for the initial pictures as a roller. They won't change until it reaches the final assembly stage.:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Tom, be sure you keep a before picture of those 21"ers.
And post it sometime. If you have the cajones .............. :D

Progress report, started drilling the front axle today, it will have twenty-one one inch holes by tomorrow evening. Damn, I'm loving this build.

http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/899/rabbitaxle1kb5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/899/rabbitaxle1kb5.4f88a12644.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=137&i=rabbitaxle1kb5.jpg)

Here's your "cajones" shot, the 21" wheels I got for the front.:D

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/1011/rabbit21sdj2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/1011/rabbit21sdj2.e04b7c9393.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=91&i=rabbit21sdj2.jpg)

[Ron Golden]

Perfect 50's look. However, I don't envy you drilling the front axle. Thats a lot of work.

Ron

[64 DODGE 440]

It may be a lot of work, but it will sure add to the car having the ventilation up front.:D

Actually, including the layout I'll only have about six or seven hours in it and it's been a fun project. One of those things where you can see progress happening while you work.

[Toymaker]

Lookin good Tom, you going to check out the Antique Nats. at Fontana?


Here's your "cajones" shot, the 21" wheels I got for the front.:D

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/1011/rabbit21sdj2.jpg (http://imageshack.us/)

Yours are bigger than Dicks:D:D:D

[64 DODGE 440]

[QUOTE=Toymaker;2852809]Lookin good Tom, you going to check out the Antique Nats. at Fontana?


I'm gonna have to miss that one, we have a "family gathering" that weekend.

[64 DODGE 440]

Here's a picture of the twenty-one holes in the axle. :D

http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/7899/rabbitaxle2ng0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/7899/rabbitaxle2ng0.3cf99a1fcb.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=379&i=rabbitaxle2ng0.jpg)

[Old6rodder]

That thing's flat out beautiful. :cool:

"Yours are bigger than Dicks"
Damn, they are, and so's his "axle". :eek:

[Toymaker]

DO MINE, DO MINE, DO MINE! Looks great Tom, Keep after it!

[64 DODGE 440]

DO MINE, DO MINE, DO MINE! Looks great Tom, Keep after it!

Definitely need to do yours Rocky, all you need is a couple of days, (hell, the way you work, probably just an evening), some patience, a drill press and a 1" holesaw. The layout took almost as long as the drillin', but I was into the measure many times before drillin' mode.

Just drilled a small pilot hole first and then went slow with the holesaw and used lots of oil. Messy but fun, but that covers most of the good stuff. :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Picked up a piece of cold rolled steel today, 3/8X3"X24" long and started drilling holes and soon will have the flange to build my intake and exhaust. I'll put up some pictures as soon as it's finished. Guess I'm going to go with the flow and make a set of up swept short stacks for it. The intake side will be another story. :D

Been a long time since I've had this much fun with a build. It seems like this thing is really bringing me back to what this stuff is all about and I'm loving every minute of it.

[REJ]

Looks like the west coast and east coast are thinking alike on some things. My exhaust are swept back and down and there are six of them, and they sound so good!!
You guys keep on building out there and meet us in Mokan one year so we can have some fun.
Robert

[64 DODGE 440]

Looks like the west coast and east coast are thinking alike on some things. My exhaust are swept back and down and there are six of them, and they sound so good!!
You guys keep on building out there and meet us in Mokan one year so we can have some fun.
Robert

That's our goal.......to one day have the First Annual East/West HA/GR Match Races. :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Got my manifold flange drilled. Discovered that Liquid Wrench Super Penetrant is a great cutting fluid for using with a hole saw in the drill press, low speed and light feed pressure and it cut like butter.

http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/4237/rabbitflange2uw7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/4237/rabbitflange2uw7.f55e75f488.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=502&i=rabbitflange2uw7.jpg)

[leon renaud]

I'm baaaack.......after a bit over three months I opened the hangar today and the parts are still there.......so I did the logical thing and started tinkering and measuring a bit more. I'm even able to lift the transmission and such so things should start to happen now.

Need to scrounge a few more bits and then my first goal is to have a rolling chassis this summer or if I get lucky maybe even late spring!

Good to feel that things are starting to come together. No visible progress, but I'll put some pictures in as soon as the work shows.:D

We be havin' some fun now!!!I thought those white tubes looked like wing struts!I seem to remember a couple of rails built in the late 50s out of wing strut tubing for frame rails one was drilled full of appx.2 inch holes the full length.the other thing I remember about that car was everything but the body tin was painted white engine and all.

[dixiedog]

Not to be nosey but what brand hole saw do you use?

I love this build, it's different. I am interested to see how this front end is going to work with a single point of the frame and 1/4 elliptics. How the hell is that going to work?

My best buddy up here just had a 2 way bypass over Christmas (we are both 45), we used to work out together last fall and we had his bench press up to 185lbs and now he just works out with light weights on machines. Told me the pillow trick about coughing, wouldn't talk to me because all I do is crack jokes and he couldn't laugh.

Keep up the fight,

[64 DODGE 440]

Not to be nosey but what brand hole saw do you use?

I love this build, it's different. I am interested to see how this front end is going to work with a single point of the frame and 1/4 elliptics. How the hell is that going to work?

My best buddy up here just had a 2 way bypass over Christmas (we are both 45), we used to work out together last fall and we had his bench press up to 185lbs and now he just works out with light weights on machines. Told me the pillow trick about coughing, wouldn't talk to me because all I do is crack jokes and he couldn't laugh.

Keep up the fight,

I used Lenox Bi-Metal hole saws that I bought at Lowe's, made in USA and I've been happy with the results. Previously I have used Blu-Mol hole saws with equally good results.

The single point chassis should work well with the single 1/4 elliptic spring.

This car of John Ewald inspired me at the 2007 CHRR at Famoso.

http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/8577/jeaafdsb8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[64 DODGE 440]

We got stacks!!:cool:

http://img113.imageshack.us/img113/3889/61808003bu6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Toymaker]

Those are cool Tom, plenty of down force:D are you and the misses going to the ANRA race saturday?

[Old6rodder]

That "stacks up" pretty good, Tom. :D (Sorry 'bout that one. :rolleyes:)

Looking forward to seeing some carbon in'em. :cool:

[nexxussian]

MMMMMMMM, Stackage:D.

[64 DODGE 440]

Sorry Rocky, we're going to miss the ANRA meet this weekend. Too much stuff on the home front right now.

Get that tractor into the 14s and keep Dick honest.:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Well DAMN!!! CRAP, CRAP, CRAP!!!

After finally starting to make progress, another delay.......

Thought that my problems were over, (see post #35 of 1.19.2008, this thread), things have been going well since I got back into working on the car and then I hear that laughing again.

Last Friday I had my eyes dilated as part of a "normal" eye exam and that evening my heart rate had jumped up to 129, (it was 59 that morning and has been running in the high 50s to mid 60s since early March). It seems that the drops they use to dilate your eyes contains atropine and it effects some people more than others and I'm one of the "lucky ones".

That sent me back into Atrial Fibrillation and now I have two more pills to take each day and am on a "no strenuous activity" regimen for the next month or more depending on results. The cardiologist said I can walk about "at a slow pace or stroll, but no work", so here we go again, just as I felt that we were starting to make some real progress.

On the bright side, my name has avoided showing up in the obituaries and I'm still seeing grass when I go outside, not dirt and roots, so life is good. I guess it will give me some more "engineering time" for the little details and more time to read.

Hang in there folks, you ain't rid of me yet, I'm damn well gonna have a roller by the end of the year. Got the parts and gonna build the thing on way or another. Just frustrated by the circumstances and delays, but still inspired to get it together.

