as you all know.i'm building the cherry pie car(the weesner painting).any modifcations i make,i'll have to keep the same look as the painting.so keep that in mind. i'm looking for suggestions.it's a 1951 331 block.i would like to change the heads and put a good cam.the car will have a hydro stick or manual stick.with headers and a quick change.with dual carbs.i would like it run mid 12's with ease..that's were groucho comes in..(but,that's a diffrent story.)so,if you have experince with these motors.here's your chance to let it all out. sorry,no pics and let's stay on subject.
well, you may want to go w/ a 390 block-- same but with more bore (thats what brought the 331 to 365) and stoke (thats what brought the 365 to 390.) Cam wise, i've put an Isky solid lifter cam in my 390. Requires you to use solid lifters--- an SBC set will work. Rocker wise, you'll have to use a set of Studebaker arms on the stock shaft. Heads... you could do a port clean up, and/or up the valve size and springs. you could also increase compression if you choose. Headers.... buy some flanges from scoop here on the HAMB and build your own. That's what I'm doing. Intake.... Im running a Detroit Racing Equipment w/ dual 350cfm Stromberg 4bbls. Intakes can be tough to find, but are out there. Ingition.... im running an old Vertex magneto. Those are hard to find, but you can send the gear off a stock distributor and have Vertex build you one. Cant comment on your goal to run 12's, as i dont know the car / trans / etc you're putting it in... hope this helps. -scott noteboom
thanks. the car will look exactly like the painting.and i already have the 331 and the mounts made.and the intake is dual 2barrels.
Mid 12's in the quarter aren't going to be easy unless you are running an NOS fogger under the intake. If 12's are really your goal, then your first priority should be assuring that the chassis is going to transfer the power to the ground. What rear suspension set-up are you using? Ladder bars? You'll need to select a gear ratio that will keep the little Caddy in it's powerband..probably something in the 3.73-4.11 range. Tire selection will be important as well. Get the compression up somewhere around 10.5:1 or so, bore it as much as you safely can and install forged pistons, get the biggest solid cam you can jam in it (small base circle, long duration, high lift), install adjustable pushrods, port the heads and install larger valves, balance the rotating assembly, gasket match the intake to the heads, and make sure the exhaust flanges match the exhaust ports. Convert the distributor to electronic, put good gas in it and crank up the advance. If you run a manual trans, be sure to use a good clutch and good shifter. Fuel delivery could be a problem with the 2x2...I'd consider running a pair of Stromberg 48's with the largest power valve jet you can get (71 or larger) and start with about 45 main jets and step-up drill sizes until the mixture seems right. Running 12's with a '51 Cadillac motor is not going to be as easy as it sounds. Be prepared to open your wallet.
i'll change the heads for sure.can i put the 390 heads on.and mill the shit out of them.and mill the intake to fit.
i say keep the 331, but bore it out to a 390, cuz then you can put a lesalle trans behind it. shnieder*spelling* makes a cam and lifter set. also you will need 390 rockers because they are adjustable. and then get a offy dual quad intake. my 2 cents....
With 4 barrell carbs and dual exhaust these babies were pumping out 250 horses stock. You bumped it up to 365 you should see about 300 horses and you all the way to 390 (if Possible) you should see 325 hp. That dont seem to bad to me. Add multi carb setup, msd ignition, etc, 411's in that quickie and your defiinalty in the low 13's if not the 12's. I say go for it. 12 seconds really is not that fast if you really think about. It is but it aint for a race car. I mean if you get down into the 10's then you are doing something. My pops is gonna be putting a 331 in his roadster eventually running 4x2's. I know he does not want it to be a racer but i am sure it will get hopped up alittle. I dont see it being to hard to get there plus I think they are one of the coolest looking motors being done. Or keep the compression low and pore the Nitrous too it dip down into the 10's like the little Coupe did at the Day of th Drags. It should be your goal to make a statement with this motor. I will be keeping my eyes on this one. Good luck and have some fun
Skratch, just outta curiosity, why the 331. Is more asthetics, or just what you've got, or..........331s are great motors but its no secret that the 365 or 390 would be the better way to go. Everyone screams for the 59-62 390 but there is a difference. 59 390s still had the external mounted oil filter canister, they are not full flow like the later 390s. So if ya want more of the early look find a 59 so ya get that ugly filter canister instead of that ugly screw on filter!
Studebaker rocker arms are adjustable and fit Cadillac rocker shafts perfectly. as far as all you guys who can't STFU about "why use a 331?" after '55 the bellhousing changed,and there are even fewer transmission options then.
AH! THATS WHAT IT WAS! thats why i said he should bore his 331 out to a 390(cuz then he has more tranny options without having to get an adapter made.)
Exactly. I've got a '51 331 that was punched out to 365 years ago, and has Jahns pistons. I'll hunt up some later, larger port heads and have myself a decent engine. Ever try to find '55-'62 standard shift parts? Good luck!
starting with a 390 would be cheaper... already has the big port heads, already 390, and you can get a Chevy stick bellhousing behind it with a kit from Wilcap.
well.weesner's drawing is a 331.and i have one, that's been punched out.so,that was easy.so,390 heads do fit the 331 block?what all parts interchange?
keep the 2x2... copy taht painting my friend the car will be sICK.. 390 heads, maybe bore it out some, 2x2, decent cam, port work maybe, 10.5:1 or so comp, reliable and quick, maybe not 12s, but quick... car outta be light too, i mean shortened, narrowed b pillars even, shouldnt be much there... man i cant WAIT to see this even in mock up
Mid 12's should be a piece of cake with a car that should come in well(?) under/near 2000 lbs. I'm puzzled why some of these light jalopy style Hot Rods are so painfully slow in the 1/4 mile. Maybe gutless flattys w/good rear gears, or decent overhead V-8's w/lousy rear gears (just a guess). THIS brings me to Skratch's car having a quikchange. That should be a huge advantage to get this fucker down the track, and still drive anywhere. I remember (oh come on, it's a short tale) a Willys truck at the street races 30 years ago with a STOCK 409 and a Hydro. That fuker'd run like it's ass was on fire, and when the Hydro hit 3rd(?) the motor sounded like it hit a wall, and then slowly recovered the drastic change in ratios on that shift. And it ran in the low 12's. Stock 409, no tricks, a Hydro, and a less than optimum rear gear for the spread the Hydro had. But it "left" like a Pro-Stock, and it was light.
How many people that replied to this post have built a car that ran 12's with an engine made before 1955? Sure seems like there is a lot of speculation going on. You're going to use a Champ style quick change, or a V8 style quick change? The V8 style is going to have a hard time holding up to enough horsepower to run in the 12's. Be ready for sheared axle keys. You can switch to 9" axles, but again $$$$. There is also quite a difference between building a 12 second car you plan to run mostly on the street, and a 12 second car that will only see the track. Which is this one going to be?
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