HEMI in a Box

[Tim]

hey guys,

my brain yet again turning up some ideas and i thought id ask for some ideas and thoughts.


heres the basics of the idea

take one 1950 for two door shoebox ford

add one 50 vintage old style hemi

close hood and have some fun:)

now as i see it you would need a new
radiator
motor mounts
trani mounts
drivshaft
exhaust

probably trim the inner fenders and trani tunnel as well

so that sound like that should be it? just your basic mtor swap stuff???

what trani would be easyest to bolt up and intall? with out being overly expensive?

thoughts?

coments?

pics of this done before???

TIA
tim

[manyolcars]

You didnt mention the 9 inch rearend

[Tim]

yeah was thinkin about that,

the motor is gona stay preety stock if i did this, at least to start off with, would the stock rear take stock hemi power??

ive got a 8 inch out of v8 mavric with the 5 bolt wheel patern would that take stock hemi power??

soon as i up the power a new rear would be in the plans but for now what will take it?

tim

[286merc]

So far all it will do is go in a straight line.

You gotta figure how you will steer and stop that thing as it weighs maybe 300 # more than a flatty.

[Tim]

hmm the hemi lowering kit http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[scarliner]

Saw one at a show this year in Pella Iowa--it was a white business coupe with a Hemi-was a really nice car--well done.It made for a great little car.

[FONZI]

Also may have to consider mofifying crossmember, possibly changing front suspension...... mock it up!


FONZI

[Tim]

all good info, pix anybody?

the crosmember had crossed my mind seeing as they are such a wide block but i wont know till i can mock it up i guess

tim

[Brock49Ford]

I just put a Caddy in my 49, does that count? Hemi would be about the same challenges to over come. I actually have a copy of a book that outlines that swap. You will probably ave the additional challenge of the steering column as the Hemi is most likely wider than the Cad. Let me know if I can help.

[Tim]

any pics or sugestiond would be great brock, what problems did you have getting the cad to fit, what did you do to get around those problems?

[stevenjerk]

your basic motor swap? there is no such thing, take your time do it right, lots of things will come up that you didnt know

[fab32]

After doing the front suspension upgrade on Fuelpumps '50 convert I think you would have some serious issues with the steering shaft and getting it around the engine and hooked up. As so many people have issues with doing front clip grafts this might be a situation where one would be in order. I only have experience with GM front clips but maybe Elpolacko could give you the lowdown on the Dodge Dakota clip and if it would be a good candidate for this application. When out do a clip you get modern suspension, modern steering, Disc brakes, good handling, everything you need to handle an elephant transplant.

Frank

[Tim]

i realize that lots of little things will
pop up thats why asked first;)

any body know the guy in pella with the one mentioned before? if i can just find some one whos done it before i can ask what they had to do ect. a front clip doesnt sound like a bad idea if thats what it ends up taking to get it done,

i figure if you gota do a motor swap and a clip might as well make it low and HEMI-fied

tia
tim

[Brock49Ford]

OK you asked for it:
Motor mounts, new radiator, relocated alternator, removed heater motor, relocate battery - move up or to trunk (still undecided), "dented" steering column for exhaust clearence, notched pass fender brace for exhaust clearence, bend pitman arm, removed stock steering, new tie rod and drag link, new front coils for heavier motor (origs had been cut too much), NOS Cragar bell housing, NOS Schiefer alum flywheel, 11" ford truck clutch, Ford 3spd toploader, floor mods for shifter, modified trans crossmember, new exhaust from mufflers forward, modified orig. mechanical throttle linkage, new clutch linkage due to tranny change, rewire for new senders & starter solinoids, and probably a few more things that I have "blocked out". Just your typical engine swap. I'll try and post a picture tonight. Get to mocking that thing up!!!! E-mail me if you want me to look up in that book the specifics on putting the Hemi in.
Brock

[Tim]

i havnt got anythig to mock up quite yet, just want to see how feasable some of my ideas are

love to see the pix

tim

[48_HEMI]

leaving it close to stock and you end up with a 700 pound motor that has only 180 horsepower, If you do this leave the hood off and run straight pipes and don't race anyone just cruise it and park it.everyone will tell you how fast it is with a HEMI.don't prove them wrong. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

[Machinos]

331's from '55 actually came with 250hp, 340 ft/lbs stock. '51-'54 had considerably less HP, but it's not hard to get 'em to '55 specs.

[Brock49Ford]

Here are a couple of build up pictures that should give some idea of what I am talking about.Here is the first on of the steering column.
http://photo.starblvd.net/~brock49ford/t1-2-1.jpg
Then you have the fender brace on the pass side. Kind of hard to see in the back there.
http://photo.starblvd.net/~brock49ford/1-2-2.jpg
Then here are a few now that it closer to being finished.
http://photo.starblvd.net/~brock49ford/1-1-3.jpg
See what I was saying about the battery http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif Nice bungee cords
http://photo.starblvd.net/~brock49ford/1-1-4.jpg
Inspired yet?!?!?

[Brock49Ford]

I dont know how that first picture got so little, I don't have the desire to try and resize tonight. You get the idea I hope. I can get you that info out of the book too if you are interested.