Think I am going to have to run some of that high priced gas through the '64 and go mark some pavement for an attitude adjust.

[Old6rodder]

Yeah, go paint some street, always helps the attitude. Just don't get stupid and actually enjoy it, that might up your heart rate again. :p

Sorry Tom, couldn't resist that one. :o

You'd think they'd have given you a list of the various drugs that'd affect your condition rather than let you find out the hard way. Oh well, at least it's one mistake you won't remake.

By the way, if you want'em you can have a pair of the rims I got for the Ford rear. You know, 'cause of how I feel so sorry for ya and all ....... :D
Actually we only need two of'em so the rest are just in the way, and in my garage that's a problem. They're certainly strong enough.

Let me know, I'll be out your way sometime next week again.

[Hudsonator]

I'm a mopar flatty fan, I hate your situation is slowing you down.

I'd like to hear those pipes sing. The SU's are sexadelic.

Hud

[64 DODGE 440]

Don't worry, it's gonna sing. This is just one of those three steps forward, one step back deals.

Just need to get my ignition re-timed and we'll be makin' some beautiful noises.:cool:

Got a pile of parts and pieces to put together and things will really start lookin' good.:D

I didn't get my new birthday in January to sit on my butt and watch the fun happen, I'm gonna get out there and make it happen!

[Toymaker]

Tom, Glad to hear your OK, that's the most important #1 thing! Just have that car ready for next year so we can all get together. Rocky

[64 DODGE 440]

Tom, Glad to hear your OK, that's the most important #1 thing! Just have that car ready for next year so we can all get together. Rocky

That's my intent Rocky. Somebody needs to get out there and run slower than you. :D

We may be slow, but I doubt that we will ever stage next to a car that will be the same.:cool:

[348chevy]

You know at the Tulsa nostagia races that was really a common comment was that there were no two cars alike. That is what is fun about this class is ingenuity. We do not have any cookie cutter cars like the NHRA touring clowns.:DRoy

[Hudsonator]

I'm still diggin' the stacks.

Stacks and side suckers, just what snappy 230's are made of.

Hud

[64 DODGE 440]

I'm still diggin' the stacks.

Stacks and side suckers, just what snappy 230's are made of.

Hud

Gonna work good on the 218 too. The short stroke should make up for the slightly lower displacement.

[64 DODGE 440]

Good news (finally).

Friday morning I'm getting my timing reset.......(they are doing a procedure called a cardioversion that puts my heart back into proper rhythm, hopefully third time is charm), and once I get back up to speed, we'll start making some real progress on the car. Been doing about an hour a day with my "no strenuous activity" regimen and hope to have some pictures in the next week or so of real parts going together.

Thanks to all for your support and good wishes.

[REJ]

Good luck on your procedure, we'll be seeing a lot of progress on the car I'm sure.
We have to take care of ourselves first, if we are going to enjoy what we do.
Robert

[Toymaker]

Great News Tom!

[64 DODGE 440]

Well, last Friday was successful, they zapped me and got the timing reset and all appears to be running well once again sooooooo.:D

PROGRESS!!

Got the intake and exhaust plumbing all done and making some more progress on the chassis layout, and now that I have the rear axle,(an 8" Ford) it will be much easier to get things stuck together. Hope to have a roller by the end of the year so I can at least push it aroung and make car noises.:D

The plumbing:

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/5830/plumbing4bm6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

The mock up:

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/9958/mockup6zl0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Old6rodder]

Jesus Tom, an eight FOOT Ford rear? :eek: They'll certainly need to widen the bleach box some. :p :D

Ah, I see you've narrowed it to an 8", must've been a bit of work in that. Don't you think 8" may be just a tad too narrow?

Plumbing's looking great, sir.

[348chevy]

Do you guys on the left coast have a warehouse stocked with sidesucker carbs?:pRoy

[64 DODGE 440]

Do you guys on the left coast have a warehouse stocked with sidesucker carbs?:pRoy

Sure, ya just go to Sidesuckers R Us and pick 'em up.

Actually, mine came from an old Volvo we had back in the mid '70s.

They are out there, you just need to hunt a bit and there are several shops that have rebuilts and kits available. Just google SU carburettors.

[Dolmetsch]

You are gonna get rid of the "trans brake"?
It is gonna be one cool rail. I'm pullin fuer ya
Don
PS crane used to have some nice cammasters for those motors. i did some classic boat engines and had them put one grind on my core. Worked wonderful and is still working great 15years later so i hear. i forget who i talked to but he was most interested and very helpful. (Many Marine engines also had dual carbs although your SUs will be far better.
Don.

[64 DODGE 440]

Thanks for the kind words, Don.

The "trans brake" is removed, just haven't pulled the drum. May keep the drum as a rear flywheel or just extra ballast to help with the traction so I don't smoke the tires through the lights.:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Visible progress today.......:cool:

Finally started welding bits together and the basic chassis is ready to hang brackets on and put the axles under her. As I previously said it's a triangle made from Model T Ford rails, simple, rigid and light.

Next step is to achieve "roller status" and then start hanging the important bits on it.:D

First picture is from the right front.

http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/4047/chassis01yg2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Second picture is from the left rear.

http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/4723/chassis02gm3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Toymaker]

Good to see you makin' progress Tom!

[Old6rodder]

Yesssssss, it is begun! :cool:

[class 'A']

Coming along nicely!
Hope your health keeps up.


Mike
Waiting for Champ Pics. :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Coming along nicely!
Hope your health keeps up.


Mike
Waiting for Champ Pics. :D

Had a doctor's checkup Tuesday and he said I'm doing good. My goal is to stay that way and make this car come together!:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Another step forward, got the bat wings made and the spring fitting on the front axle,made the spring clamp plates and got the thing mocked up to figure where the hairpin brackets go.

I have the rear axle mount plates done and fitted to the chassis and once I get the housing cleaned up I'll hang the 8"ford under the back side. Ain't far from being a roller. We be havin' fun.:cool:

First picture is from the front showing the spring mount and basic layout for the hairpins.

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/2505/frontviewow9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Second shot is from the drivers point of view.

http://img388.imageshack.us/img388/914/driverviewyy7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Toymaker]

That's FREAKIN' COOL Tom! Love that front end.

[Old6rodder]

I don't think bone mounts attached with a spring clamp and a pair of vise grips are going to pass tech ........... ANYWHERE! :D

Nor can I truly believe that a rear end-less frame needs kitty litter. :eek:

Parts are starting to resemble a car. Lookin' good Tom. :cool:

[vectorsolid]

Looks cool. :)

that's a lot of leverage. Have you stood on the nose and watched the spring movement?

[nexxussian]

Had a doctor's checkup Tuesday and he said I'm doing good. My goal is to stay that way and make this car come together!:D


Dang, how'd I miss this? Good news, glad to hear it.

Good to see progress too.

[64 DODGE 440]

Looks cool. :)

that's a lot of leverage. Have you stood on the nose and watched the spring movement?

Been there, done that.......I believe that's how the saying goes.

Made that spring from a military M37B1 3/4 ton rear leaf, it doesn't flex much.:D

With the engine setback we'll be running and the planned weight of the car, I don't think we'll have a problem.:cool:

[64 DODGE 440]

Dang, how'd I miss this? Good news, glad to hear it.

Good to see progress too.

Life is good.......got up this morning and I wasn't in the obituaries, it's another beautiful day to make race car parts.:D

[2b-banjo]

Excellent job!!! Very creative, I like it.

[nexxussian]

Life is good.......got up this morning and I wasn't in the obituaries, it's another beautiful day to make race car parts.:D


That's good, it's also the one part of the paper I DON"T read.:eek:

[vectorsolid]

Life is good.......got up this morning and I wasn't in the obituaries, it's another beautiful day to make race car parts.:D

I wish I lived nearer to ya, I'd swing by and help ya knock it out. :)

[64 DODGE 440]

I wish I lived nearer to ya, I'd swing by and help ya knock it out. :)

For me it's not the speed of the build or the car when it's done that matters, it's the joy of the trip that makes it all worth while.

We may not be the quickest out there, (in build or ET, though I will admit I cut a pretty good tree), but our goal is to enjoy the journey to the maximum.:D

Quick times and fast runs gather wins, but consistent runs and good reactions do too. Been doing this stuff on and off since 1962 when a couple of friends and I built a gutted shell of a '53 Ford Victoria into a gasser and always done it because it brought a smile to my face. Made some boxes of little pieces out of big parts, (mostly transmissions) and it may have pissed me off at the time, but I have some great memories and tales of "the time the trans case spread across the street", and things like grenading a '39 box and Columbia rear end on the same launch.

If we ain't doing this for fun, what the hell are we doing here?

[64 DODGE 440]

Well.......got about a week of goofing off in the shop and finally have some more progress to show for it. Got rid of the spring clamps and vice grips in the process and made up the brackets for the rear of the hairpins and the mount plates to hang the 8" ford rear under the rails.

First shot is the rear mount plates.......Rocky, note the liberal use of holes.:p

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/5038/rabbit11620083qm7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Second shot from the front quarter.

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/2799/rabbit11620086ej3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Third shot of the hairpin bracket.......hole saw used here too.:p

http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/5534/rabbit11620087rw8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Last shot from the front just 'cause it looks cool.:D

http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/1043/rabbit11620085yc6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Stay tuned for more to come. This is looking to be a good month.

[vectorsolid]

Looks neat. :)

Just curious, how do you plan to dampen the rotational movement shown in the image?

the movement shown is greatly exaggerated so it's easier to see.

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/7366/frontendtwistnm7.jpg

[nexxussian]

MMM Holes.:D

Looks good so far.

[Toymaker]

Lookin Good Tom! Are you sure you didn't buy those brackets? They sure look nice :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Looks neat. :)

Just curious, how do you plan to dampen the rotational movement shown in the image?

the movement shown is greatly exaggerated so it's easier to see.

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/7366/frontendtwistnm7.jpg

It didn't seem to be a problem for these guys, (reference post #66), running much faster than we can hope for so I'm not really concerned with your perceived problem.

Plan on having the front wheels balanced and if an excess of bounce occurs we will deal with it at that time.


http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/8577/jeaafdsb8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[ThingyM]

Tom,, Don't ya think you might need some sort of a panard bar for the front end..???? And shocks... But it really looks cool...

[64 DODGE 440]

Lookin Good Tom! Are you sure you didn't buy those brackets? They sure look nice :D

Thanks for the compliment, Rocky.

Sometimes I amaze myself in what I make with a drill press, band saw and belt sander.:p

It takes a bit more time than if I had a properly equipped shop with a mill and lathe and such, but it does link back to doing it how they did back in the "old days".

Must be a carryover from all of my years as a machinist and tool maker that some of it sunk in to my thick skull before I fled the computerization of the trade and took up wrenchin' on old aircraft.:cool:

If tech would accept fabric covering for the body like on the old aircraft I could knock a bit more weight off of the car.:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Tom,, Don't ya think you might need some sort of a panard bar for the front end..???? And shocks... But it really looks cool...

The sideways motion is taken care of by the spring, that three leaf quarter ellyptic was made from a military Dodge M37B1 rear spring and is over 1" thick. Plenty stiff enough to handle the loads and damn near rigid so shocks shouldn't be a necessity, but if needed I have that in the plans as an easy add-on.

[ThingyM]

What I was thinking Tom, That you might have some movement at where the spring is clamped to the sq, tube. Thats all... "The Spring From Hell" he he he.......On my Fiat, The front spring is a single leaf 3000# trailer spring...It don't move either.....

[64 DODGE 440]

What I was thinking Tom, That you might have some movement at where the spring is clamped to the sq, tube. Thats all... "The Spring From Hell" he he he.......On my Fiat, The front spring is a single leaf 3000# trailer spring...It don't move either.....

The mounting to the square tube has another piece that isn't there yet, shouldn't be a problem.

[alteredpilot]

Man Oh Man...
This thing is gonna be WILD!

i really hate it when you guy do things that i would NEVER think to do....

REALLY NEAT CAR!

that front end design is just too cool.
i dig the way you've got your rear end in there.
love the intake and exhaust.

now get it done.
if you let DickM get his done first there will be unspeakable thrashings to be had.

[64 DODGE 440]

Man Oh Man...
This thing is gonna be WILD!

i really hate it when you guy do things that i would NEVER think to do....

REALLY NEAT CAR!

that front end design is just too cool.
i dig the way you've got your rear end in there.
love the intake and exhaust.

now get it done.
if you let DickM get his done first there will be unspeakable thrashings to be had.


Thanks for the kind words, we strive to be unique.......

Not worried about DickM.......he's older than me and I'll take the thrashing.:D

[vectorsolid]

Your car, do as you please. :)

But "looks like" is not the same as "exactly the same". I'd drop those dudes a note, see if they can get you a close up shot of the front end. Been a year and a half whats a few days to verify something that critical? :)

I looked for over an hour and nobody else is doing it like that. Maybe your extra clever. And if so, I say congrats. the shackle bolts make me uneasy, the trapezoid shape of the front end geometry requires that there be no slop in that joint or it will move side to side. that leaf has become a panhard of sorts. Just be safe, that's all I'm saying (and a few others).

nothing personal, I'd rather have you look at something a few extra times than regret it later. :o

[64 DODGE 440]

Your car, do as you please. :)

But "looks like" is not the same as "exactly the same". I'd drop those dudes a note, see if they can get you a close up shot of the front end. Been a year and a half whats a few days to verify something that critical? :)

I looked for over an hour and nobody else is doing it like that. Maybe your extra clever. And if so, I say congrats. the shackle bolts make me uneasy, the trapezoid shape of the front end geometry requires that there be no slop in that joint or it will move side to side. that leaf has become a panhard of sorts. Just be safe, that's all I'm saying (and a few others).

nothing personal, I'd rather have you look at something a few extra times than regret it later. :o

Trust me I have checked that front end out from all angles, there is no side play on my setup, no panhard is needed, there is no shackle, (design secret) and the front end is quite safe. No regrets. Just because others haven't taken a path doesn't mean, "lions, tigers and bears, oh my".:D

Back yard engineering still exists and works.:p

[nexxussian]

Um, so it doesn't bother you that you aren't in Kansas anymore?

[64 DODGE 440]

Um, so it doesn't bother you that you aren't in Kansas anymore?

Haven't got a dog anymore either.:p

[Old6rodder]

Nah, SoKal'll do just fine, spent a week in Kansas one day a few years back. Nice place. :D

Hey Tom, whatcha need two seperate front wheels for anyhow?
Maybe push'em together like a row tractor.
OH yeah, you need'em to hold up what's left of that axle. :eek:

Lookin' damn good Sir, keep on keepin' on.

[ThingyM]

Ol' Team Twirl'n showed up at my joint today.. He had a camera in his hand.. I told him to either put it back in the car or it will be confiscated and smashed.Then he started laughing...Just kidding.. Had a good visit..Sad News. His dad just passed away yesterday..Im so sorry my friend.He is now in Gods hands and at peace...

[nexxussian]

haven't got a dog anymore either.:p


:) :) :)

[ThingyM]

So whats so bad about Kansas.??? It's a good state to be from, About 2000 miles from... The K.C Kid....