[Rocky]

Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, Tim's talkin about running a 331 Chrysler Hemi, not a Caddy 331....

[Brock49Ford]

That is a 390 Caddy with early valve covers, sneaky huh?! I told him it was a Cad mill, he wanted to see anyway. Same problems to solve I bet. Actually I am just waiting for some one to come out with some fake Hemi valve covers for a early Cad motor so I can be like the SBC guys in Street Rodder.

[Rocky]

Ahahahaha! Here's a photo of my 4 cylinder Jeep engine with Hemi covers on it. Looks real, eh?

[Brock49Ford]

I still don't know why they came out with the Jeep kit first, but Rocky you gotta lose the 1-bbl carbs, that is a dead Jeep give away!!! You need one of those $3000 "Stromberg 97" EFI 6 packs if you want to fool people into thinking that thing is a Hemi. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Machinos]

In all fairness, that "Stromberg" EFI kit would cost nearly $3000 even if it weren't made to look like anything special http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif Injectors, sensors, and brand-name ECU's are ridiculously expensive.

[Mel]

Tim-

Talk to Bugman... he's working out the details for his Plymouth motor swap too.

~Melissa

[48_HEMI]

Rocky if you keep posting that rusty old piece you're going to force me to resize a photo of my shiney one!! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

the post started with a 50 chrysler Hemi and they first came out in 51 and thru 53 they had a whopping (compared to fords 100) 180 horsepower. there is nothing on gods green earth that sounds better than an uncorked Hemi period, end of conversation.

to put a stock early 51-53 Hemi in a 50 ford (the stock rear end will hold that 180 horse) will give you a great nostagiia ride but encono-boxes will kick your ass at a stoplight. but no one will touch you for cool!! that's why I suggest running with no hood

horse power cost money how fast do you want to go. I put 6 grand into mine not counting the chrome and its still sitting on the floor in the shop. that sounds sick even to me. just know that Hemis are not cheap to build. BUT every dime spent is worth it. I have to keep mine covered up because my eyes glaze over and I don't get anything done after I look at it http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif

[Tim]

all good info, and yeah i did ask to see the caddy to see what stuff he ran into also.

when i said 50 vntage i ment "50's" not just a 1950 ect.

and right now it would just be a bad ass cruiser, later in life im sure it would recieve some hard core injection of money...er i mean horsepower.

so far the hemis im found are around $750 bux, so if i can find an amazingly cheap shoe box thats mostly complete, or maybe a more expensive box and a cheaper hemi

it could possibly work out---just gota find somewere to do it as i dont suspect that campus security would be to impressed with a motor swap going on in the parking lot:P

gota see how some things turn out to see if this will work but keep the info coming anyways

tim

[Tim]

alright starting to find cheaper beter deals:)

new-and old- questions

what trani would be the easyest to use to drop this motor in? its just going to be a cruiser so an auto would be fine. is there a stock style trani that would be easy enuff to install with out a ton of linkage or is there some low buck plate to install a th350 ??

also is there any sort of stock manifold that just may fit or is a no question build some headers situation?

thats all for now

tim

[Machinos]

'54-'55 came with Powerflite autos on them, but it's a cable shift on the dashboard...you could probably relocate it but I have no idea. New adapters are $350 minimum, plus you need a new starter. 354's came with 3-speed Torqueflite pushbutton shift, it'd probably bolt onto a 331, but the Powerflite is good enough for cruising.

The stock manifolds are pretty tight, in my car there's tons of room on either side of the exhaust.

[Tim]

yeah im thinkin a stock auto is the way to go.

the button shift could be cool, i want to say there was a post about running those a while back, any body gota link.

on that note anybody got one layin around?


tim

[Mel]

The concept of push buttons is relatively simple... if you want I'll scan in the section from my shop manual and email it to ya.

And if you really have your heart set on one, I know a guy who might give you the button setup. I think he's still got a few in his parts cars.

~Melissa

[Tim]

thatd be great if you could scan that info mel,
i apreacate it -even though i cant spell it-

holar at jeff n tell him to post his 2 cents id like to here what he has to say about it.

hmmm what else, oh! you figure you could mount the buttons in some sort of center consle arm rest if you wanted to? just thinking of options is all

thanx
tim

[Tim]

back to the top,

anybody got pix of the hemi ford from pella or else were??

can anyone with a tape measure handy tell my how wide that caddy 390 is and how wide the 331 hemi is?

im talkin like the widdest point, top outside corner of valve covers? of the motor


just want to look at those pix and be able to think about how the hemi will fit in comparison ect

thanx
tim

[SlowLearner]

Tim, as per usual, I don't have first (or even second) hand experience on this...but I do love Hemis.
Here's a link to a chart on engine dimensions, including the hemi (tho I suspect it's the late one:
http://www.westechperformance.com/pages/Tech_Library/Popular_Engine_Specs/dimensions.html
Just google "engine dimensions" or the like..stuff's out there. Keep on schemin' http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Tim]

thanx for the link, i have alot of lists, as far as weights and lengths go, but the overall dimensions and pix help alot

tim