[alteredpilot]

Ol' Team Twirl'n showed up at my joint today.. He had a camera in his hand.. I told him to either put it back in the car or it will be confiscated and smashed.Then he started laughing...Just kidding.. Had a good visit..Sad News. His dad just passed away yesterday..Im so sorry my friend.He is now in Gods hands and at peace...

AAARRRGGGGHHHH!!!

i KNEW i shoulda stopped by...
i had to stop at Mooneyes for something and my car just kept wanting to go a little further, but i had to get my wife somewhere....


sorry about yer pops.

[Toymaker]

Thanks guys, Dad was 82 and still working when his heart gave out. My dad was the best! Rocky

[nexxussian]

So whats so bad about Kansas.??? It's a good state to be from, About 2000 miles from... The K.C Kid....

Trust me I have checked that front end out from all angles, there is no side play on my setup, no panhard is needed, there is no shackle, (design secret) and the front end is quite safe. No regrets. Just because others haven't taken a path doesn't mean, "lions, tigers and bears, oh my".:D


It's a reference to a movie, in that part of the movie the group on screen is on their way to a special place, to visit a special person, and they're on an oddly paved street. That group (at that point in the movie) would include the characters, Tin Man, Scare Crow, Dorothy, AND Toto (The Cowardly Lion, as played by Burt Lahr (sp?) had yet to appear, he shows up in this sequence though, hence the 'lion' tie in). And no, they weren't in Kansas at that point. :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Well.......been gone to Arizona for the last ten days, my mother in law fell and broke her hip and we had to make a rush trip to get her set up in a rehab hospital along with a bunch of other stuff.

Got home today to find a box of parts for the Rabbit that I had ordered came in while we were gone, so it's time to start hanging pieces together and getting the big parts hung in place so we can figure out where the little parts need to go.:cool:

Probably be a few days till it comes together, but we should have some good progress in the next few weeks.

Screw Kansas.......it's good to be back home in SoCal!!:D

[nexxussian]

Sorry to hear about the familial health issues.

Glad to hear you are back on track (and home, home's a good thing).

[wsdad]

64Dodge440,

I'm very happy to have found your thread because I'm considering a similar front end. I'll be following your creation with great interest! Please keep the pictures coming. I'm looking forward to a test drive report.

I think the front axle will provide a little sway-bar action through your hairpins. The frame looks pretty flexy, though, so I'm not sure how much will be transferred to the bulk of the weight of the rest of the car. Fortunately, it will be going mostly in a straight line so I think it will work out very well. My point is, I think it will turn corners a lot better than it looks like it would at first glance. It looks like it would act like a tricycle, but I think the torsional rigidity of the axle acting on the hairpins will keep the frame from tipping. I think it will be quite stable.

Besides, even if it only had one wheel on the front, the solidly mounted rear will not roll (tip) at all.

I wonder if a boxed boat trailer frame would work?

P.S. I don't know how much God listens to the likes of me, but I'll be praying your health continues to improve.

[ThingyM]

WS.. God listens to everyones prayers.... I too like Toms concept..And I thought about the spring efect. But after talking with John Ewald, Who has a TF car with the suspension like that.. Everything is cool.. BTW> Your trailer frame should work.. If it can run a boat down the freeway for miles. There is no reason it should not take you down the 1/4 mile. Since I'm in the conveyor business. Guess what materials my frame is made of...I Can't wait to see it go down the track..A kid with a new toy...Dick..

[64 DODGE 440]

64Dodge440,

I'm very happy to have found your thread because I'm considering a similar front end. I'll be following your creation with great interest! Please keep the pictures coming. I'm looking forward to a test drive report.

I think the front axle will provide a little sway-bar action through your hairpins. The frame looks pretty flexy, though, so I'm not sure how much will be transferred to the bulk of the weight of the rest of the car. Fortunately, it will be going mostly in a straight line so I think it will work out very well. My point is, I think it will turn corners a lot better than it looks like it would at first glance. It looks like it would act like a tricycle, but I think the torsional rigidity of the axle acting on the hairpins will keep the frame from tipping. I think it will be quite stable.

Besides, even if it only had one wheel on the front, the solidly mounted rear will not roll (tip) at all.

I wonder if a boxed boat trailer frame would work?

P.S. I don't know how much God listens to the likes of me, but I'll be praying your health continues to improve.

As you said, the solid mount rear will pretty much take the roll problem out of the equation, particularly with the wide track stance involved, and though it looks "flexy", that triangle chassis is pretty dang rigid. I feel that the main thing is to make sure that the front wheels are well balanced and there shouldn't be any problems. That and the fact that the car is designed for the purpose of going in a straight line, not road racing, had a lot to do with the design.

As you said, it would work well with only a single front, but that is sort of outside the rules, although it would be a great way to cut weight.:D

Boat trailer frame would probably work, but it's more fun to build from scratch, even if using existing parts like our Model T rails.

The line from the song says "if you want to hear God laugh, tell him your plans", I must say I have heard a lot of laughter this year. It keeps me inspired in the build.

[64 DODGE 440]

WS.. God listens to everyones prayers.... I too like Toms concept..And I thought about the spring efect. But after talking with John Ewald, Who has a TF car with the suspension like that.. Everything is cool.. BTW> Your trailer frame should work.. If it can run a boat down the freeway for miles. There is no reason it should not take you down the 1/4 mile. Since I'm in the conveyor business. Guess what materials my frame is made of...I Can't wait to see it go down the track..A kid with a new toy...Dick..

Ewald's car was a big inspiration for me and I figured if it worked for him at the speeds of that car, it should work fine for us.

[wsdad]

Since I'm in the conveyor business. Guess what materials my frame is made of...
Is your wheelie bar wheel longer and wider than most? - Kind of cylindrically shaped, like a roller? :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThingyM:
Since I'm in the conveyor business. Guess what materials my frame is made of...

Is your wheelie bar wheel longer and wider than most? - Kind of cylindrically shaped, like a roller? :D

Hell, forget the wheelie bar, is the car belt drive?:D

[wsdad]

The sideways motion is taken care of by the spring, that three leaf quarter ellyptic was made from a military Dodge M37B1 rear spring and is over 1" thick. Plenty stiff enough to handle the loads and damn near rigid so shocks shouldn't be a necessity, but if needed I have that in the plans as an easy add-on.

What are your plans for the shocks, should you need them? Your frame is a long way from the axle.

My spring will be much softer so I very likely will have to have them. I'm hoping you've come up with a better idea than I've been able to.

[64 DODGE 440]

What are your plans for the shocks, should you need them? Your frame is a long way from the axle.

My spring will be much softer so I very likely will have to have them. I'm hoping you've come up with a better idea than I've been able to.

Something simple along the lines of these.

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/6683/1015200711qj6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[64 DODGE 440]

Finally some more visual progress to show, I got the front engine mount to chassis piece put together today.

I know that to those who aren't familiar with the early Mopar "Floating Power" engine mounts will look at this and go WTF, but those among you who know this setup realize that it mounts to a point above the timing chain cover on the front of the block as can be seen in the picture in post 67 and that's why it looks so high. The final assembly will have the nose of the crankshaft 6" above the frame rails and the engine will sit at 6 degrees up in the front along the lines of many of the early altereds and the engine will sit above the rails as the previous pictures in posts 67 and 84 show the basic layout.

First picture is from the left front of the chassis and shows it pretty well.

http://img124.imageshack.us/img124/5927/rabbit1211200807ko6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Second picture from the right front quarter.

http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6364/rabbit1211200804sd5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

The liberally ventilated formed piece at the top is part of the original '34 Dodge factory mount and the vertical legs are made from airfoil shaped aircraft streamlined strut tubing acquired from the rebuild of our '46 Aeronca Champ that also calls our hangar home.

Next comes the rear mounts and when they are done and the engine can be mounted all of the controls and driveline bits can be made and things will really start coming together.:D

[REJ]

Tom, that thing looks great. I love the different thinking you guys on the west coast are putting into these cars!
Hurry and more pics!!
Robert

[Toymaker]

I cant wait to see your car sittin on all 4!

[64 DODGE 440]

I cant wait to see your car sittin on all 4!

Lookin' forward to it myself.:cool:

[wsdad]

Something simple along the lines of these.

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/6683/1015200711qj6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Does the rubber bushings keep it from binding? The arc of the shock lever is way shorter than the arc of the hairpins. I'm guessing the rubber bushing compressing allows for the different lengths.

Exwestracer pointed out to me that a boxed shackle would handle the side loads while providing for the difference in length of the arcs. However, if the bushings are able to squish enough to work, that is a much simpler idea. I like it!

A good unintended consequence is that it also provides a nice gradual, gentle bump stop for the suspension as the rubber "squishability" runs out and the suspension starts to bind (in an extreme event, not in normal driving). That would keep the frame off the ground until the suspension broke - if you'd ever reach that point.

So, is that how it works? The compressed rubber bushing allows for the different lengths of the hairpins and shock levers?

[ThingyM]

I think the movement on the frontend is so minimal that the shocks just dampen it enough so you dont get wheel hop or fluttering....

[64 DODGE 440]

Does the rubber bushings keep it from binding? The arc of the shock lever is way shorter than the arc of the hairpins. I'm guessing the rubber bushing compressing allows for the different lengths.

Exwestracer pointed out to me that a boxed shackle would handle the side loads while providing for the difference in length of the arcs. However, if the bushings are able to squish enough to work, that is a much simpler idea. I like it!

A good unintended consequence is that it also provides a nice gradual, gentle bump stop for the suspension as the rubber "squishability" runs out and the suspension starts to bind (in an extreme event, not in normal driving). That would keep the frame off the ground until the suspension broke - if you'd ever reach that point.

So, is that how it works? The compressed rubber bushing allows for the different lengths of the hairpins and shock levers?

What you said.......the difference in arcs of the hairpins and the spring do cause a movement relative to the spring attach point, but with the relative small travel of the assembly considering the stiffness of our spring and the movement allowed by the rubber bushing of the spring eye, there shouldn't be any conflict in the setup.

If the suspension had five or six inches of travel it might be a problem, but with the rigidity of the spring and the weight of the car, I don't think that is going to happen.

If we need to make some friction shocks for our setup, the ends of the shocks can be linked or slotted to allow for the movement.

[Doug Sparks]

Hi, I'm new to these kind of dragsters.I understand they are like the 50s bug, but what do they call them now. I was starting a front engined dragster, tube construction, but I might switch to one of these ones

[Rand Man]

They are called HAMB Gas Rails or HA/GR.

[64 DODGE 440]

They are called HAMB Gas Rails or HA/GR.

Or to keep it simple they are called FUN!!

[Doug Sparks]

what is the HP of a stock Ford flat head??

[97]

what is the HP of a stock Ford flat head??

Between 60 and 154 hp...

'39 and later 239 cubes 100 or 255 cube Merc 125 hp as a base to build a HA/GR engine if you are serious about horsepower.

337 inch 154 hp Lincoln /Ford truck motor ???????? dunno

[Doug Sparks]

About 100- 125 hp, that's what a 151 Chevy S-10 motor is.I have enough spare parts to build a HA/GR except the motor. The cost of buying and rebuilding a pre 1962 motor would be more than I would be willing to spend. Too bad there isn't a 1962 and older class...

[Joe Hamby]

Welcome Doug. What part of the usa are you in? Check out what toymaker did for an engine. Joe

[Old6rodder]

About 100- 125 hp, that's what a 151 Chevy S-10 motor is.I have enough spare parts to build a HA/GR except the motor. The cost of buying and rebuilding a pre 1962 motor would be more than I would be willing to spend. Too bad there isn't a 1962 and older class...

Many of the '60-'62 inliners were made on into later years in the same molds, some as late as '76 (ie, the slants). These are generally accepted as they're literally the same as the first models, and they're available quite cheaply. Ford, Chevy and Chrysler (Dodge & Plymouth) all had'em, and I'll bet there are others as well.

[Doug Sparks]

I'm from Northern Indiana. I have been reading other posts discussing HA/GR legality with the NHRA. What I have concluded is to build one of these gas dragsters I will have to follow NHRA rules for an altered dragster. Basiclly a funny car frame with a full width front and rearend. This makes sense. I believe I can still use rectangular tubing for the bottom frame. I'm still thinking on an engine...

[64 DODGE 440]

No pictures yet.......I'll take some tomorrow, but the chassis is on wheels and rolls!!:cool:

If everything goes right, I should have the engine core set in place next week and start working on the details like clutch linkage, drive shaft, steering and such.

[Toymaker]

Cool Tom, do you have an engine ready or do you still have too build 1?

[64 DODGE 440]

I have the engine, just need to go through it before it runs.

That's the "easy part". The flathead Dodge is an easy build and parts are available so when all the other stuff gets done and I tear the car down for paint and such, the engine goes on the stand and gets done. When it goes back together we'll be ready to rock.

Never said I was the fastest builder, but we're getting there slowly but surely.:D

[Old6rodder]

I'm from Northern Indiana. I have been reading other posts discussing HA/GR legality with the NHRA. What I have concluded is to build one of these gas dragsters I will have to follow NHRA rules for an altered dragster. Basiclly a funny car frame with a full width front and rearend. This makes sense. I believe I can still use rectangular tubing for the bottom frame. I'm still thinking on an engine...

Doug, you have my sympathies, I'm from Elkhart.
Lakes winters are a BIG reason I'm in SoCal.

You have several folks around the brickyard who'll be glad to help out, even from a distance. They're very well versed in HA/GR down there.
In that the class has been around long enough for a few to get out of it now, there may even be a used car or chassis available that could be NHRA'd with reasonable effort.

[Toymaker]

Pictures, Pictures, Pictures! :D:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Pictures, Pictures, Pictures! :D:D

Sorry Rocky, I had rain at the hangar all day Friday and there just ain't enough room inside to take a decent picture. Hope to be able to roll it outside Monday or Tuesday and get some photos took.:D (Unlike Thingy I do know how to post them:p)

Must say regardless of any other opinions.......I Like It!!

Got some pieces made on Friday for the steering box mount and hope to have the engine set in place sometime next week. :cool:

[Toymaker]

Alright:(, I guess I can wait:D

[Old6rodder]

post #141 ...... I cant wait to see your car sittin on all 4!

post #161 ...... Alright:(, I guess I can wait:D

:p :D

Don't think I'll wait, think I'll run out there Tuesday.

[64 DODGE 440]

post #141 ...... I cant wait to see your car sittin on all 4!

post #161 ...... Alright:(, I guess I can wait:D

:p :D

Don't think I'll wait, think I'll run out there Tuesday.

I'll consider myself warned.:D

See ya at the hangar, we can do lunch and bench race.

[rocketadg]

Look real cool! I was kind of thinking of building one of these. but now i have to come up with a cooler design because this thing is going to be amazing. Keep up the good work.

[64 DODGE 440]

Sunshine today!!:D Got it outside for the first time and took some pictures.

Here's a walk around series.:cool:

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/680/12609rabbitchassis1iu8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/1217/12609rabbitchassis2xv2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/2338/12609rabbitchassis3ko2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/2438/12609rabbitchassis4it8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/4082/12609rabbitchassis5qk7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Next goal is to get the engine set in place.

We be havin' some fun now!!

[Old6rodder]

Fuckin' A! :D

[esfoder]

Hey dodger love thoes front wheels!!!! Are you going to run them on the car for race day?


The chassis looks great too!!!

Keep up the good work.

Must be nice to have sunshine???

Dusty

[Toymaker]

Thats wild Tom!

[64 DODGE 440]

That's just the beginning.

I have a feeling this is gonna be a good week for visible stuff to happen.:D

[REJ]

I love what I am seeing! More pics as it comes together.
Robert

[64 DODGE 440]

Hey Rocky.......lets go.:p

In the spirit of the Bug!!

http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/5394/1272009rabbit5ib8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/1194/1272009rabbit2yr4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/6496/1272009rabbit3ao3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Joe Hamby]

Now that reminds me of the bug. Be sure and tie down that chair.

[64 DODGE 440]

And a few more for the fans.......


From the front:

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/1723/1272009rabbit4oz7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

From the front quarter:

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/4150/1272009rabbit1no7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

And with my inspiration, Old6rodder:

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/4081/1272009rabbit6zc6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[bobw]

Man, your dragster is truely one of a kind! It looks ten times better outside and up on wheels. Oh, it would be so sweet if it could be run with a shoulder high single rollbar and no body panels. A real BUG.

[alteredpilot]

tom...
yer killin' me.

[64 DODGE 440]

Hey Mitch, just doin' my best to keep hotrodders ingenuity alive.:cool:

We may not be the fastest, but we're tryin' with everything we have to make sure the spirit stays alive!!

The car WILL be light and quick, we just have to see what the "hole saw concept" can make happen.:D

[348chevy]

You know the saying take off lbs. and gain HP. As you know I work for parts at a machine shop and dyno. Gary is working on some injectors for a drag racer who runs the 10.5 in slick class. You run a doorslammer that cannot have slicks bigger than 10.5 inches. The big gun in that class is not some 800 cu.in. monster motor but a Pro Charged 4 cylinder that runs 80 lbs boost and weighs 1600 lbs. 4.02 in the 1/8 mile so build it light and go quick.:D Roy

[RaceCar Rob]

Now that's just cool ,I don,t care who you are !!!!!!!!

[64 DODGE 440]

Got the seat height at a more realistic level and have a "real seat" to set in place soon. Adjusted the shift lever a bit to gain clearance for the steering wheel location and came up with a rather cool pre-made floor panel for the car. Even have a few surprises when I get the time to do a bit more tweaking on things.:cool:

If the damn rain stops I should be able to make some more progress and possibly even get some pictures taken. Meanwhile I'm making up some parts lists and doing some garage engineering.:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Had a good week, even if I was a bit cool in the hangar. Made some progress and some parts and even took some pictures today to add here.

In keeping with the light weight aspect, I made a strong but light gas pedal.

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/453/22709gaspedal.jpg (http://img7.imageshack.us/my.php?image=22709gaspedal.jpg)

Got the floor pans fitted into the rails.

http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/1384/22709floorpan1.jpg (http://img25.imageshack.us/my.php?image=22709floorpan1.jpg)

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/8070/22709floorpan2.jpg (http://img7.imageshack.us/my.php?image=22709floorpan2.jpg)

And have a "teaser" of the current assembly state until I can roll it outside next week and get some good pictures in the sunlight. The details don't show too well, but the drag link is fabricated from a piece of streamline aircraft strut tubing, light and strong.

http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/7300/22709rabbit.jpg (http://img25.imageshack.us/my.php?image=22709rabbit.jpg)

[Old6rodder]

Bitchin'.
Damn, if'n you ain't careful you're gonna have a HAMBster 'fore long.

Looking good Tom, I think you may be having too much fun with the new parts .... :D

[64 DODGE 440]

Bitchin'.
Damn, if'n you ain't careful you're gonna have a HAMBster 'fore long.

Looking good Tom, I think you may be having too much fun with the new parts .... :D

If we ain't havin' fun, what the hell are we doing this for?

[64 DODGE 440]

More progress shots.

First a front quarter shot showing our intake scoop.

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/3338/rabbit311093.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rabbit311093.jpg)

Next a couple showing the drag link.

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/2626/rabbit311096.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rabbit311096.jpg)

http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/2395/rabbit311097.jpg (http://img14.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rabbit311097.jpg)

One artsy shot for you Rocky.

http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/613/rabbit311098.jpg (http://img14.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rabbit311098.jpg)

And finally a drivers eye view.

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/7875/rabbit311099.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rabbit311099.jpg)

[Toymaker]

Soon all you'll need is gas and we'll be racing:D Are you going to bringit to DragFest finished or not?

[leeberz]

hey pop we r gonna have to get that cam so we can keep up with these new builds this ones gonna haul "the mail" looks great love the front motor mount cant wait to see it in person

[Old6rodder]

Damn, I think I've seen shorter drag links on early slingshots. :eek: :D

The front end really cooks in the "Rocky" picture, maybe I'll try a couple Rockyshots of ours this week.

Tom, how much actual caster'd you wind up with finally?

[64 DODGE 440]

Damn, I think I've seen shorter drag links on early slingshots. :eek: :D

The front end really cooks in the "Rocky" picture, maybe I'll try a couple Rockyshots of ours this week.

Tom, how much actual caster'd you wind up with finally?

Sure they had shorter drag links.......they had shorter wheel bases too.:D

The drag link is only 91" long.:p

Seems like "Rockyshots" is our new word.:D

The caster came in where I wanted it. It's right at 20 degrees.:cool:

I figure that the air scoop should be good for about five pounds boost in the lights.:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Got the clutch pedal and linkage made yesterday. Works real nice and easy to adjust if needed.

Two shots, one from the top.......

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/4382/3180919.jpg (http://img13.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3180919.jpg)

And one from the rear.......

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/8067/3180921.jpg (http://img13.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3180921.jpg)

[bobw]

That's a very sanitary installation. You must be pushing almost straight down. How far does the clutch fork move at the rod end to disengage the clutch? I look at pics of your car and old6's car almost every day. Two truely unique builds.

[64 DODGE 440]

That's a very sanitary installation. You must be pushing almost straight down. How far does the clutch fork move at the rod end to disengage the clutch? I look at pics of your car and old6's car almost every day. Two truely unique builds.

Thanks for the good words. I'm not sure on the movement at the arm, I'll take a measurement for you tomorrow.

[64 DODGE 440]

Well Bob, like all good intentions, "tomorrow" was only five days getting here. Seems like time's really fun when you are having flies.:D

Took that measurement this morning and the clutch fork at the rod end moves 3/8" from initial contact of the throwout on the clutch arms to full disengagement. I came up with a comfortable ratio on the pedal by figuring out how long the pedal would be by just using a bar across the pivot and sliding it up while pushing on it until it worked easy. Ended up around 8 to 1 for the pedal and pushes easy so it should have pretty good feel and ease of use.

[Four Banger]

Just curious...have you given much thought to how much this car will weigh? I'm thinking this may be the lightest car yet built, looking at the pictures. There is just no ugly fat at all, so far. I can't help but think that everything you'll need to add to this car to finish it and make it function will add more than another 200 pounds. I'm betting under 1200 pounds total....any guesses?

[bobw]

Thanks for the clutch linkage information. I was wanting to compare with what I did to see if mine is going to work. Keep up the great work.

[64 DODGE 440]

Thanks for the clutch linkage information. I was wanting to compare with what I did to see if mine is going to work. Keep up the great work.

Glad to help. Most of my engineering has been note paper and chalk lines on the floor type stuff, but so far it works.


Just curious...have you given much thought to how much this car will weigh? I'm thinking this may be the lightest car yet built, looking at the pictures. There is just no ugly fat at all, so far. I can't help but think that everything you'll need to add to this car to finish it and make it function will add more than another 200 pounds. I'm betting under 1200 pounds total....any guesses?

Yup, I've built from the beginning with the attitude that pounds per horsepower is the name of the game. I realize that the 218 flathead 6 won't have anywhere near the output of the Jimmys or Flathead V8s so the answer to my equation is to make the car as light as possible to compensate. Don't know if we will make it, but the goal has been to come in at or under 1000 lbs.

Actually that is the secondary goal.......the primary goal from the beginning has been to have a ball with the build and later with the car on the track and so far that goal has been achieved.:D

[Ron Golden]

Tom,

Cars looking good...and light weight. Have you given any thought to chucking the front drums in the lathe and removing the brake part and just leaving the mounting area?

Ron

[64 DODGE 440]

Tom,

Cars looking good...and light weight. Have you given any thought to chucking the front drums in the lathe and removing the brake part and just leaving the mounting area?

Ron

It's on the list of details to do when the time comes to take it apart for the final details, engine build and reassembly.

[64 DODGE 440]

Life has been getting in the way of large progress the last few weeks, have some lifestyle changes happening, but things are looking good for making progress and having more funds for the project in the near future.

I have been getting the brakes set up and making "baby steps". Hope to have a few pictures of that stuff in the next week or so.

[Toymaker]

This car is gonna be the "talk of the track". I can't wait to see "the body", hope you have it done by October :D

[Toymaker]

It's coming along nicely Tom. I had to put up a comparison!
http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/6001/11212007rr03dr6.jpg (http://imageshack.us/)
http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/2626/rabbit311096.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rabbit311096.jpg)

[64 DODGE 440]

The antique Nationals got the juices flowing and after a bit of slow down, stuff is happening again.

[64 DODGE 440]

Finally a bit of progress to report. Went to the LA Roadster Show on Saturday and scored the fuel tank I have been looking for. The mount will be a little different from the 4X6 it's sitting on right now, more of a tubing structure like the AA/FA "Pure Hell" uses, but the location is close.:p The mount is next on the construction list.

http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/1397/62209rapidrabbit1.jpg (http://img194.imageshack.us/i/62209rapidrabbit1.jpg/)

On the other end.......we have brakes!! Got the master mounted, the brakes assembled and all the plumbing done. It may not go right now, but it will stop!:D

http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/9130/62209rapidrabbit2.jpg (http://img200.imageshack.us/i/62209rapidrabbit2.jpg/)

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/9927/62209rapidrabbit3.jpg (http://img151.imageshack.us/i/62209rapidrabbit3.jpg/)

After the tank mount the seat mount base is on the list and then we'll be getting ready to start on the cage. I may be slow, but we keep plodding along.

[Old6rodder]

Personally, I think you're just stringing it out, trying to squeeze every last micron of fun out of the build ......... :p

Good looking tank, it truly fits the car. :cool:

[Toymaker]

more, more, more!

[butch nassau]

Stay at it...do something every day no matter how little.

Looking good so far.

[64 DODGE 440]

I may be slow, but I keep tinkering at it.:D

More to come.:cool:

[64 DODGE 440]

Still slow, but making some progress.

Trying to sell the '64 to help finance the project.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=397022

Really hate to see it go away, but with limited income, there's just too many toys and not enough toy money.:p

[ThingyM]

You thjink your slow.. My car is as close to being finished as its gonna be for awhile.. It's only taken me 1 1/2 years to get where I am now..Now I'm told that I have to go have my peepers operated on..Oct 19th for the left eye. And one month later for my right eye.. Geeze,, Just what I've always wanted to do..NOT !!!!.. But the car will run..I'll take it up to the Fresno/Merced race on Oct 10th. But have to find a driver..Dick M

[64 DODGE 440]

Relocated the shop.......we sold our airplane and moved out of the hangar, so everything is now in the garage at home.

Once it all gets sorted out we'll start working again. Right now, life has been getting in the way of progress, but after Rocky's Eagle Field meet things should start happening again.

I'll post some pictures when we can walk around the shop and access things once more. It's going to be nice to be able to just walk out the back door to the shop and have everything in one place.

[leeberz]

did ya start on the ol girl yet sounds like the next event is right around the corner

[64 DODGE 440]

Getting stuff put in it's place in the shop and then work will resume.

Moving from the 40'X35' hangar into the 20'X20' garage has caused some challenges, but they will be overcome.

Don't need to say that pass in Old6's Barn Job has given a huge boost to the project.:D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbYguqAG5y4

Now.......if I could just figure out how to shift a bit quicker.:p

[esfoder]

Getting stuff put in it's place in the shop and then work will resume.

Moving from the 40'X35' hangar into the 20'X20' garage has caused some challenges, but they will be overcome.

Don't need to say that pass in Old6's Barn Job has given a huge boost to the project.:D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbYguqAG5y4

Now.......if I could just figure out how to shift a bit quicker.:p


Cool ass vid 64!!!

Hell that inspires me just watching it.

Dusty

[64 DODGE 440]

Cool ass vid 64!!!

Hell that inspires me just watching it.

Dusty

If these cars don't make ya grin, ya must be incapable of emotion.:D

[Joe Hamby]

Is that Rapid Rabit about ready to come out of the briar patch? When you changed to a smaller building place, that might be a plus. When I was building mine in a larger building I kept loosing parts and tools. They were there just hard to see. Driving that Barn Job might be a disadvantage, making it hard to see past your grin. Joe

[64 DODGE 440]

Is that Rapid Rabit about ready to come out of the briar patch? When you changed to a smaller building place, that might be a plus. When I was building mine in a larger building I kept loosing parts and tools. They were there just hard to see. Driving that Barn Job might be a disadvantage, making it hard to see past your grin. Joe

The smaller shop will be a plus, now I just have to walk out the back door and I'm there, plus all of the tools are in the same place.

You are right about that pass in the Barn Job.......I'm still grinning.:D That said it also gave me a much needed push to get the Rabbit out of the briar patch and also gave some good insight as to what performance I'll need to keep them boys in sight.:D

[Joe Hamby]

It's not all that hard to keep them in sight, I have had a really good view of several including 2B, Roy Merritt, Don Alexander, Shawn Mcdermit's Crooked 6, the Okie Outlaw, the Red barron, the Ozark Mountain Special, the Owasso Rams and others, when you are just in the next lane it is a great view. Joe

[leeberz]

well?????? any progress yet buddy

[64 DODGE 440]

Damn little, life stuff keeps getting in the way.

[Toymaker]

I'm bored!

[64 DODGE 440]

I'm bored!

Man...if only we could run that kind of cage it would look period perfect. You did a good job catching our ideas. Now to get it done.:p

[64 DODGE 440]

Actually spent the last few days out in the shop getting stuff put away and getting ready to start working on it again. Nothing worth pictures yet...but soon.:p

[Toymaker]

Actually spent the last few days out in the shop getting stuff put away and getting ready to start working on it again. Nothing worth pictures yet...but soon.:p
Startin' the new year right!

[bobw]

Ok, you had three days to straighten the garage. Waiting...:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Ok, you had three days to straighten the garage. Waiting...:D

Take a breath once in a while.......I'm slow.:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Forgot to post this picture...this was back on September 17th when we brought the car home. First time I actually "drove it" although I must admit the performance with Old6rodder pushing wasn't quite up to the rest of the cars out there..it still was cool.:D

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/7097/9172009rabbithome001.jpg (http://img98.imageshack.us/i/9172009rabbithome001.jpg/)

[Toymaker]

Good to see it in the sun!

[64 DODGE 440]

Made some small progress yesterday...:p I'll have some pix to post soon.

[Toymaker]

Photos, Photos, Photos, Photos

[64 DODGE 440]

Photos, Photos, Photos, Photos

Soon, Soon, Soon, Soon!:p

[Toymaker]

Soon, Soon, Soon, Soon!:p
photos, photos, photos:p

[fxfxr]

I want more. I like very much.

[64 DODGE 440]

photos, photos, photos:p

Maybe next week...there's been too much "life" happening to get out into the shop lately.

Some progress will show soon...don't give up.:p

[64 DODGE 440]

Small progress.......no pictures yet.......maybe some after Eagle Field.

Don't get excited, it still has a loooooong way to go.:p

[64 DODGE 440]

Finally!! Some actual progress that shows.

First picture...a view as how it sits now...even have room to walk around the car in the garage.:p

http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/4644/asstjuly192010002w.jpg (http://img138.imageshack.us/i/asstjuly192010002w.jpg/)

Next up...a shot of the engine plates and the rear side of the fuel tank mount.

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/4120/asstjuly192010003w.jpg (http://img291.imageshack.us/i/asstjuly192010003w.jpg/)

Next...a shot from the front of the fuel tank mount and engine plates.

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/3507/asstjuly192010005w.jpg (http://img3.imageshack.us/i/asstjuly192010005w.jpg/)

And one last one...on the seat, checking how it fits.:D

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/4657/asstjuly192010009w.jpg (http://img6.imageshack.us/i/asstjuly192010009w.jpg/)

Feels good to be back working on the car after all the inactivity lately, (our veggie garden has been taking priority...though the results are coming to fruit nicely)...even with the temperatures in the 100's in the last week it has been fun getting out in the garage and seeing results.

[Four Banger]

Great to see you back "on the job". I've been very interested in this build, as it's a study in power to weight ratio. I'm making my prediction now...maybe around 1100 pounds ready to toll? Guess time will tell. How much power do you figure that little Dodge flat head will make?

[64 DODGE 440]

Great to see you back "on the job". I've been very interested in this build, as it's a study in power to weight ratio. I'm making my prediction now...maybe around 1100 pounds ready to toll? Guess time will tell. How much power do you figure that little Dodge flat head will make?

Our "goal" is for the car to come in under 1,000 lbs...have to wait and see how close we get to that...may need to add a few more holes before we are done.:p If all goes well, we'll be happy to have 125 to 150 hp out of the 218. Looking for fun and reliability in the car and still have a few more tricks planned in the construction.

Progress is slow, but we keep plodding away and sooner or later it will be together.:D Thanks for the comments.

[Four Banger]

I just located a 54 Nash Statesman that has the "Dual Powerflyt Six" with aluminum head and dual carbs. It still has the origonal carbs and air cleaners on it, and I'll bet I could E-Bay those and break even (or better) for what the guy wants for the car. I thought a couple long ram tubes with newer carbs would look cool as hell on the thing, or maybe a pair of 90 degree elbows and side drafts??? It's supposed to be 110 hp stock, but I'll bet some exhaust work, and better carbs would bump that up some. The car is thrashed, so I wouldn't feel too bad about parting it out. It has a torque tube rear end, and I could use that too, perhaps. I'm going to start researching parts availability for this engine to see what it will cost to make this happen. My 194 Chevy has not recieved a warm reception, but I was going to use it anyway untill the right vintage engine came along. Last night the thought occured to me..."Why do it TWICE ???" So I'll just keep looking for the right deal, till I find it. I like your Mopar Flathead, and other Flatheads in general, so I am leaning that way, since Jimmys and Stovebolts seem to go for a premium around here.

[64 DODGE 440]

Four Banger...Build the Nash, it would be cool and probably the only one running.

Small progress this week, hope to have more visible stuff next week.

[ScottV]

I just located a 54 Nash Statesman that has the "Dual Powerflyt Six" with aluminum head and dual carbs.

I like the NashTy idea !!! :p

[Four Banger]

Have you ever seen one of these dual carb engines? They're crazy looking things....no intake manifold at all. The carbs bolt right on top of the head! I'm sure there's NO real performance to be had here, and rebuild parts are pricey. But the "Cool Factor" is just right off the rails....!!!! It occures to me that half the fun of these cars (after the build, that is) is they seem to be great conversation pieces. I love people, so the social aspect of these cars tends to really turn me on. I have a front axle (a wavy 35 Dodge tube) frame material, a rear end, a seat, a fuel tank, etc, already stashed. My little 194 Chevy with it's header and Crane cam and dual carbs sits in the corner.....I think he's sad....looks sad anyway! We'll see what I can work out on this little Nash. Like the man said, it would likely be the only one.

[ScottV]

I am sure if you build it short and lite it would run ok. You can probably adapt bigger carbs and maybe get a cam re-ground ??!!??

[Four Banger]

Cam????? I think that might have been an option on one of these! LOL! Yeah, I think you can get a cam done for about anything, as long as your core is decent. I don't know how/if the valve adjustment is done on a Nash, so I don't know if a smaller base circle will cause issues or not. I'm doing all the research I can to see how this can play out. It won't be cheap, though....I know that much. I hate the idea of spending a lot of cash, and not getting any power. Hell, I can re ring an old 261 Chevy, or 270 Jimmy, and add carbs and pipes and doubtless make twice the torque for half the cost. No fun in that, though! Still searching....just found another Corn Binder that actually rolls over, and is said to run okay....or did when it was parked, like 20 years ago! Options, options....

[64 DODGE 440]

Another day.......a small step forward. Got the brackets welded to the chassis for the engine plates and got the front plate trimmed to finished size and properly "holed".:p
I figured if I couldn't be up at Famoso with Old6rodder and the guys, at least I could make some progress in our shop.:D

1st picture from the right front wheel...

http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/4985/asstaugust202010009e.jpg (http://img841.imageshack.us/i/asstaugust202010009e.jpg/)

2nd shot from the left front...

http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/7687/asstaugust202010010e.jpg (http://img441.imageshack.us/i/asstaugust202010010e.jpg/)

Last two shots from a slightly closer perspective...

http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/7218/asstaugust202010007e.jpg (http://img821.imageshack.us/i/asstaugust202010007e.jpg/)

http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/6581/asstaugust202010008e.jpg (http://img534.imageshack.us/i/asstaugust202010008e.jpg/)

[Old6rodder]

Plates're looking good Sir. :cool:

..... but you do know those SUs have an "enrichment circuit" in lieu of a choke, right? There's no need to cork up the scoop to do it .......
:D

[64 DODGE 440]

Plates're looking good Sir. :cool:

..... but you do know those SUs have an "enrichment circuit" in lieu of a choke, right? There's no need to cork up the scoop to do it .......
:D

The cork is to prevent birds from nesting while it's parked.:p

[64 DODGE 440]

Things are happening...just not any visible progress. Been busy with other stuff lately...family, house/garden stuff and helping Old6rodder on the float. Hope to have some more pictures soon.

[64 DODGE 440]

Again...no visuals yet, but...have a MIG welder on the way for the shop and have decided on what is happening for the body work...(I love having secrets). Pictures will follow soon of actual bits of race car. :p

[butch nassau]

Sano!

Great work so far.

[64 DODGE 440]

Sano!

Great work so far.

Thanks Butch...I may be slow, but I keep plodding along and sooner or later this thing is gonna run!:D

[Toymaker]

sounds like you may be gathering steam:D

[64 DODGE 440]

sounds like you may be gathering steam:D

Don't know about "steam" but I need to get some Argon/CO2. Progress can't be far away!:p